NH NH - Maura Murray, 21, Haverhill, 9 Feb 2004 - # 7

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Weird Tolkienish F said:
Wow! Is that the underwear?
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Are you referring to the underwear found by Maura's sister on one of the initial searches? If so, I believe the DNA didn't match and it was ruled out as evidence early in the investigation. Here's an excerpt from the link:


Maura's older sister discovered a ripped white pair of women's underwear lying in the snow on a secluded trail near French Pond Road on 26 February, but DNA tests found that the underwear did not belong to Maura

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disappearance_of_Maura_Murray
 
Weird Tolkienish F said:
I think it's very clear that Maura did not want this guy around. The fact is, he "followed the rules" and called the cops despite the fact that Maura didn't even want him to do this. Were I a lone girl out in the middle of nowhere and some big 300 pound guy insisted on "staying with me" I'd be scared as hell, personally. What's funny is if he hadn't been truly callous and just driven by without a care he probably wouldn't be considered a suspect until he died.
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I agree. I also think he didn't have time to hurt or hide her. Also, the other neighbors saw him leave without her. She was still at the car when he left.
To me, the timeline and these other circumstances clear him.
 
I've been going in circles with this case. Sometimes, I think she was abducted and other times, I think she may have been hit by a car or succumbed to the elements. I've known a few cases where people have disappeared and have been found and their disappearances were caused by a terrible accident--not a crime. A small group of guys from my town disappeared in Florida a few years ago and there was a lot of speculation swirling around about a drug deal gone bad. It turned out that their rented SUV went off a freeway exit ramp into a retention pond, flipped over and they all drowned or died from their injuries. The vehicle was fully submerged in the pond, so nobody would have seen it from the roadway. A recent case of another young guy from my area, who disappeared in Aspen, CO, had the same similarities. After several searches with no results, speculation began to swirl around about a possible abduction of this young man. He was found weeks later under a bridge. He accidently fell between 2 bridges at night (no lights on bridge). He thought the space between the bridges was a sidewalk, but it was a 100 ft. drop. The point I'm
trying to make is that these disappearances are not always a crime, but with Maura being a female it does make it more likely than with the males, because females of her age tend to be targets. So, this is why I'm going in circles with this case.

Since LE claims they have some evidence, then it looks like it could be a homicide. I guess it all depends on how sure LE is about the evidence, or if it is only a possible lead.
 
McSpy said:
I've been going in circles with this case. Sometimes, I think she was abducted and other times, I think she may have been hit by a car or succumbed to the elements. I've known a few cases where people have disappeared and have been found and their disappearances were caused by a terrible accident--not a crime. A small group of guys from my town disappeared in Florida a few years ago and there was a lot of speculation swirling around about a drug deal gone bad. It turned out that their rented SUV went off a freeway exit ramp into a retention pond, flipped over and they all drowned or died from their injuries. The vehicle was fully submerged in the pond, so nobody would have seen it from the roadway. A recent case of another young guy from my area, who disappeared in Aspen, CO, had the same similarities. After several searches with no results, speculation began to swirl around about a possible abduction of this young man. He was found weeks later under a bridge. He accidently fell between 2 bridges at night (no lights on bridge). He thought the space between the bridges was a sidewalk, but it was a 100 ft. drop. The point I'm
trying to make is that these disappearances are not always a crime, but with Maura being a female it does make it more likely than with the males, because females of her age tend to be targets. So, this is why I'm going in circles with this case.

Since LE claims they have some evidence, then it looks like it could be a homicide. I guess it all depends on how sure LE is about the evidence, or if it is only a possible lead.
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I always love your posts, and I usually agree with your thought patterns. This was a very thought-provoking post, and although I hadn't thought about it before, this caused me to think about the number of similar incidents I've heard of, and it turns out it was more than I realized.

I also stopped to examine exactly why I've felt the way I have, and I think what it is is that the main reason I've always felt that she was the victim of foul play is because I just feel like they would have found her body by now. I've always felt that she couldn't have gotten too far on her own, and even though it seems like the searches haven't been as thorough as they should have been, it still seems like someone would have found something by now. That's my only hangup with this theory.

However, of course it's possible that she did get a ride with someone to another location and then had some accident happen after being dropped off somewhere else, so I guess I shouldn't assume that she couldn't have made it far from the scene. For all we know, she got a lift or a series of different rides and made it 10 miles away and then was left to walk on her own and that's when something happened. That's a sad thought, because if that's the case, it's unlikely that she'll ever be found unless by chance, and who knows how long that will take. IMO, she'd have been most likely to be found had she had an accident in the immediate area, second most likely (although not very likely) to be found if she were the victim of foul play and they had evidence or a suspect in mind, and least likely to be found if she did have help getting away but had an accident in another location (since no one would know where to look), so I guess that's a pretty likely theory after all, considering they still haven't found her. The only hangup I have with that is that it seems like if anyone had innocently given her a ride and dropped her off somewhere, that person would have come forward by now with that information.
 
goldiegirl said:
I always love your posts, and I usually agree with your thought patterns. This was a very thought-provoking post, and although I hadn't thought about it before, this caused me to think about the number of similar incidents I've heard of, and it turns out it was more than I realized.

I also stopped to examine exactly why I've felt the way I have, and I think what it is is that the main reason I've always felt that she was the victim of foul play is because I just feel like they would have found her body by now. I've always felt that she couldn't have gotten too far on her own, and even though it seems like the searches haven't been as thorough as they should have been, it still seems like someone would have found something by now. That's my only hangup with this theory.

However, of course it's possible that she did get a ride with someone to another location and then had some accident happen after being dropped off somewhere else, so I guess I shouldn't assume that she couldn't have made it far from the scene. For all we know, she got a lift or a series of different rides and made it 10 miles away and then was left to walk on her own and that's when something happened. That's a sad thought, because if that's the case, it's unlikely that she'll ever be found unless by chance, and who knows how long that will take. IMO, she'd have been most likely to be found had she had an accident in the immediate area, second most likely (although not very likely) to be found if she were the victim of foul play and they had evidence or a suspect in mind, and least likely to be found if she did have help getting away but had an accident in another location (since no one would know where to look), so I guess that's a pretty likely theory after all, considering they still haven't found her. The only hangup I have with that is that it seems like if anyone had innocently given her a ride and dropped her off somewhere, that person would have come forward by now with that information.
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I share your thoughts!

Try to put yourself in her position - what would you do if you just crashed your car, were afraid of being arrested for DWI, not to mention your leaving college like you did and now having this happen could get you thrown out... you are also fearful of the burly man (SBD) who just offered to help.

It was a mild winter night - temp in the 30's. You can run, but the roads are dark, poorly lite, recently plowed after it had snowed. As a runner you know you can easily twist your ankle on unseen rocks in the road kicked up by the plowing...

What are your options?
Seek shelter somewhere unseen overnight?
Get a ride to where?
What to do about your car? - you know have valuable jewelry locked in the trunk... you know alcohol has been spilled inside it...
 
More thoughts about putting oneself in her position and what would you do if you just crashed your car, were afraid of being arrested for DWI, afraid of leaving college under false pretenses such that having this happen to you could get you thrown out and lose your scholarship.

You are fearful of the burly man (SBD) who just offered to help.

It was a mild winter night - temp in the 30's. You can run, but road was recently plowed, rocks kicked up, and few if any street lights - as a runner you know you can easily twist your ankle as a result.

What are your options?

Seek shelter somewhere unseen overnight?
Get a ride to where? Towing garage?

You left valuable jewelry locked in the trunk, you know your car can be traced so you know you have to come back.

How can you deal with alcohol, open container left in the car?

With so much spinning around in one's mind - I can picture a person just wandering down the road a bit.

Did someone come along and grab her, force her into a car?

I would think she would have seen a vehicle approaching and it would have been difficult to surprise her such that she
would not have screamed out..

Would she accept a ride from a stranger?
 
goldiegirl said:
I always love your posts, and I usually agree with your thought patterns. This was a very thought-provoking post, and although I hadn't thought about it before, this caused me to think about the number of similar incidents I've heard of, and it turns out it was more than I realized.

I also stopped to examine exactly why I've felt the way I have, and I think what it is is that the main reason I've always felt that she was the victim of foul play is because I just feel like they would have found her body by now. I've always felt that she couldn't have gotten too far on her own, and even though it seems like the searches haven't been as thorough as they should have been, it still seems like someone would have found something by now. That's my only hangup with this theory.

However, of course it's possible that she did get a ride with someone to
another location and then had some accident happen after being dropped off
somewhere else, so I guess I shouldn't assume that she couldn't have made it far from the scene. For all we know, she got a lift or a series of different rides and made it 10 miles away and then was left to walk on her own and that's when something happened. That's a sad thought, because if that's the case, it's unlikely that she'll ever be found unless by chance, and who knows how long that will take. IMO, she'd have been most likely to be found had she had an accident in the immediate area, second most likely (although not very likely) to be found if she were the victim of foul play and they had evidence or
a suspect in mind, and least likely to be found if she did have help getting away but had an accident in another location (since no one would know where
to look), so I guess that's a pretty likely theory after all, considering they still haven't found her. The only hangup I have with that is that it seems like if anyone had innocently given her a ride and dropped her off somewhere, that person would have come forward by now with that information.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the kind words!

I've also thought that she may have accepted a ride, got dropped off and then something happened at that location, but as you said, no driver has come forward about giving Maura a ride. I've also entertained the idea that she accepted a ride from someone who was heading west, instead of east. That area was not searched thoroughly. She could have even gone up to a house and something happened to her there.

I'm not sure that her body would be found by now if she was hit by a car or perished from hypothernia. The area is thickly wooded and sparsely populated. She was wearing dark clothes and a black back pack, which could easily blend into the terrain. Only her blue jeans would be noticeable, but by now they would be a filthy gray. There have been several missing persons cases where areas have been professionally searched, but later a body is found in the same area by chance by a hunter or hiker months or years later. Chandra Levy was one of those cases. Unfortunately, the area doesn't seem like a good place to walk a dog. They are very good at coming upon a body.

I think it would be a good idea to publicize Maura's possessions, such as her backpack to hunters, hikers, etc. Many tourists come up to NH to hike and hunt and would not know if a black backpack or a cell phone found in the woods was attached to a missing persons case. It would be a shame if someone came upon that sort of evidence and didn't realize the importance.

I sure hope something breaks soon on this case. It's heartbreaking that there are no answers by now.
 
OldSteve said:
More thoughts about putting oneself in her position and what would you do if you just crashed your car, were afraid of being arrested for DWI, afraid of leaving college under false pretenses such that having this happen to you could get you thrown out and lose your scholarship.

You are fearful of the burly man (SBD) who just offered to help.

It was a mild winter night - temp in the 30's. You can run, but road was recently plowed, rocks kicked up, and few if any street lights - as a runner you know you can easily twist your ankle as a result.

What are your options?

Seek shelter somewhere unseen overnight?
Get a ride to where? Towing garage?

You left valuable jewelry locked in the trunk, you know your car can be traced so you know you have to come back.

How can you deal with alcohol, open container left in the car?

With so much spinning around in one's mind - I can picture a person just
wandering down the road a bit.

Did someone come along and grab her, force her into a car?

I would think she would have seen a vehicle approaching and it would have been difficult to surprise her such that she
would not have screamed out..

Would she accept a ride from a stranger?
Click to expand...

I think she may have taken the chance of accepting a ride from a stranger if the stranger seemed nonthreatening and friendly. I think that she knew she was taking a risk though. I can imagine someone stopping to ask her if she needed help. They may have even seen her car in the distance with the hazard lights flashing and surmised that she was connected to that disabled car.
 
I keep on hitting the icons accidently with my ipad, so if you see a smiley face or a angry face in an inappropriate place or post, please disregard.
 
McSpy said:
Thanks for the kind words!

I've also thought that she may have accepted a ride, got dropped off and then something happened at that location, but as you said, no driver has come forward about giving Maura a ride. I've also entertained the idea that she accepted a ride from someone who was heading west, instead of east. That area was not searched thoroughly. She could have even gone up to a house and something happened to her there.
Click to expand...

I sniped part of your quote - l agree about her heading west instead of east since it would be toward places she had passed and might remember where she could get help or shelter.

I also thought if she was going to run anywhere, west would be the direction I would go as a runner since she would be more familiar with that direction, and again might remember someplace she had passed for help/shelter. Might be better lite as well.

No way would I want to run east into a foreboding forest!

Also - something I'm not sure of.... it was Feb, and it was mild. Do bears come out of hibernation for a short time under those conditions? I know raccoons do that.
 
OldSteve said:
I sniped part of your quote - l agree about her heading west instead of east since it would be toward places she had passed and might remember where she could get help or shelter.

I also thought if she was going to run anywhere, west would be the direction I would go as a runner since she would be more familiar with that direction, and again might remember someplace she had passed for help/shelter. Might be better lite as well.

No way would I want to run east into a foreboding forest!

Also - something I'm not sure of.... it was Feb, and it was mild. Do bears come out of hibernation for a short time under those conditions? I know raccoons do that.
Click to expand...

I don't think the bears would come out, but I could be wrong. Although, moose may be out licking the salt on the roads. They can be very dangerous too, especially if you get near their offspring.
 
This is a not an important question, but how is the name Maura pronounced? I thought I had it corret, but my husband informed me that I've been pronouncing Maury Povich's name incorrectly, so it got me thinking about Maura Murray's name, too. Thank you : )
 
goldiegirl said:
This is a not an important question, but how is the name Maura pronounced? I thought I had it corret, but my husband informed me that I've been pronouncing Maury Povich's name incorrectly, so it got me thinking about Maura Murray's name, too. Thank you : )
Click to expand...

You should watch the Disappeared episode on Maura, it's pretty good.
 
goldiegirl said:
This is a not an important question, but how is the name Maura pronounced? I thought I had it corret, but my husband informed me that I've been pronouncing Maury Povich's name incorrectly, so it got me thinking about Maura Murray's name, too. Thank you : )
Click to expand...

I believe it is pronounced like this: more-uh.

It is hard to explain the pronunciation of the "a" but her name rhymes with "flora"

Hope this helps!
 
goldiegirl said:
Thank you, McSpy!




I've been wanting to, but I don't know how to find it. Where can I?
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It is on the Investigation Discovery channel. Seems like they only put "sneak peeks" on their website---not the whole episode.
 
I can't imagine what the 2 possible pieces of evidence found in the woods of Haverhill are . . . I wonder where these items were found? I'm guessing they were found in the vicinity of the accident. I wish I knew. IIRC, the first 2 searches were months before the contractor came forward with his story about her being miles up the road. I believe the initial searches didn't include the area where the contractor may have witnessed her running east. I could be wrong on this and should read up on it.

I'm just thinking out loud here.
 
Okay, here's another thought. Since the contractor lived right near the accident scene, why didn't he notice all the search activity and come forward at that point? Didn't he notice all the commotion? He may very well be innocent, but I'm trying to figure why he didn't remember the night he worked late at that point. Perhaps, he was at the Franconia work site and missed it all? Yet, I heard he was living with a girlfriend. Did she notice the searches and talk about it with him? If I saw officials with dogs wandering around in front of my house, I would want to know the reason and the specifics, so that I could help if possible. Could their house be set back enough to block the view of the activity?

Just some thoughts.
 
I dont thing this has been brought up but bus drivers have CB;S just like truckers do why did he have to go home and call why not just go on the cb and contact the police right there and then...
 
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