The ransom note & Patsy Ramsey, letter by letter.

Did Patsy write the ransom note?

  • Yes, Patsy wrote the note

    Votes: 289 91.2%

  • No, Patsy did not write the note

    Votes: 28 8.8%
  • Total voters
    317

New Posts

Status
Not open for further replies.
wonderllama said:
Any chance there are some of these available online?
I think some nice examples of before murder/after murder would go nicely in this thread.
Click to expand...

Not sure. LONG ago I saw a sample from one of the Christmas newsletters.
 
DeeDee249 said:
Patsy knew exactly what they were showing her.

Interesting that it was noted (by one of BR's teachers, I believe) that Patsy ALWAYS handwrote the notes she sent in for JB and BR before the murder. But AFTER JB was killed, all her notes were typed. She was also said to have altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters).
Click to expand...

Right, and that little tid bit (typing the notes after the murder) came from Burke's teacher. (Alot of IDI's always ask who gave that info.) One of the letters that I can think of off the top of my head...is how she made her lower case A's....before the murder...(and in the RN)....it was a....after the murder it changed to the more common way that my computer will not let me type...without the "hoodie" at the top...just a line down the side.
 
cynic said:
Absolutely, there can be dueling experts, but seeing is believing.
Click to expand...

Precisely. The jury would decide, not the experts.

Well, I am sharing with you all a bit of an early Christmas present which I received, Michelle Dresbold’s book, Sex, Lies and Handwriting (with Cina Wong’s analysis.)
Click to expand...

I thought so. I have it myself, from before they excised that material. (I can only imagine how you got it!)
 
DeeDee249 said:
Patsy knew exactly what they were showing her.

Interesting that it was noted (by one of BR's teachers, I believe) that Patsy ALWAYS handwrote the notes she sent in for JB and BR before the murder. But AFTER JB was killed, all her notes were typed. She was also said to have altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters).
Click to expand...

You can't tell me that's a coincidence.
 
DeeDee249 said:
Patsy knew exactly what they were showing her.

Interesting that it was noted (by one of BR's teachers, I believe) that Patsy ALWAYS handwrote the notes she sent in for JB and BR before the murder. But AFTER JB was killed, all her notes were typed. She was also said to have altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters).
Click to expand...

Yes. Detective Steve Thomas alluded to this in his famous 'debate' with the Ramseys on Larry King.

He said that apparently, Patsy changed her handwriting "post homicide".
 
DeeDee249 said:
Patsy knew exactly what they were showing her.

Interesting that it was noted (by one of BR's teachers, I believe) that Patsy ALWAYS handwrote the notes she sent in for JB and BR before the murder. But AFTER JB was killed, all her notes were typed. She was also said to have altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters).
Click to expand...

by bold

I think it would be more accurate to say ST alleged that she "altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters)." We only have his word for all of this.
 
MurriFlower said:
by bold

I think it would be more accurate to say ST alleged that she "altered her handwriting after, differing even from her own KNOWN samples (like her Christmas newsletters)." We only have his word for all of this.
Click to expand...

"During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

This is exactly what I said in one of my above posts. I had read about the a's before...but I didn't know that ST said this too.

I am quite positive that ST is not the only person that recognized that she changed her handwriting style. I have yet to hear anyone that studied those before and after writing samples...disagree with him. It's not like he was locked in some room by himself with those samples. Nay sayers also believed that Mark Furhman was making things up too. Steve Thomas is the Mark Furhman of the JB case. Just because you disagree with him, does not mean that he is making things up. Someone would have stepped forward a long time ago...and cleared that up...if the changing of the handwriting style was not true.
 
Ames said:
"During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

This is exactly what I said in one of my above posts. I had read about the a's before...but I didn't know that ST said this too.

I am quite positive that ST is not the only person that recognized that she changed her handwriting style. I have yet to hear anyone that studied those before and after writing samples...disagree with him. It's not like he was locked in some room by himself with those samples. Nay sayers also believed that Mark Furhman was making things up too. Steve Thomas is the Mark Furhman of the JB case. Just because you disagree with him, does not mean that he is making things up. Someone would have stepped forward a long time ago...and cleared that up...if the changing of the handwriting style was not true.
Click to expand...

Just remind me again. Wasn't ST successfully sued by the Rs??
 
Ames said:
"During the interview, Thomas described how out of 73 suspects whose writing samples were analyzed by experts in comparison with the note, Patsy Ramsey was the only one who could not be excluded as its author. He also accused Patsy Ramsey of changing her handwriting after the murder. "In the ransom note, almost exclusively the lowercase manuscript a was used, I think, 98 percent of the time," he said. "What was telling was that after the Ramseys were given a copy of the ransom note, the lowercase manuscript a almost disappeared entirely from Patsy's post-homicide writing. Writing samples from Ramseys' personal letters and notes she wrote before the killing contain 732 manuscript a's that look like the lowercase typewritten a, but they are written by hand. She switched to a cursive a after the murder."

This is exactly what I said in one of my above posts. I had read about the a's before...but I didn't know that ST said this too.

I am quite positive that ST is not the only person that recognized that she changed her handwriting style. I have yet to hear anyone that studied those before and after writing samples...disagree with him. It's not like he was locked in some room by himself with those samples. Nay sayers also believed that Mark Furhman was making things up too. Steve Thomas is the Mark Furhman of the JB case. Just because you disagree with him, does not mean that he is making things up. Someone would have stepped forward a long time ago...and cleared that up...if the changing of the handwriting style was not true.
Click to expand...

attachment.php


Ok, here's an example from before the murder from PR from ACR. I count about 11 lower case "a"s, none of which are written typewriter style.
 
I voted NO Patsy did not write that note.
It is my belief that we have some very good handwriting analysts and she would not have escaped them
JMHO

Having said that.
I have always suspected the brother and I have no Idea WHY I have, but I have.
I felt that he has been protected all along. GRANTED he was just a minor.

This case was long ago and I was riveted to it then...Long before I knew about WS.

So that was my synopsis; If not the brother definitely someone close to the family.
JMHO

I have not been reading here on this case,
 
wonderllama said:
http://www.forstevethomas.com/08062002letter.htm

Not how I'm reading it here.
Click to expand...

Perhaps SD can enlighten us, although we all now know he isn't ST, he does seem to know a lot about him. I had it in my mind that there was a discussion here that ST did a deal of some kind with the Rs that he wouldn't talk/write etc about the case, in return for something (dropping the suite?).
 
MurriFlower said:
attachment.php


Ok, here's an example from before the murder from PR from ACR. I count about 11 lower case "a"s, none of which are written typewriter style.
Click to expand...
These notes are in cursive. The ransom note is printed. (I myself make manuscript a's when printing but not when writing in cursive. AND I prefer printing to cursive.)

So...did PR prefer printing notes to writing in cursive prior to the death of JBR?
 
MurriFlower said:
Perhaps SD can enlighten us, although we all now know he isn't ST, he does seem to know a lot about him. I had it in my mind that there was a discussion here that ST did a deal of some kind with the Rs that he wouldn't talk/write etc about the case, in return for something (dropping the suite?).
Click to expand...

And you are suggesting.....what I think you are?
 
songline said:
I voted NO Patsy did not write that note.
It is my belief that we have some very good handwriting analysts and she would not have escaped them
JMHO

Having said that.
I have always suspected the brother and I have no Idea WHY I have, but I have.
I felt that he has been protected all along. GRANTED he was just a minor.

This case was long ago and I was riveted to it then...Long before I knew about WS.

So that was my synopsis; If not the brother definitely someone close to the family.
JMHO

I have not been reading here on this case,
Click to expand...

Interesting that you voted yet have not read about the case. Possibly you'd feel differently if you had. Experts actually did not say Patsy didn't write it. They said they could not rule her out (out of all the people who gave samples). She was the ONLY one who was not ruled out as the possible author of the note.
If your theory about the brother is correct (and many agree with you), who else BUT a parent would have written it. An intruder wouldn't have written a fake RN to cover for a family member any more than a family member would have written a fake RN to cover for an intruder.
there were 4 people known to have been in the home the night JB was killed. The deceased (JB) and her parents and brother. That is a fact. While there is speculation that others (JAR, Grandpa P, friend of BR etc) may have been present, that has not been proven.
Out if those 4 people, one was a dead child, so that leaves the parents and brother. One of them had to have written the note and the handwriting matches Patsy's more closely than anyone else. JR and BR were excluded as the authors of the note. So that leaves Patsy.
If you haven't seen them, there are side-by-side examples of the RD compared to Patsy's writing on this forum and elsewhere on line. It's worth a look.
 
my_tee_mouse said:
These notes are in cursive. The ransom note is printed. (I myself make manuscript a's when printing but not when writing in cursive. AND I prefer printing to cursive.)

So...did PR prefer printing notes to writing in cursive prior to the death of JBR?
Click to expand...

Precisely. The point I was making is that it was only ST who alleged she changed her writing style after the murder. If she decided to type everything after, I could understand that, because you could guess than even a grocery list would be worth a fortune if sold to a tabloid. The fact was that she didn't change her writing style at all, but cursive was her usual writing mode. The fact that the RN writer chose printing does not mean it was usual for PR to print. I just looked at a printed RN exemplar of hers and while the "manuscript 'a's" exist, there is at least an equal number of 'a's written normally. The RN has consistent manuscript 'a's. This is just another one of those 'half-truths' designed to make PR look guilty.
 
MurriFlower said:
Precisely. The point I was making is that it was only ST who alleged she changed her writing style after the murder. If she decided to type everything after, I could understand that, because you could guess than even a grocery list would be worth a fortune if sold to a tabloid. The fact was that she didn't change her writing style at all, but cursive was her usual writing mode. The fact that the RN writer chose printing does not mean it was usual for PR to print. I just looked at a printed RN exemplar of hers and while the "manuscript 'a's" exist, there is at least an equal number of 'a's written normally. The RN has consistent manuscript 'a's. This is just another one of those 'half-truths' designed to make PR look guilty.
Click to expand...
So just to be clear, you're saying that cursive was her preferred writing method before the death? And she continued to use that as her preferred writing method after the death? No going from printing to cursive or printing to typing or cursive to typing? Do we have expanded examples of this? (More before/afters?)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

DNASolves

Who is Escambia County John Doe (1989)?

Members online

... and 121 more.
Total: 1,002 (members: 122, guests: 880)

Online statistics

Members online
122
Guests online
880
Total visitors
1,002
Totals may include hidden visitors.

Forum statistics

Threads
591,794
Messages
17,958,950
Members
228,607
Latest member
wdavewong
Back
Top