Who should be responsible for this crime?

Caylee's Mom, totally. I do believe she is mentally ill, but not legally insane. If she will ever get out of jail, I believe she needs extensive psychiatric care before she's released and foisted on the rest of society. However, as a society, we simply can not allow parents to fail to report missing children for 31 days. And if those children have hairs testing positive for decomposition in the trunk of their parents' cars, after the parent has failed to report their children missing and if they have not actively co-operated with police efforts to find their child, those parents should go down for the rest of their lives. AND there should be strict laws to that effect, if there aren't already!

yolorado said:

Caylee's Mom, totally. I do believe she is mentally ill, but not legally insane.

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I agree, I know very little about being deemed legally insane. But I have an idea that one of the main qualifications is that you need to not know right from wrong. She's admitted that it was wrong to steal the money from AH and her parents. She said it was wrong for her to lie. So on the record she provided a sworn statement that she knows right from wrong. It's going to be hard for defense to prove she doesn't....JAT

impatientredhead said:

I think Casey is solely responsible for her action. I think personal responsibility is lacking in our world to a very concerning level.

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I agree 100%

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal:
Reporter on MyFox Orlando said she spoke to Cindy and Cindy calls the latest test results, "Hocus Pocus" and she believes her daughter and is standing behind her.


Now with this latest quote by Cindy, does anyone doubt she is STILL ENABLING HER DAUGHTER?

We have some truly disturbed parents on our hands

marleysmom said:

I agree, I know very little about being deemed legally insane. But I have an idea that one of the main qualifications is that you need to not know right from wrong. She's admitted that it was wrong to steal the money from AH and her parents. She said it was wrong for her to lie. So on the record she provided a sworn statement that she knows right from wrong. It's going to be hard for defense to prove she doesn't....JAT

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I believe the true signs of mental illness in this case comes from Casey's complete lack of concern or emotions for her child. She has only shed tears for herself. The lying had gone as far as making up individuals who do not exist. This is beyond the normalcy of a liar. She is living in an altered state of reality. I am not a psychologist but Casey has shown true sociopathic tendencies.

Devorahhh said:

First and foremost, I believe that Casey is responsible for what happened to little Caylee, HOWEVER, I also feel that Cindy has some responsibilty also. In my mind, if she knew her daughter did not want to keep the child, then why didn't she take her as her own and raise her herself? By forcing Casey to have the child and then raise her, this, I believe, was the beginning of the end. And George is responsible by being always in the background, apparently a hands off dad. BUT this is just IMHO.

Devorahhh

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I agree with what you are saying, Devorahhh. I really disagree with the parents insisting Casey keep her baby and be responsible for raising her when it was someting Casey clearly did not want. Forcing her to keep Caylee was a punishment, no matter how you look at it. And in the end, that punishment cost the life of a sweet three year old. I have no doubt Casey's parents did everything they thought would bring their daughter in line and change her ways. The cruel thing about that is - looking at the outcome - maybe they did too much.
JMO

I'm so impressed with your thoughts on this issue.
I held out for so long that Caylee was alive, but always in the back of my mind, I thought there was some serious mental illness.
I've actually wondered a few times if perhaps Casey was schizophrenic and Zenaida the nanny was one of her personalities.
Your post really gives one a lot to think about.

Nedthan Johns said:

I believe the true signs of mental illness in this case comes from Casey's complete lack of concern or emotions for her child. She has only shed tears for herself. The lying had gone as far as making up individuals who do not exist. This is beyond the normalcy of a liar. She is living in an altered state of reality. I am not a psychologist but Casey has shown true sociopathic tendencies.

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I agree, but I only have my B.S. in Psychology and would not feel comfortable putting a diagnosis on someone I have never talked to directly.

anyone else wondering if she'll slip into a psych ward in the next few days?

azwriter said:

I agree with what you are saying, Devorahhh. I really disagree with the parents insisting Casey keep her baby and be responsible for raising her when it was someting Casey clearly did not want. Forcing her to keep Caylee was a punishment, no matter how you look at it. And in the end, that punishment cost the life of a sweet three year old. I have no doubt Casey's parents did everything they thought would bring their daughter in line and change her ways. The cruel thing about that is - looking at the outcome - maybe they did too much.
JMO

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HI azwriter. Casey does not strike me as the type that does things she doesn't want to.
I would guess the ultimate decision came down to casey and she chose to keep caylee or not
This is not about Cindy imo.

If your question is, who is responsible for PHYSICALLY taking this precious child's life.
Perhaps the mother, out on bond. (I have trouble at this point even typing their names.)
I have my own theory, but we all do...
Seems there is quite a lot of backpeddling and covering up.
-From what I have read the pregnancy was not confirmed until the third trimester. The reports of the young pregnant mother partying and maybe not getting any medical care, and not caring?
-abortion was out of the question, maybe always out of the question.
-adoption was not an option
-identity of the father, could be a moot point
-grandmother insists on keeping the child. why? to love and help raise? to use as punishment? her own selfish needs? Why not just adopt the baby and take responsibility?
-grandparents never met or spoke with a babysitter or nanny
-did not have a phone number for their daughter work info?
-spoke with a counselor and were advised to give ultimatum to daughter about partying and sponging off them --when?
-could be if the ultimatum was given soon before the disappearance the daughter decided she was going to have to make some changes. Rather than make a serious attempt at being responsilble she took little Caylee away to "teach them a lesson."
-whatever happened after that is all speculation at this point since none of us know for sure
Something is very fishy, and I believe there is more that will come out.

Jolynna said:

Hopefully a psych professional will come online and correct me if I am wrong, BUT, it is my understanding that those in the field are leaning more toward nature being responsible for mental illness & personality disorders than upbringing. Haven't tests and scans shown that the brains of those with some disorders are different?

To my knowledge being a sociopath does not DRIVE a person to kill. The lack of empathy for other humans and putting themselves first makes it easier to do wrong.

But, I think sociopaths can choose.

Can you have someone committed without evidence they are a danger to themselves or others?

Don't people with personality disorders have to WANT to change before ANY treatment is effective.

What evidence MUST a grandparent have to take custody of a grandchild from the natural parent?

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Jolynna, great questions and I know the answers to some of them. Yes mental illness although in cases of bipolar (that i know of) they do think it's related to genetics. But it also has been proven that an unhealthy upbringing or environment can contribute to mental illness. A good case and point is the abuse to Sybil, who created altered identities to keep herself safe in her mind. The direct abuse of Sybil contributed to her psychosis and schizophrenia. They have found that a certain part of the brain in bipolar people is smaller and shrinks as they get older contributing to their illness. Give me 5 minutes and I will post that link for you.

This statement is correct: To my knowledge being a sociopath does not DRIVE a person to kill. The lack of empathy for other humans and putting themselves first makes it easier to do wrong. Being a sociopath does not drive a person to kill

In the state of Colorado you can only have someone picked up and detained at a mental facility for 24 hours if they pose a direct threat to themselves or others. They must voluntarily choose to stay at that facility or they are released.

You stated: Don't people with personality disorders have to WANT to change before ANY treatment is effective.

most people that have a personality disorder do not think they are crazy. They think other people are crazy and usually will not seek help on their own. I was told this specifically in my brothers case on a specialist in Bipolar Disorder.

What evidence MUST a grandparent have to take custody of a grandchild from the natural parent?[/QUOTE]

They must show that the parent is neglectful in taking care of their child or poses a threat to that child.

Here's the link I promised:

http://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/77396.php

Nedthan Johns said:

I believe the true signs of mental illness in this case comes from Casey's complete lack of concern or emotions for her child. She has only shed tears for herself. The lying had gone as far as making up individuals who do not exist. This is beyond the normalcy of a liar. She is living in an altered state of reality. I am not a psychologist but Casey has shown true sociopathic tendencies.

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You just described the person that murdered my sister. Personally I think anybody who can take another person's life has to be insane, but both my sister's husband and Casey knew right from wrong.

kidz110 said:

I agree 100%

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I agree with ya.....

Nedthan Johns said:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal:
Reporter on MyFox Orlando said she spoke to Cindy and Cindy calls the latest test results, "Hocus Pocus" and she believes her daughter and is standing behind her.


Now with this latest quote by Cindy, does anyone doubt she is STILL ENABLING HER DAUGHTER?

We have some truly disturbed parents on our hands

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I don't believe she enabled her, to me that would be that she stood by and watched her child commit an unspeakable crime, and helped her cover her tracks.. I think this is a woman in pure denial that this child is gone.
One of the first stages of grief is denial.

There is no proof whatsoever Casey is mentally ill. Just because someone acts outside the norm in not proof of mental illness. There is also no proof whatsoever Casey even behaved outside the norm before the age of 18.

Yes, I do wish Cindy, George, and Lee would wake up and face reality. However, since I am not in the position, THANK GOD, where my grandchild is missing and the evidence is pointing that my daughter killed her, I can't say for sure I would act any differently. Period.

Maybe, just maybe, they realize Caylee is gone, and Casey is responsible for it. Maybe, they feel Casey spending the rest of her life in prison, or getting the death penalty is not going to bring this precious baby back, and they can't face, after losing a grandchild they clearly loved, they just can't face losing their daughter, as well. Yes, their behavior has made me roll my eyes, shake my head, and even angered me from time to time, but since I am not in their shoes, THANK GOD, I have no idea what is motivating them to act this way. I don't believe for one minute, however, that they are not suffering dearly for what they have lost, and they will for some time to come.

I have not seen one shred of evidence whatsoever to show they could have had any clue Casey would have done this. It is a long way from ripping off the parents credit cards to murdering a child. I also haven't seen one shred of evidence to support them helping to dispose of the body. What I have seen evidence of is LE picking up on Casey's lies right away, and acting accordingly by arresting her. I have seen evidence of the GP's throwing out some pretty lame statements, and even some outright lies, but I also believe LE is just as aware of all this as I am, and I don't see anything they have done, other than washing the pants, and there is no evidence this was done deliberately to destroy evidence, that has really impeded this investigation at all.

What do you people suggest to be done about all this? You know, frontal lobotomies and electric shock treatment was all the rage not so long ago. Turns out that wasn't such a good idea. Do you really want some govermnent official coming into your homes whenever they feel like it and dictating to you how to raise your children? What if they want you to give them medication you don't feel is safe? That is already going on with Ritulin, and there is still a lot of debate over whether this stuff is even effective. ADHD isn't necessarily a mental defect, it is just a different way of being, but since it doesn't fit into our cookie cutter society at this time, everyone wants to 'treat' it. The brain and how it works is such a massive, complicated process that isn't even close to being understood yet. One size does not fit all.
I'm done.
Lanie

:clap::clap::clap:

Nedthan Johns said:

most people that have a personality disorder do not think they are crazy. They think other people are crazy and usually will not seek help on their own. I was told this specifically in my brothers case on a specialist in Bipolar Disorder

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Bipolar disorder is not a personality disorder, it is a mood disorder, and is an Axis 1 diagnosis according to DSM-IV, thus placing it closer to a psychotic type disorder than an Axis 2 personality disorder. People can have both bipolar disorder and a personality disorder but they are not one and the same.

in Cincinnati right now we have a newlywed bride who supposedly drowned in a bathtub while her husband watched T.V., her family helped bail him out of jail is telling anyone that will listen he is innocent, DENIAL. A shrink was on our local news channel tonight and said it's denial and it's a protective mechanism when you just can't handle the reality.