FL - 17-yo Boy Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #2

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chefmom said:
I listened to it repeatedly last night through a really good set of headphones and a really good set of speakers, and I could clearly hear the slur that the Herald is reporting. Not the ones it could be, but the worse one that they thought it to be. This is why I feel strongly that it will be treated as a hate crime. I am appalled that GZ has not been arrested. MOO
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I was up until 5am listening to it... over and over again. We even had our own conversation about it. I agree 100% with you.
 
LolaMoon08 said:
Regarding any pictures taken of Zimmerman's injuries:

Do you think if they had pictures of Zimmerman's injuries that night they would have been released already? Or do you think they are keeping them and not releasing them? Do you think pictures even exist?

I would think that if they had photographed Zimmerman's injuries, the pictures would have been released immediately with the 911 calls?

I just want to know if someone believes the pictures exist and they are just holding them ack
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IMO no pictures of GZ's injuries were taken. IMO there was very sloppy police work.
 
HiHater said:
Police can make an arrest when there is probable cause that the person was not acting in self-defense, even if the person asserts they were.
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and this is where i think it gets real sticky for the police. i think they thought, neighborhood watch guy + John Doe alone in gated community he doesn't live in = pretty open shut self defense. BUT that is <modsnip> lazy police work.
 
annalia said:
I can't tell for sure, to me it sounds like the slur, however, if he said, the slur, punk or tool, it shows that he judged Tray before going after him, and was the reason he went after him.

JMHO
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you don't even need to address the mumble then. He clearly calls Trayvon one of those "*******s [that] always gets away with it" early on in the call
 
LolaMoon08 said:
I was up until 5am listening to it... over and over again. We even had our own conversation about it. I agree 100% with you.
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I've been on many sites listening to this call because I just couldn't believe my ears when I listened on the miaminewstimes site. The racial slur is clear on every posting of the 911 call, even the earliest postings on other news sites. Yep, hate crime big time. IMO there is absolutely no reason to not charge GZ and it needs to be done immediately.
 
i'm suddenly talking to myself...lol but I do want to say that I also think this is a hate crime. And the best evidence of that is what is outwardly said on GZ's 911 call. He was profiling the heck out of Trayvon because he was black like the "others" and the "others" are identified in the other 911 calls by GZ and the other neighborhood watch guy that has been on the tele saying that it was black teens who did the 8 recent break-ins.
 
tlcox said:
Wish there was some way to give Sharpton a heads up that "hey, we got this dude, no need to come out and get involved"

Sorry but every time that man gets involved in some headline making case the only winner is Mr. Sharpton himself, who gains all that face time in the cameras.

Right now, there is a pretty loud and polarized group calling for justice. The Social media has assisted us in getting this story national attention and now GJ, FBI and Federal involvement. I really don't think Mr. Sharpton can do anything but screw this whole thing up by turning it into a big ole hatefest between the races.
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You are so right ! I can see him now fanning the flames :maddening: this case is hot enough ! no need for him here !! maybe they can :jail: him until this is over ?
 
What'sThatClue said:
I've been on many sites listening to this call because I just couldn't believe my ears when I listened on the miaminewstimes site. The racial slur is clear on every posting of the 911 call, even the earliest postings on other news sites. Yep, hate crime big time. IMO there is absolutely no reason to not charge GZ and it needs to be done immediately.
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Yes, last night I listened to numerous versions of the 911 call. From youtube, to miamiherald, to wftv, etc... because I wanted to make sure it wasn't somehow edited in by someone. It's clearly on the all of them.
 
JVM will cover Trayvon later on tonight...

Watching HLN, just saw the clip of Crump...I have to paraphrase, but he basically said self-defense is a legal argument to be made in a courtroom, and not on the side of the road to a police officer.
 
HiHater said:
JVM will cover Trayvon later on tonight...

Watching HLN, just saw the clip of Crump...I have to paraphrase, but he basically said self-defense is a legal argument to be made in a courtroom, and not on the side of the road to a police officer.
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AMEN! Especially one who obviously didn't think it important to take pictures of the physical evidence that would support a self-defense claim?
 
HiHater said:
JVM will cover Trayvon later on tonight...

Watching HLN, just saw the clip of Crump...I have to paraphrase, but he basically said self-defense is a legal argument to be made in a courtroom, and not on the side of the road to a police officer.
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That's what I thought! Something is seriously wrong here that he claimed self defense and apparently the police accepted it and let him go. Sounds like a good ol' boy network or something. I have NEVER heard of this just being accepted - it always has to go to court and be argued, especially if the person who was killed was unarmed! Shoot, if it were you or me, we'd have to prove it in court! I think some heads are going to roll in that police department when all is said and done.
 
http://abcnews.go.com/US/traynor-ma...-crucial-phone/story?id=15959017#.T2jNwtU_I3w
"He said this man was watching him, so he put his hoodie on. He said he lost the man," Martin's friend said. "I asked Trayvon to run, and he said he was going to walk fast. I told him to run, but he said he was not going to run."

Eventually, he would run, said the girl, thinking that he'd managed to escape. But suddenly the strange man was back, cornering Martin.

"Trayvon said, 'What are you following me for,' and the man said, 'What are you doing here.' Next thing I hear is somebody pushing, and somebody pushed Trayvon because the head set just fell. I called him again, and he didn't answer the phone."
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1. Sounds like GZ was looking for more than a street sign.
2. If Trayvon ran, how did GZ catch up to him? I think Trayvon played football?
3. Did GZ take a short cut, or did Trayvon think he was in the clear and let his guard down?
4. Doesn't sound like GZ gave Trayvon a chance to explain what he was doing there, which is what I have thought from the beginning. If GZ was told Trayvon lived in the neighborhood, then Trayvon should not have been a John Doe.
5. I wonder if they struggled more than once, like, in more than one location.

I think when the Feds make GZ tell his own story with no prompting, and possibly make him reenact what he says happened, this will all be clear.
 
I could be wrong, but it just seems odd that TM would be face down with both arms underneath. If TM was on top punching and then shot dead(since there was no moaning after the shot) he would instantly fall on top of GZ. GZ would have to push TM to the side to to get him off. What ever side GM push him off the other arm would end up sliding over GZ therefore not going under the body. Does that make any since?
 
GiantPickle said:
i'm suddenly talking to myself...lol but I do want to say that I also think this is a hate crime. And the best evidence of that is what is outwardly said on GZ's 911 call. He was profiling the heck out of Trayvon because he was black like the "others" and the "others" are identified in the other 911 calls by GZ and the other neighborhood watch guy that has been on the tele saying that it was black teens who did the 8 recent break-ins.
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BBM

Not sure I've seen him...Is this the neighbor who claims GZ stopped a burglary at his unit by alerting him to an open window?
 
BBM

An unknown person goes on to a porch at dusk, pulls up a hoodie covering his face, in a suburb of the US city with the THIRD HIGHEST crime rate in the country looks suspicious to me. Why would he have to go to the porch to pull the hoodie up? It's not as though he stood there waiting to dry, or the rain to subside. By the description, he walked under the porch, pulled the hoodie up, and returned to the street. I could see how an observer would take that as suspicious.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2011/02/16/the-11-most-dangerous-cities



Tray ducks under a random porch to avoid the rain and put his hoodie up, then goes back to the sidewalk to start walking towards home again.


GiantPickle said:
Bold part makes me so sad....in the world I grew up in, this is one of the reasons to HAVE a porch. To keep dry from the rain. To think a neighbor's kid is no longer considered normal for ducking out of the rain on the closest porch......well its just a sad sad world. Thankfully if I see a downpour and a kid run up on a porch and put up his hoodie, my first thoughts are "getting out of the rain" instead of SHOOOOOOOOT THAT ****

(and for the record, i'm only in my 30s....not 100).
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So what does that mean, that he deserved to be killed for looking suspicious? A lot of people look suspicious. That doesn't give anyone the right to chase them down and kill them. That is the problem here.

rossva said:
BBM

An unknown person goes on to a porch at dusk, pulls up a hoodie covering his face, in a suburb of the US city with the THIRD HIGHEST crime rate in the country looks suspicious to me. Why would he have to go to the porch to pull the hoodie up? It's not as though he stood there waiting to dry, or the rain to subside. By the description, he walked under the porch, pulled the hoodie up, and returned to the street. I could see how an observer would take that as suspicious.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2011/02/16/the-11-most-dangerous-cities



Tray ducks under a random porch to avoid the rain and put his hoodie up, then goes back to the sidewalk to start walking towards home again.
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rossva said:
BBM

An unknown person goes on to a porch at dusk, pulls up a hoodie covering his face, in a suburb of the US city with the THIRD HIGHEST crime rate in the country looks suspicious to me. Why would he have to go to the porch to pull the hoodie up? It's not as though he stood there waiting to dry, or the rain to subside. By the description, he walked under the porch, pulled the hoodie up, and returned to the street. I could see how an observer would take that as suspicious.

http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2011/02/16/the-11-most-dangerous-cities



Tray ducks under a random porch to avoid the rain and put his hoodie up, then goes back to the sidewalk to start walking towards home again.
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he was a kid... I could easily see my son doing the same thing if it started pouring rain on his head.

as for what people saw as suspicious they could call it in... but no need for pulling out a gun

:moo:
 
This case breaks my heart, makes me so angry and sick to my stomach. No one was in danger from Trayvon. If his killer thought he was suspicious then he had completed his duty as "neighborhood watch" by reporting it to the police. He should have listened to the operator and stayed in his car. He should be charged with first degree murder and if he truly used that slur on the 911 tape, it is a hate crime. The police chief should resign and that department should be investigated. None of which will be justice because Trayvon is gone but we must prevent this from happening again.
 
If it' raining out and someone ducks under a porch then goes right back out after putting their hoodie up, how hard is it to see that they might have been trying to get out of the rain? Especally a kid. My daughter lived in a hoodie, she'd wear her hoodie up just to hide her hair, if she didn't feel like fixing her hair when she went somewhere for a short period of time, I wonder if she might have been called a criminal in the dark and rain.

If someone looks suspicious call the police, no one has the right to chase them carrying a gun.

As far as all of these burglaries, it was reported that in the past year, prior to GZ's 911 call, there were 8 burglaries. I don't know but that doesn't sound like a major crime wave. We live in a middle class area, considered safe and we've had at least 8 burglaries in a years time.
 
BBM Way O/T but do you have any Asian friends to base that statement on? Racism towards Asian is extremely wide spread. If you go to GOOGLE, and have auto fill on it enabled, type in the word RACISM, the first autofill is racism against Asians.



LolaMoon08 said:
I can't believe Zimmerman's father said that because his son is Hispanic he can't be racist? Living in Florida all my life, I can assure you that there are Hispanic people who are racist against black and white people. There are black people who are racist against white and hispanic people! There are white people who are racist against hispanic and black people!

Asian's seem to have it pretty good! Because I rarely see any racism against Asian people?

Pointing out that Zimmerman is Hispanic does not mean that he wasn't racist!
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