ARUBA - Robyn Gardner, 35, Maryland woman missing in Aruba, 2 Aug 2011 - # 2

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Starfish said:
I thought the same thing LOL. But the other pic of her isnt too bad, hardly looks like the one of her with her mom. I would post it, but if you can't copy & paste I'm lost LOL.

Also, on HLN the other night when this mom & daughter were on, hubs said mom claimed she had been modeling for 20 years. I don't think mom looks like the model type either.
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I suppose that print modeling for "larger women's" apparel is a possibility, but even that's a stretch. Most of the models in store advertisements or magazines are much more attractive than either the mother or daughter.
 
Dushi said:
I don't know
Was it consensual?

I can't imagine anyone would be able to determine whether they had aggressive sex against her wishes unless the photos can prove that

If two adults enjoy rough sex and someone gets hurt or dies,has a crime been committed?

If it was rape, i don't know how it could be proven
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Photos will not prove anything. Lots of people indulge in mild fantasy/BDSM. Anyway, these pictures likely don't involve anything like that, they are probably just explicit. The BDSM angle is just speculation being pushed by HatesSociopaths, but I don't think there is anything to back that up.

In any case, whatever was on the camera wouldnt have been related to what eventually happened. If it was you can be sure that deleting it would have been his first priority. Remember, there is a two hour window between when she was last seen and he tried to find help. And everything has to fit into that time frame.
 
"According to the transcript, Giordano told police that he feared for his life when he signaled for Gardner to turn back and didn't look for her as he swam for shore.

"I only looked back when I hit a rock," the document quotes Giordano as telling investigators. "Before that, I did not look back. I was only busy saving my life."

Gardner had been snorkeling before and was a comfortable swimmer, he said. And he showed police scrapes on his legs, but he said he did not know how they happened."

http://www.foxreno.com/news/28905465/detail.html

I wonder how GVG knew that RG had been snorkeling before? Lots of information that I haven't seen regarding questions asked of GVG and some of his answers. Good read.
 
Kamille said:
Did they rent the snorkelling equipment from the Dive Shop? Isn't equipment usually rented by the hour? Wouldn't someone from the shop have gone looking for them if they hadn't returned in two hours?
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They did not rent or buy anything from the dive shop, but that is not to say that he didn't bring equipment for both of them from home.
 
HatesSociopaths said:
I would hope he sticks to the facts as well. Right now his attorney has probably told him that he has a good chance of being released in a couple weeks if no new evidence is found. I imagine he is just hoping her body isn't found and to keep to his original story.
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He may well be wishing that her body would be found so that his story is verified.
 
Starfish said:
So, maybe he could have brought equipment for Robyn to use too. Masks & snorkels are pretty much one size unless you get into custom masks. The fins of course, you need to be the proper size.
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He has three sons that live in with their mom in the same neighborhood where he lives. There's a good chance he had snorkeling gear for them too, so I think it's quite possible he brought along snorkeling gear for both of them.
 
It's so frustrating to get bits & pieces & to not know if the sources can be trusted! Perfect example the blood on the rocks behind the dive shop. I've read it was drops of blood & then a bloody handprint & now Taco Stein says there was no blood. And the condom, first I read unused in the package, then I read it was used & now Taco Stein says no condom!

There's so many little things we don't know that we need to help us with our sleuthing! We haven't heard a thing in regards to what they've found from the items taken from his house. It's driving me crazy! Well one thing I do know is that LE needs to be working day & night on this because their time is limited with holding this guy. I'm hoping that the FBI will make all the difference, they have all the best knowledge & resources.
 
SDT said:
"According to the transcript, Giordano told police that he feared for his life when he signaled for Gardner to turn back and didn't look for her as he swam for shore.

"I only looked back when I hit a rock," the document quotes Giordano as telling investigators. "Before that, I did not look back. I was only busy saving my life."

Gardner had been snorkeling before and was a comfortable swimmer, he said. And he showed police scrapes on his legs, but he said he did not know how they happened."

http://www.foxreno.com/news/28905465/detail.html

I wonder how GVG knew that RG had been snorkeling before? Lots of information that I haven't seen regarding questions asked of GVG and some of his answers. Good read.
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I think that is very believable. I've been caught in dangerous waters with another person and I can assure you we both swam as hard as possible to get to a safer place ... neither of us was checking on the other until at a safe place. Fortunately, we were still together ... and were able to then help each other out of the water.
 
SDT said:
"According to the transcript, Giordano told police that he feared for his life when he signaled for Gardner to turn back and didn't look for her as he swam for shore.

"I only looked back when I hit a rock," the document quotes Giordano as telling investigators. "Before that, I did not look back. I was only busy saving my life."

Gardner had been snorkeling before and was a comfortable swimmer, he said. And he showed police scrapes on his legs, but he said he did not know how they happened."

http://www.foxreno.com/news/28905465/detail.html

I wonder how GVG knew that RG had been snorkeling before? Lots of information that I haven't seen regarding questions asked of GVG and some of his answers. Good read.
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We are assuming that the going snorkeling was his idea, but it may have been hers. Either way, the question of prior experience doing that for both of them would definitely have come up, so it shouldn't be surprising that he would know that.
 
Starfish said:
It's so frustrating to get bits & pieces & to not know if the sources can be trusted! Perfect example the blood on the rocks behind the dive shop. I've read it was drops of blood & then a bloody handprint & now Taco Stein says there was no blood. And the condom, first I read unused in the package, then I read it was used & now Taco Stein says no condom!

There's so many little things we don't know that we need to help us with our sleuthing! We haven't heard a thing in regards to what they've found from the items taken from his house. It's driving me crazy! Well one thing I do know is that LE needs to be working day & night on this because their time is limited with holding this guy. I'm hoping that the FBI will make all the difference, they have all the best knowledge & resources.
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GVG's reputation is down the tubes because of women's statements from previous relationships. The thing to remember is that even though rape is alleged and police have a video of that alleged rape, police chose not to file charges agains GVG. That suggests that the allegation of rape is not as clear cut as suggested. If he did something to Robyn, I would like to see justice served. However, I wouldn't want to see him convicted on the basis of claims made by women he angered in previous relationships.
 
I'm not throwing GVG under the bus yet. We don't know anything about what happened honestly because everything we read gets denied by another interview. I will be glad for RG to be found and this all comes together. JMO
 
otto said:
GVG's reputation is down the tubes because of women's statements from previous relationships. The thing to remember is that even though rape is alleged and police have a video of that alleged rape, police chose not to file charges agains GVG. That suggests that the allegation of rape is not as clear cut as suggested. If he did something to Robyn, I would like to see justice served. However, I wouldn't want to see him convicted on the basis of claims made by women he angered in previous relationships.
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My bolding

Police did pursue it, the women were too terrified to move forward, they had to drop the charges, it was posted here. It has nothing to do with the allegation not being clear cut.

If it was a stranger rape on video, then all they would need was the video, since the women were involved with him at the time, their testimony was crucial to move forward, otherwise he would just say it was a consensual sex tape and walk away. They filed the charges and they could drop the charges, not the same as if it had been a stranger crime.

From what we've heard from multiple places, I can understand them being too terrified of him and what he is capable of. That doesn't mean that it wasn't clear cut.
JMHO
 
Tugela said:
We are assuming that the going snorkeling was his idea, but it may have been hers. Either way, the question of prior experience doing that for both of them would definitely have come up, so it shouldn't be surprising that he would know that.
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It was the boyfriend that claimed Robyn would never get into the water, but who also claimed that she was a strong swimmer. Both can't be true. If she is indeed a strong swimmer, I'm sure her mother has cleared that up. If she's a strong swimmer, then I think it's more likely that she went snorkeling with him and it's also quite possible that they were unaware of the riptides in the area.
 
My kids are all very strong swimmers, they will probably stay strong swimmers.

However, when they get to be 35 they may not like to get in the water and get their hair wet, especially if they put in extensions or have makeup on. Doesn't mean they're not strong swimmers anymore.

I don't like the water as much as I used to and don't usually get my hair wet. If I go in up to my shoulders, I splash water on my face.

JMHO
 
annalia said:
My bolding

Police did pursue it, the women were too terrified to move forward, they had to drop the charges, it was posted here. It has nothing to do with the allegation not being clear cut.

If it was a stranger rape on video, then all they would need was the video, since the women were involved with him at the time, their testimony was crucial to move forward, otherwise he would just say it was a consensual sex tape and walk away. They filed the charges and they could drop the charges, not the same as if it had been a stranger crime.

From what we've heard from multiple places, I can understand them being too terrified of him and what he is capable of. That doesn't mean that it wasn't clear cut.
JMHO
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There is only one woman that has alleged rape. Police don't need permission from a victim to bring rape charges. There is a video of the alleged rape and police obtained that video. If it was a clear case of rape, that much would be obvious, so police would have the responsibility to take a rapist off the streets. The fact that police did not file rape charges suggests to me that whatever happened was not clearly evident to Maryland police as a rape.

If the contents of the video did not indicate a clear rape, then indeed the victim would be required to testify and it has been said that she was afraid to testify. I suppose that means one of two things: she did not have confidence in a conviction; or, she did not believe that a sentence would be long enough to keep her safe.

Either way, police had a video of the alleged assault and did not conclude that it was sufficient to bring rape charges against GVG.
 
otto said:
There is only one woman that has alleged rape. Police don't need permission from a victim to bring rape charges. There is a video of the alleged rape and police obtained that video. If it was a clear case of rape, that much would be obvious, so police would have the responsibility to take a rapist off the streets. The fact that police did not file rape charges suggests to me that whatever happened was not clearly evident to Maryland police as a rape.

If the contents of the video did not indicate a clear rape, then indeed the victim would be required to testify and it has been said that she was afraid to testify. I suppose that means one of two things: she did not have confidence in a conviction; or, she did not believe that a sentence would be long enough to keep her safe.

Either way, police had a video of the alleged assault and did not conclude that it was sufficient to bring rape charges against GVG.
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Were they personally involved with each other at the time?

The last sentence isn't true, articles were posted, police did want to pursue it, they didn't drop it because of lack of sufficient evidence, they had no choice but to drop it because the witness backed out. That happens in other cases too.
 
annalia said:
Were they personally involved with each other at the time?
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Sure ... they were dating, they were at his house. They went into his bedroom where he has video cameras and everything that they did was caught on camera and obtained by police. Police clearly did not have enough evidence, even after reviewing everything that happened in the bedroom, to bring charges.
 
otto said:
It was the boyfriend that claimed Robyn would never get into the water, but who also claimed that she was a strong swimmer. Both can't be true. If she is indeed a strong swimmer, I'm sure her mother has cleared that up. If she's a strong swimmer, then I think it's more likely that she went snorkeling with him and it's also quite possible that they were unaware of the riptides in the area.
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Yes, I heard her bf say that too. I also heard or read that her brother said she would never want to ruin her hair or make-up & would not put her head under water.
 
otto said:
There is only one woman that has alleged rape. Police don't need permission from a victim to bring rape charges. There is a video of the alleged rape and police obtained that video. If it was a clear case of rape, that much would be obvious, so police would have the responsibility to take a rapist off the streets. The fact that police did not file rape charges suggests to me that whatever happened was not clearly evident to Maryland police as a rape.

If the contents of the video did not indicate a clear rape, then indeed the victim would be required to testify and it has been said that she was afraid to testify. I suppose that means one of two things: she did not have confidence in a conviction; or, she did not believe that a sentence would be long enough to keep her safe.

Either way, police had a video of the alleged assault and did not conclude that it was sufficient to bring rape charges against GVG.
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Out of curiosity, what experience or knowledge are you basing all that on?

Can you think of a rape prosecution that has been brought when the victim was unwilling to testify?

Of course, you are correct that prosecutors do not need the "permission" of a victim to prosecute a crime. But in a rape case, where state of mind and victimization are central to the case, the cooperation of the victim is generally essential.

I also happen to agree that this is even more true when the victim and the perp already had a relationship, than with complete stranger cases.

I think it's pretty clear the prior instances of sexual aggression by GVG were not prosecuted because the victims did not want any more pain or trouble.
 
otto said:
They did not rent or buy anything from the dive shop, but that is not to say that he didn't bring equipment for both of them from home.
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I dont know whats going on in this case..well, I mean yeah, im following along with everyone, but still some how confused as to various reports, etc..

what I want to say is this..per snorkel gear..

My husband and I have had the pleasure to snorkel in the Bahamas, in Cancun, In hawaii, and we always take our own snorkel gear with us, we never rent it..
 
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