Casey & Family Psychological Profile #3

FLjay said:

This has been posted before, but want to include here this link which is a window into family dynamics mentioned above.

Emails between Cindy and her brother in which he calls her on Casey's lies & brings up past experiences: http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFiles/Stories/Local/Anthony pgs 2951-3010 f.pdf

These emails and others are being discussed (again; previous thread is apparently closed) at Find'Her's post http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=76862

ETA: Note also emails at http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache...ee,+record,+07/14/08&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=6&gl=us
This section taken from 6/6/2008 written to Cindy's mother: "AS FOR HER PAYING FOR CASEY'S CREDIT CARD, "NO WAY"!!!! IF CINDYS' NAME IS ON THEACCOUNT, I WOULD CANCEL THAT CARD AND CASEY WOULD HAVE TO DO THE BEST SHE COULDDO. I WOULD MAKE HER PAY THE OUTSTANDING AMOUNT AND SHE WOULD NOT GET ANOTHERCARD WITH MY NAME ATTACHED TO IT , NO MATTER WHAT.

"WHAT ABOUT CASEY'S CAR? IS CINDY MAKING PAYMENTS ON THAT TOO? IF SO I WOULD GIVE HERJUST SO MUCH TIME TO GET ANOTHER JOB AND SHE WOULD HAVE TO MAKE THE PAYMENTS OR IWOULD LET THEM REPOSSESS THE VEHICLE."

I post this just to illustrate that others in the extended family recognized that things were "off", and had been for a long time. Yikes. Tip of the iceberg...

I'm off to bed now. Again, regards to all who grieve.

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OneLostGrl said:

Boy aint that the truth!

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OneLostGrl said:

Several of us here were raised by personality disordered parents also. IMO that is how we were able to spot it in Casey and IMO Cindy. Cindy reminds me SOO much of my mother. I wanna spit in her face when she goes on TV denying she said things that we heard with our own ears. and she defends and stands by that lie even if the proof is shoved her face. "I never said that" then she attacks and attempts to degrade anyone and everyone she feels has "wronged" her. Tim Miller, LP, Kathy from the TV station, the protesters in the street, hanging out in the lawn with a hammer.. calling people "maggots" and "stupid" because they are not acting the way or treating CINDY like CINDY thinks she should be treated.

It is so easy to spot that- splitting!

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Lavanda Dolce said:

Now this I totally disagree. I don't support whatsoever the actions Cindy did..I truly believe she was in deep denial. However, I do not believe that Cindy and Casey has the same personality disorder. Cindy was a nurse. She had goals. She provided a home for her family and granddaughter. She does not come across as selfish or self centered in any way. she does not come across as a narcisstic person. Fact is, and anyone will tell you...most nurses are extreme care-givers. Used to being "walked all over" by those around them...because they are overly nurturing. It's thier nature and its the career path that they took.

Cindy recognized hard times as she was seeing a therapist. Casey would never have.

No....I believe it is exactly the opposite personality problems that caused the clashes between Casey and Cindy.

Cindy could "fix" nearly any problem (hence is why she is the dominant one in the family)...again, by nature as that is also very common with nurses....yet, unfortunately, she couldn't "fix" Casey.

I think George was caught in the middle of the two as he loved both and didn't know HOW to fix the problem between the two so he stayed out of it....and became the passive parent. Perhaps due to his own occupation as a cop, and we all know cops have ego's and are NOT passive....but that is the role he took in parenting for fear that if he did use his cop personality it would compound problems in the household. I believe that is why he turned to gambling to avoid the problems. It wouldn't surprise me if he even possibly sought a "way out" himself by divorcing the family............until Caylee. Then there was hope again for normalcy.

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shadow of my mind said:

I would like to add my two cents to this discussion about Casey and the family dynamics. I think the emails between Rick & Cindy’s and the emails from Mrs. P to her sister about Cindy, George & Casey give a new look at this family.

If you read Mrs. P’s interview with LE .

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Lavanda Dolce said:

I thought I had read all in the case? Who is Mrs. P ??? Can you post a link to reference above? Many thanks

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shadow of my mind said:

Shirley P. is Cindy's mother. All the links for the interviews with LE are in the sticky thread at the top of the forum page.

Shirley P. Interview Only (Cindy's Mother) 7/22/08
http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedFile...Transcript.pdf
http://www.cfnews13.com/uploadedfile...o/DS300005.WMA
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=72060

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shadow of my mind said:

Shirley P. is Cindy's mother. All the links for the interviews with LE are in the sticky thread at the top of the forum page.

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Lavanda Dolce said:

Some eyebrow raising comments taken from: http://www.wftv.com/news/18155274/detail.html

1. Cindy told her mother that Caylee was her life and her mother says if not for Caylee, Cindy might have harmed herself.

2. The released documents show Grund also told investigators Cindy wanted Caylee to call her "Mommy" in front of Casey.

3. The documents also show there was no rotting pizza in the trunk of Casey’s car. Cindy Anthony has long claimed a horrible smell that detectives have described as the smell of death, was due to a rotting pizza. But the documents show there was nothing but an empty pizza box in a bag in the trunk. Investigators say when George opened the car trunk at a towing company, with a towing company employee next to him, flies flew out of the trunk. The pair tossed the trash bag that was in the trunk into the dumpster. Later, when investigators went back to it and opened it, they found flies, maggots, and the empty pizza box.

4.The investigation has brought out accusations Casey had been making against those closest to her, namely that her father George has abused her, and that her brother Lee made inappropriate sexual advances toward her once when she was in junior high. The documents show Casey said her mother Cindy did not believe that to be true.

5. Investigators also say the documents indicate that Casey might have been considering coming clean a couple of times. On the day she was indicted for murder she actually called her attorney from the sheriff's headquarters and hinted she might help investigators find Caylee. But once she talked to him she changed her mind. In August, she was about to meet with her father at the jail but once again it appears her attorney talked her out of it.

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Lavanda Dolce said:

I guess what strikes me as "different" from what I knew is that I was not aware that George was rare, if ever, working. I knew about the potential divorce...and the fact that did not transpire...i just didn't know how/why. I assumed they worked their differences out. I didn't realize Cindy carried SO much responsibility in that family. That only reinforces my previous opinion and post of her personality. Ironically, Cindy herself graduated from my hometown in Ohio at the same school my brother attended. I know all of the places they spoke of in Niles, Oh. What I am curious....is why did George give up his career as a State Trooper? His personality traits, from what I've read in all those email exchanges that Cindy's brother and mother describe...just is not one of a cop. He sounds quite troubled, lazy and passive from those email exchanges. That is certainly not a cops personality. Maybe that is why he wasn't a Trooper anymore? Something just not right with him not working and Cindy supporting all. It doesn't fit. Perhaps there is more to this than we are aware.

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concentric said:

Hi Lost Girl! What I'm thinking is very sick, but what isn't with this case? Here it is: KC is testing CA's love for her by doing away with Caylee and seeing if CA still supports her.

What do you think?

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Lavanda Dolce said:

Now this I totally disagree. I don't support whatsoever the actions Cindy did..I truly believe she was in deep denial. However, I do not believe that Cindy and Casey has the same personality disorder. Cindy was a nurse. She had goals. She provided a home for her family and granddaughter. She does not come across as selfish or self centered in any way. she does not come across as a narcisstic person. Fact is, and anyone will tell you...most nurses are extreme care-givers. Used to being "walked all over" by those around them...because they are overly nurturing. It's thier nature and its the career path that they took.

Cindy recognized hard times as she was seeing a therapist. Casey would never have.

No....I believe it is exactly the opposite personality problems that caused the clashes between Casey and Cindy.

Cindy could "fix" nearly any problem (hence is why she is the dominant one in the family)...again, by nature as that is also very common with nurses....yet, unfortunately, she couldn't "fix" Casey.

I think George was caught in the middle of the two as he loved both and didn't know HOW to fix the problem between the two so he stayed out of it....and became the passive parent. Perhaps due to his own occupation as a cop, and we all know cops have ego's and are NOT passive....but that is the role he took in parenting for fear that if he did use his cop personality it would compound problems in the household. I believe that is why he turned to gambling to avoid the problems. It wouldn't surprise me if he even possibly sought a "way out" himself by divorcing the family............until Caylee. Then there was hope again for normalcy.

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Penelope said:

OneLostGrl--

(Sorry, still tring to figure out the "quote message in reply" feature!

My stepdaughter's mother finally agreed to put her in therapy a little more than a year ago. Of course, it's mother-daughter therapy, with the mother in the same session with the daughter. (Sometimes the daughter gets to see the therapist in private.) The daughter told me that her mother sometimes "freaks out" in sessions. I perceive this as a positive-- at least the therapist gets to see the real mother.

Oh, forgot to include some details-- when the girl was 6 1/2 years old, she and her mother got into a big fight because the girl was found crying at school and told the teacher that her mother was "under a curse and she was afraid she would get the curse." (Her mother had told her daughter that she suffered from a curse that has been passed down for generations and she was afraid her daughter would get it. I believe this so-called curse was bi-polar disorder and anger issues, but her mother always called it a curse. The mother's mother and grandmother had both suffered from mental illness.)

We received a phone call that my stepdaughter had locked herself in the bathroom and was telling her mother that her life was horrible and she had nothing to live for. I was the one who talked her out of it, and the mother told my husband to come and get her.

My stepdaughter lived with us for a year and a half-- which was wonderful on one hand and totally stressful on the other since the mother was calling 2 to 3 times a day, telling the daughter how much she missed her, and my husband would not set up limits on these phone calls. Eventually, the mother turned the stepdaughter against me, showered the girl with gifts, and convinced her that all would be wonderful if she came back to live with mommy.

The stress on my marriage was so great, we agreed to send her back. But at least she was doing better and had learned to read. (When she arrived at our house, she was in the middle of second grade and was reading at a 1st grade beginner's level.)

I feel bad for her, but my husband's cultural beliefs prevented him from fighting the mother for custody. I did as much as I could, but the mother was very jealous that I would replace her as the "mother" in her daughter's eyes, so she did everything she could to undermine my influence. If I had to buy my stepdaughter an article of clothing-- say a dress-- her mother would then send a package with 3 dresses in it to show that she loved her more and was a "better mother." It is very disturbing to watch this kind of behavior and not be able to do more to help the child.

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shadow of my mind said:

I would like to add my two cents to this discussion about Casey and the family dynamics. I think the emails between Rick & Cindy’s and the emails from Mrs. P to her sister about Cindy, George & Casey give a new look at this family.

If you read Mrs. P’s interview with LE I find it interesting in the fact that Mrs. P. is very much into ‘how it looks to outsiders’ just as much as Cindy does. The exchange about the Caylee not being hungry since she had popcorn at the nursing home and that is why she did not eat the Chili but she did have peanut butter and jelly sandwich to me is a perfect example of how Mrs. P had to make every thing look ‘normal’ to others.
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To me an almost three year old would have no interest in eating chili for a meal. They may try a spoonful but it would not be something I would expect any small child to really want to eat. It is not a food that small children dive into, although I am sure there are some exceptions. To attempt to make the LE interviewer think that the serving of popcorn is why Caylee did not eat the chili is absurd in its on right. Why not just say that we thought we would see if she would like it but well, as expected she didn’t so I gave her the old child tested and child loved standby peanut butter and jelly. Why go into the whole popcorn, chili and peanut butter & jelly sandwich bit? To minimize the fact the two adults did not think that a small child would not want chili for a meal and that would make them look bad, hence Caylee filled up on popcorn and was not hungry enough for chili.

Also when asked some questions about the date of June 9th Mrs. P. states that she even would have sworn it was the 8th but it was Father’s day. Mrs. P. is giving cover to Cindy for being wrong about the date by saying that she thought the same thing also.
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Why? To minimize the fact that Cindy was ‘wrong’. Cindy cannot be wrong. She is my daughter and my daughter is not wrong.

During the discussion about Caylee being missing and the proper date that Caylee was visiting at the nursing home Mrs. P. makes the comment “that is whole week in our favor” is odd.
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Again Mrs. P. is minimizing the fact the Cindy was wrong with the date.

When Mrs. P. speaks about Casey not coming to see her and her husband since April it is not because of any estrangement between Casey and her grandfather. She just doesn’t know why…
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Again Mrs. P. is not telling LE what she knows. She is attempting to make things look as though there is nothing wrong in the family.

The entire interview is laced with these types of comments. Mrs. P. does not want anyone to know that there have been problems with Casey or that there have been problems between George and Cindy. Mrs. P. wants LE to think that everything is ‘normal’.

The name calling between Cindy and Rick although you do have to factor in normal sibling push and pull to me is another sign that dysfunction has been passed down from Mr. & Mrs. P to the children. At ages 50 & 55 there emails show them to be acting like pre teens. It has been way past the time to grow up and act like adults. I get the fact that Rick was attempting to get Cindy to see what was in front of her nose but it appears that they are still enmeshed in the way that they have been raised to handled strife and crisis within a family; point the blame finger, make outlandish comments and call each other names and ridicule each other. That is a learned behavior. They learned that from someone and it is usually the parents.

As far as Mrs. P. emails to her sister, you are only getting the view that Mrs. P. wants her sister to know about Cindy, George, Casey & Caylee or the view that Cindy has given Mrs. P.

It is not difficult, for short periods of time, for the mentally ill especially BPD, narcissist PD or the sociopath to act normal in front of others. It is only in the long term, close contact with such persons that one starts to recognize the inconsistencies and problems.

My opinion is that there has been long term mental and possibly physical abuse that has been passed down with in this family. Cindy, from what we have of seen her behavior as well as what she says and the assorted facts that have been made known acts like she is a classic functioning BPD.
George, with his one demeanor with LE, and a totally different one to the public makes me think major long term damaged and broken down self-esteem issues. The only person he feels remotely comfortable with is LE because that may have been the only time in his past, while being in LE when he felt some self-confidence. He has been told he is worthless, a no good for nothing loser for so long that it has become a self fulfilling prophecy and he can no longer act on his own. He has to have Cindy in his life to function. His interviews with LE and his requests not to tell his son Lee that he is at the police station, not to tell Cindy he said this or said that is shows just how afraid he is of being seen as going ‘against’ the family.
As far as Lee I have not spent a lot of time in going over his statements and media comments. I think there are some major issues between him and his father but I suspect that Cindy is the one who was the instigator of those problems. It fits with BPD. The goal of the BPD person is to pit one against the other then destroy any love, respect between them causing them to feel loss. While vulnerable, the BPD becomes their life- line and puts himself or herself in the role of savior to gain full control. The fact that Lee moved out of the family home makes me question if this process failed or that it was actually working but Caylee came along and the focus was switched. The relationship between Casey and Lee is odd to say the least. I just cannot tell whether Lee is another Casey but more functional or he has just learned survivor skills and can act like the ‘family’ when he has to and can turn it on and off. Lee’s interview with LE just does not sit right with me and I have my suspicions he is up to his neck in something he does not want known.
Casey, well I think that there will be some greater minds than mine that will not be able to agree on what is wrong with her. I also think there will be books written about her for years to come. I will keep my opinion on her to myself, at least for now. Maybe after the trial is complete when more information is known I will venture a guess.

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Brini said:

Marry Christmas, OLG!

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shadow of my mind said:

From what has been said George worked for the Trumbull County Sheriffs Office and Cindy felt that George should quit. She wanted the perceived lifestyle and money of owning a car dealership. He left the sheriff office and went into business with his father and then for himself. The when and why of the incident with a plate glass window is something that I have not seen any documentation on. I did look on line in at one time in Trumbull County and could find no records for this. It may have not been something that would have been handle on the county level and it may be with a local police department if there was ever any report at all. I did some research into deeds and such and found that there is a judgment against George from the Ohio labor and industry department for repayment of funds. The original filing documents are not on line so I cannot tell if this because George did not pay state unemployment and disability to the state according to their rules or funds that may have been paid out to George improperly. Actually without seeing the original reason for the judgment this may have been a debt that George ended up with due to the way his father may have filed for paperwork while he worked with him.
In George’s FBI interview he did make mention that he had made some bad choices in finances and failed in a business. Somewhere I did see that one of his former co-workers from the Sheriffs office spoke highly of him so I am not sure if the idea that he may have had problems being a cop is correct. I tend to take what is said about George and his past with a very large grain of salt due to the fact that what we have witnessed so far with Cindy shows that she is not above lying. On the lie-o-meter scale Cindy scores up there pretty well.

I did catch in one of Mrs. P’s. e-mails her comment about Cindy not going to Ft. Meyers as planned. [George’s parents live there now]. In Cindy’s statement with LE, I do not remember if it was the one with OCSO or the FBI she said that she was suppose to go to Ft. Meyers to visit with her in-laws but they didn’t go because her father took a spell for the worse and she went and stayed with her mother to be close. Interesting that Mrs. P. did not mention a thing about Alex P. having any trouble or Cindy coming down and staying there. George also mentions that they did not go to Ft. Meyers due to Mr. P.’s health. So did Mrs. P. not tell her sister that Alex was not well or did Cindy not want to see George’s family and told LE and George a lie? If Cindy did in fact tell George that she was going to go and stay with her mother due to her father’s health and Mrs. P. says nothing of this to her sister where did Cindy go.
This is something that I have not seen anything about. This was a trip to Ft. Meyers was to have taken place sometime in the month of June but my memory is little fuzzy so I don’t want to say an exact date. I do apologize that I have not included page and line detail of the transcripts and emails that back up what I just posted. With the holiday I just do not have the time to go through the transcripts right now. Possibly later next week I can see what I can find to give everyone the links to be able to read for themselves.

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Brini said:

I think that;s also why LA pops up, then disappears. Tires to make peace between the two viragos. Then, gets frustrated, and goes away, for awhile.

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