Can a Toddler shed any light?

Wondergirl

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I am wondering if there is anyone else questioning the following things:

-If Baby K was indeed with TH June 4th, is there any possibility that an 18 month old could have remembered anything?

-Has a child psychologist questioned Baby K?

-Are there any other cases where this sort of anaylsis has come into play?

-What sort of time frame is necessary in this type of questioning (would it be possible to somehow bring Baby K back to that day, or just generally speaking to her, obtain a clue as to Kyron's whereabouts?)

Without sleuthing Baby K in anyway, does anyone have any thoughts or experience with this type of child psychology?
 
Thanks for bringing that up; I've thought the same thing.
 
Im not a psychologist. I am a mother of 4 and I doubt Baby K will be much help. JMO

I'd love to hear professional opinions though. Great questions :)

ETA~ my own opinion is that she may not be very vocal yet. I noticed one pic of her with a pacifier. My own children were not very vocal until their binky's were taken away. I know this can be a topic of hot debate between Moms so Im not suggesting the pacifier is a bad thing, just that she is still in the sucking stage and not quite gotten in the very verbal stage yet. She may babble and even be able to put words together but Im not sure she can express what detectives need to hear. Im thinking shes more into the phase of saying "juice, ball, cup, Ky, kitty"
If she were older I would think maybe she could say "Ky fall down, Ky went swimming, Ky go bye bye with him"
 
I responded to similar on another thread somewhere, based solely on the fact that my son is exactly to the day the same age as Baby K.

I suppose that it may be possible that she could have seen something, but as far as being able to express that something, I don't personally think so.

My son has quite a few words, but they are words focused around his everyday life, like mama, dada, truck, apple, book, cat, etc. For the 1st time this past week, he uttered a 2 word phrase "more cake", when we were at a birthday party. So even if he saw a violent crime occur, he would likely not know how to express that, since it is not a part of his everyday life.

If Baby K were to have witnessed anything, unless it was extremely violent, she likely would not recognize that it was something negative. Also, I would think/hope that TMH would not have exposed her to something like that. Hopefully, she was sleeping in her car seat or facing the opposite direction in her car seat, so as that she would not have been able to see anything.

BTW, Happy 20M Birthday (yesterday), Baby K!
 
My sister was speaking in sentences at 18months. I guess it depends on the child. They could show her pictures or drive her around to see if she points and says Kyron, but I doubt at that age. I remember baby Blake in the Jessie Davis case, but he was 2 1/2. He said mommy in rug and daddy mad. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,333153,00.html
 
I don't think baby K being only 19 months old could offer up any information as to what happened..

Right now all I want to hear is Kyron has been found...And hopefully, ALIVE......JMO
 
I don't think she could help. Unless it was exceptionally violent, I'm not sure she would even have realized anything was amiss.
 
My sister was speaking in sentences at 18months. I guess it depends on the child. They could show her pictures or drive her around to see if she points and says Kyron, but I doubt at that age. I remember baby Blake in the Jessie Davis case, but he was 2 1/2. He said mommy in rug and daddy mad. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,333153,00.html

I agree.

My dd who is highly gifted was a full fledged talker by 18 months with complete sentences. She had great memory also. She also had a pacifer in her mouth constantly at this age. Now, my son would probably not have been able to convey much at that age even though he is very observant.

So, without knowing what K verbal skills are there is no way for us too know.
 
I can't recall how old "JR" was in the Haleigh Cummings case when Haleigh disappeared? His mom said he saw a man in black that night. In Haleigh's forum, it has been discussed for over a year now and nothing much has come of it.

I have to wonder if maybe baby K came up with a blurb like that in this case that might help a wee bit?
 
I doubt it. 19 months is too young to comprehend a lot. And, don't forget if someone tells a child something happened, (especially repeatedly) even if it did not, a speaking child will repeat it as if it is true. Even if the child is oh, let's say up to 10 years old. But 19 months, nah, not enough words or cognitive ability.
 
I can't recall how old "JR" was in the Haleigh Cummings case when Haleigh disappeared? His mom said he saw a man in black that night. In Haleigh's forum, it has been discussed for over a year now and nothing much has come of it.

I have to wonder if maybe baby K came up with a blurb like that in this case that might help a wee bit?

Jr was 3 at the time I believe
 
FWIW, I have cared for 3 children who were eyewitnesses to murder. Ages of children were 5,2, and 11 months. None of them were able to provide any kind of assistance to LE, and nether did they act out the murders in play.
All JMO
 
I can't recall how old "JR" was in the Haleigh Cummings case when Haleigh disappeared? His mom said he saw a man in black that night. In Haleigh's forum, it has been discussed for over a year now and nothing much has come of it.

I have to wonder if maybe baby K came up with a blurb like that in this case that might help a wee bit?

I think Jr was 3 or 4 at the time which is quite a bit older than Baby k.

jmo
 
As some others have said, it all depends on the child. Of my 4 children, only 1 could speak in short sentences by 18 months. He had a great vocabulary and tried to converse with others. He had an exceptional understanding of things going on around him and could remember things that happened a few days before. The other 3 mostly knew simple words, or two-word combinations....like "want cookie," or "big dog." Their concept and memory skills were still in early development stages.
 
MOO - Baby K could be of absolutely no help...

only based on my own experience...I have a 19 month old son right now. He is very verbal - has a great vocabulary for his age. But I still think it would be beyond his comprehension to answer any questions even if done in the most age appropriate manner.

And way too much time has gone by if there was any hope whatsoever that Baby K might indicate something.

Plus there's a good chance she could have been asleep if she were present for anything.

I don't think there would be any reliability to anything from Baby K.
 
I took Normal Language Development and then a second class called Language Disorders as at one time I was going to go into special education. It was from the department of Speech and Language at the college.

It was at least 25 years ago. We had to remember MLU-mean length of utterance.

The way I remembered it was that at a particular month, the child had an MLU of about the age that they were.

So a 19 month old could say 1.9 words. In other words, you take a bunch of words expressed by a child and divide it by the sample.

If you took 10 samples, you divide it by 10.

So a child could say 4 word sentences; one word; 2 words. Whatever to come up with about 1.9 as an MLU.

That is considered "normal".

If your child isn't saying 1.9, then that would indicate a closer look see. Hearing issues? Other issues.

So baby K could be "normal" or be above average. Or she could be below average.

But I agree that the concepts would be related to food, pets, clothes, TV, etc.

And she probably saw nothing and Mommy told her what to see.
 
Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm a social worker currently working in the field of child abuse and neglect, specifically at an agency that does forensic interviewing of children when there is an allegation of abuse/neglect, namely sexual abuse but also physical abuse and children who have witnessed violence. Childrens' advocacy centers (accredited through the National Children's Alliance) are common and I'm wondering whether the investigators in this case might have utilized their services in questioning classmates or other children believed to have pertinent information in this case if there is one in the area.

Our agency's policy is that we will attempt to interview a child beginning around the age of two. However, these interviews are often not very successful, children at this age may have knowledge but like other posters have said, they simply don't have the verbal ability to get it out. In terms of the way in which a child is questioned, this is HUGELY important...questions have to be non-leading, non-suggestive or the interview simply will not hold up in court. This is "best practice" nationwide and if it is not used cases are not likely to hold up in court. Issues of suggestibility and poor questioning were partially responsible for many of the "witch hunts" and false accusations that perpetuated the daycare sexual abuse cases and other hysteria in the 1980s. In terms of what constitutes leading or suggesting...we cannot even mention a name unless the child brings it up first regardless of what evidence/allegations we have.


Further, all children who are interviewed need to meet the criteria of "legal competence" if it is ever a possibility that they will have to testify or that their information will be used in court. This means that they need to demonstrate that they know the difference between the truth and a lie (typically tested through a simple question such as "If someone said this blue crayon was yellow would that be the truth or would that be a lie?"), agree to tell the truth, they need to demonstrate an ability to NOT guess at questions to which they don't know the answer (generally the interviewer explains that it is ok to say 'I don't know' and that we don't want the child to guess, and then tests this by asking "What's my dog's name?") and lastly, they need to be able to agree to correct the interviewer if she says something wrong (this is tested by the interviewer calling the child the wrong name or wrong age).

So, this is an awful lot for a child Baby K's age to have to do if LE is hopeful to get an legally useable and credible information about anything knowledge she may have.
 
Long time lurker, first time poster. I'm a social worker currently working in the field of child abuse and neglect, specifically at an agency that does forensic interviewing of children when there is an allegation of abuse/neglect, namely sexual abuse but also physical abuse and children who have witnessed violence. Childrens' advocacy centers (accredited through the National Children's Alliance) are common and I'm wondering whether the investigators in this case might have utilized their services in questioning classmates or other children believed to have pertinent information in this case if there is one in the area.

Our agency's policy is that we will attempt to interview a child beginning around the age of two. However, these interviews are often not very successful, children at this age may have knowledge but like other posters have said, they simply don't have the verbal ability to get it out. In terms of the way in which a child is questioned, this is HUGELY important...questions have to be non-leading, non-suggestive or the interview simply will not hold up in court. This is "best practice" nationwide and if it is not used cases are not likely to hold up in court. Issues of suggestibility and poor questioning were partially responsible for many of the "witch hunts" and false accusations that perpetuated the daycare sexual abuse cases and other hysteria in the 1980s. In terms of what constitutes leading or suggesting...we cannot even mention a name unless the child brings it up first regardless of what evidence/allegations we have.


Further, all children who are interviewed need to meet the criteria of "legal competence" if it is ever a possibility that they will have to testify or that their information will be used in court. This means that they need to demonstrate that they know the difference between the truth and a lie (typically tested through a simple question such as "If someone said this blue crayon was yellow would that be the truth or would that be a lie?"), agree to tell the truth, they need to demonstrate an ability to NOT guess at questions to which they don't know the answer (generally the interviewer explains that it is ok to say 'I don't know' and that we don't want the child to guess, and then tests this by asking "What's my dog's name?") and lastly, they need to be able to agree to correct the interviewer if she says something wrong (this is tested by the interviewer calling the child the wrong name or wrong age).

So, this is an awful lot for a child Baby K's age to have to do if LE is hopeful to get an legally useable and credible information about anything knowledge she may have.

Great first post, Sarahbert, thanks so much for your valuable input.

I only have one thing to note here, and that is perhaps LE would find it useful to question Baby K, hoping to obtain any useful information on Kyron, while recognizing that it may not be legally useable in a court of law (but nonetheless useful towards the investigation).

Thanks again!
 
My daughter spoke in long sentences and had a huge vocabulary when she was 19 months old but my two sons had only single word utterances and mostly just something that I would understand, other people needed an interpreter. But even my daughter didn't have much of a concept of time, she would tell that something happened "yesterday" although it was a longer time ago, and I don't think she would have been a very reliable witness. She was parroting a lot and generally one could make her say pretty much anything by just repeating it to her often enough.
 

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