Sheri Coleman, sons Garett and Gavin murdered 5-5-09, Columbia, IL. Pt9

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who knew? said:
I hadn't heard this but would love to know if anyone has info..

Sorry - I'm catching up and then will be away from the internet for most of the day which means I'll be catching up again late tonight!
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It was posted by a "local" and in response to a "what's new, what's going on" question. Also mentioned a camera mounted on a post.
 
dgfred said:
She seemed to be working on things before this, with financial and marrital counciling... but I really do wonder what the spark was that started this hellstorm. Maybe she found out about affair, financial misdoings or maybe she just got sick and tired of the maniac... something happened to throw his plans out of whack imo. It looks to me like he was planning on doing it, but was rushed and panicked in the cover-up.
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Yeppers, I bet ol C loses sleep at night as he runs the "what ifs" and "if onlys" over and over in his mind. If only I'd remembered to do this, what if I'd done this instead of that, and finally "How did things go so wrong that I may have to live without TL now?" Remember how the fiancee of the Craigslist killer stood by him? I wonder if TL is standing by her man, who brought her such excitement.
 
Bluenotes said:
I'm right handed, but I do just the opposite. I'm somewhat ambidextrous though.
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Bluenotes said:
I must be odd. I hold the bottle with my right hand and twist with my left. I also cross my arms with my left over my right. I can't write at all with my left hand, but I seem to use it a lot. When I played baseball, I could switch hit and I throw/kick well with my left hand/foot when playing sports. My left arm is also my strongest. Weird.
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dgfred said:
I always hold the hot cup with my stronger hand (which is my right) and remove the lid with my weaker hand... but that's just me.
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Ditto to both posters. Thank you, was beginning to think I was "special" lol.

Knox said:
Disturbing thought ... Guess we will have to wait until the trial to see those type of details come out. Where did that info come from?
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This whole thing is beyond disturbing. How for instance there can be some who can hardly bear just the burden of disappointing or injuring even a stranger's feelings, while others evidently can methodically plot and carry out the coldblooded executions of their entire family, of their innocent children... honestly can not seem to wrap my mind or heart around this case, yes profoundly disturbing. :(

:parrot:
 
Sal said:
Yeppers, I bet ol C loses sleep at night as he runs the "what ifs" and "if onlys" over and over in his mind. If only I'd remembered to do this, what if I'd done this instead of that, and finally "How did things go so wrong that I may have to live without TL now?" Remember how the fiancee of the Craigslist killer stood by him? I wonder if TL is standing by her man, who brought her such excitement.
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Yeah, I'm sure he's getting some pretty good 20/20 hindsight, as most murderers do. Which is fine by me, as long as they are going to do the crime, I'd much rather they see their mistakes after than prior. He's going to have plenty of time to ponder the woulda, shoulda, coulda's. Too bad the same can't be said for Sheri, Garett and Gavin.

All of that, and for what? Too bad he didn't consider the consequences of his actions prior to acting on them. But then again, too bad all of these murderers didn't do the same. If they did, we'd be here exchanging receipes and discussing our favorite books and there would be no need for Crime Sleuthing, which would be fine by me, I love to eat and read. Sometimes I do both at the same time!! (When hubby's not here the computer desk converts to a table..... heh, heh...... shhhhh........ don't tell him, I have him convinced the bread crumbs on the keyboard are left by elves!)

:cool: ~TCO~
 
Hallo All,

Well, it is the 12th and someone said it took several days for transcripts. Are there any signs of prelim transcripts anywhere? If so...can we snatch these pronto? Anyone have transcripts?

Let us hope that these transcripts can be displayed publically and do not have a copyright kinda thing on them :( IF they do...then we must have reporters who will dilligently comb them and report on the new info, knowing what is really knew and isn't.
 
Greetings Kiki the doll :)

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3859888&postcount=21"]I mentioned the bit of mattress that was gotten during the SW.[/ame] You wrote:

kiki the parrot said:

(snipped) I believe it will turn out to be fresh too. It could also be from SC. In last thread, Part 8, I posted link describing bloody discharge which can come from nose and mouth of a ligature strangulation victim. Gmab after learning the window of TOD in this case was between 11pm and 3am, it's clear CC lacks a brain AND a heart...

http://www.corpus-delicti.com/ligature.html

:parrot:
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Yes, I remember having read your post about ligature strangulation and blood, and took that into account.

I think that the important thing here will be if the blood was fresh, and if it was CC's blood, i.e. perhaps from abrasion and/or scratches on right forearm. There is, of course, no indication from where on the mattress that bit was cut. i.e. we do not know where that was in proximity to Sheri's body. The snip of mattress may have been taken to help determine time of death (if that can occur, I do not know), BUT IF it was fresh blood and IF it was CC's blood, well then how will that be explained away (particularly because CC had no explanation at first for the injury, then he had the banging on the guerney explanation).

My guess is that they swabbed Sheri's body looking for information too. I venture to what if he did a strangle hold to drop her, she injured his forearm, he picked her up and put her in bed and then ligature strangled (i.e. could some of his blood have come off on her body from that abrasion/scratches). I also venture to the possibility of the rumor of a hanger used in strangling, might he have begun with a wire hanger from the closet, and in his haste of using it, it spun around and scratched his arm? We do not know what this red mark or the scratches looked like or their direction.

A further guess would be that CC gave the arm a good scrub when at the gym, hoping to remove any connection between how he got it.
 
IIRC, there was mention that Sheri's jaw was broken. If Sheri & CC were fighting downstairs and Sheri went upstairs to get her things and wake the boys to leave. . .
CC followed her up stairs and when he approached her, she went for the phone. He grabbed her and she scratched him before he slammed her in the jaw, knocking her unconscious and causing blood to flow from her mouth & nose. He threw her on to the bed, stomach down, pinning her arms with his knees, and strangled her with ???

The blood flowing from her mouth would have stained the sheet & mattress. Did he undress her after the fact to make it look like a sexual attack? Or to get rid of the clothes she was wearing?

(This dramatic recreation is based in part on what happened when I was attacked. First I retreated, then I tried to flee, tried to fight and the attack escalated - I imagine that if she was awake the same scenario could be possible.)
 
DomCasual said:
I would bet you a dollar it isn't much different than last Sunday.

These don't seem like the kind of folks that care about little things like overwhelming evidence.

Sorry, but I'm still bugged about the whole "not-going-to-bother-talking-to-the-family-with-the-murdered-daughter-and-grandsons" thing.
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Seriously. Or little things like common decency. What a family.
 
I am well over a week behind now and will have to catch up! Ugh! (Missed you guys~:blowkiss:)

I saw they found the threat came from Chris' work computer. (Imagine that?!) I sadly saw there were horrible things painted on the bed, too. :(

What else have I missed?!
 
I was gone a few days over illness and then computer issues. Ughh. Just learned that someone close to me is going to be in Chester next week - like 3 days, maybe 4, on business, but working with a lot of locals. I have deputized them to be a Sleuther and given them some prompts to get some conversations going, if possible. Should be interesting to get in some reports.

Now, I got caught up. I have a lot of thoughts, but nothing not already mentioned. I am planning on being at the trial, if it is hear, and who knows if moved, maybe even then, depending on where it is. Luckily WLR has friends all over IL, LOL.

I hope you all have a grand weekend. I am off a couple days to enjoy some outdoor fun and see some old friends.
 
WholeLottaRosie said:
I was gone a few days over illness and then computer issues. Ughh. Just learned that someone close to me is going to be in Chester next week - like 3 days, maybe 4, on business, but working with a lot of locals. I have deputized them to be a Sleuther and given them some prompts to get some conversations going, if possible. Should be interesting to get in some reports.

Now, I got caught up. I have a lot of thoughts, but nothing not already mentioned. I am planning on being at the trial, if it is hear, and who knows if moved, maybe even then, depending on where it is. Luckily WLR has friends all over IL, LOL.

I hope you all have a grand weekend. I am off a couple days to enjoy some outdoor fun and see some old friends.
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Glad you and your 'puter are feeling better! Can't wait to hear what your deputy finds out. Most of all, I am darn near to covetous of your time off in the yonder. . . These are the times when I reminisce about growing up in northeastern PA :) Have Fun!!!!!
 
I am hugely distressed after listening to RC's last two sermons. In particular, I listened to the messages:

Putting on Truth part 1 Air Date 6.7.09
Putting on Truth part 2 Air Date 6.14.09

After spending hours of note taking and consideration, after writing several very thoughtful pages detailing info (which I have decided not to post, people don't like long posts), I am just going to say that I believe RC knows that his son murdered Sheri and the children and that he thinks CC has asked forgiveness, and wants everyone to now "leave it alone" (his words).

You have to listen to the above sermons to hear what I am talking about.

In a nutshell, it is as if RC is saying, "Leave him alone, he privately asked for forgiveness." There is much more to that which is "heard" in those sermons, there is some very deep error...deception.
 
Wrinkles said:
I am hugely distressed after listening to RC's last two sermons. In particular, I listened to the messages:

Putting on Truth part 1 Air Date 6.7.09
Putting on Truth part 2 Air Date 6.14.09

After spending hours of note taking and consideration, after writing several very thoughtful pages detailing info (which I have decided not to post, people don't like long posts), I am just going to say that I believe RC knows that his son murdered Sheri and the children and that he thinks CC has asked forgiveness, and wants everyone to now "leave it alone" (his words).

You have to listen to the above sermons to hear what I am talking about.

In a nutshell, it is as if RC is saying, "Leave him alone, he privately asked for forgiveness." There is much more to that which is "heard" in those sermons, there is some very deep error...deception.
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That's an incredibly amazing stretch and I've listened to both sermons! :eek:

We can "find" whatever we want to if we're suspicious enough. :rolleyes:

The "belt of truth" .... perhaps a study of the "belt of truth" would eradicate all those pesky suspicions and faulty interpretations.

There is no deception or error, only for those suspicious enough and blood-thirsty enough to imagine them.

..... selah
 
analytical said:
That's an incredibly amazing stretch and I've listened to both sermons! :eek:

We can "find" whatever we want to if we're suspicious enough. :rolleyes:

The "belt of truth" .... perhaps a study of the "belt of truth" would eradicate all those pesky suspicions and faulty interpretations.

There is no deception or error, only for those suspicious enough and blood-thirsty enough to imagine them.

..... selah
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I agree. No one can ascertain what his father preached and what is related to his son.

He isn't going to include his son's guilt in his spoken word. It is a given.

The problem comes from the facts in this case. His word based on his son's word which right now is slapping him in the face. (If it isn't...then he needs some real scripture read to him because JMM saw it right off!)

Crow?! Seems it is a must.
 
SeriouslySearching said:
I agree. No one can ascertain what his father preached and what is related to his son.

He isn't going to include his son's guilt in his spoken word. It is a given.

The problem comes from the facts in this case. His word based on his son's word which right now is slapping him in the face. (If it isn't...then he needs some real scripture read to him because JMM saw it right off!)

Crow?! Seems it is a must.
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There's nothing better than agreeing to disagree!
 
analytical said:
That's an incredibly amazing stretch and I've listened to both sermons! :eek:

We can "find" whatever we want to if we're suspicious enough. :rolleyes:

The "belt of truth" .... perhaps a study of the "belt of truth" would eradicate all those pesky suspicions and faulty interpretations.

There is no deception or error, only for those suspicious enough and blood-thirsty enough to imagine them.

..... selah
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Welcome back, Analytical....I miss your posts....they keep me thinking outside the box and obvious
 
There was an an article in the Post Dispatch this morning about JM and her divorce policy and the Coleman murders that I think most of us will find interesting reading:

http://www.stltoday.com/stltoday/ne...5BB1245EEE3DEE1C862575D40008AD3E?OpenDocument

For those of you who are outside the St Louis area, the PD ran a very enlightening expose of JM and JMM several years ago. It basically exposed her lavish lifestyle. I am sure JMM and the PD are still not on speaking terms. In fact, throughout the course of the the last few weeks whatever comments we have received from reps at JMM seem to have been gathered by the Belleville News Democrat (bnd.com) which is probably the largest paper on the IL side of the river in the area.

One thing that I do find interesting is the first comment on article mentioning that the JM family has had more than it's share of divorces....which I think has been established on this thread. To me, this is hypocritical.

The reporter that wrote the article is the religion editor of the PD, not someone who has been following the case for the PD on an everyday basis.
 
Sal said:
PG, I'm curious when your NPD ex was saying all this, was he acting it out too? You didn't feel anything was wrong? My ex was NPD, too, and said all those things but life just didn't "feel" right. Now, I was one of those dummies who let denial take over and I pushed facts way to the back, which SC may have done. I'm just sayin. And seeing as how they'd had counseling before for a "small" prob, SC may have just thought it was another "small" prob and that it would blow over, or if it continued, they'd seek counseling again. SC may not have ever imagined it was cheating, just that niggling little idea in the back of her mind that somethin jes weren't right! Or, she may have been so caught up in her own world of kids/trips/whatever and have come to not give 2 hoots about what DH was up to. ?????????????????????????
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Hi Sal,
Things did not feel right, but he managed to turn any discussion into a listing of my short-fallings. So I would pray and resolve to be a better wife. Just what he counted on. SC probably sensed things were off, but had no idea just how off, and like you say, when focusing on the kids it can give you an excuse not to meet the bigger problems straight on. Hard to say what SC thought, and exactly how CC acted it he home, but I'll bet she had no idea that he was stepping out at all, least of all planning to move on with TL whether through divorce or murder.

If I had to speculate, the "one problem" was probably a down-play on his part. She may have found his *advertiser censored* stash (and if he was exchanging raunchy stuff with TL it was probably a pattern of behaviour) or caught him cheating with someone prior to TL (again, these guys have a pattern), and talked him into counselling.

My prediction if he doesn't plea out, is that at some point CC will state that SC was cheating on him. He will want to justify his own actions and also try to misdirect and to attempt to paint himself as the wronged party.
 
Wrinkles said:
I am hugely distressed after listening to RC's last two sermons. In particular, I listened to the messages:

Putting on Truth part 1 Air Date 6.7.09
Putting on Truth part 2 Air Date 6.14.09

After spending hours of note taking and consideration, after writing several very thoughtful pages detailing info (which I have decided not to post, people don't like long posts), I am just going to say that I believe RC knows that his son murdered Sheri and the children and that he thinks CC has asked forgiveness, and wants everyone to now "leave it alone" (his words).

You have to listen to the above sermons to hear what I am talking about.

In a nutshell, it is as if RC is saying, "Leave him alone, he privately asked for forgiveness." There is much more to that which is "heard" in those sermons, there is some very deep error...deception.
Click to expand...

I listened and agree - I commented on this in post #32 on this thread.
RC manipulates scripture (and the congregation) in an attempt to subvert the natural abhorrence his followers must feel, by chastising them with guilt & shame and commanding forgiveness (and a vow of silence) and never addressing the reality of the tragedy with repentance, humility or prayer for REAL PEOPLE who are in the middle of this tragedy.

It's the same kind of hypocrisy that allows JMM to justify one set of rules for her family and another for the rest of the world. They truly believe that they are entitled to lie, cheat and destroy as long as it furthers their "Kingdom".

If this sounds harsh, think about it. Purposefully hiding the truth is deception. Building a personal empire with the funds sent for charity is stealing. Not paying taxes on personal wealth far beyond the legal definition is cheating. CC, her right hand man, destroyed his family rather than lose his job. This destruction is epic on a spiritual level that the leaders of these ministries are desperate to hide.

God will not be mocked.
 
SeriouslySearching said:
I am well over a week behind now and will have to catch up! Ugh! (Missed you guys~:blowkiss:)

I saw they found the threat came from Chris' work computer. (Imagine that?!) I sadly saw there were horrible things painted on the bed, too. :(

What else have I missed?!
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Glad to have you back SS! It was revealed in the prelim that CC had told TL that SC would be served with divorce papers on May 5 and that LE found the face of the DVR off the highway between the home and the gym. Reiterated TOD was likely between 11 PM and 3 AM and certainly before 5 AM. Also have surveillance video from a neighbor's residence showing that CC was the only person seen leaving his home at 5:43 AM.

I personally feel they have much more evidence they're saving for trial - if it comes to that.
 
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