Amanda Knox tried for the murder of Meredith Kercher in Italy *NEW TRIAL*#8

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SMK said:
I find it odd that the jacket had not been collected right away, the day of the discovery. And also that it was tossed on the floor after handling, rather than placed carefully in a labeled, plastic and sterile bag. They did strange things even while filming....
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Strange how? Strange in comparison to what? Strange in comparison to people that have no training in evidence collection? Strange in comparison to well publicized (??) evidence collection footage for murder cases in the US?

Let's suppose that a person is murdered and lying on the floor covered by a duvet. Let's suppose the first priority is to examine the body and then remove the body. Let's suppose that a piece of clothing, like a hoodie, must be moved in order to remove the body. Now what is going to happen with the hoodie? Should we stand around, criticize and complain because the deceased person, and not the hoodie, was a priority? Seriously ... should we complain that we don't have full body shots of Meredith as she lay dead in a pool of blood while the hoodie was collected according to some unreasonable expectation?

Since the complaint is now about the hoodie, where exactly was the hoodie at the moment that the murder was discovered and why is it unreasonable that it was moved?
 
otto said:
Strange how? Strange in comparison to what? Strange in comparison to people that have no training in evidence collection? Strange in comparison to well publicized (??) evidence collection footage for murder cases in the US?

Let's suppose that a person is murdered and lying on the floor covered by a duvet. Let's suppose the first priority is to examine the body and then remove the body. Let's suppose that a piece of clothing, like a hoodie, must be moved in order to remove the body. Now what is going to happen with the hoodie? Should we stand around, criticize and complain because the deceased person, and not the hoodie, was a priority? Seriously ... should we complain that we don't have full body shots of Meredith as she lay dead in a pool of blood while the hoodie was collected according to some unreasonable expectation?

Since the complaint is now about the hoodie, where exactly was the hoodie at the moment that the murder was discovered and why is it unreasonable that it was moved?
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OK, yes, I am used to watching the US crime shows and movies where they take every piece of evidence they find and pick it up with big tweezers and put it in a sterile bag. That is why this seemed strange to me. And as this footage is labelled Dec 18 I assumed the body of the deceased was examined and moved long ago, no?
 
SMK said:
I guess this business of the abrasion/bruise on Amanda's neck - like so much else in this case, enough to raise questions, but not enough to be absolutely clear one way or the other - will have to remain an unknown possibility.

For my part, I don't find it being a hickey that hard to believe, but I can remain open to the idea that it might have - might have - come from some kind of scuffle. I think the fact that it was not a wound which broke the skin or bled sort of negates it as evidence (because can be explained away as a hickey, whether it was one or not).
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I think it was a red herring from the beginning. I think it was dropped by the prosecution in the first level trial.

1. There is no mention of it in Massei's motivation where he reconstructs the roles and actions of the accused.

2. Hellmann doesn't mention it at all.

3. Galati doesn't complain that Hellmann left it out.

4. Crini doesn't mention it.

I can't think of any explanation of the above other than it had never been claimed by any of the prosecutors.

I speculate it's because the defence provided the medical report at some point in the first trial, shooting down this myth. It lives only in old media reports and on pro-guilt blogs.
 
I would like to point out that any authentic video of the crime scene was released illegally by Sollecito's family. The release of that footage by the Sollecito family horrified Meredith's family. I do hope that the original footage released by the suspect in violation of the law is not being posted here. It seems to me that it would be such an insult to the victim.

"Relatives of Meredith Kercher, the British student murdered in Perugia in November, were said to be shocked and distressed last night after images of her bloodied corpse were broadcast on Italian television.

The footage, shown in news bulletins by RAI, the Italian state broadcaster, showed police forensic scientists examining Ms Kercher’s bedroom and collecting evidence, including her underwear and bloodstained bra, as her body lay nearby beneath a duvet with one foot sticking out."

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/news/world/europe/article2596828.ece

"Eight “notices of termination of the investigations” have been reported by the public prosecutor of Perugia… Four Sollecito family members, the TV journalist on Telenorba and the director of the station, are accused of the crimes of defamation, invasion of privacy, publication of documents during the investigation, and publication of gruesome acts….

According to the reconstruction, the Sollecito family members delivered to Telenorba the video and photos of the crime scene survey carried out by the forensic team on November 2 of 2007 in Meredith’s house. Telenorba then put the material on the air.

Other investigations are on-going."

http://www.lanazione.it//perugia/2009/04/01/162310-corpo_meredith_telenorba.shtml
 
SMK said:
OK, yes, I am used to watching the US crime shows and movies where they take every piece of evidence they find and pick it up with big tweezers and put it in a sterile bag. That is why this seemed strange to me. And as this footage is labelled Dec 18 I assumed the body of the deceased was examined and moved long ago, no?
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I will not view any footage of the crime scene for the reason posted in my last comment.

Was the hoodie collected on December 18?
 
I just realized that some of the photos, like the bra, are probably screen shots from the video that was illegally released by Sollecito's family ... which may explain why I had never seen them before even though I have followed the case for years. Is that also why the only links for the photos is the website that supports Sollecito?

This illegal release of crime scene video should also hopefully clarify which party was quick to release information to the media.
 
otto said:
I will not view any footage of the crime scene for the reason posted in my last comment.

Was the hoodie collected on December 18?
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Understood and respected. Yes, that was the date on the video, the 18th.
 
aa9511 said:
Look at it from the guilty viewpoint for one minute: Would Laura, who stated that it did NOT look like a hickey to her, have more motivation to lie about the hickey than a guilty Amanda, who actually got the mark from the murder she is denying being anywhere close to?
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I don't think Laura said this. In fact after looking into the testimony I know she didn't.
http://www.amandaknox.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Trascrizioni-2009-Feb-14-Mezzetti-Ceppitelli-Silenzi-Bonassi.pdf p. 21.
 
The hoodie, the bra clasp and other things were indeed collected on December 18. The same day as the luminol testing.

I agree with SMK about the hoodie and the bra clasp, along with other things, not being removed from the cottage until so long after the crime. There were interviews done and it was known what Meredith was wearing before she was killed. The hoodie itself should have been taken immediately as it would possibly have evidence on it as to who killed Meredith. Same with the bra clasp. Why on earth would any investigator wait so long before going back to the crime scene to take into evidence important items?
 
otto said:
I just realized that some of the photos, like the bra, are probably screen shots from the video that was illegally released by Sollecito's family ... which may explain why I had never seen them before even though I have followed the case for years. Is that also why the only links for the photos is the website that supports Sollecito?

This illegal release of crime scene video should also hopefully clarify which party was quick to release information to the media.
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Information to the media that showed the incompetence of the investigators. The video shows the complete lack of not only respect to the deceased but also the complete lack of professionalism. If my child was wrongfully accused of a crime and I had video evidence of the investigators collecting evidence in a nonprofessional manner I would release that video as well.
 
I have to wonder how much time was wasted by LE being sent on a wild goose chase involving Patrick.
 
Amber29 said:
Yes I agree but it also gives more weight to why they returned on dec 18th. There was still plenty that needed collected. Including much of the evidence that would be used against RG.
Seems a lot less like a "we have to find something against RS visit" as has been suggested.
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Too bad they didn't give a heads up to the Perugian cops not to disturb the crime scene because they will be coming back.

The December video shows the place looked like after a tsunami when Scientifica arrived. Things are thrown around, piled in huge disordered heaps, furniture is dismantled. Absolute mess. Totally compromised and contaminated.
 
Myvice said:
I have to wonder how much time was wasted by LE being sent on a wild goose chase involving Patrick.
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You mean the wild goose chase that was started by them falsely assuming that "see you later" actually meant that a later meeting was going to happen instead of the traditional American "see you later" as meaning whenever we see each other again? It's a shame that the police did not follow the clues from the actual evidence instead of following the clues of what they perceived to be evidence.

MOO
 
Katody said:
Too bad they didn't give a heads up to the Perugian cops not to disturb the crime scene because they will be coming back.

The December video shows the place looked like after a tsunami when Scientifica arrived. Things are thrown around, piled in huge disordered heaps, furniture is dismantled. Absolute mess. Totally compromised and contaminated.
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To make matters worse, the luminol testing in the hallway was done AFTER everything was moved into the hallway in piles from the rooms. It's amazing to see how tidy the cottage was after the crime and then compare that with how the cottage was after the "professional investigators" were done.

ETA: With the way the entire cottage was dealt with, the evidence collected, I am surprised that Guede was even convicted of the crime of killing Meredith. It is amazing to me that anyone can look at the way the crime scene and cottage was dealt with and know that a conviction actually happened. I would expect any defense lawyer to be able to raise certain reasonable doubt just based on the handling of all of the evidence.

MOO
 
TorisMom003 said:
You mean the wild goose chase that was started by them falsely assuming that "see you later" actually meant that a later meeting was going to happen instead of the traditional American "see you later" as meaning whenever we see each other again? It's a shame that the police did not follow the clues from the actual evidence instead of following the clues of what they perceived to be evidence.

MOO
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No, I mean after Amanda pointed the finger at an innocent man. Twice...
 
otto said:
I would like to point out that any authentic video of the crime scene was released illegally by Sollecito's family. The release of that footage by the Sollecito family horrified Meredith's
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That's not correct. In fact it's slanderous. The video which is part of the case file is publicly available and it's absolutely legal to share it.

A TV station broadcasted it not editing out the moment when the body is visible, that's another issue.

Let's not forget that Kerchers' lawyer Maresca himself purposefully displayed an obscene slideshow of Meredith's tortured body for the media present in the courtroom. He did it by ambush, circumventing the court's care to close the hearing for the media anytime sensitive material were used.


Finally, the video that is linked here has the frames showing Meredith's body edited out.
 
Myvice said:
No, I mean after Amanda pointed the finger at an innocent man. Twice...
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And when did Amanda point the finger at this man? Was it, or was it not, after she was questioned about the text of see you later? Was it, or was it not, after she was questioned as to who Patrick was?
 
TorisMom003 said:
The hoodie, the bra clasp and other things were indeed collected on December 18. The same day as the luminol testing.

I agree with SMK about the hoodie and the bra clasp, along with other things, not being removed from the cottage until so long after the crime. There were interviews done and it was known what Meredith was wearing before she was killed. The hoodie itself should have been taken immediately as it would possibly have evidence on it as to who killed Meredith. Same with the bra clasp. Why on earth would any investigator wait so long before going back to the crime scene to take into evidence important items?
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What was surprising to me is that there were such obvious and large blood stains on the Adidas hoodie, and I would think that this would be taken to a lab for immediate processing (and to see if there was any DNA/blood from anyone else. ) That the video was dated Dec 18, and the crime committed Nov 1 or 2, is to me just stunning. Unless they had some reason for doing so, of which we are unaware......
 
Katody said:
Too bad they didn't give a heads up to the Perugian cops not to disturb the crime scene because they will be coming back.

The December video shows the place looked like after a tsunami when Scientifica arrived. Things are thrown around, piled in huge disordered heaps, furniture is dismantled. Absolute mess. Totally compromised and contaminated.
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I spoke with a former police officer about this case one time. His job had been to secure crime scenes for investigators. His first words were, "Contaminated, contaminated."
 
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