TN - Gail Nowacki Palmgren, 44, Signal Mountain, 30 April 2011 - #12

glorias said:

And vice versa, obviously. This is still a situation where people are taking sides, hoping that it will be proven Gail killed herself and/or was so medicated or mentally ill she caused this all herself, vindicating both Matt and their own prior theories about the case.

Personally, I didn't think much of this so-called data dump because no important information was ever shared, only anecdotal evidence from all sides. And I personally hold criminal defense attorneys to a higher standard than friends and acquaintances; if an attorney involved in the case pushes anecdotal third-hand information to the media, that's completely different in my mind than a person telling anecdotes to a reporter.

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OK, I see your point. I think they are both culpable. The motivations may be different but the outcome is the same to me.

realdeal said:

Just to be clear, I'm not saying they knew about it all along and kept it secret from GP. I'm just saying they were not happy when GP found out, that she didn't take it lying down..

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Do you know MP, and GP and their families?

JayCeeVee said:

[It is my understanding that this was the info that the LE told the family. NO ONE else has said that they EVER heard Matt utter a hateful word to Gail. NO ONE.

Apparently, you haven't heard the tape turned over to the FBI with MP screaming vehemently at GP.

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BBM-when was this released? I missed it too.

We seem to have more posters coming to the thread who have some personal knowledge of Gail and her family. It is wonderful to have more information to help fill in the brush strokes.

Just as an FYI-

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I just read where CUE was presented a coin badge from the Sheriff for all their efforts in Gail's case. A well deserved honor IMHO...

Emeralgem said:

I just read where CUE was presented a coin badge from the Sheriff for all their efforts in Gail's case. A well deserved honor IMHO...

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This is good because the success of this search will encourage local authorities to work with CUE again, I'm sure.

Eternal Memory

Eternal memory. Eternal memory. Grant to your servant Gail Marie O Lord, blessed repose and eternal memory.
Amen

Emeralgem said:

Yes, theoretically possible, but IMHO, a coincidental accident with coincidental timing, highly unlikely...... And like you, I'm inclined to believe foul play is involved..JMHO...

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"Highly unlikely" struck me in your quote. I agree.

I'm a local who has followed this case from the time it (finally) was mentioned in the media. I never met Gail and don't know anyone who knew her, but her case has touched me and so many people who live in this community. I feel more should have been done to help find Gail from day one. Many people are so sad for her and for her children. I'm grateful for the people who worked so hard to keep her story in the media. Without their help I don't know if Gail and the Jeep would have ever been found.

My house is about a mile from the site where her Jeep went over the bluff... the entire mountain now knows the exact spot. I know six people who this week decided to drive the East Brow Road site where the Jeep went over...including the man who lives across the road from it. None, except for me, had preconceived opinions. Each person, and that includes me, said the same thing: this had to be intentional.

Either Gail had an incredible plan devised, where circumstances aligned and she returned her children to her home even as she thought someone was following and threatening her. She told her sister as she drove that she was afraid and asked the police to meet her. Yet amidst all the drama of the past days and months she was then able to drive to the Brow Road site and execute a seemingly impossible 90' right angle turn at exactly the spot where the stone wall was just barely wide enough to drive a Jeep through, and continue on through grass and a hedge to fall to her death. Or something else happened.

I've driven East Brow Road hundreds of times. It's at such a high elevation and has such a sheer drop to the valley that it seems you're looking out an airplane window. It is, however, a perfectly straight road -- no curves or dips or undulations. When driving from the Hampton Road side and driving up toward the site the Jeep went over, I found it impossible to see how anyone could thread the needle to drive through that small opening without doing damage to something other than a rock -- and they are rocks, not huge boulders. The area there is a lot more narrow than the elongated view that Google shows. Coming from the other direction (from the W Road side) is just as bad -- the driver is on the "house" side of the road and has the smallest bit more of a view when driving. Still not enough that any of the six people I know said they would be able to maneuver.

As I said before, six people have this week driven the route and each one said there was no way this was anything except intentional. Their ages range from a 28 year-old man who drives a truck for a living and drives the road regularly, to the 70-something person who lives on the Brow Road and drives it daily.

If any other locals are reading this, it would be very insightful to hear from you with your thoughts about the accident site. Looking at it on the map and actually driving it makes a huge difference. Please take the time to drive it and see what you think. I hope this is thoroughly investigated and not pronounced a tragic accident. Many things that happen in our county result in being called a tragic accident -- we already know that much, but has every possible scenario been investigated as to what caused it?

It's sad to miss someone you never met. Many on this mountain feel that way.

F.Lee - Beautiful and Informative Post!

Am not a local, however, agree with your thoughts that this was not a natural occurring accident. It reeks of planing to me, sadly will be declared an accident.
I am pleased to see that other agencies are investigating various aspects of the case, not just locals.

F. Lee said:

"Highly unlikely" struck me in your quote. I agree.

I'm a local who has followed this case from the time it (finally) was mentioned in the media. I never met Gail and don't know anyone who knew her, but her case has touched me and so many people who live in this community. I feel more should have been done to help find Gail from day one. Many people are so sad for her and for her children. I'm grateful for the people who worked so hard to keep her story in the media. Without their help I don't know if Gail and the Jeep would have ever been found.

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F. Lee: Thanks so much for your post! I am a local too, although I live in the eastern part of the county. However, in my younger years I had friends on Signal Mt. and in Walden, so I know what the roads are like both in sunny and rainy weather. And I have to say that I just cannot figure out what scenario would lead to a huge Jeep going over at that particular point.

If it had been a foggy night or morning and she went over, I could totally understand. We've all seen clouds roll in up there so that it gets scary fast. But on a sunny afternoon on a flat road? Sheriff Hammond mentioned that fact in an interview, so I hope that is keeping them focused on figuring this out instead of merely calling it an accident.

F.Lee said:

Either Gail had an incredible plan devised, where circumstances aligned and she returned her children to her home even as she thought someone was following and threatening her. She told her sister as she drove that she was afraid and asked the police to meet her.

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Why leave the kids alone if she was afraid? Because maybe she was just going to a convenience store for a few minutes, but something else happened. But how did it happen?

Yet amidst all the drama of the past days and months she was then able to drive to the Brow Road site and execute a seemingly impossible 90' right angle turn at exactly the spot where the stone wall was just barely wide enough to drive a Jeep through, and continue on through grass and a hedge to fall to her death. Or something else happened.

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Exactly - I can't figure this out. And smart people here who know about these things have studied maps and phone records for months, and they can't jive where she went over with what was going on that day plus the really short timeline from the time she dropped the children off till she disappeared.

F. Lee said:

I've driven East Brow Road hundreds of times. It's at such a high elevation and has such a sheer drop to the valley that it seems you're looking out an airplane window. It is, however, a perfectly straight road -- no curves or dips or undulations.

When driving from the Hampton Road side and driving up toward the site the Jeep went over, I found it impossible to see how anyone could thread the needle to drive through that small opening without doing damage to something other than a rock -- and they are rocks, not huge boulders. The area there is a lot more narrow than the elongated view that Google shows. Coming from the other direction (from the W Road side) is just as bad -- the driver is on the "house" side of the road and has the smallest bit more of a view when driving. Still not enough that any of the six people I know said they would be able to maneuver.

As I said before, six people have this week driven the route and each one said there was no way this was anything except intentional. Their ages range from a 28 year-old man who drives a truck for a living and drives the road regularly, to the 70-something person who lives on the Brow Road and drives it daily.

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I can't even imagine anyone pulling over there in a regular car, let alone a big Jeep. And the hedge just baffles me. Why would she pull over in the one spot with a hedge, instead of the plain pull-offs unless she lost control for some unknown reason, she was pushed from behind, or she was about to have a head-on with someone who is still alive and knows what happened. OR . . . things didn't happen exactly the way we think and there's a different timeline.

great post F. Lee...under sad circumstances. I have been on that road a few times, been a while but still....I think I recall the area , and yes, intentional really fits the bill for me also. Seems an accident would lean more toward front wheel going off the side with the vehicle following it off, as opposed to what has been proposed as happening.

Peace to the SM community.

First time posting ...have read everything on this site about Gail and followed the case for the last seven months.

F. Lee you could have taken the words right out of my mouth...I so agree with you and know the area. It has been several months since I have been on that area of the mountain but know it well. My thoughts after the jeep being found last week was why no homeowner reported the boulder or large rock missing. The neighborhoods on Signal Mountain are known for calling the police dept if anything goes on in the area. My husband use to work EMS on the mountain and he would say that calls to the police would come in for any reason whether small or large ...probably things we would overlook. The residents would call about a dog going to the bathroom in their yard....they are very particular about their property. How a missing boulder, tire marks, and damage to a hedge was not reported amazes me. I know this is on the edge side of the mountain across the road but the homeowners own that part. This information of owner is located on Hamilton County government website and property located across the street if any is listed.

So strange that a time was released by the lawyer so quickly after the discovery of the jeep.

I agree. Not a local here, but very familiar with the area.

I will not be satisfied until it has been explained to me how the 90 degree turn, coupled with the velocity necessary to take the Jeep not only through the opening in the wall, but over the grass and 'hedges' and then impact- rear first- bounce, and then roll, is explained.

And add to that- I know I mentioned ages ago that we have worked vehicular accidents where no trace of the vehicle was left on a guard rail or boundary- no damage whatsoever (usually in mountainous areas) so I can see some sort of freak accident taking place where that might be the case. But the turn, the velocity, the cell pings, the GPS, the timeline, the black box data, the final location... just don't say accident to me.
Was the phone charging on the 2nd?

I hope crash scene investigation is able to recreate this effectively, so that we can help find accident victims much earlier than Gail was found.

I guess I need more explanation.

Peace to all who loved Gail- whether personally, or from a distance.

I wonder if the brake line was cut AND someone hit her further up the road.

Someone bumps her about 150 yards further up the road. The impact causes the Jeep to turn slightly. She reaches for the brakes, but they do not work. The Jeep starts to careen out of control and over the side of the mountain. That would account for the speed, the angle and no skid marks.

JMO, but there is a cover-up goin' on. And maybe it goes deep.

Perhaps good citizens are afraid of whatever and I don't blame them a bit.

Still, Gail deserves justice...and her children and other loving family and friends....

I'll shup now.

If Gail was headed down the mountain, already keyed up from believing she was being followed, wouldnt she have noticed if her brakes began to be spongy? Isnt that how cutting brake lines works?

believe09 said:

If Gail was headed down the mountain, already keyed up from believing she was being followed, wouldnt she have noticed if her brakes began to be spongy? Isnt that how cutting brake lines works?

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I personally would have tried to drive it down the mountain to a store or someplace. Wasn't the cell phone service close to nil where she was at?

The stop at the convenience store....for what reason. Did she stop for gas, make a purchase, meet someone there,....what???? And....did the jeep go over the edge at a later time.... or date????

I am not sure I would have continued my descent, fwiw. But I am not local.

Whitedog said:

First time posting ...have read everything on this site about Gail and followed the case for the last seven months.

F. Lee you could have taken the words right out of my mouth...I so agree with you and know the area. It has been several months since I have been on that area of the mountain but know it well. My thoughts after the jeep being found last week was why no homeowner reported the boulder or large rock missing. The neighborhoods on Signal Mountain are known for calling the police dept if anything goes on in the area. My husband use to work EMS on the mountain and he would say that calls to the police would come in for any reason whether small or large ...probably things we would overlook. The residents would call about a dog going to the bathroom in their yard....they are very particular about their property. How a missing boulder, tire marks, and damage to a hedge was not reported amazes me. I know this is on the edge side of the mountain across the road but the homeowners own that part. This information of owner is located on Hamilton County government website and property located across the street if any is listed.

So strange that a time was released by the lawyer so quickly after the discovery of the jeep.

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BBM

Hi Whitedog. Welcome to WS.

The Hamilton County Sheriff’s Department serves the Township of Walden where the incident took place.

Walden folks are more independent than the Town of SM people with their hyper vigilant LE, IMO.

I just can’t believe that MP’s PI didn’t go, gee, maybe she took the scenic route to the W Road, a route known to be taken as it conveniently hits Mountain Creek Road right close to MP’s mothers apartment.

The cell phone pinged in that area… and hey there is a rock out of place and tire marks off the side.


all imo