Trayvon Martin's Autopsy

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LambChop said:
I think what some posters are trying to tell us is that the wound does not match GZ's story. No matter what he could have done with his wrist. TM did not sit up after he was shot, turn and then fall face forward onto the ground stretched out full length as he was found, from a sitting position. His heart exploded and he dropped right where he was at that point. jmo
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Unless these posters tell me that they have experience in forensics and bullet trajectories I don't really care "what they are trying to tell us."
 
LambChop said:
I think what some posters are trying to tell us is that the wound does not match GZ's story. No matter what he could have done with his wrist. TM did not sit up after he was shot, turn and then fall face forward onto the ground stretched out full length as he was found, from a sitting position. His heart exploded and he dropped right where he was at that point. jmo
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I'm not seeing that from the evidence. Sitting? Or do you mean straddling? If Trayvon was straddling GZ I could see him falling face down as he was found. JMO.
 
LambChop said:
I think what some posters are trying to tell us is that the wound does not match GZ's story. No matter what he could have done with his wrist. TM did not sit up after he was shot, turn and then fall face forward onto the ground stretched out full length as he was found, from a sitting position. His heart exploded and he dropped right where he was at that point. jmo
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What if TM was leaning over GZ already as the shot rang out?

Someone needs to put two people with the exact same heights and then have the one that was GZ's height point outward to see where a gun would come to on TM's body.

Multiple witnesses report seeing two people on the ground before the shot rang out.
 
jjenny said:
Unless these posters tell me that they have experience in forensics and bullet trajectories I don't really care "what they are trying to tell us."
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They're in the medical field. They would have some knowledge. It's not hard to figure out from diagrams also. Too much is wrong with the lying on my back with TM beating my face and I shot him to be believable given the trajectory of the bullet, the fact that TM died instantly and how TM's body ended up stretched out and face down in the grass. I can't imagine how it could have happened the way he said it did when you take into account what we now know from the reports. jmo
 
LambChop said:
I think what some posters are trying to tell us is that the wound does not match GZ's story. No matter what he could have done with his wrist. TM did not sit up after he was shot, turn and then fall face forward onto the ground stretched out full length as he was found, from a sitting position. His heart exploded and he dropped right where he was at that point. jmo
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Correct, his story doesn't match the evidence as Investigator Gilbreath stated at the bond hearing, now we are seeing the reason...TM died where he was shot...at close range and it removes the doubt that GZ was going back to his vehicle, he should have not left the security of his vehicle if he was that 'frightened' of TM, a lone teen walking...GZ is one paranoid dude who will now have to answer for his actions for once in his life....for it appears he and his family think it's always someone elses fault GZ gets into violent confrontations...we shall see...
 
cityslick said:
What if TM was leaning over GZ already as the shot rang out?

Someone needs to put two people with the exact same heights and then have the one that was GZ's height point outward to see where a gun would come to on TM's body.

Multiple witnesses report seeing two people on the ground before the shot rang out.
Click to expand...

I believe the state will....they will show the evidence as they see it...Thankful for the SP and the team of prosecutors getting to the heart (no pun intended) of the actions of GZ...it's very relevant for GZ instigated this entire scenario by not backing off....
 
LambChop said:
They're in the medical field. They would have some knowledge. It's not hard to figure out from diagrams also. Too much is wrong with the lying on my back with TM beating my face and I shot him to be believable given the trajectory of the bullet, the fact that TM died instantly and how TM's body ended up stretched out and face down in the grass. I can't imagine how it could have happened the way he said it did when you take into account what we now know from the reports. jmo
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Well just because you can't imagine how it happened doesn't mean it didn't happen. First of all one guy sitting perpendicularly on top of the other is not the only orientation one guy can be sitting on top of the other. Person on top could be leaning. So it's misleading to have a photo of one guy sitting perpendicularly on top of the other and then claim the trajectory doesn't make sense since you don't know what was the orientation of two people at the time of shot.
 
cityslick said:
What if TM was leaning over GZ already as the shot rang out?

Someone needs to put two people with the exact same heights and then have the one that was GZ's height point outward to see where a gun would come to on TM's body.

Multiple witnesses report seeing two people on the ground before the shot rang out.
Click to expand...

How many seconds went by from the time the last person saw them on the ground? How many seconds does it take to start to get up? One witness said it was seconds, literally seconds after GZ shot TM that an officer showed up. Did LE arrive with full lights and sirens? GZ had to have seen them coming if they did. Flashing lights and sirens can be seen and heard from a long distance off. Why would he shoot??? Why?

I would think SA has already had an expert do a run through about what happened. They have all the information they need to reconstruct the crime, they have a video of GZ doing an reenactment. How could SA not know what happened at the exact time of the shooting? Obviously SA feels there is enough reason to disbelieve GZ's story because they've charged him with 2nd degree and not manslaughter. jmo
 
LambChop said:
How many seconds went by from the time the last person saw them on the ground? How many seconds does it take to start to get up? One witness said it was seconds, literally seconds after GZ shot TM that an officer showed up. Did LE arrive with full lights and sirens? GZ had to have seen them coming if they did. Flashing lights and sirens can be seen and heard from a long distance off. Why would he shoot??? Why?

I would think SA has already had an expert do a run through about what happened. They have all the information they need to reconstruct the crime, they have a video of GZ doing an reenactment. How could SA not know what happened at the exact time of the shooting? Obviously SA feels there is enough reason to disbelieve GZ's story because they've charged him with 2nd degree and not manslaughter. jmo
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Using that logic, the only outcome of every trial would be "GUILTY."
 
jjenny said:
Well just because you can't imagine how it happened doesn't mean it didn't happen. First of all one guy sitting perpendicularly on top of the other is not the only orientation one guy can be sitting on top of the other. Person on top could be leaning. So it's misleading to have a photo of one guy sitting perpendicularly on top of the other and then claim the trajectory doesn't make sense since you don't know what was the orientation of two people at the time of shot.
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A sitting position does not explain how TM landed stretched out, face down in the grass with his hands together underneath him. It's as if he dropped right where he was standing or kneeling. His arms and hands indicate he fell directly onto the grass undisturbed. Somehow the pieces just do not fit when you look at the whole picture. I'm sorry but they don't. jmo
 
jjenny said:
Using that logic, the only outcome of every trial would be "GUILTY."
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If the person is guilty that would be true. SA can only go by the evidence they have put together in order to charge someone with a crime. If GZ story were solid he would not be going to trial. We don't have his full statements yet and we can see holes just from what we know up to this point. jmo
 
Just K said:
We now know that TM was 71 inches tall (5' 9") and weighed 158 pounds = average height and skinny

We also know that GZ wore a size 38 pants and an XL jacket = heavy guy or as the one witness referred to him the "Bulky Built Guy."
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Thanks, JustK,
GZ has a sturdy build as evidenced in the police station video. His weight is listed as 200 lbs and height is 5'7".

http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/93951121?access_key=key-1afxr6fw4p9qoeni6hod

I just can't imagine Trayvon allegedly pinning GZ to the ground for any significant length of time. Even tho Trayvon was 2" taller than GZ, IMO Trayvon was at a disadvantage because GZ outweighed him by 42 lbs. (and was packing)

The thing that's bugging me is that Mr. wm is about the same size as GZ and mr. is STRONG as an OX. I can't envision a skinny 17 year old kid who is two inches taller getting the best of Mr.wm.

MOO

wm
 
waltzingmatilda said:
Thanks, JustK,
GZ has a sturdy build as evidenced in the police station video. His weight is listed as 200 lbs and height is 5'7".

http://www.scribd.com/fullscreen/93951121?access_key=key-1afxr6fw4p9qoeni6hod

I just can't imagine Trayvon allegedly pinning GZ to the ground for any significant length of time. Even tho Trayvon was 2" taller than GZ, IMO Trayvon was at a disadvantage because GZ outweighed him by 42 lbs. (and was packing)

The thing that's bugging me is that Mr. wm is about the same size as GZ and mr. is STRONG as an OX. I can't envision a skinny 17 year old kid who is two inches taller getting the best of Mr.wm.

MOO

wm
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71 inches is 5' 11" not 5' 9". Who is strong as an ox and how do you know that?
 
LiveLaughLuv said:
I believe the state will....they will show the evidence as they see it...Thankful for the SP and the team of prosecutors getting to the heart (no pun intended) of the actions of GZ...it's very relevant for GZ instigated this entire scenario by not backing off....
Click to expand...

They can't prove who instigated it. Gilbreath said this during the bond hearing.
 
LambChop said:
How many seconds went by from the time the last person saw them on the ground? How many seconds does it take to start to get up? One witness said it was seconds, literally seconds after GZ shot TM that an officer showed up. Did LE arrive with full lights and sirens? GZ had to have seen them coming if they did. Flashing lights and sirens can be seen and heard from a long distance off. Why would he shoot??? Why?

I would think SA has already had an expert do a run through about what happened. They have all the information they need to reconstruct the crime, they have a video of GZ doing an reenactment. How could SA not know what happened at the exact time of the shooting? Obviously SA feels there is enough reason to disbelieve GZ's story because they've charged him with 2nd degree and not manslaughter. jmo
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BBM

And once again, not everyone who is facing a charge is guilty of said charge, nor does that mean there is enough evidence to fulfill that charge in the eyes of a jury.

Do you think he was on the ground, then got up and shot him while TM was on the ground? That would even be more unlikely for a straight shot.
 
cityslick said:
They can't prove who instigated it. Gilbreath said this during the bond hearing.
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Originally Posted by cityslick
What if TM was leaning over GZ already as the shot rang out?

Someone needs to put two people with the exact same heights and then have the one that was GZ's height point outward to see where a gun would come to on TM's body.

Multiple witnesses report seeing two people on the ground before the shot rang out.
Click to expand...

I did comment to the above quote...not the who instigated it...but since you brought that up....

In reality, GZ did instigate it since he didn't stop his following of TM...he was in hot pursuit and I feel he now hunted TM down....he should have stayed in his vehicle...so, in essence, it was GZ who instigated this confrontation...
 
cityslick said:
They can't prove who instigated it. Gilbreath said this during the bond hearing.
Click to expand...

Can't prove it with 100% certainty I'm sure. But if GZ's statements don't match up a jury gets to decide whether it was more likely GZ initiated it or TM and what happened right before TM was shot. Was he trying to get away and was it that GZ was trying to keep him from getting away? jmo
 
LiveLaughLuv said:
I did comment to the above quote...not the who instigated it...but since you brought that up....

In reality, GZ did instigate it since he didn't stop his following of TM...he was in hot pursuit and I feel he now hunted TM down....he should have stayed in his vehicle...so, in essence, it was GZ who instigated this confrontation...
Click to expand...

GZ didn't break the law by stepping out of his vehicle. He's certainly not guilty of 2nd degree murder by seeing where TM was.
 
cityslick said:
BBM

And once again, not everyone who is facing a charge is guilty of said charge, nor does that mean there is enough evidence to fulfill that charge in the eyes of a jury.

Do you think he was on the ground, then got up and shot him while TM was on the ground? That would even be more unlikely for a straight shot.
Click to expand...



How did TM end up face down and straight? Sounds more like they both were standing up when TM got shot.
 
Hi RANCH,

Sorry I miscalculated. Lol. mr wm is 'strong as an ox' which is just a figure of speech,
and the reason I know should be self explanatory. I was making an observation on the similarities between GZ and mr. wm's body types. I still can't imagine someone 4 inches taller yet 42 lbs lighter putting a whipping on mr wm for very long because of the weight difference. I am not disputing that TM was on top at some point. I just don't think it was for very long. GZ appears to be in good physical shape.

Hope this helps clarify.:)

moo

wm
 
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