GUILTY Canada - Paul Bernardo & Karla Homolka, murdered, 1993

PattyCake said:

Sorry Jane...

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Thats ok PC LOL :blowkiss:

White Rain said:

Were you answering me? If so, I already knew, and yes that is what caused it. I was just throwing out what some of the players in the case said/thought could have caused it at the time. And I really can't believe it wasn't pursued further.

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Yes White Rain I was - sorry

JaneInOz said:

Thats ok PC LOL :blowkiss:




Yes White Rain I was - sorry

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No apology necessary!

White Rain said:

If you don't get it at the library let me know...I have a copy I can send to you...I want it back though!

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WR ~ i have the book. thanks though for your very kind and generous offer!


i've just started reading and am saddened @ how the author is describing paul's mother on the day he and karla married... paul's mother complained about paul's choice of pheasant for the meal and paul yells @ her in front of everyone during the meal to: "(f-word) off! (f-word) off, mom! sit down and eat your (f-word w/ "ing") meal!!" nice, huh?


the book then describes how leslie was locked out of her house the night she was kidnapped... she didn't have a key and had missed her curfew so her mom locked the door so she'd have to face her parents returning home. leslie didn't want to knock and face her parents so she left to go call a friend... i can only imagine the guilt poor mrs. mahaffy feels to this day over this decision. the kidnapping of her daughter is certainly not her fault but i hope she isn't blaming herself.

also, the book mentions that when kristen was forced into bernardo's car @ the church, a woman was driving by and saw a struggle @ a car. she didn't think too much of it and continued driving. later when she heard where kristen was kidnapped, she realized she'd seen it. i hope this woman isn't feeling guilt over this either but it certainly is valuable to know that just by keeping your eyes open, anyone at anytime can be the key to solving a crime... maybe even before it goes from bad (kidnapping) to worse (murder). and even if you think what you see/saw isn't important, it just might be the thing needed to solve a case or even save a life.

Karla "fought" like heck her transfer to a federal psych evaluation unit in the maritime provinces.

She has some disorder, that is a psych sexual/violence disorder.

She should still be in Prison, but "conned" her way out of it. She apparently is very smart, in a evil sort of way.

She never gave her victims a second thought, and is only concerned with her own life and herself. She has and will never show any remorse.

Apparently, she was "shocked" as there was an online pool as to "how long she will live" once released. She just makes people's blood boil.

One little tidbit. Karla wanted a "lavish" over the top wedding and when her Father told her that they may have to "cut back" a little, because the funeral of her sister Tammy was expensive, Karla went "crazy" and demanded the wedding she wanted, regardless of knowing that SHE and Paul were the only ones aware of whom was responsible for the death of Tammy.

Her whole family and the family of Paul are just dysfunctional to the core. Another tidbit of information. Paul's Dad is, I am pretty sure, a sex offender. But that is not Paul's real Dad. In his teen years, Paul's mom admitted his Dad is not his "real" Dad. After that Paul called her openly a "*advertiser censored*" swore at her and mentally "abused" her along with the mental and physical abuse from the Dad.

Karla's sister, thinks that what her sister did was not that bad and if she "dyed" her hair when she was released from prison. No one would know who she is or "remember:" what she did.

To say the Canadian public is less then impressed with Karla Holmolka is an understatement.

Hi There,
Not sure if anyone still visits this thread or not. I stopped keeping up to date with the "case" after Karla was released from jail, I was utterly disgusted when she got out.
The Tori Stafford case and references to the Homolka/Bernardo case mildly renewed my interest.
Just want to confirm that she has moved from Quebec and now has a child of her own?

The Attorney General want to the lengths that Ontario(where she lived and committed her crimes) be notified if she ever decided to "visit" her family.

I would think that she would want to stay the heck out of this province.

Since she was "afraid" to come back to Ontario, that she know spoke French well, and Quebec was not as well informed about her crimes, she decided to stay in Quebec, where she would be "somewhat welcomed"

But after her initial realize, there were pictures of her snacking, having a coffee, she has aged and changed her hair and colour

Karla is no victim. Not in any way shape or form. Who knows where she lives. As long as she is not in Ontario.

She is just one messed up person. Oh by the way, do you know who "she was having" a relationship with in prison also. A vicious, convicted killer who "brutally" murdered his girlfriend.

This is the type of "guy" that Karla has a relationship with and dates.

Karla knew that Paul was the Scarborough Rapist, she got "off" on it, wanted all of the details from Paul, he continued to rape even when they were dating and engaged. Only when they moved to St. Catherine's(a small city) did the rapes stop. So yes, Karla will never be well.

Her whole family is messed up....along with Paul's.

CyberLaw said:

The Attorney General want to the lengths that Ontario(where she lived and committed her crimes) be notified if she ever decided to "visit" her family.

I would think that she would want to stay the heck out of this province.

Since she was "afraid" to come back to Ontario, that she know spoke French well, and Quebec was not as well informed about her crimes, she decided to stay in Quebec, where she would be "somewhat welcomed"

But after her initial realize, there were pictures of her snacking, having a coffee, she has aged and changed her hair and colour

Karla is no victim. Not in any way shape or form. Who knows where she lives. As long as she is not in Ontario.

She is just one messed up person. Oh by the way, do you know who "she was having" a relationship with in prison also. A vicious, convicted killer who "brutally" murdered his girlfriend.
This is the type of "guy" that Karla has a relationship with and dates.

Karla knew that Paul was the Scarborough Rapist, she got "off" on it, wanted all of the details from Paul, he continued to rape even when they were dating and engaged. Only when they moved to St. Catherine's(a small city) did the rapes stop. So yes, Karla will never be well.

Her whole family is messed up....along with Paul's.

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Maybe the new hubby is the same way! then we will be less one evil person.

K.Scarpetta said:

Hi There,
Not sure if anyone still visits this thread or not. I stopped keeping up to date with the "case" after Karla was released from jail, I was utterly disgusted when she got out.
The Tori Stafford case and references to the Homolka/Bernardo case mildly renewed my interest.
Just want to confirm that she has moved from Quebec and now has a child of her own?

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Yes, she has a child and a husband, and I believe she lives in the Caribbean somewhere. (The info is on this thread someplace.)

This case never ceases to shock and disturb me.

In 1995 I moved to Nashville from CA and a girlfriend there who was also from CA to Nashville (we were married to musicians) gave me some books to read. One of them was on this case.

It must have been that book that is no longer in print or something - IT WAS GRAPHIC and horribly disturbing, My God. It went into great detail about exactly what was on those tapes - I had nightmares.

Just now I went to look at the pictures on that site and I literally jerked back from the monitor when I saw the picture that was discovered in Tammy's casket - put there by Paul and Karla. It is the most disgusting, evil, horrible thing I've seen. Just the looks on their faces. I said out loud," bless your soul Tammy. Maybe you can rest in peace now." Horrible.

Does anyone know what the content of the death letter was?

there is a picture of the letter in "karla: a pact with the devil" but it's not readable. i've read 4-5 books on this case and i think it was printed in one of them but it's not one i have here. google has allowed me to find one snippit so far:

from paul:

"If I've caused you any harm or pain, Tammy, please forgive me. I only wanted the best for you and for you to be happy and to experience the joys of this world".

"Please forgive me, Tammy. I'll love you from now until eternity and I'm looking forward to seeing you again once I die."



incidentally, to add further insult/injustice, the letter was written on paul and karla's wedding stationary. wow, eh?

Ugh. I found it on that site. It is horrible.

God, there is no doubt with all the pathetic letters and notes KH sent to that devil PB, she was very disturbed when she met him, ripe for the picking. She was so delusional about him, imo. I'm no Dr. but geez, you have to be a messed up girl to want so badly to be with a guy like that. It's crazy.

I wish I could erase everything I know about this case from my mind now.

I need one of those Men In Black devices, fast.

ziggy said:

Ugh. I found it on that site. It is horrible.

I need one of those Men In Black devices, fast.

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you found a copy of the death letter online? can u post it for anyone who might want to read it now that it's being discussed? TIA

i'm not convinced KH was disturbed when she met PB... needy maybe, but not disturbed. more about this later.


MIB devices? LOL... i'm sure we all could use one to forget about something or other.

Here is what the letter said written on their wedding stationary (they were still planning the wedding):

December 27, 1990
Dear Tammy,
My dearest little sister, words cannot express the deepest sorrow and regret that I now feel. You gave me your love and trusted me like your big brother. We shared a lot of good times and you touched my heart in a way that no one ever could. I love you Tammy, I always have and will. I miss you so much and my life will never be the same now that you've gone. If I ever caused you any harm or pain, Tammy, please forgive me. I only wanted the best for you. Just for you to be happy and to experience the joys of the world. Please forgive me, Tammy. I'll love you from now till eternity and I'm looking forward to seeing you again once I die.
Love,
Your brother, Paul.
XOXO

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Dear Tammy,
I have so much to say to you that words cannot express. I've talked to you every night and you know how I feel about everything. I won't write everything I want to say, you know it already. I know the card shouldn't be used yet, but I wanted to give you the thoughts it holds to carry with you. I love you deeply and will hold you in my heart forever.

All my love,
Your big sister, Karla
XOXO

P.S. I love and miss you with all of my heart. I hope you're happy and loved and in Gods hands. I love you so much little sister and can't wait to see you again.
All my love to you, Kar.

I too read a horrid book on the case and a few others. This letter is truly disturbing.

Thanks for posting it ziggy. I think I did read it once. They both give me the chills when I think of them too. Would love to erase the books from my mind also.


Gozgals

redheadedgal said:

you found a copy of the death letter online? can u post it for anyone who might want to read it now that it's being discussed? TIA

i'm not convinced KH was disturbed when she met PB... needy maybe, but not disturbed. more about this later.


MIB devices? LOL... i'm sure we all could use one to forget about something or other.

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I agree with you. I don't think she was disturbed, I think she was needy and he filled that need. I also am not sure he ever would have become a murderer without her. I don't think, unless she meets up with someone who is as evil as Paul, she will ever harm anyone again.

I think it's really easy for us to say that she was not a victim because of what we have seen of her, but I truly cannot say that because I don't know what she went through. I was with someone at one time who wanted to be like this, who had fantasies of harming people. It took all I had to get out of that situation and save myself before I became party to something so evil I could never return.

Gee I don't know. I think she was disturbed and it was the perfect storm when they hooked up.

KH has the severe problem of being invested in her fantasy instead of her reality. She's a sociopath. I don't think she ever felt remorse or anything for the victims including her sister. How could anyone with a conscience act the way she did post TH's death at her hands?
The only things that ever mattered were what she wanted, regardless. She wanted P because of her fantasy of him, not who he really was. She wanted her wedding even after her sister's death and her parents grief. She would do anything to perpetuate her fantasy and lie that she had a perfect husband and life. Sound familiar?

I don't know who her babydaddy is but i think i read he's a *advertiser censored* actor? She has not changed, nor will she. The dead eyed non-human is still there.

ziggy said:

Gee I don't know. I think she was disturbed and it was the perfect storm when they hooked up.

KH has the severe problem of being invested in her fantasy instead of her reality. She's a sociopath. I don't think she ever felt remorse or anything for the victims including her sister. How could anyone with a conscience act the way she did post TH's death at her hands?
The only things that ever mattered were what she wanted, regardless. She wanted P because of her fantasy of him, not who he really was. She wanted her wedding even after her sister's death and her parents grief. She would do anything to perpetuate her fantasy and lie that she had a perfect husband and life. Sound familiar?

I don't know who her babydaddy is but i think i read he's a *advertiser censored* actor? She has not changed, nor will she. The dead eyed non-human is still there.

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I totally agree. Karla was not a victim. Unfortunately the horrible visual material proving her willing complicity emerged only after the Crown had struck a deal with her. I don't doubt some of the bigger Canadian papers are preparing a story reviving the Homolka/Bernardo horror depending on the outcome of the Tori Stafford Case--as we speak.

As a Canadian, your views on the H/B case fascinate me. Most Canadians followed the story closely as it played out but didn't read the book. The book didn't sell well in Canada (at least not in the area where I live) and many businesses refused to carry it. I work in a large library; it was made part of our collection but the book kept getting stolen. I'm convinced a grassroots group formed to protect the victims families and these individuals destroyed as many copies as they could--IMHO. It's just a theory and maybe I'm wrong.

I think the book was probably easier to purchase in the USA.

I had thought Karla was in Quebec. I hadn't heard differently. A couple of years ago, curious as to her whereabouts, I googled her name and one of the pages I inadvertently opened was of the disgusting film the courts promised would never be made public. I don't know if it was the entire bonafide video that was shown to a select group in a court room many years ago because I went into a terrible state of shock; I watched only long enough to confirm what my eyes would not believe. But it did appear to be of the sexual abuse that was later written about.

I've never googled her name since but if I see anything in our media I'll be sure to post up here.

That's one of the reasons we are praying so hard for little Tori. We really want justice to be served for this little girl. Many Canadians are still still raw form the H/B horror.

Sociopaths and murderers are not the same things. I've known a couple of CEOs in my time who were definitely sociopaths and had found a "socially acceptable" way of channeling their desires.

That being said, I still don't think she's a danger to anyone anymore.

HesterMofet said:

Sociopaths and murderers are not the same things. I've known a couple of CEOs in my time who were definitely sociopaths and had found a "socially acceptable" way of channeling their desires.

That being said, I still don't think she's a danger to anyone anymore.

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I am quite aware that sociopaths are not all murderers. I don't really know any sociopaths who behave completely socially acceptable as they live only for themselves.

KH was a sociopath who condoned and assisted in murder. You can't get away from that one.

What do you mean she is not a danger? Really? You don't think she is still capable of luring young women for sex if her new baby daddy *advertiser censored* guy wants her to? Drugging people for sex? I mean, heck, it's a lot easier to obain a Roofie these days than having to steal second-rate sedatives.

The problem is, you don't know. The only reason she is free is because of the deal, not because she wasn't JUST as guilty as PB.

Have you read the play by play of just exactly what she was involved with when it came to the death of those three young girls...THREE!

In prison it has been said that her sexual deviancy continued.

It's a tragedy that she is not still in prison.

By the way- DOES ANYONE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS?

Paul changed his name to Teale some time back. I read that Karla is now going by Karla Teale...

What? For real? They both changed their last name to Teale? Ok, you're right, I'm sure she's JUST fine.

On the TV show "Friends" one of the characters put a book in the freezer because it disturbed them so much. It was funny on the show, but when I read "Deadly Innocence" I literally DID put it in the freezer because it terrified me. It stayed behind the boxes in the freezer for more than a year before I threw it out. The picture of Karla with the two black eyes... lord, it still makes me shiver to think of it. I've read a ton of true crime books, but that one hit me way harder than any other I've ever read. The more details I hear, the more horrifying it is.