NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 7

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armywife210 said:
I think the very fact that the only thing that's really missing is the alcohol shows that the reason she fled was because she just didn't want to get caught driving with all that alcohol, some of it being opened. I don't even know that she was necessarily all that intoxicated. She may have been but either way she'd need to ditch the alcohol. I have always thought that she trusted the wrong person, or the wrong person got a hold of her. I do think she was still alive for the call to her bf's cell. But I think by 2 days later her cell would have been dead so she would have had to use a landline. Maybe a perp stopped at a truck stop and she told him she had to use the bathroom. Maybe she was able to get to a pay phone.
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I wonder if she left her phone charger in the car. If I recall correctly, the call to the bf's phone was about 2 days after the car accident. Perhaps, she was staying with someone?
 
If I remember correctly, the charger was left in the car, along with a lot of personal items that meant a great deal to her (some jewelry given to her by her BF, and a stuffed monkey, also from her BF that she slept with. All she seems to have taken was the alcohol and whatever else happened to be in her backpack...such as her wallet. She used a backpack as a purse, so she probably just put the alcohol in it too. This further supports the theory that she was just trying to ditch the alcohol and MAYBE put some time between the accident and the conversation between her/police because she had alcohol on her breath and wine spilled in her car.
In my opinion she didn't intend to stay gone. If she did, she wouldn't have left her belongings that meant enough to her to bring with her on the trip. She also wouldn't have taken the time to print off an accident report (that was found in her car), and brought her school books.
I don't think she froze to death because I can't see her going that far into the woods to ditch the alcohol and perhaps wait a bit with all the snow.
 
McSpy said:
In my opinion, the rag doesn't mean anything. I don't think it has anything to do with her disappearance. It is like the packed boxes in her dorm room. There is probably an innocent explanation. IMO, whatever happened to her happened after she left the scene of her car accident in NH. I believe she may have been hit by a car, succumbed to the elements, or had met with foul play. This is all my opinion---so far.
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I agree. I don't think her plans beforehand have anything to do with what happened to her. The only reason I thought the rag was significant was in determining whether or not something happened to her right at the crash site or later on after she left. For example, if she put the rag in the tailpipe herself then she made it away from the car on her own, as opposed to someone abducting her from the scene. I guess the fact that she took the alcohol bottles was enough to indicate that. Either way, I guess it doesn't matter much.

Another way that the rag could have been a tad bit helpful would be in determining what her plans were. I had never heard of someone using a rag like this before, so what I was wondering was whether or not it was an indication that she planned to have the car towed, or whether it meant something else specific. My thought was that it might help to determine what Maura planned to do - walk to a place with a signal? Hitchhike? etc., so I thought it might have given us some indication about where she could have been walking and whether or not she did just go into the woods. That was the main theory I was trying to examine with that thought - if she went into the woods to die, she wouldn't have cared what happened to her car. It looks to me that she did walk away from the scene but did not plan to be gone for long, but regardless of what her exact plans were at this point, something else obviously happened to her instead.

My theory has always been that she was picked up by someone, either willingly or not, as opposed to being hit by a car or succumbing to the elements. It just seems like the most likely scenario.
 
McSpy said:
I wonder if she left her phone charger in the car. If I recall correctly, the call to the bf's phone was about 2 days after the car accident. Perhaps, she was staying with someone?
Click to expand...

Yeah the whole "other person theory"... how was Maura communicating with this person? Obviously not cellphone. Probably not email although she could have had a "secret" account or something.

I just don't see it.
 
goldiegirl said:
My theory has always been that she was picked up by someone, either willingly or not, as opposed to being hit by a car or succumbing to the elements. It just seems like the most likely scenario.
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They had a very similar case to Maura's on this thread, a young woman's car found by the side of the road with a flat tire, and she had just vanished. As it turns, there was a guy going around in a fake cop car and uniform and he abducted and murdered her... they found her body in a freezer he had rented and it was found just by chance.

The fact that it's so similar to Maura's case, coupled with what happened to Brianna Maitland (sp?), makes the hairs stand up on the back of my neck. I honestly wonder if we'll ever know.

Someone even made a post of various people in the NH area caught driving around impersonating police.
 
Those are some creepy cases about the police impersonators. Reminds me of the first case of its kind I ever heard about, with Craig Peyer and Cara Knott.

Anyway, I've never thought the Brianna Maitland case and Maura's case were related, but I guess it can't be ruled out. I guess I discounted the theory of Maura's getting into the car with someone she thought was a police officer because of her having the alcohol on her and not wanting the bus driver to call the police, but I guess anything is possible, especially with those other incidents in the area.

In answer to the question about how to know whether or not someone is really a cop - after the Cara Knott case, I remember there were a few phone numbers out there that motorists could supposedly call to confirm or something like that, but I don't think any of them turned out to be real. Others say to call the department to see whether or not they really have an officer in the area and to wait to pull over until you are in a safe place, but that's not so easy to do with the threat of a charge of evading the police as a possibility. Anyway - that's a different topic.
 
If it is a marked unit, then it is likely a real cop. If an unmarked car with flasher tries to pull you over, you can call 911 to check on the unit, you can ask for a marked unit and a uniformed officer to back up the unmarked car, or you can drive (within the speed limit) to the nearest police station. It's tougher in a rural area, where 911 headquarters might be miles away and there is often only one or two police units and no real police station to drive to. If you pull over in an area you don't know or where there is no police office, the best thing might be to look for a well-lighted convenience store or other business and keep windows and doors locked. Keep hands on the steering wheel and call 911 or get someone else and put them on speaker until you are sure the person is a police officer.

It is rare for officers to ask women to get out of the car for a simple traffic stop, and unless there is more than a traffic issue, they prefer males to stay in the car and contained, as well. But it is wise to check the car for vehicle violations (check brake lights, headlights and tail lights; clean off snow; make sure license plate is visible and registration and inspection current.) Never carry anything illegal in the car or have alcohol visible because a police officer who sees that can ask you to step out of the car. That's
why there is a trunk or hatch in the car. If you do stop and the "officer" asks you to exit the car, then do ask for a back-up marked car with a uniformed officer. Ask to see ID and check it carefully. In many jurisdictions, it is common for police to have a second car back up traffic stops anyway, as police are also very vulnerable when approaching an unfamiliar vehicle.
 
pittsburghgirl said:
If it is a marked unit, then it is likely a real cop. If an unmarked car with flasher tries to pull you over, you can call 911 to check on the unit, you can ask for a marked unit and a uniformed officer to back up the unmarked car, or you can drive (within the speed limit) to the nearest police station. It's tougher in a rural area, where 911 headquarters might be miles away and there is often only one or two police units and no real police station to drive to. If you pull over in an area you don't know or where there is no police office, the best thing might be to look for a well-lighted convenience store or other business and keep windows and doors locked. Keep hands on the steering wheel and call 911 or get someone else and put them on speaker until you are sure the person is a police officer.

It is rare for officers to ask women to get out of the car for a simple traffic stop, and unless there is more than a traffic issue, they prefer males to stay in the car and contained, as well. But it is wise to check the car for vehicle violations (check brake lights, headlights and tail lights; clean off snow; make sure license plate is visible and registration and inspection current.) Never carry anything illegal in the car or have alcohol visible because a police officer who sees that can ask you to step out of the car. That's
why there is a trunk or hatch in the car. If you do stop and the "officer" asks you to exit the car, then do ask for a back-up marked car with a uniformed officer. Ask to see ID and check it carefully. In many jurisdictions, it is common for police to have a second car back up traffic stops anyway, as police are also very vulnerable when approaching an unfamiliar vehicle.
Click to expand...

Good advice but most law-abiding people will just pull over immediately and without question when those blue lights flash. Can you really tell an unmarked car from a marked car at night? I can't imagine someone like Maura would ever risk running from the cops... but then again I guess she did flee her accident. I'm not sure if that's illegal when it's just your car only.
 
armywife210 said:
If I remember correctly, the charger was left in the car, along with a lot of personal items that meant a great deal to her (some jewelry given to her by her BF, and a stuffed monkey, also from her BF that she slept with. All she seems to have taken was the alcohol and whatever else happened to be in her backpack...such as her wallet. She used a backpack as a purse, so she probably just put the alcohol in it too. This further supports the theory that she was just trying to ditch the alcohol and MAYBE put some time between the accident and the conversation between her/police because she had alcohol on her breath and wine spilled in her car.
In my opinion she didn't intend to stay gone. If she did, she wouldn't have left her belongings that meant enough to her to bring with her on the trip. She also wouldn't have taken the time to print off an accident report (that was found in her car), and brought her school books.
I don't think she froze to death because I can't see her going that far into the woods to ditch the alcohol and perhaps wait a bit with all the snow.
Click to expand...

I agree on the most part. I think she brought her jewelry along, because she didn't want it stolen from her dorm room. Stuff can disappear in places like that.

I do think she could have suffered hypothermia. I don't think she was dressed for weather. Hypothermia can hit a person by surprise. It could make them act strange. Sometimes they can "feel" overheated, but in fact their core body temp has lowered. I'm not saying that hypothermia is the answer to her disappearance, but I'm only saying it is a possibility.
 
Weird Tolkienish F said:
Yeah the whole "other person theory"... how was Maura communicating with this person? Obviously not cellphone. Probably not email although she could have had a "secret" account or something.

I just don't see it.
Click to expand...

I was just questioning that, because of the 2 day gap from her accident to the red cross calling card phone call to her boyfriend. I'm not sure I believe she was staying with anyone it either. I'm just exploring possibilities.
 
goldiegirl said:
I agree. I don't think her plans beforehand have anything to do with what happened to her. The only reason I thought the rag was significant was in determining whether or not something happened to her right at the crash site or later on after she left. For example, if she put the rag in the tailpipe herself then she made it away from the car on her own, as opposed to someone abducting her from the scene. I guess the fact that she took the alcohol bottles was enough to indicate that. Either way, I guess it doesn't matter much.

Another way that the rag could have been a tad bit helpful would be in determining what her plans were. I had never heard of someone using a rag like this before, so what I was wondering was whether or not it was an indication that she planned to have the car towed, or whether it meant something else specific. My thought was that it might help to determine what Maura planned to do - walk to a place with a signal? Hitchhike? etc., so I
thought it might have given us some indication about where she could have been walking and whether or not she did just go into the woods. That was the main theory I was trying to examine with that thought - if she went into the woods to die, she wouldn't have cared what happened to her car. It looks to me that she did walk away from the scene but did not plan to be gone for long, but regardless of what her exact plans were at this point, something else obviously happened to her instead

My theory has always been that she was picked up by someone, either willingly or not, as opposed to being hit by a car or succumbing to the elements. It just seems like the most likely scenario.
Click to expand...

Makes sense.

She locked the car, so she cared enough about her belongings to make sure
they wouldn't be taken so easily. To me, it does look like she was not planning to take off forever or to commit suicide. Why lock the car or bother putting a rag in the tail pipe to just walk off and commit suicide? I think it is possible she ran into a creep. He initially acted helpful, but turned mean. Classic. Most guys in that area know that it is an isolated area and that establishments close early. To me, it was very possible that someone took advantage of the situation.
 
McSpy said:
Makes sense.

She locked the car, so she cared enough about her belongings to make sure
they wouldn't be taken so easily. To me, it does look like she was not planning to take off forever or to commit suicide. Why lock the car or bother putting a rag in the tail pipe to just walk off and commit suicide? I think it is possible she ran into a creep. He initially acted helpful, but turned mean. Classic. Most guys in that area know that it is an isolated area and that establishments close early. To me, it was very possible that someone took advantage of the situation.
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The suicide theorists never explain exactly how she committed suicide out in the woods... by OD'ing on Tylenol and alcohol? I'm sure that would kill your liver. It takes several days though. And like I said, she wouldn't get far into the woods with 2.5 feet of snow on the ground.
 
Weird Tolkienish F said:
The suicide theorists never explain exactly how she committed suicide out in the woods... by OD'ing on Tylenol and alcohol? I'm sure that would kill your liver. It takes several days though. And like I said, she wouldn't get far into the woods with 2.5 feet of snow on the ground.
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I agree. I don't think her intentions of going up to NH was to commit suicide. Although, I think she was emotional and could have got into a bad situation after taking off from the accident scene.

It isn't unusual for young suicidal women to try to commit suicide by drinking alcohol and swallowing fists full of Tylenol. I know a ER nurse, who sees it from time to time, which is why I think LE believes she could have been suicidal.
 
Weird Tolkienish F said:
Someone even made a post of various people in the NH area caught driving around impersonating police.
Click to expand...

Was the police impersonator ever in the Haverhill, NH area or around the towns connected by Rt. 112 or 116?
 
Maura is one missing person who I cannot get out of my head. In my opinion (after reviewing all the facts) I really believe that most of the information we have is completely irrelevant to what happened to her. I know why we are discussing it and every angle has to be explored, but I really believe the actual person or people who took her have absolutely nothing to do with the emotional phone call or her needing to take a break or the car accident(s). I don't think she randomly drove to kill herself. I think she wanted to get away for a few days, had the bad luck of having an accident, and then someone took her.

I feel like I relate to this story even more because a lot of the surrounding circumstances remind me of myself a few years ago-college student, wrecked a parent's car, long distance boyfriend, sometimes drinks to self-medicate, emotional, impulsive, and wants to get away sometimes. I know most of those are superficial similarities, but I feel like I can understand exactly what she felt like when she got in her car and just drove. It is a shame that this combination of factors led to what might be a tragic end.
 
:welcome: Darcyline

I agree about Maura being at the wrong place at the wrong time.
 
Darcyline said:
Maura is one missing person who I cannot get out of my head. In my opinion (after reviewing all the facts) I really believe that most of the information we have is completely irrelevant to what happened to her. I know why we are discussing it and every angle has to be explored, but I really believe the actual person or people who took her have absolutely nothing to do with the emotional phone call or her needing to take a break or the car accident(s). I don't think she randomly drove to kill herself. I think she wanted to get away for a few days, had the bad luck of having an accident, and then someone took her.
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My theory exactly, except I do believe she made the phone call. I think someone took her/she willingly left, and she was still alive two days later to make that call. After that, who knows.
 
Essex143 said:
I found this on Wikipedia, so I know it's true

In October 2006, volunteers led a two-day search within a few miles of where Maura's vehicle was found. In the closet of an A-Frame house, cadaver dogs allegedly went "bonkers," identifying the possible presence of human remains. A sample of the carpet was sent to the New Hampshire State Police.

The Menstral Blood doesnt make sense to me at all. The dogs wouldnt go crazy over someone elses scent. They said the house was abandoned, so why would there be a hamper with clothing. The dogs went crazy over her scent.
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Please tell me you are being sarcastic with your first statement. Wikipedia can be edited by anyone who is a member, whether they have direct knowledge of a subject or not. It is not a reputable source for anything.


I remember the dogs scenting on something, but I thought DNA ruled out Maura? I am not sure about that. I do not believe Maura is alive. She either got lost and succumbed to the elements or was abducted. I don't think for a second she went off to kill herself either.
 
Darcyline said:
Maura is one missing person who I cannot get out of my head. In my opinion (after reviewing all the facts) I really believe that most of the information we have is completely irrelevant to what happened to her. I know why we are discussing it and every angle has to be explored, but I really believe the actual person or people who took her have absolutely nothing to do with the emotional phone call or her needing to take a break or the car accident(s). I don't think she randomly drove to kill herself. I think she wanted to get away for a few days, had the bad luck of having an accident, and then someone took her.

I feel like I relate to this story even more because a lot of the surrounding circumstances remind me of myself a few years ago-college student, wrecked a parent's car, long distance boyfriend, sometimes drinks to self-medicate, emotional, impulsive, and wants to get away sometimes. I know most of those are superficial similarities, but I feel like I can understand exactly what she felt
like when she got in her car and just drove. It is a shame that this combination of factors led to what might be a tragic end.
Click to expand...

Wow! I could have written this myself! We are pretty much on the same page. Although, I do think there is a slight chance she was hit by a car or something.
 
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