The Springfield Three--missing since June 1992 - #1

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Liz,

Thanks for posting the timeline. I found it helpful--it reminded me about things I read when I first became interested in the case that I have since forgotten.

The way it is written raises some questions. For example, under August 26-27, 1994, the timeline states: "He had escaped from prison and, most recently, was arrested for raping and sodomizing a woman in Springfield after breaking into her home." "Most recently" in reference to the grand jury dates, or the date of the timeline story (October 4, 2007)? Or both, I guess? There are other little odd moments like that. But it is a great summary of the big events and a place to start.

This could just be the English teacher in me seeing more than one possible meaning...

Pittsburghgirl, You're welcome. I found it helpful too. I think before I had read so many articles from the Springfield News-Leader and the Kansas City Star and I wasn't too organized in my thinking about things. Seeing it encapsulated like this made it a bit easier for me.

I think the "most recently" in the time line refers to the date from 1994. That's the way I took it. It is somewhat confusing though.

It is interesting that all 3 suspects were on the street when the abductions occurred. There were a couple other things in the timeline I don't remember hearing before, like the AMW tip about the bodies being in Gainesville, MO and searchers finding the garbage bag with 2 blue T-shirts with gunshot holes and old blood on them. I'm sure it was in a news article but I completely missed it. I wonder if they did DNA testing on the T-shirts? I assume they did but there was no follow up article in regards to that.
 
Yeah, there has to be more to the AMW thing than we know. I still find it interesting that it came from Florida, where Bartt was living, although the number of psychopathic dirtbags that go in and out of that state has to be pretty high. It's probably a little harder to be a predator in a place like Pittsburgh or Green Bay, where you've got to function with boots and coats and gloves in the winter ...and you can blend in with or victimize the snowbirds and tourists and students.
 
Looking back at the timeline, I realize that I made an unwarranted assumption. The AMW "tip" that I have read about before was from a caller in Florida. The tip about bodies in Gainesville does not have to be the "same tip." Hmmm...
 
Pittsburghgirl, You're welcome. I found it helpful too. I think before I had read so many articles from the Springfield News-Leader and the Kansas City Star and I wasn't too organized in my thinking about things. Seeing it encapsulated like this made it a bit easier for me.

I think the "most recently" in the time line refers to the date from 1994. That's the way I took it. It is somewhat confusing though.

It is interesting that all 3 suspects were on the street when the abductions occurred. There were a couple other things in the timeline I don't remember hearing before, like the AMW tip about the bodies being in Gainesville, MO and searchers finding the garbage bag with 2 blue T-shirts with gunshot holes and old blood on them. I'm sure it was in a news article but I completely missed it. I wonder if they did DNA testing on the T-shirts? I assume they did but there was no follow up article in regards to that.

I must confess I have not heard of the Gainesville matter before or I had long forgotten about it. Is there a news item that speaks to this particular matter or is it in relation to those other missing and/or murder victims during this general period most likely perpetrated by a serial killer but unlikely unrelated to the 3MW case?

We are not confusing Gainesville, Missouri and Gainesville, Florida, are we? I knew about the caller from Florida to AMW and watched that particular program but don't recall anything related to this case from Gainesville, Missouri which is about 100 miles from Springfield, Missouri.
 
I must confess I have not heard of the Gainesville matter before or I had long forgotten about it. Is there a news item that speaks to this particular matter or is it in relation to those other missing and/or murder victims during this general period most likely perpetrated by a serial killer but unlikely unrelated to the 3MW case?

We are not confusing Gainesville, Missouri and Gainesville, Florida, are we? I knew about the caller from Florida to AMW and watched that particular program but don't recall anything related to this case from Gainesville, Missouri which is about 100 miles from Springfield, Missouri.

pittsburgh girl and MM - I thought the same things when I saw that about the Gainesville, MO search. I was positive I had never read that before but then I thought maybe it was something I forgot about. I also have always found it strange that Bartt was in Florida at the time of the AMW call, and I also wondered if they meant Gainesville, Florida instead of Missouri. I wonder if KY3 got their cases mixed up? I'm sure if I heard that before it was something I would remember because the 2 blue T-shirts with gunshot holes and old blood certainly grabbed my attention. When I have time I'm going to check the archives on the KY3 site and also the newspapers. If it really pertains to the 3MW case there should be another news article about it somewhere
 
A high ranking Springfield government official with GPR experience (I can't tell you who), thoroughly reviewed the videotaped GPR scan. In his opinion, the results of the scan clearly indicate the presence of organic material.

We do know for sure there is something organic underneath the concrete.

It could be three sets of tree roots with three sets of five foot long branches. If that's true, then it is a simple case of careless workmanship.

It is true that tree branches can't be ruled out. However, bones also can't be ruled out.

If the SPD were to dig and find remains, there is nobody to charge with a crime. The families will want justice and there is nobody to indict. I believe this is the reason why the dig hasn't taken place. If they ever connect one person to that spot, they would dig tomorrow.

I have never been to Springfield, Missouri. I do know that the SPD has done at least two complete thorough background checks on me that I know of. So, it won't be me.
 
Question has come up repeatedly and I thought I would throw it out for anyone who might know the answer.

So far as I can recall, the mystery caller to AMW came in to the SPD sometime during December, 1992. (I watched the live broadcast.) That would have been some period after the "48 hour" piece some months prior.

My question is whether anyone has any knowledge who that person was? Does anyone have any information who that was? Would they care to identify themselves here to clear up this long time mystery? Evidently the police seemed to think it was of importance but it, to my knowledge, has never been revealed and so far as I know, that person never recontacted the SPD with this "vital information."

Any takers?
 
There were a couple other things in the timeline I don't remember hearing before, like the AMW tip about the bodies being in Gainesville, MO and searchers finding the garbage bag with 2 blue T-shirts with gunshot holes and old blood on them. I'm sure it was in a news article but I completely missed it. I wonder if they did DNA testing on the T-shirts? I assume they did but there was no follow up article in regards to that.

This was a bogus tip that came in to SPD from the Oct. 20 showing of AMW (not sure if that was the original showing or a repeat, I haven't looked up the date yet).

I'll paraphrase by date what each of three articles from the News-Leader had to say:

11/04/94

AMW tip led investigators to a remote area north of Theodosia, MO and Bull Shoals Lake in Ozark County where they discovered bones and shirt fragments.

Ray Richardson of the Ozark County Sheriffs Dept. said the bones were identified as being from a cow and a deer.

The clothing, described as having holes in the front was taken to the MSHP lab in Jefferson City for testing.

11/05/94

SPD's Doug Thomas said the tip looks to be just another in a long line of false leads.

The tip had said that the bodies could be found in this remote location.

Thomas said that the panties and tee shirts did not match what Streeter, McCall, & Levitt were thought to have been wearing.

Ozark County Sheriff Vaughn said that the holes in the front of the tee shirts looked to be consistent with shotgun pellet holes. The fronts of the tee shirts were covered with a black substance, which was to be tested for blood.

SPD's Doug Thomas said that nothing was consistant with what their looking for.

11/09/94

Tests reveal tip not tied to missing women.

Substance was no blood.

Incident marks just the latest bogus tip.
 
This was a bogus tip that came in to SPD from the Oct. 20 showing of AMW (not sure if that was the original showing or a repeat, I haven't looked up the date yet).

I'll paraphrase by date what each of three articles from the News-Leader had to say:

11/04/94

AMW tip led investigators to a remote area north of Theodosia, MO and Bull Shoals Lake in Ozark County where they discovered bones and shirt fragments.

Ray Richardson of the Ozark County Sheriffs Dept. said the bones were identified as being from a cow and a deer.

The clothing, described as having holes in the front was taken to the MSHP lab in Jefferson City for testing.

11/05/94

SPD's Doug Thomas said the tip looks to be just another in a long line of false leads.

The tip had said that the bodies could be found in this remote location.

Thomas said that the panties and tee shirts did not match what Streeter, McCall, & Levitt were thought to have been wearing.

Ozark County Sheriff Vaughn said that the holes in the front of the tee shirts looked to be consistent with shotgun pellet holes. The fronts of the tee shirts were covered with a black substance, which was to be tested for blood.

SPD's Doug Thomas said that nothing was consistant with what their looking for.

11/09/94

Tests reveal tip not tied to missing women.

Substance was no blood.

Incident marks just the latest bogus tip.

I take it that this was a second tip and not "the" tip that generated so much interest. I'm referring to the tip about the information of "vital interest" that the SPD seemed so interested in. That particular segment of AMW consisted of the original lead detective and the McCalls and it took up much of the program and there was a bank of telephone operators taking information. Somehow that particular call was disconnected and to the best of my knowledge never recontacted the SPD. But if I am mistaken, then I stand to be corrected.

I understand that SPD's Doug Thomas was the detective who spent most of the time on this case. He may now be retired and it would be helpful if he or someone from the department would simply clear up some of these questions. I don't know why it would be so "classified" to simply state that the call in question turned out to be without substance. What I don't understand and will never understand is why the SPD is seemingly so unwilling to periodically go over the facts and a basic summary of the case to bring the public up to speed. From what I have been told by someone with access to the department is that they flatly refuse to even discuss the case. I don't get that. I'd like to believe that they are trying to fake out the culprits but I tend to doubt that is the case.
 
I take it that this was a second tip and not "the" tip that generated so much interest. I'm referring to the tip about the information of "vital interest" that the SPD seemed so interested in. .

My quote is concerning the 'bodies at Gainesville" tip that Liz and pitsburghgirl were wondering about.
 
My quote is concerning the 'bodies at Gainesville" tip that Liz and pitsburghgirl were wondering about.

Hurricane - I appreciate your finding the news articles explaining the Gainesville tip. It saved me a lot of time having to look them up myself!

Thanks again!
 
Ken,

One hundred fifty yards would be the equivalent of standing in the middle of three football fields, end to end. Everything within that 150 yard radius containing mercury would set off a signal on Gray's scanner. How did Gray null out all other signals and hone in on what may only be five or six, maybe even a dozen dental fillings that belonged to the missing three?

The hospital would certainly be within this radius. Think about all of the sources of mercury producing signals from there; a hundred or more patients, nurses, and doctors all with dental fillings in their mouths; mercury switches, thermostats, thermometers, wood, and who knows what else containing mercury and producing such signals would all be in that hospital.

How can Gray's scanner ignore all of these sources of mercury signals and hone in on a location that he supposedly has no prior knowledge of?

For him to get away with just saying "Ken, I can't tell you how it works. I can just tell you that it does." only adds to the lack of credibility of him, and of those involved in the scan who did not ask such questions and demand appropriate answers before taking the results as being worthy.

You wanted him to find the results you wanted, and where you wanted them.

Hurricane, what if Tim already knew where the women were buried and is using his "new technology" as a facade? Hypothetically speaking, if you knew where remains were buried and you wanted to tell someone without incriminating yourself; what Tim has done is a plausible scenario. Technically, Tim didn't find the anomaly at the parking garage; his "magic box" did the work.

Here is something else to ponder...

Robert Cox has an adopted brother. His name is Brad Cox. Both Brad and Robert are adopted and they both share the same birthday (October 6th) one year apart. It's an eerie coincidence that the Cox Parking Garage is located on Bradford Parkway.
 
Hurricane, what if Tim already knew where the women were buried and is using his "new technology" as a facade? Hypothetically speaking, if you knew where remains were buried and you wanted to tell someone without incriminating yourself; what Tim has done is a plausible scenario. Technically, Tim didn't find the anomaly at the parking garage; his "magic box" did the work.

Here is something else to ponder...

Robert Cox has an adopted brother. His name is Brad Cox. Both Brad and Robert are adopted and they both share the same birthday (October 6th) one year apart. It's an eerie coincidence that the Cox Parking Garage is located on Bradford Parkway.

Ken, I won't bite and play your game of blame on Tim Gray. You all hired him to come to Springfield and test a series of locations that you had in mind:

"Bonnie put him (Gray) in touch with Ken Young, who connected him to Kathee Baird, and we all chipped in and hired him to go to the Ozarks! We had a list of places for him to search."

You probably already know if he had ever been to Springfield before or not.

What needs to be cleared up is how this technology, which detects signals from mercury, could null out all such signals coming from the hospital from up to 150 yards out, and key in on mercury signals from as few as a dozen or less dental fillings which you say belong to the skeletons of Levitt, Streeter, and McCall buried 20 to 24 inches below the surface of the concrete floor of the parking garage.

One of you should have asked for an explanation as to how this would be possible.
 
What needs to be cleared up is how this technology, which detects signals from mercury, could null out all such signals coming from the hospital from up to 150 yards out, and key in on mercury signals from as few as a dozen or less dental fillings which you say belong to the skeletons of Levitt, Streeter, and McCall buried 20 to 24 inches below the surface of the concrete floor of the parking garage.

One of you should have asked for an explanation as to how this would be possible.

Good point. His instrument detects not only mercury; it also detects bone. He said he had to do the scan at night (he found the anomaly at 12:30 AM) because a daytime scan would pick up too much interference. With too many people around, the mercury and bone signals would make it difficult to pinpoint a location. I am just reporting what he told me.

He said that it has a range of about a mile. It can scan deep into the ground and deep into water. It can scan for just about anything. This includes cancer. If this technology is legit, the implications are mind numbing. One time he told me: "Ken, I can stand outside and scan your house and tell if there is anybody home. I can also tell where your valuables are located."

IF this technology is legit; it's a pandora's box. Privacy, as we have known it, would become obsolete. IF this technology is legit and IF it is responsible for discovering the remains; this will be a case where the cure will be worse than the disease. There will come a time in which we will wish the case was never solved.
 

What we don't know is IF Tim Gray really is Tim Gray. We have kicked around the idea that "Tim Gray" could be "Brad Cox". It's plausible that Robert's brother could know where the remains are buried. It's plausible that Robert could have told Brad in confidence where the remains are buried. From there, Brad could have moved out of state and changed his name to "Tim Gray". It's plausible.
 
What we don't know is IF Tim Gray really is Tim Gray. We have kicked around the idea that "Tim Gray" could be "Brad Cox". It's plausible that Robert's brother could know where the remains are buried. It's plausible that Robert could have told Brad in confidence where the remains are buried. From there, Brad could have moved out of state and changed his name to "Tim Gray". It's plausible.

Is there a reason why his bona fides were not firmly established early on? I'm not getting this question coming up now. Norland's reputation is solid but this business about "Tim Gray" baffles me. To the casual reader his or her head must be spinning like Linda Blair's in the Exorcist reading this. How on earth is anyone supposed to take this garage business seriously? Is there any doubt why the SPD don't act on this when such basic information at this late date is still unconfirmed?
 
Is there a reason why his bona fides were not firmly established early on? I'm not getting this question coming up now. Norland's reputation is solid but this business about "Tim Gray" baffles me. To the casual reader his or her head must be spinning like Linda Blair's in the Exorcist reading this. How on earth is anyone supposed to take this garage business seriously? Is there any doubt why the SPD don't act on this when such basic information at this late date is still unconfirmed?

What we do know about Tim Gray is that he works as a subcontractor for the EPA in Homeland Security. That has been confirmed.

Tim did tell me awhile back that the technology was something the Air Force and Navy were working on and they couldn't get it to work right. So they discarded it. Tim came across the instrument and tinkered with it and modified it. How he got his hands on it; we don't know.
 
What we do know about Tim Gray is that he works as a subcontractor for the EPA in Homeland Security. That has been confirmed.

Tim did tell me awhile back that the technology was something the Air Force and Navy were working on and they couldn't get it to work right. So they discarded it. Tim came across the instrument and tinkered with it and modified it. How he got his hands on it; we don't know.

All that may be true. Why is his identity in question? Where did that come from?
 
Good point. His instrument detects not only mercury; it also detects bone. He said he had to do the scan at night (he found the anomaly at 12:30 AM) because a daytime scan would pick up too much interference. With too many people around, the mercury and bone signals would make it difficult to pinpoint a location. I am just reporting what he told me.

He said that it has a range of about a mile. It can scan deep into the ground and deep into water. It can scan for just about anything. This includes cancer. If this technology is legit, the implications are mind numbing. One time he told me: "Ken, I can stand outside and scan your house and tell if there is anybody home. I can also tell where your valuables are located."

IF this technology is legit; it's a pandora's box. Privacy, as we have known it, would become obsolete. IF this technology is legit and IF it is responsible for discovering the remains; this will be a case where the cure will be worse than the disease. There will come a time in which we will wish the case was never solved.

If I am asking all of these questions and making all good points as you say, why don't you ever address any of them?

The parking garage is next to a CANCER hospital! I guess at night all of the patients must turn off their mercury, bone, and cancer producing signals so as not to interfer with the signal that Gray is to receive. Give me a break! You guys were there in the middle of the night so as not to be run off by security.

I ask again; Why didn't any of you ask Gray how he could null out signals, from a mile out, of mercury, bone, and cancer that would have been in much greater concentration (coming from the cancer hospital) than from three skeletons under 20 inches of dirt?

Can you see why there are problems with the credibility with this scan? If you guys were flying to the sun you would go at night!
 
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