Dubbed "Vodka Mom" in scathing Nancy Grace segment, MN woman burns self to death

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Melanie said:
Ryan was fleeing from the police though after killing Jasmine Fiore -- who was brutally beaten, her teeth pulled out of her head, her fingers removed to conceal identity and folded up into a suitcase.

Good riddance to him -- I don't blame that on Nancy Grace one bit. While I do believe she's over the top, I don't think she drives anyone to suicide.

Just my opinion - thanks.

Melanie
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We have two women accused of murdering their children and one man accused of murdering his girlfriend. All committed suicide around the time that their cases were profiled by NG and all we're repeatedly raked over the coals by NG. NG did not stick to the facts, but instead sought to sensationalize what she thought happened. There may be more suicides connected with her show, but those are three that I'm am familiar with.
 
believe09 said:
That sounds about right. Maybe she might want to reconsider re structuring her show when it comes to some of these cases.
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I think it's important to consider the state of mind of the accused. I think it's better to see these people prosecuted in a courtroom than to victimize them on national TV until they are so broken that they want to kill themselves. There's something really warped about what NG does ... persecution comes to mind.
 
believe09 said:
So even if Nancy led a public stoning, she bears no responsibility since Mom was guilty anyway. Fair enough-we have a microcosm of the court of public opinion here. We judge here too.

I know I keep banging this drum, but where is the outrage regarding Dad's inaction? We should be frothing at the mouth-he let his son die too.
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If NG played fair, she would have equally victimized both parents for the death of their child. If she focused solely on the mom, then she's got some weird idea in her head about women. If both parents were at home, both parents were aware of the drinking and both parents knew that an infant was sleeping next to a drunk person, then both parents are equally liable ... in my opinion. I don't watch NG (can't stand what she says, or that odd nasal tone she has), but if she treated the husband as another victim, I would question her agenda.
 
I think there are much worse villains in the world than Nancy Grace.
 
katydid23 said:
I think there are much worse villains in the world than Nancy Grace.
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ITA and I think those 3 criminals would have killed themselves even if there was no such person as NG.

One was running from the cops and they were closing in on him. He took the coward way out. Probably never watched a NG show.

One was a suspect in her son's missing persons case. IMO wanted to die before the world found out what she did to her son.

One got plastered, killed her baby, and was facing 10 years in prison. I'm sure she felt a lot of guilt. Who wouldn't? Killed herself a month after the NG show.

I don't see NG being at all to blame in any of these suicides.

JMO
 
Whether she holds any culpability or not, she presents a biased, shrill, and vile program that is much more about sensationalism than it is about justice, IMO.
 
Carnel's mother was a guest on NG and was treated very nicely by Nancy. And still, people are now saying that she is suicidal. So how come she is suicidal, and yet Nancy treated her respectfully? Maybe nancy isn't the trigger for grieving, guilt fueled suicidal feelings.
 
HMSHood said:
Never heard of Ryan Jenkins committing suicide because of Nancy Grace. I thought he did it because he was a coward.
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He had no where to go, he had spoken with a top criminal attorney at home and was in the process of heading home, where he would have turned himself in. NG sensationalized his story nightly - with lots and lots of embellishment - and the day before he was to meet with his lawyer, he committed suicide with his belt. Clearly it wasn't much of a planned suicide, but he could have been very distraught about what he did in the heat of the moment. He was in a very bad relationship with a woman that didn't respect any boundaries associated with marriage, but wanted the money. I knew his father. Ryan came from a good family, but his life went completely sideways somewhere along the way. If justice had been allowed to take its course, I'm 99% certain that Ryan would have turned himself in, he would have been extradited and the victim's family would have had the answers they needed through trial. NG should have stayed out of it. She added nothing to the case, or the investigation ... except that she persecuted and victimized the accused. The accused was not a guilty man. At the time, he was the prime suspect. NG doesn't respect that status, but she should.
 
otto said:
He had no where to go, he had spoken with a top criminal attorney at home and was in the process of heading home, where he would have turned himself in. NG sensationalized his story nightly - with lots and lots of embellishment - and the day before he was to meet with his lawyer, he committed suicide with his belt. Clearly it wasn't much of a planned suicide, but he could have been very distraught about what he did in the heat of the moment. He was in a very bad relationship with a woman that didn't respect any boundaries associated with marriage, but wanted the money. I knew his father. Ryan came from a good family, but his life went completely sideways somewhere along the way. If justice had been allowed to take its course, I'm 99% certain that Ryan would have turned himself in, he would have been extradited and the victim's family would have had the answers they needed through trial. NG should have stayed out of it. She added nothing to the case, or the investigation ... except that she persecuted and victimized the accused. The accused was not a guilty man. At the time, he was the prime suspect. NG doesn't respect that status, but she should.
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He was a monster.

Even if "He was in a very bad relationship with a woman that didn't respect any boundaries associated with marriage, but wanted the money" he had NO right to kill and mutilate that poor girl the way he did.

JMO

ETA: he obviously didn't mind women who loved his money since he went on the VH1 reality show "Megan Wants a Millionaire," in which wealthy young men tried to win over a materialistic blonde.
 
otto said:
He had no where to go, he had spoken with a top criminal attorney at home and was in the process of heading home, where he would have turned himself in. NG sensationalized his story nightly - with lots and lots of embellishment - and the day before he was to meet with his lawyer, he committed suicide with his belt. Clearly it wasn't much of a planned suicide, but he could have been very distraught about what he did in the heat of the moment. He was in a very bad relationship with a woman that didn't respect any boundaries associated with marriage, but wanted the money. I knew his father. Ryan came from a good family, but his life went completely sideways somewhere along the way. If justice had been allowed to take its course, I'm 99% certain that Ryan would have turned himself in, he would have been extradited and the victim's family would have had the answers they needed through trial. NG should have stayed out of it. She added nothing to the case, or the investigation ... except that she persecuted and victimized the accused. The accused was not a guilty man. At the time, he was the prime suspect. NG doesn't respect that status, but she should.
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I think you are giving him way too much credit. He had been on the run for quite awhile. He pulled her teeth out, one by one, for god's sake. Awww, he killed himself, boo freakin hoo.
 
oh_gal said:
Who is saying that NG is wholly responsible for her death, which is what this post implies? IMO, there's a BIG difference between "NG is responsible for her death," and "NG's comments could have played a role in her death."

Do none of us, then, bear any personal responsibility for how we conduct ourselves or treat others? Is/are common courtesy, civility, basic manners or having a conscience dead?? We teach our children manners and tell them not to speak meanly or harshly to others, don't we? Even if it's warranted...what do we tell our kids? Do we tell them, "Have at it! Rip 'em apart!", or do we try to teach them to extend grace, courtesy, manners?

Yes, yes, yes, I know, this woman drank a bunch of vodka, then smothered her child (accidentially, as a result of her negligence). That was wrong, and horrible, and no one should ever do it. She, and she alone is to blame for her drinking. She, and her husband, both bear responsibilty for their child's death.

And we, as civilized human beings are responsible for how we treat others.
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My post implied nothing of the sort. I never said NG was wholly or partially if you go back and read my post. I think MANY factors play into this woman's death. She was obviously a very messed up individual who made a very horrible decision that ended up killing her baby. Just like a drunk driver who commits vehicular homicide. She is responsible for her actions, just as she was responsible for her own death. She had a choice both times and she made the final choice to end her life. NG did not do that for her.
 
I think I will just stay out of this one......................
 
oh_gal said:
Who is saying that NG is wholly responsible for her death, which is what this post implies? IMO, there's a BIG difference between "NG is responsible for her death," and "NG's comments could have played a role in her death."

Do none of us, then, bear any personal responsibility for how we conduct ourselves or treat others? Is/are common courtesy, civility, basic manners or having a conscience dead?? We teach our children manners and tell them not to speak meanly or harshly to others, don't we? Even if it's warranted...what do we tell our kids? Do we tell them, "Have at it! Rip 'em apart!", or do we try to teach them to extend grace, courtesy, manners?

Yes, yes, yes, I know, this woman drank a bunch of vodka, then smothered her child (accidentially, as a result of her negligence). That was wrong, and horrible, and no one should ever do it. She, and she alone is to blame for her drinking. She, and her husband, both bear responsibilty for their child's death.

And we, as civilized human beings are responsible for how we treat others.
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Well said, Oh_Gal! Well said.

IMHO, NG and/or her show, epitomizes what is wrong with this country today. And the shame is, she was probably raised better, but, it doing this to make the almighty dollar. Shame Shame MOO
 
Kimberlyd125 said:
He was a monster.

Even if "He was in a very bad relationship with a woman that didn't respect any boundaries associated with marriage, but wanted the money" he had NO right to kill and mutilate that poor girl the way he did.

JMO

ETA: he obviously didn't mind women who loved his money since he went on the VH1 reality show "Megan Wants a Millionaire," in which wealthy young men tried to win over a materialistic blonde.
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He put himself out there as a millionaire and the Megan production bought into it because his father was rich. He may have been okay with a woman that wanted a rich husband, but I doubt he expected what he got. In any case, neither of them were upstanding people when they were married. He dismembered her to disguise her identity. He diidn't count on the breast implants having codes attached to them ... and so he was caught. Once he was caught, there was only one option for him: life in prison. The alternative: suicide. How many men facing life in prison commit suicide before they are even convicted? Very few.

The talking heads were non-stop on him. He committed suicide spontaneously with the belt he was wearing the day before he was going to meet with his lawyer - probably hoping for a fair trial - but not after seeing the talking heads. He probably thought he'd be murdered within the year, if he wasn't first shot by police that thought he was armed and dangerous. He had his laptop with him and he was in a motel - so he had internet and TV.
 
Gypsy Road said:
My post implied nothing of the sort. I never said NG was wholly or partially if you go back and read my post. I think MANY factors play into this woman's death. She was obviously a very messed up individual who made a very horrible decision that ended up killing her baby. Just like a drunk driver who commits vehicular homicide. She is responsible for her actions, just as she was responsible for her own death. She had a choice both times and she made the final choice to end her life. NG did not do that for her.
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The persecution could have tipped her over the edge. Did NG ever take the time to know who this woman was, or was she pre-judged, convicted and sentenced?
 
otto said:
He put himself out there as a millionaire and the Megan production bought into it because his father was rich. He may have been okay with a woman that wanted a rich husband, but I doubt he expected what he got. In any case, neither of them were upstanding people when they were married. He dismembered her to disguise her identity. He diidn't count on the breast implants having codes attached to them ... and so he was caught. Once he was caught, there was only one option for him: life in prison. The alternative: suicide. How many men facing life in prison commit suicide before they are even convicted? Very few.

The talking heads were non-stop on him. He committed suicide spontaneously with the belt he was wearing the day before he was going to meet with his lawyer - probably hoping for a fair trial - but not after seeing the talking heads. He probably thought he'd be murdered within the year, if he wasn't first shot by police that thought he was armed and dangerous. He had his laptop with him and he was in a motel - so he had internet and TV.
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:eek:

The past couple of posts on this person seems like you are blaming the victim.

She wasn't what he wanted so he killed her.
He only mutilated her because he wanted to hide her identity.
He only killed himself because of NG.

Sorry, but IMO that's horrible.

He was a monster. He was worthless.
The world is a better place without him in it.
May he burn forever for what he did.

As far as him coming from a nice family, who cares??? Many murdering psychopaths do. Doesn't make the victim any less dead.
 
otto said:
The persecution could have tipped her over the edge. Did NG ever take the time to know who this woman was, or was she pre-judged, convicted and sentenced?
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NG knew the MOM got drunk and smothered her baby.
That's the just of it.
That's what was reported.
That's not prejudging. That's reporting the facts.
Who cares who this woman is?

She killed her baby because she got plastered.
 
I didn't mean to imply that a victim was in any way responsible for the death, but wanted to demonstrate that sometimes the prime suspect feels remorse for what he or she did, and is suffering tremendously. Being persecuted by a national audience may be too much to bear in addition to the guilt he or she already experienced. A mother that suffocated an infant because of drunkenness could never really forgive herself. NG gets that, right? Being persecuted doesn't add anything. NG going after this woman did nothing to move the case forward or advocate for the victim. It sounds like it was little more than a self-indulgent, punlic flogging of the prime suspect.

What did NG add to the case? If we assume that she did not contribute to the death, we can at least hope that something was accomplished by her broadcasts. The fact that: the family bed is not recommended because of potential infant suffocation, is not news; neither is it the point NG is making.
 
WholeLottaRosie said:
Well said, Oh_Gal! Well said.

IMHO, NG and/or her show, epitomizes what is wrong with this country today. And the shame is, she was probably raised better, but, it doing this to make the almighty dollar. Shame Shame MOO
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Is she doing this show for the almighty dollar or is she perhaps doing this show to keep the public's attention on missing children and murdered wives and girlfriends?

I am going to give her the benefit of the doubt, given that she spent years as a prosecutor, and is presently the ONLY person doing a 5 night a week show focusing upon current crime victims. Many things that she does drive me nuts. I agree with the fact that she is not always accurate and is a day late and a dollar short quite often. But I don't see anyone else jumping up to take her place in trying to keep these crime victims in the public's eye.

It is weird that some think that SHE is what is wrong with our country today, as opposed to the people she was criticized for criticizing so harshly. That Ryan guy bludgeoned his beautiful young girlfriend, and then pulled her teeth out with pliers, one by one. And nancy Grace is the villain?
 
otto said:
I didn't mean to imply that a victim was in any way responsible for the death, but wanted to demonstrate that sometimes the prime suspect feels remorse for what he or she did, and is suffering tremendously. Being persecuted by a national audience may be too much to bear in addition to the guilt he or she already experienced. A mother that suffocated an infant because of drunkenness could never really forgive herself. Being persecuted doesn't add anything. NG going after this woman did nothing to move the case forward or advocate for the victim. It sounds like it was little more than a self-indulgent flogging of the prime suspect.

What did NG add to the case? If we assume that she did not contribute to the death, we can at least hope that something was accomplished by her broadcasts. The fact that: the family bed is not recommended because of possible suffocation is not news, neither is it the point NG is making.
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That 'poor' woman had TWO Dui's in one month, and then drank a liter of vodka, while home caring for her newborn. Why shouldn't NG go after her for that totally abhorrent behavior? It wasn't like it was just a normal 'family bed' accidental smothering. I don't think she would criticize a woman who lost her child in that way, if it was a freak accident in bed after nursing. But this woman drank a huge bottle of vodka before sleeping on the couch with a tiny newborn. That is not an accident, that is negligent manslaughter, imo.
 
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