KS - Patricia Kimmi, 58, Horton, 6 Nov 2009 - #1

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
Rita...

I have been reading the posts on this thread since I found out that information was being posted here. Words truly cannot express how heart broken we are about everything that you and your family are going through.

A few days ago I told my daughter that the Grandma of her best friend in Horton is missing. Of course that led to many other questions. How do we explain to our children that there are people in this world that are capable of such unthinkable acts? The tears welled up in her eyes and she looked to me to answer questions that I just don't have answers to. Can Grandma's just disappear? Are there people capable of taking Grandmas away? Then came the realization that she once lived very close to where her friends Grandma lived. In that very same section. At a place where she always felt comfortable and safe.

I know how difficult this talk with my daughter is and I can't imagine what you have been through while trying to explain the unexplainable to your children.

I can't stop thinking about your Mom. I wish there was something that I could do to help you and your family. You are so dear and so sweet. Another friend posted on facebook the other day that she wished she could just take your pain, and anger, and worry, and tears for just one night. Maybe then you could really rest....if even for just one night. I thought that was so well said. I wish for the same thing.

Please know that there are so many out here that are thinking of you and praying for your Mom. If there is ANYTHING that I can do...I hope you will call me. I haven't wanted to call and haven't wanted my daughter to call because I imagine your phone is ringing off the wall. But if your daughter would enjoy calling then please have her do that. My daughter would love to hear from her. And please call me if I can help in any way. Even if it is just someone to vent to for a few minutes.

You and your family haven't left my heart and my thoughts and my prayers since I heard about this.

Sending all of our love.
 
Recommendation ...to those in a rural residence, get an alarm for the driveway. It is cheap (less than $20), easy (put up the sensor facing the driveway, place the receiver in the house- no cords). Range is up to 400 feet. A friend bought one for us after Pat went missing...and I'm glad he did.
 
Rita,
Is there a way to have the saw mill searched and maybe even any computers your dad might have used. Just saw a thing on 20/20 where key evidence against a husband was suspitious computer searches.
 
lynejo said:
Rita,
Is there a way to have the saw mill searched and maybe even any computers your dad might have used. Just saw a thing on 20/20 where key evidence against a husband was suspitious computer searches.
Click to expand...

Hi Lynejo, welcome to Websleuths!

You make some very good suggestions! In many different cases, evidence was found off people's computers looking to search different "things" that would appear criminal to most unless they are researching a case.
I agree, the Saw Mill and all his property should be searched!
 
dagascag said:
How much of JA county has been searched? Do you know where people were being sent last weekend ? I have a specific place in mind. I am hesitant to post it. I don't know what the chances are that the perp is reading this forum and I am not willing to risk it. I am planning to be there in the morning. Do I just ask at the station?

G~

Ps 119;76 May your unfailing love be my comfort, according to your promise to your servant.
Click to expand...

If you know of a place that should be searched, let LE know as well, so that way if it is fruitful, the proper authorities would be able to deal with potenital evidence (even footprints!)
 
lynejo said:
Rita,
Is there a way to have the saw mill searched and maybe even any computers your dad might have used. Just saw a thing on 20/20 where key evidence against a husband was suspitious computer searches.
Click to expand...

I know the police cannot go in w/out a warrant, but I do not know what happens if family goes in w/out one and copies a whole hard drive on an external drive and gives it to police. Is that admissible in court?

I am not suggesting anyone should do this, of course. It could be dangerous even if anyone still worked there and had access. If it was my mom though, yeah, I'd be tempted. The police are probably digging through phone records, unless they have to have some type of reason / proof he was involved to do so. This is a horrible thing and I don't know what would be worse, thinking it might be someone you all know or that is was random. One is just unthinkable and the other is sure scary.

Just thinking about you all a lot today...
 
Daisy_May said:
I know the police cannot go in w/out a warrant, but I do not know what happens if family goes in w/out one and copies a whole hard drive on an external drive and gives it to police. Is that admissible in court?

I am not suggesting anyone should do this, of course. It could be dangerous even if anyone still worked there and had access. If it was my mom though, yeah, I'd be tempted. The police are probably digging through phone records, unless they have to have some type of reason / proof he was involved to do so. This is a horrible thing and I don't know what would be worse, thinking it might be someone you all know or that is was random. One is just unthinkable and the other is sure scary.

Just thinking about you all a lot today...
Click to expand...

No warrant = no search unless he gives consent to search. A judge won't sign a warrant unless there is enough evidence. If they had enough evidence against him, I'm sure they would've searched by now.

fyi...I'm not correcting your information just adding to it.

and to the family,....
Jeremiah 29:11
For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future.
 
dagascag said:
No warrant = no search unless he gives consent to search. A judge won't sign a warrant unless there is enough evidence. If they had enough evidence against him, I'm sure they would've searched by now.

I am sure that is true so... no "official' search could be done by the investigators/ police/ sheriff's dept.

I was thinking more along the lines if someone had access to the building that was family or employee (really more our of curiosity than suggesting anyone try this) but anyway--- if a FAMILY MEMBER or EMPLOYEE copied a hard drive on an external drive and gave it to the cops.... could they use any of that information in court? Just in general...
Click to expand...
 
Daisy_May said:
I was thinking more along the lines if someone had access to the building that was family or employee (really more our of curiosity than suggesting anyone try this) but anyway--- if a FAMILY MEMBER or EMPLOYEE copied a hard drive on an external drive and gave it to the cops.... could they use any of that information in court? Just in general...
Click to expand...

I'm thinking no, they probably couldn't....what comes to my mind is 'chain of custody' issues with evidence.
 
Daisy_May said:
dagascag said:
No warrant = no search unless he gives consent to search. A judge won't sign a warrant unless there is enough evidence. If they had enough evidence against him, I'm sure they would've searched by now.

I am sure that is true so... no "official' search could be done by the investigators/ police/ sheriff's dept.

I was thinking more along the lines if someone had access to the building that was family or employee (really more our of curiosity than suggesting anyone try this) but anyway--- if a FAMILY MEMBER or EMPLOYEE copied a hard drive on an external drive and gave it to the cops.... could they use any of that information in court? Just in general...
Click to expand...

I don't think so because it wouldn't have been obtained "legally". If anybody else knows for sure, please correct me if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
 
Thinking of Pat today and her beloved family and friends.
Hope today brings some answers.
 
lynejo said:
Rita,
Is there a way to have the saw mill searched and maybe even any computers your dad might have used. Just saw a thing on 20/20 where key evidence against a husband was suspitious computer searches.
Click to expand...

I don't think there are any computers at the sawmill and don't think the ex-husband has ever used a computer.
 
bowmancabin said:
I don't think there are any computers at the sawmill and don't think the ex-husband has ever used a computer.
Click to expand...

My thinking also - no computers to search. And we are being VERY careful regarding finding anything that might be evidence and maintaining custody chain. It has to be looked at by LE in the place it's found before being removed, and then has to be removed by LE.

KHP is flying their helicopter again today, searching mostly water.

We are so grateful for everyone's support, prayers, and hours volunteered. I hope someday Mom will get to know every detail of how people have helped.
 
Rita,

Any reaction from the reward money yet? Was really hoping that would induce someone to come forward. Glad to hear KHP is on the search again.

Am still praying hard for your Mom and all of you. I miss her.
 
Like everyone else, I too thought the ex- was the natural person to have had a hand in this. But let's assume for a minute that that is not the case.

Let's assume this was a straight home invasion/burglary, one which went wrong. If this was the case, it could explain the most baffling aspect of the case, to me---why Mrs. K. was removed from the home. If this were a retaliation crime, surely she would not have been, as it would complicate matters for the perp(s) to take someone with them.

But in a burglary, it might make sense---Mrs. K. refused to go gently along with the crime, fought back hard, and may have escaped the initial scene and run into the yard. From there, it may have been expeditious for the perp(s) to remove her not back to the house, but to the vehicle he/they came in. This could also explain why nothing was taken from the house---the getaway was in progress once they'd recovered control of the scene, and the perp(s) fled.

This scenario might also explain the presence of the distinctive money-clip. I'm hoping LE is doing their due diligence on that piece and checking it against records of other burglaries in the area (not only in KS, but in rural MO, NE, and IA) in terms of what was taken. A perp might have stolen that in other break-in, slipped it into his pocket, and forgotten about it. Then, if he wore, say, the same jacket to another crime, the money-clip may have slipped out during the ensuing fracas. It's pocket-sized, it's the sort of thing a criminal would latch onto, and it's easily lost.

I'm thinking that, if they can locate that clip as an item missing in another burglary, LE may be on the path of finding out who did this.

Prayers for all.
 
wfgodot said:
Like everyone else, I too thought the ex- was the natural person to have had a hand in this. But let's assume for a minute that that is not the case.

Let's assume this was a straight home invasion/burglary, one which went wrong. If this was the case, it could explain the most baffling aspect of the case, to me---why Mrs. K. was removed from the home. If this were a retaliation crime, surely she would not have been, as it would complicate matters for the perp(s) to take someone with them.

But in a burglary, it might make sense---Mrs. K. refused to go gently along with the crime, fought back hard, and may have escaped the initial scene and run into the yard. From there, it may have been expeditious for the perp(s) to remove her not back to the house, but to the vehicle he/they came in. This could also explain why nothing was taken from the house---the getaway was in progress once they'd recovered control of the scene, and the perp(s) fled.

This scenario might also explain the presence of the distinctive money-clip. I'm hoping LE is doing their due diligence on that piece and checking it against records of other burglaries in the area (not only in KS, but in rural MO, NE, and IA) in terms of what was taken. A perp might have stolen that in other break-in, slipped it into his pocket, and forgotten about it. Then, if he wore, say, the same jacket to another crime, the money-clip may have slipped out during the ensuing fracas. It's pocket-sized, it's the sort of thing a criminal would latch onto, and it's easily lost.

I'm thinking that, if they can locate that clip as an item missing in another burglary, LE may be on the path of finding out who did this.

Prayers for all.
Click to expand...

Burglary, to me, doesn't make sense. It would have been obvious to this person that she was home - lights on, vehicle in the driveway. They would have known they'd have a confrontation. She had been gone most of the day, and was usually gone at least a couple days a week for most of the day. You'd think if they'd been checking out her place for robbery they'd pick a time when she was gone. I'm positive it was not a robbery gone wrong - only my opinion. They have checked into the money clip but to what extent I don't know.

Thank you for your prayers.
 
Thing is....if robbery were the motive, why does it appear that nothing was taken?
Dee
 
I lived in San Antonio for eight years, and read of countless cases when home invaders didn't care if anyone was there or not---they were drugged up and just got in either by ringing the bell or opening the door or breaking down the door. These acts took place both in the city and in the country. It frequently appeared that there was no forethought whatsoever as to what might have been available to steal---the idea was just locate a residence, then smash and grab. If circumstances had have gotten out of hand, this would account for nothing being taken.

We in rural areas---where I grew up, and where I now live---tend to think that the world is a rational place. But it's not, especially when dealing with drug addicts.

I just hope Mrs. K. will be found safe and sound. And more prayers toward that end. I'm a born and bred Kansan, and this doesn't set well with me at all.
 
I grew up in a rural / farming community too, and most break-ins/thefts are for things that are easily sold....tools, quads, electronics....I just have a hard time seeing anybody attacking Pat, abducting her, and then leaving empty-handed had theft been a motive.
Rita, you're all in our thoughts tonight. Hugs from afar to all of you and yours.
Dee
 
Did she keep any financial records at her job? Or perhaps for any kind of church or charitable organization? In other words, was there any possibility that she had come upon some kind of incriminating information about someone else? It just seems that they needed her, and alive, to go with them somewhere. So, I was thinking about a case where she would be able to withdraw funds that the person could not get access to without her being there. Or did she have the keys or code to anything that they would need her to actually help them get into some place of interest to them?


Just thinkin' here about some possibilities.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 173 more.
Total: 4,000 (members: 174, guests: 3,826)

Online statistics

Members online
174
Guests online
3,827
Total visitors
4,001
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
591,532
Messages
17,954,131
Members
228,524
Latest member
archangel78100
Back
Top