2008.11.05 Nancy Grace

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Chilly Willy said:
I agree with you completely. No way would Cindy have willingly allowed Casey to move out and take Caylee with her.
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Unless she went to Lee's just for the night, Cindy might have agreed to that. It's in phone ping distance too.
 
Chilly Willy said:
The possibility of a chloroform overdose came from the defense, but nothing about Caylee being alive in a car trunk. We shouldn't jump to horrible conclusions.
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ITA TY Another voice of reason... (I will pass my oxygen mask...) JMO
 
Chilly Willy said:
I agree with you completely. No way would Cindy have willingly allowed Casey to move out and take Caylee with her.
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I don't think Cindy could have stopped her unless DFSS (or whatever it's called in Florida) was already involved. I am a guardian ad litem in S.C. and have had to deal with similar situations. She couldn't just say, No, you are not taking her without some kind of history, which Cindy said there was not.
 
Chilly Willy said:
Who says she did that? We DON'T know what happened. Casey may have never been alive in that trunk. Everyone is freaking out over a unsubstantiated theory.
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But isn't the majority of what is posted a theory? That is what we r doing is bouncing ideas from each other back & forth! JMHO Except for docs etc. that are fact aren't theory! Re-visiting past subject matter r theories helps when new media reports come out. It also helps those who are new or those who haven't finished reading every thread. A lot that was brought up tonight DO point to a lot of theories that you & many fellow WS's have brilliantly posted.

God Bless TES & all of the volunteers!:blowkiss::clap:

Caylee Angel We are Trying Are Hardest To Find You! :blowkiss::angel:
You Are Loved By So Many People In The World!:grouphug::blowkiss:
 
Leila said:
I think that's a very likely scenario. If she and Cindy had a big fight as has been stated, Casey was angry and stomped out of the house with Caylee with no definite plans. She couldn't go to TL's as he didn't want Caylee staying overnight at his apt. She was just plan fuming mad, and probably drove around for a while, thinking of her options. She wanted to be out from under Cindy's thumb in the worst way.
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I remember the early reports of the fight being overheard by one of the neighbors...and also they stated that the fights at other times were loud.

A child gets so upset when adults fight that no doubt Caylee was crying and out of control also..just a theory...but being taken away by an angry KC from home and GP's...KC took her rage out on Caylee.

I surmise that Amy was possibly chloroformed by KC...and it was present because it was a double use tool for KC...use it to steal from those around her, and knock out her child quickly. I buy into the Xanax theory also...easily gotten.

Agree Leila...she either drove around the general vicinity of her house and Lee's, or wherever it was her friend said was KC's "place" to go...near the cell tower range.

In any case, someone in that family needs to step up and be a HUMAN being...
 
We know that Caylee was DEAD in that trunk. We know that the last hours of her life, if she was chloroformed, were terrible. That she probably wondered why this woman who was supposed to love her was hurting her. It doesn't matter if she died in the car or not.
 
Pondering Mind said:
I don't think Cindy could have stopped her unless DFSS (or whatever it's called in Florida) was already involved. I am a guardian ad litem in S.C. and have had to deal with similar situations. She couldn't just say, No, you are not taking her without some kind of history, which Cindy said there was not.
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The post that we were referring to is the one that someone says they think possibly CA kicked Caylee and KC out of the house. We were saying we think CA put up a fight about KC taking Caylee. We were not saying there was anything she could do legally or otherwise to make KC leave Caylee behind. CA could certainly tell KC that she wasn't taking Caylee, KC just didn't by law have to listen. JMO.
 
I still can't get past the earlier computer searches for chloroform-That shows some sort of pre-meditation, not just being pizzed at parents, storming out and searching for a way to knock your child out to sleep- the chloro would have already had to have been 'made'!
 
galvino said:
I still can't get past the earlier computer searches for chloroform-That shows some sort of pre-meditation, not just being pizzed at parents, storming out and searching for a way to knock your child out to sleep- the chloro would have already had to have been 'made'!
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From what LP said on NG, the only reason Casey used Chloroform was because she left her Xanax behind when she left the house.
 
MD MOMMY said:
Bolded by me.. IMO CA knew what KC was/is capable of. If they both left that night I see KC taking Caylee out of pure spite as a barganing chip. I do not see CA kicking a 2 3/4 year old out of the house..I just don't see it at all. CA may have even said "Caylee stays here" and KC wasn't having it. JMO.
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What plays in my head, MD, is Cindy's early statements about "I was giving them time to bond.." and things of that nature. There is something in that statement that my mind goes back too-like she feels guilty for letting Casey keep Caylee from her for that length of time (31 days), or those were the words she used when she last saw them...I am not being clear I know.

I know women like Casey with children...ok not exactly like Casey clearly, but I can envision a frustrated parent or parents saying look, it is time you grew up and took care of yourself and your child. Tough love, it is time to get out and find out what it is really like to parent and work etc....

But, because of something fundamentally wrong with Casey, instead of her crawling back to her parents with an "oh I am sorry, come rescue me" she killed her child and went on her way free as air.

George and Cindy might have actually started to believe that Casey was getting her life together and then as time went on and no Caylee anywhere, they had to start to wonder. jmo.
 
Chilly Willy said:
From what LP said on NG, the only reason Casey used Chloroform was because she left her Xanax behind when she left the house.
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Yeah- but she still had to google how to make it, make it, have it 'on hand'...it's not like she could pop in to CVS and pick some up because she left the house in a huff!
 
believe09 said:
What plays in my head, MD, is Cindy's early statements about "I was giving them time to bond.." and things of that nature. There is something in that statement that my mind goes back too-like she feels guilty for letting Casey keep Caylee from her for that length of time (31 days), or those were the words she used when she last saw them...I am not being clear I know.

I know women like Casey with children...ok not exactly like Casey clearly, but I can envision a frustrated parent or parents saying look, it is time you grew up and took care of yourself and your child. Tough love, it is time to get out and find out what it is really like to parent and work etc....

But, because of something fundamentally wrong with Casey, instead of her crawling back to her parents with an "oh I am sorry, come rescue me" she killed her child and went on her way free as air.

George and Cindy might have actually started to believe that Casey was getting her life together and then as time went on and no Caylee anywhere, they had to start to wonder. jmo.
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Yep, I think Cindy planned to file for custody but knew the way things were she would really have no justification to do so. So she had to let Casey try to do things on her own, Cindy would document each and every failure to use against her in court, but things completely blew up in her face.
 
galvino said:
Yeah- but she still had to google how to make it, make it, have it 'on hand'...it's not like she could pop in to CVS and pick some up because she left the house in a huff!
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I agree, it's not something a person just happens to carry around in their purse. However, in LP's theory, the chloroform was used only because Xanax was not available - meaning the computer searches do not show premeditation.
 
galvino said:
I still can't get past the earlier computer searches for chloroform-That shows some sort of pre-meditation, not just being pizzed at parents, storming out and searching for a way to knock your child out to sleep- the chloro would have already had to have been 'made'!
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Thats why I think KC had already used it before...on Amy to steal from her. You sure would not need much in a small closed bottle.

It reminds me of when George stated that there was a bottle of "cleaning fluid" in the trunk...anything these people say after weeks of lies and outright crazy statements makes my hink meter go nuts.

Was George going to try and answer ahead of time for a bottle of "cleaning fluid?"
 
Chilly Willy said:
I agree, it's nothing something a person just happens to carry around in their purse. However, in LP's theory, the chloroform was used only because Xanax was not available - meaning the computer searches do not show premeditation.
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Then why the heck were the searches on the computer? That smacks of at LEAST premeditation of drugging her daughter... I doubt KC was looking that up so she could enter a project in the local hs Science Fair!
 
Sorry if already posted but I think this "leaked" because they know (GA's behavior last week staring into the woods, CA's post on her site, etc) that we will find Caylee this weekend. They know where we are searching and know thousands of people will show up! They know we are close! They are scared so they are trying to take the sting/shock out of the announcement by the press when TES or LE tells them WE FOUND HER!!

PS Xanax, Chloroform, whatever - to purchase either one, think about giving either to Caylee for ANY reason takes minutes at the least, not seconds. Computer searches, opening the bottle, finding cloth to pour on, etc. Premeditated!! Something not premeditated seems to me to be an immediate accident - like I dropped my bottle of pills and didn't clean it up right away and she got into them while I was in the bathroom staring at my "hot body". I bet she mixed Xanax in juice (or KOOL-AID) to get her to drink it!
 
believe09 said:
What plays in my head, MD, is Cindy's early statements about "I was giving them time to bond.." and things of that nature. There is something in that statement that my mind goes back too-like she feels guilty for letting Casey keep Caylee from her for that length of time (31 days), or those were the words she used when she last saw them...I am not being clear I know.

jmo.
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I guess I look back to how long supposedly KC stole from her family. I don't see anyone putting up with that unless there is a darned good reason. I think that reason was Caylee. I see KC using Caylee as a poker chip to her parents. I think CA knew full well what KC was capable of. I firmly believe the comment by RP in his interview about CA saying KC was a sociopath. GA admitted that he thought something was fishy about her job. IMO they all walked on egg shells around her for one reason..that being Caylee. JMO.
 
galvino said:
Then why the heck were the searches on the computer? That smacks of at LEAST premeditation of drugging her daughter... I doubt KC was looking that up so she could enter a project in the local hs Science Fair!
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Hahhaaaa! Good one :clap:
 
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