Deceased/Not Found CA - Sierra LaMar, 15, Morgan Hill, 16 March 2012 #5 *A. Garcia-Torres guilty*

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IHAVENOCLUE said:
Thank you, 90nine!
My father has Alzheimer's, and his wandering is a concern of ours.
I am going to bring this to the attention of my family!

And...do you think I can get this system for my cowboy boots?
:bud: :bud: :cowboy: :cowboy: :seeya:
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I believe you can! Giddyup!!
 
IHAVENOCLUE said:
Wow, JDB!
You have me intrigued. What kind of job requires you to wear an ankle bracelet that zaps?:waitasec:
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It is a joke honest all though sometimes I swear as soon as I walk away from desk the phone rings.
 
cluciano63 said:
I don't know...my cat came with a chip as all shelter cats do here...but it only will give the info of his owner...as far as a GPA needing charging, perhaps now they don't? But the ones you buy for your car charge in a lighter, for example, at least some of them...

Anyway...
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Long story off topic about microchips and updating chip info...good story though..

Speaking of microchips and animals - I can't encourage people enough to make sure they update their information on the chip or they are almost useless. I can't tell you how many times I've rescued a lost dog, taken them to the vet for a scan, and the owner information is completely out of date and sometimes even out of state. Actually it's happened every time...and I've done it probably 5 times just this past year.

Thank God I'm a sleuther and my job requires me to do it for a living, so I have tools...but it takes almost an entire day to do the research to find the owner and let them know I have their beloved.

I recently had a situation where the father bought the dog for the son several years ago, son didn't want the dog (son's name on microchip), son too young to come up on a background, I had to put all of the information together, research family on the internet, use an obituatuary to find a family member name based upon the survived by name (being the kids name on the chip) on the obituary and contact the sister of the deceased out of state in Texas...say 'hi' I'm so sorry about the loss your sister but I have your brother in laws dog (dad of the son). I called the vet hospitals in the area indicated on the chip (over an hour from me)..found the dogs hospital, they gave me the name of the dad, but the number on the vet records was that of his deceased wife - her cell number). Turns out the dog ended up being his wifes dog (the woman who recently passed - she took over after the son didn't want the dog)...the dad came into my town to spend Christmas with his family about a half mile from my house...the dog had substantial separation anxiety because of the wife passing and wouldn't let the dad out of site. He had to run an errand and put the dog in the guest house...the dog escaped (beautiful GSD) and was heading towards the freeway to go home to find the dad...They ened up being a LE family and all were crying when they got the dog back...very emotional moment and so nice because they said they thought they were not going to have a dog for Christmas...especially since his wife had just passed in late October.

That was the most complex missing dog case I have worked lol, but a good reminder to update the information on the microchip.

whew!
 
sarx said:
They are finding hundreds of items each day during these searches, every piece of trash that has been dropped, dumped, left, teen drinking, partying and sex hang outs, roadside trash, and on and on. As someone that has the pleasure of doing these types of searches, I can say that I have come across pretty much everything under the sun, including, but certainly not limited to-drugs, weapons, all types of clothes, including underwear, areas used for bathrooms with all sorts of lovely items, all things related to sex, bedding, bags, stolen goods. Getting the picture? The media does an awesome job of taking something that will make for a good story and connecting it to the case they're covering. There is generally no connection....
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Just catching up, I have a couple thoughts so far so am using this post as a jump-off.

First, as a runner I can totally relate to this. I grew up in a suburban/semi-rural "town" along the old Appalachian Trail. I ran long-distance is h.s. and college so I ran up, down,and all along the mountain, on two-lane roads, the appalachian trail, and old (dirt) logging roads...and boy did I see some interesting stuff along the way. :blushing: Some of it was pretty obviously party leftovers, but also I came across at least 2 long-abandoned cars.

Second, I realize no one has been talking about this for a while, but the clothes in the bag...it seemed to me like a lot of people thought it was odd that underwear were in there as well. Maybe it was just me but in high school, when I participated in PE or sports and then changed back into my school clothes afterward, I always changed my underwear too even if I didn't get to shower. (I bet your lives are all complete now that you know this! :blushing:) I just didn't think it was that unusual I guess. Not that it matters because I'm sure we could all think of 5 reasons why it was weird, and 5 equally good reasons that it was normal.
 
I'm sorry but what does all this talk of microchips and GPS tracking devices have to do with finding Sierra?
 
RabidBadger said:
I'm sorry but what does all this talk of microchips and GPS tracking devices have to do with finding Sierra?
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Unfortunately, a GPS device is not going to help Sierra now but just as a doctor should treat the cause of the disease and how to prevent it, and not just the symptoms, had GPS been in place, Sierra might be home tonight with her family or out enjoying the weekend with her friends.
 
90Nine said:
Do you every watch Unusual Suspects on ID? I was watching it last night (catching up on 5 episodes) and all of the people ultimately responsible for people going missing and ultimately their murders, were people who were interviewed originally by LE (including FBI). One of the stories actually included a FBI employee. It turned out one of the neighbors, although never conviced, had several sexual assault attemps that were dismissed. But they only questioned people, didn't do backgrounds. He was initially interviewed by the FBI on the first day of the murder. It took 2 years for them to figure out that it was him. And it was only because he go defensive upon the 2nd questioning when they went back to start over 2 years later. It was only his behavior that raised their suspicion, nothing else. This murder happened shortly after the FBI employee (their admin) moved into this new home.


I guess what I'm saying is that we know the likelihood of her being abducted by someone she know is very high. Or someone in the area...we also know that a lot of these cases involve some type of change in a persons life, either a relocation, life change, legal or emotional issues that have come up...we see this in SO many cases...a lot of the time there is some type of deviation from the norm when these things happen.

She may have had interactions (casual that she likely wouldn't have even thought about to mention, i.e., the landlord since they were renting, someone who helps maintain the property since it is so large, gardener, student, love interest, students at her new school, a house sold and closed across the street one week before this happened - not implying anything here). Sometimes it takes a long time for this information to come out and, as I mentioned above, people can pass initial interviews easily.

Someone could have come to the house that morning (like one of the above mentioned people) and she was running out the door...they offered her a ride.

I really believe it was someone she knew. Especially since her scent ended at the driveway.

I also believe in another theory could be she intended to do something that night and that is the reason she had the clothes with her and something went wrong with that. It's a change in her normal schedule...we see these things happen when there is a change in the normal schedule.

There is so much they are not telling us...it's too bad we have minimal victimology to go off.

Just my .02 :twocents:
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Yes, I think it was someone she was casually aquainted with...

I also think it is significant that she was in a new environment. She was perhaps too distracted to notice that someone was watching her... Agree also that people can and do fool LE at times...MOO
 
90Nine said:
Do you every watch Unusual Suspects on ID? I was watching it last night (catching up on 5 episodes) and all of the people ultimately responsible for people going missing and ultimately their murders, were people who were interviewed originally by LE (including FBI). One of the stories actually included a FBI employee. It turned out one of the neighbors, although never conviced, had several sexual assault attemps that were dismissed. But they only questioned people, didn't do backgrounds. He was initially interviewed by the FBI on the first day of the murder. It took 2 years for them to figure out that it was him. And it was only because he go defensive upon the 2nd questioning when they went back to start over 2 years later. It was only his behavior that raised their suspicion, nothing else. This murder happened shortly after the FBI employee (their admin) moved into this new home.


I guess what I'm saying is that we know the likelihood of her being abducted by someone she know is very high. Or someone in the area...we also know that a lot of these cases involve some type of change in a persons life, either a relocation, life change, legal or emotional issues that have come up...we see this in SO many cases...a lot of the time there is some type of deviation from the norm when these things happen.

She may have had interactions (casual that she likely wouldn't have even thought about to mention, i.e., the landlord since they were renting, someone who helps maintain the property since it is so large, gardener, student, love interest, students at her new school, a house sold and closed across the street one week before this happened - not implying anything here). Sometimes it takes a long time for this information to come out and, as I mentioned above, people can pass initial interviews easily.

Someone could have come to the house that morning (like one of the above mentioned people) and she was running out the door...they offered her a ride.

I really believe it was someone she knew. Especially since her scent ended at the driveway.

I also believe in another theory could be she intended to do something that night and that is the reason she had the clothes with her and something went wrong with that. It's a change in her normal schedule...we see these things happen when there is a change in the normal schedule.

There is so much they are not telling us...it's too bad we have minimal victimology to go off.

Just my .02 :twocents:
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Hi 90Nine, I agree and Sandra Cantu comes to mind as an example.

If there were an abduction scene, her being taken against her will, I would think differently. No, I think someone she knew from somewhere offered her a ride. Maybe a teacher or a friend's big brother. Just sayin'.


ETA: Hi Ocean ;} What a great lead about that guy. It could be he had his eye on her and offered her a ride to the bus stop. I'll have to see how far away that is - a block or 2 I think. If he had been hanging at the bus stop I wonder if he had ever talked to her? And why would he be there?

I am kind of surprised LE allowed that journo to include that comment in the news report.
 
scandi said:
Hi 90Nine, I agree and Sandra Cantu comes to mind as an example.

If there were an abduction scene, her being taken against her will, I would think differently. No, I think someone she knew from somewhere offered her a ride. Maybe a teacher or a friend's big brother. Just sayin'.
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But sadly there doesnt have to be an abduction scene. There wasnt one in Sandra Cantu's case. All they had of her was a camera shot of her skipping across the road going out of sight of the camera never to be seen alive again.

And there was no evidence of an abduction in the Carlie Brushia case. She would have been gone without a trace if there hadnt been a surveillance camera at the carwash which showed Joesph Smith taking her by the arm and leading her away never to be seen alive again.

IMO
 
oceanblueeyes said:
But sadly there doesnt have to be an abduction scene. There wasnt one in Sandra Cantu's case. All they had of her was a camera shot of her skipping across the road going out of sight of the camera never to be seen alive again.

And there was no evidence of an abduction in the Carlie Brushia case. She would have been gone without a trace if there hadnt been a surveillance camera at the carwash which showed Joesph Smith taking her by the arm and leading her away never to be seen alive again.

IMO
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Yea, I thought about that. Sandra knew that lady from the church and I think she lived down around the corner.
 
scandi said:
Hi 90Nine, I agree and Sandra Cantu comes to mind as an example.

If there were an abduction scene, her being taken against her will, I would think differently. No, I think someone she knew from somewhere offered her a ride. Maybe a teacher or a friend's big brother. Just sayin'.


ETA: Hi Ocean ;} What a great lead about that guy. It could be he had his eye on her and offered her a ride to the bus stop. I'll have to see how far away that is - a block or 2 I think. If he had been hanging at the bus stop I wonder if he had ever talked to her? And why would he be there?

I am kind of surprised LE allowed that journo to include that comment in the news report.
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Hi there sweet friend!

She was the only one that caught the bus there. He had to be there because Sierra was there. Frightening and now it seems he has disappeared. This is not looking good at all.

IMO
 
scandi said:
Yea, I thought about that. Sandra knew that lady from the church and I think she lived down around the corner.
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Yes, that is true. She knew her because they lived in the same trailer park and Sandra would come sit on the porch and play with Huckaby's 5 year old daughter. She didnt know her well, I dont think, but Sandra was such a trusting liittle soul and was friends with everyone there.

IMO
 
scandi said:
Hi 90Nine, I agree and Sandra Cantu comes to mind as an example.

If there were an abduction scene, her being taken against her will, I would think differently. No, I think someone she knew from somewhere offered her a ride. Maybe a teacher or a friend's big brother. Just sayin'.


ETA: Hi Ocean ;} What a great lead about that guy. It could be he had his eye on her and offered her a ride to the bus stop. I'll have to see how far away that is - a block or 2 I think. If he had been hanging at the bus stop I wonder if he had ever talked to her? And why would he be there?

I am kind of surprised LE allowed that journo to include that comment in the news report.
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Hi Scandi,

Yes, absolutely great lead (thank you Oceanblueyes). It seems to be quite significant if true.

The bus stop is little more than a quarter of a mile around the corner from her home. More significantly, she is the only child to take the bus from that location. So it's very curious that someone would be there talking with her all the time.
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I came across this video.

Listen to what a farm worker says in the video.

He describes a man that he saw often at the bus stop and has not seen him since Sierra went missing.

He describes him as a white man, long hair with black jeans, black shirt or jacket.

This is the first time I have heard about the man at the bus stop.

http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/vi...pkey=fb7d1868-b268-4869-a68c-1154ebb388b1||||
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Wow! That's strange. I hadn't seen that before. I had heard mention that she was the only child at that bus stop.
 
If he has seen the other guy there with her then certainly others have also. Could he be lying?
 
oceanblueeyes said:
I came across this video.

Listen to what a farm worker says in the video.

He describes a man that he saw often at the bus stop and has not seen him since Sierra went missing.

He describes him as a white man, long hair with black jeans, black shirt or jacket.

This is the first time I have heard about the man at the bus stop.

http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/vi...pkey=fb7d1868-b268-4869-a68c-1154ebb388b1||||
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OceanBlue Eyes,
Great catch. I have not heard this before... Would have thought that Sierra's bus driver would have noticed him at the bus stop ? An adult at a school bus stop where only one child gets on ?

Wonder if he somehow got her address ? Also, this would mean that the farm worker was watching her too,right ?
 
This is what was said in the video: Friday they also spent time talking to neighbors. One man says he usually sees a white man with long hair at the bus stop, but hasn't seen him since Sierra disappeared. The man interviewed then says: "He usually wear like black jeans, black shirt or black jacket you know so."
http://www.bing.com/videos/watch/vid...b1||||

Is this man a neighbor or a worker in the area? Hmmm....
 
Caligram said:
I still don't think that the search being done locally is going to lead to Sierra. I think that the change of clothing was either for plans she had for after school, or that they had been left in the bag from a previous day. The neatly folded doesn't puzzle me. If I were going to take a change of clothing with me and only had a cloth bag, I would make sure to fold that clothing very neatly. Why bring a change of clothing if you are just going to them haphazardly in a bag. The clothes would look like you slept in them. Well, if going to another girl’s house later I guess that wouldn't matter. But Sierra had to have another small bag with her personal effects ...toothbrush, toothpaste?, deodorant, hairbrush, makeup, cell phone charger. If she was going to her father's she probably has her own set of personal items there. So, the spare clothing is not much of a statement in my mind. Also, I disagree with the suggestions that this may be a military man just because the clothing was "neatly folded". Our military have enough bad reps as it is. My heart goes out to them and their own personal wars. I think the reason LE originally added those folded words was to suggest that she had made plans for later, thus she took off with someone she knew.
She has been missing too long to consider that she is being held captive somewhere. I think that the faint hope of an escape is just wishful thinking. I think that Sierra was taken to a distant remote place where she was “used” and then murdered. No witnesses. That person(s) would most likely want to delay discovery for as long as possible to make collecting trace evidence difficult. If this was a "thrill killing" then she may be found out in the open, so the monster could sit back and re-live his experience as the story unfolds on TV. There hasn't been any outrageous behavior being displayed, and she hasn't been found yet, so I don’t believe that this was a done for thrills. I think this perp is going to avoid publicity. I think that if/when Sierra is found, it may be depicted as another “unidentified body” discovered accidentally by a hiker, a hunter, or some other unfortunate person who wasn't out looking for dead people.
On the possibility that Sierra knew the person she went with, once she got in that car she had to be immediately subdued - and that's what puzzles me. The gun threat is hard to imagine, unless this was pre-planned. How many low-life molesters are out and about in that area with guns.
I don't believe the handcuff/condom discovery had anything to do with this case. If anything, it appears to me as a cruel teenage type prank.
IMHO
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Agree with alot of your summations. What bothers me is what is being reported as the routine on this. Since she was only at this location since October (6 months, and many holiday breaks in school), not sure what routine can be established. (I have a child walking to a bus so I can relate to this). 1) The mother leaves at 6:00 on that day. Is that every day? 2) if so, how does the child get to the stop under all conditions? Nothing is reported except assumed that she walks that distance to the stop, every day. 3) What is the time to walk that distance for a 15 YO at a normal pace? 4) what happens in bad weather? That looks like alot of open area no shelter. how does someone get to that bus stop in bad weather, rain? I will drive mine a couple blocks in rain/snow/cold and wait in car until bus arrives. Also October-March was daylight savings time, and not very light out at that time in that latitude. Did the family trust her walking to the bus in these conditions? 5) Interview the regular bus driver, was she always waiting outside for the bus? In bad weather did she wait in car, make/model of car she exited to get the bus? if not family, who was it?
6) was there a substitute bus driver at any time during this period (October-March) that could have become familiar with the riders and their locations (in bad weather or certain days our driver will go off route a few blocks to drive ours closer to home, drivers are familiar with riders homes). 7) Why no school books located? Mine caries a ton back and forth to the bus, yet none are reported missing. 8) On the dogs scent only tracing only to the end of the driveway it appears from the photos posted earlier that this is the end of an oval of a large building or a complex. Why is there no trace of scent earlier than this past this point, for say a day earlier, Thursday, Wednesday, Tuesday or Monday? Did she ever walk beyond this point? 9) From the posted pics there appears 2 adjacent large industrial buildings with a common access road, taken during the day with many cars parked. Any interviews with workers in these buildings who may have been driving/commuting past during this time, 10) On "immediately subdued", using a stun gun perhaps? How/who is this obtained? 11) Agree that the handcuff box is likely not related.
 
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