Forensic Astrology - CAYLEE ANTHONY Reported Missing 7/15/2008: #1

MommaD said:

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so any good suggestion for a beginner (best bet are the dummies book for me ) lol i have a pc and would like to get software also.. i know you have a mac but maybe soul or nep has a pc and could give me help on this.

I searched on line but i am type to have to visually see and hold stuff and read package.

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casey's pre-trial conference date and time 11-5-08 9am
trial 11-17-08 9 30 am


hope this helps everyone in the quest to find Caylee and bring the baby home .. God Bless to all..

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Hi MommaD,

I would recommend Astrology, A Cosmic Science by Isabel Hickey. I would also recommend a website, www.bobmarksastrologer.com. He has very good lessons.

As far as programs for the PC, start with Astrowin by Allen Edwall, available for free download on www.astrowin.org. It is very good for a free program. Later, should you decide you are hooked on astro & want professional software, I use Solar Fire and am pretty happy with it.

Thanks for supplying the start times of the pre-trial and the trial. I will try to give those charts a look-over.

Thanks,
Soulscape

housemouse said:

Maybe we should take a look at the timeline thread, and decide which date or dates we might look at to see how this will end?

Obviously it is extremely time consuming to check all of them, so how do we decide which might be the most significant or helpful.

I am wondering about the date the dogs visited the Anthony property? How do we ascertain which planets represents the dogs?

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Hi Housemouse,

The dogs would be the 6th House of Service, IMO. The planet that rules the 6th House would represent the dogs. If there is a planet (planets) very close to the 6th House cusp, they would also give information, but the Ruler of the 6th House would be their primary significator.

Thanks,
Soulscape

Neptunian said:

Hi Housemouse, Soulscape, Lovejac and all,

...

First of all - I went back and reread my messages and want to say this: I used past tense in describing Caylee because the disappearance was more than two months ago. (I am trying my best to cling to hope that she is alive.) There are very powerful forces at play in her life right now. Whenever the slow moving outer planets are contacting personal points in the horoscope, there are major events. She is touched by Uranus (sudden separation), Neptune (mystery) and Pluto (force) at this time. If I knew nothing of Caylee's case and was not emotionally attached to it, I would say that there must have been a terrible accident. I think that faster moving Mars was a trigger for an accident - there is a window of several days wherein Mars was active. (If we can trust what we have heard about when she was last seen.) Without transitting Mars in play, it could be a sudden separation (Uranus). Still with mysterious Neptune.. Transitting Pluto to her natal Venus could be symbolic of a sudden (Uranus) kidnapping (Pluto) of a maiden (Venus). Mars in this natal picture could mean she is cut (Mars) off from her life above ground. Transitting Mars during mid June is the thing that really bothers me.

Also, the chart behind the last 911 phonecall is chilling. This is when the cry of "Where is Caylee?" came into consciousness. Soulscape, I've never turned a chart like you've shown - the concept is intriguing. Thanks for adding your analysis, I hope you add the rest of it soon. It seems we three have indeed come to many of the same things with the different methods we use.

This is a sweet, sunny Leo child who is confused and uneasy about the rapid changes going on in her life that she has no control over. A sparkling little soul who should be the center of her family's attention in a way that does not involve this sort of tragedy. So much promise and potential here She has touched me deeply - I'm sure all here feel the same way. And HM, I will keep searching for something favorable!

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Hi Neptunian,

It does indeed seem the three of us have come to similar conclusions despite using different methods. I was marveling about that myself this afternoon, but sadly, I must add, because of what it points to.

I still have things to say about the #3 Phone Call to LE chart, and sadly, nothing favorable. I will post as soon as I can, hopefully later this evening, but if not, then tomorrow morning.

I am a mother and grandmother. Reading charts like this one wrack me over the coals and break my heart.

Thanks,
Soulscape

housemouse said:

I hope that Neptunian and Soulscape will offer their opinions on the best beginner books. I suggest staying away from the "pop astrology" bokks that tell you nonsense, like "what's your love sign", and stuff like that.

I like "Aspects in Astrology" by Sue Tompkins. Sub-title is "A Guide to Understanding Planetary Relationships in the Horoscope".

I would be happy to email you your chart, and there is no charge, for my software does it in about 2 seconds. But! AND THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT!

You must have an accurate birth time and location, otherwise you will not be able to get the most personal information. I got mine from the birth records in the city where I was born, and boy, am I glad I didn't take my mother's word for it.

She said I was born right after dinner. Come to find out that I was born at 10:30 PM, recorded on the "extra" section of my certificate.

But, I also must tell you that astrology cannot tell you what will happen in your future. This is why the Bible warns us against "fortune-telling".

What astrology can tell you is the kinds of energy you will feel or be dealing with at certain points in time. These can manifest in such a variety of ways that no astrologer can accurately predict anything specific.

Also, how you respond to these energies is what makes you a unique individual. Your personal growth over the years, past experiences of a similar nature, the knowledge and wisdom you have gained from these, and the personal choices you make are much more important than the aspects themselves.

The natal aspects, and the transiting aspects are more like a "language", and you can use this language, once you learn it, to be accepting of all of life's ups and downs.

I hope this helps. And, once you get your chart, I can send you computer generated text, both for your natal aspects, and for transiting aspects, but you must remember that these are very general, and not specific to you, personally. They also do not integrate all the information in your chart, either, so you must do a bit of work yourself.

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ok understand and am so happy I just feel such a connection to the stars for some reason.. just don't understand why.. I have dreams and sometimes just scares the capooties out of me.. dreamed my son was married and didn't tell anyone and yep he called me 3 days later and told me he had gotten married the day before.. same with them having a baby.. dreamed they were prego and yep he called me 1 day later and told me they were. lots of other dreams too.. this was just to let you have insight..

excited to get info and get me some books etcc.

keep up the great work ladies.. kudos big time to you ..

house mouse did u see the time and dates of casey's trial i put up?? i saw where you had asked for them on a thread..

i also have been searching like crazy for lp dob but only have come up so far with the year.. its 1939... also found out his first name is jesse leonard padilla

will see what I can get on baez also.

MommaD said:

house mouse did u see the time and dates of casey's trial i put up?? i saw where you had asked for them on a thread..

i also have been searching like crazy for lp dob but only have come up so far with the year.. its 1939... also found out his first name is jesse leonard padilla

will see what I can get on baez also.

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His first name is Jesse? Isn't that a coincidence! You are a good sleuther, MommaD! I did see those dates... I am hoping for a time for that first hearing on the 22nd of July. I have been watching the videos of them, but have to get my husband put to bed now.

He has Parkinson's and needs my help with the physical stuff. Will be back on later, maybe, if I don't run out of energy!

Hello All,

In Part 1, the last thing I stated was:

The Sun (Caylee) is partile (in the same degree) inconjunct (150 degrees) Neptune --- the modern ruler of the turned 8th House of Death. Uranus is conjunct the turned 8th House of Death. The Fixed Star Scheat (not on chart) is just inside the turned 8th House of Death, at 29:29 Pisces and it is square the Moon/Pluto conjunction (28 – 29 Sagittarius) in the radix chart’s 11th House of Death in the Family.

The 150 degree inconjunct or quincunx is an angle of irritation and stress, and in horary, often linked to illness, accident and even death, likely because the 6th (sickness/health) & 8th (death) houses are 150 degrees (quincunx) the Ascendant (the body, or the health center).

Here we’ve got the Sun which is Caylee’s significator in this chart -- AND IN GENERAL symbolizes Life/ being alive -- in a very uncomfortable (quincunx) 150 degree aspect to Neptune, which is a planet that dissolves anything it touches. In other words, her life (Sun) slipping away (Neptune).

The placement of the Fixed Star Scheat just inside the turned 8th House of Death is troubling. Scheat connotes just what it sounds like …. Notice that at 29:29 Pisces, Scheat is conjunct Casey’s natal 28 Pisces Sun. The image I get is coming home and finding the bird cage door open, the birdie gone and the cat standing there with a feather hanging out of his mouth…pretty incriminating… and don’t forget, both Scheat (and Casey’s natal Sun) square the #3 Phone Call to LE chart’s Moon/Pluto conjunction (28-29 Sagittarius). Astrologically, this is not a pretty picture.

And it gets worse.

There is a Fixed Star called Alcyone, also known as the Pleiades, located at 00 Gemini. This star symbolizes the seven weeping sisters and gives **something to cry about.**

Alcyone is exactly on the IC (4th House cusp). This is very important for two reasons: (1) In horary, the 4th House gives The End of the Matter (how things turn out), and (2) in traditional horary, the mother is assigned to the 10th House. Since we turned the chart for Caylee making the 7th House her 1st House, if you count 10 houses with House 7 being #1, House 8 being #2, etc., you will see Caylee’s 10th House of the Mother would be the radix 4th House. So Alcyone’s placement there tells me the end of this matter is something to cry about, and its placement exactly on the cusp of the house symbolizing Caylee’s mother shouts to me that the mother Casey is the reason there is something to cry about. (Please note, Alcyone’s placement does NOT mean the mother killed the child, but it leaves no doubt whatsoever that whatever happened to Caylee was through her mother Casey’s actions or inactions.

The Part of Death (not shown) is located at 15:40 Scorpio, located in the turned 3rd House of the neighborhood. This suggests she died near her home. Scorpio is a sign of passion and violence (ruled by Mars and co-ruled by Pluto), so it is likely an aggressive act that killed her. The Part of Death is square the Nodes and the Nodes are conjunct the Ascendant/Descendant axis --- strong indication of death. The Part of Death is disposited by Mars, the traditional ruler of Scorpio, located at 8:39 Virgo in the turned 1st House. Notice Mars (anger, violence, aggression, rage, murder) is partile (in the same degree) sextile (60 degrees) Mercury, ruler of the turned 10th House of the Mother and the radix 4th House End of the Matter. This is another chilling testimony that whatever happened to Caylee was the result of the mother Casey’s actions or non-actions.

In a horary chart, the planet the Moon last passed over shows what happened. Here, the Moon last passed over Mars --- anger, aggression violence, rage, murder --- which is just separating from a conjunction with Saturn (death indicator) and then passed over the Part of Death (death indicator), and now is applying within 28 minutes of Arc to a conjunction with Pluto (death indicator).

So where is Caylee? According to the teachings of Ivy Goldstein-Jacobson, you will find the person where the significator is located by House and sign. (See Simplified Horary Astrology)

Caylee is signified by the Sun, located in the turned 12th House/ radix 6th House at 23:54 Cancer. The 6th/ 12th houses are cadent houses. She will be found farther off and may be lost, hidden or secluded, perhaps sent away, in a neighborhood different from that of the querent (Cindy, because she placed the call to LE).

The Sun (Caylee) is in Cancer: reservoirs, wells, cisterns, fountains, pools, marshes, ditches, moats, canals, water-ways and run-offs, rivers and their banks, lakes, ponds, hydrants and plumbing lines.

The direction of Cancer is NORTH, and being a water sign, indicates lowlands (below sea level).

The direction by house and sign is WEST NORTH WEST. The mileage is calculated based on the celestial latitude of the planet that is the significator (the SUN) and the difference in degrees between that planet and the MOON.
Sun is a 00 Latitude giving 1 mile according to Ivy Goldstein-Jacobson. The difference in degrees between significator SUN and the Moon is 4 degrees 46 minutes. 46 minutes is approximately ¾ of 60 (60 minutes in a degree), so the indication is that Caylee is approximately 4.75 miles away from her home in a WEST NORTH WEST DIRECTION, or its opposite, EAST SOUTH EAST. (If you superimpose the chart over a land map, you will see the SUN (Caylee) in the EAST SOUTH EAST area.) (See Simplified Horary Astrology page 72)

Ok... I’m gonna stop now because I’m depressing myself. The connections between Caylee’s natal chart and the #3 Phone Call to LE chart only confirm what I see in the stand-alone #3 Phone Call to LE chart.

I can only pray that LE gets to the bottom of this case soon. I hope to God my analysis is wrong, wrong, wrong. But I don't think it is...

Taking a break,
Thanks,
Soulscape

Soulscape said:

Hello All,

Ok... I’m gonna stop now because I’m depressing myself. The connections between Caylee’s natal chart and the #3 Phone Call to LE chart only confirm what I see in the stand-alone #3 Phone Call to LE chart.

I can only pray that LE gets to the bottom of this case soon. I hope to God my analysis is wrong, wrong, wrong. But I don't think it is...

Taking a break,
Thanks,
Soulscape

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<snipped with the utmost respect>

Wow Soulscape. So saddened by this. I have tried and tried to believe that sweet Caylee was still on this earth. Still don't know how such a sweet, happy and well-loved child would end up like this. I sooo wish that someone, anyone in LE had an open mind about this science, if only to search what you saw......if only to pick up what is left of that child and give her some dignity. Why and how could Casey. As a mother of 3, I will never understand. I wish I could find Casey's birth time. If only to try to explain this tragedy to my mind becuse my heart will never understand. Thank you so much Soulscape, I can only imagine how hard this was for you. You will be in my prayers tonight along with Caylee. God Bless, Catherine

Soulscape........what Lovejac said.

Soulscape, HouseMouse and Gang, I am wondering, and forgive the question in advance if it is grossly novice, if your work can predict a future event? Also can you advise how much of your interpretation of your data is intuitive, from experience, etc..
I am very active on the general thread and there is not a thing I have read there that has not been confirmed on here so I am fascinated. Bumping this thread on there now.

Blink34 said:

Soulscape, HouseMouse and Gang, I am wondering, and forgive the question in advance if it is grossly novice, if your work can predict a future event? Also can you advise how much of your interpretation of your data is intuitive, from experience, etc..
I am very active on the general thread and there is not a thing I have read there that has not been confirmed on here so I am fascinated. Bumping this thread on there now.

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Actually, Blink, I do my best to avoid my personal bias, opinion, and intuition when analyzing these charts. Many astrologers, especially those interpreting political charts, seem to let their biases direct their analysis, and I find that frustrating. Particularly when I don't share their political preferences.

It is very important, especially in forensic astrology, to stick to the principle keywords, and not to interject opinion. Otherwise, the information gathered is of lesser value.

Blink, go back to the beginning of the thread, and carefully check the dates of my posts, against the dates of the posts on the general thread, and the dates of the announcements from LE.

Without trying to be a "neener-neener" type, I think you will notice that the charts came first, and the rest followed along. Not that they were taking a cue from the charts, just that the charts, at least in this case, weren't too far off the mark.

Forgot your first question, Blink. I can't predict an event such as this ahead of time.

It is simple to predict WHEN certain types of energies are apt to be active in an individual chart, but not HOW the individual will choose to experience/feel/use the energies.

But, in watching Casey's chart now, knowing her circumstances, we can watch the transits to her natal chart, and make intelligent guesses about how she will experience/feel/use/react to these.

By doing this, and then checking our observations against reality, we gain further understanding.

housemouse said:

Actually, Blink, I do my best to avoid my personal bias, opinion, and intuition when analyzing these charts. Many astrologers, especially those interpreting political charts, seem to let their biases direct their analysis, and I find that frustrating. Particularly when I don't share their political preferences.

It is very important, especially in forensic astrology, to stick to the principle keywords, and not to interject opinion. Otherwise, the information gathered is of lesser value.

Blink, go back to the beginning of the thread, and carefully check the dates of my posts, against the dates of the posts on the general thread, and the dates of the announcements from LE.

Without trying to be a "neener-neener" type, I think you will notice that the charts came first, and the rest followed along. Not that they were taking a cue from the charts, just that the charts, at least in this case, weren't too far off the mark.

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Housemouse, and all of the other astrologers here I want to thank you again for all of your hard work and input! It's been absolutely fascinating and a real learning experience. It has also been a real eye opener for me as I did exactly what you suggested above to Blink and it is truly amazing to say the very least!

Although it is also very sad hat the results and possible outcome of this case may turn out to be. Again much thanks and gratutude for the sharing and hard work!

I am hoping that we astrological researchers can be helpful on other cases that might come along in the future.

It gives us an opportunity to improve our abilities, learn from each other, and educate others about how interesting astrology, properly applied, can be in understanding these situations.

Good Morning to All here,

I am behind in this thread! Book recomendations:

Rob Hand's "Horoscope Symbols" is good. Excellent modern reference for planets, signs, aspects and houses. Even a small section for midpoints Wish I had it when I started out.. He also has a book about transits, can't remember the name of it - my copy was borrowed and never returned. I think it's Planets in Transit? Very nice for a beginner. A book that I started with is "The Only Way to Learn about Astrology" by March and McEvers. Lol, it's not the only way, but it's good!

I second the astrowin program that Soulscape mentioned. I had it years ago, it is a safe download - didn't hurt my computer. Now I use SolarFire, I am happy with the program. For those who want to look at their charts, try www.astro.com . I put a link to that site earlier in this thread - this is where I learned the most online. You can look at your own charts and learn alot. (Best to start with your own horoscope because you know yourself) Lot's of free interpretations there. If you have questions, there is also a Forum for question, discussion.

Blink, you ask good questions, no need to be sorry! You want to know where the information comes from? Like the others have mentioned - Astrology is a symbolic language. Planets and signs have meaning and energy. Houses will tell you where this is going on. Aspects (conjunction = 0 degrees, opposition = 180 degrees, etc.) are how the planets reach for connection to each other.. Once you get basic understanding of these, you can begin to "read" the combinations.

About prediction - this is the most difficult thing, unfortunately. It is so hard to predict how different energy combinations will effect an individual or a situation. Everyone has different lifestyles, experiences, environments and backgrounds. Plus, I like to believe in free will over fate. At best, I think I can give an "educated guess" about future events.

An astrologer learns from watching people, situations. Looking at a past event teaches us how to look for what comes next. But I wonder sometimes if knowledge of the future is what is best for an individual?

You ask about intuition. With astrology, the horoscope is calculated mathmatically. The planets are real, their position in the heavens is real. How they make angular connection to each other is real. These things are measurable. I would say that astrology is based in logic. Intuition has different definitions, I think. The way I define intuition is knowing something in a flash. This "something" comes from inside of us - I think it comes from a part of the brain that is good at putting things together that you already know, but may not necessarily be conscious of. Having intuition is different than being psychic, in my opinion. The majority of astroIogers I have come in contact with are not psychic. They simply have learned the language and are good at putting things together in proper order. Psychic knowledge comes from the outside, and for me - this is not reliable.

Some questions for all: What is a pretrial? I see two different dates mentioned for Casey's trial - why two? Which one should we focus on? Has anyone found a birthdate for JG? Or has it been decided that perhaps examining his chart would be unethical?

housemouse said:

I am hoping that we astrological researchers can be helpful on other cases that might come along in the future.

It gives us an opportunity to improve our abilities, learn from each other, and educate others about how interesting astrology, properly applied, can be in understanding these situations.

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I hope so too!

housemouse, I would also like to add a word of thanks for all your efforts here. As one whose knowledge of the subject barely includes the sign I was born under, I am in awe of all that you know and your ability to translate it. When I read your first posts I thought if you were never a teacher you missed your calling! But maybe in fact you were honing your skills until the time was right and here you are!

God Bless.

Thanks for the support to us astrological researchers. It is encouraging to see people taking the subject as worthy of exploration. So many just think of Sun Sign astrology or Madame whatever, and pooh-pooh it.

One of the wonderful serendipitous (is that a word?) happenings about Neptunian, Soulscape and myself?

We each use different methods of studying an event, so you can see the different techniques that can be used, and the unique understanding each can offer in figuring out what was going on in a particular event.

Neptunian said:

Some questions for all: What is a pretrial? I see two different dates mentioned for Casey's trial - why two? Which one should we focus on? Has anyone found a birthdate for JG? Or has it been decided that perhaps examining his chart would be unethical?

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Hi Neptunian,

Here is the definition of pretrial from a legal website:

PRETRIAL CONFERENCE - A meeting of the judge and lawyers to discuss which matters should be presented to the jury, to review evidence and witnesses, to set a timetable, and to discuss the settlement of the case.

What is does is prepare the lawyers for the trial, helps them get their ducks in a row, so to speak. Baez will find out (through a legal process called discovery) what the prosecutor has on his client and the prosecutor will likely find out which witnesses defense intends to call, alibis, lines of defense, etc.

I think it would be fruitful to look at both charts. The pretrial chart will tell us which side is stronger, the trial chart could possibly reveal which side is likely to prevail.

There is an accomplished astrologer/lawyer named Christopher Warnock, whom I believe operates out the Washington DC area. If I were LE, I'd contact him for his input....

http://www.renaissanceastrology.com/

Thanks,
Soulscape

housemouse said:

I am hoping that we astrological researchers can be helpful on other cases that might come along in the future.

It gives us an opportunity to improve our abilities, learn from each other, and educate others about how interesting astrology, properly applied, can be in understanding these situations.

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Ditto!!

Thanks,
Soulscape