Alcala photos discussion thread - latest updates, news, questions

Kimster,

Where did the original discussion thread go??? There were lots of interesting connections made there that still haven't been transferred over to these separated threads and it would be great to be able to reference the original!

: )
 
BBM
In that photo, her ankle looks horrible swollen and misshapen. I just thought it was a trick of the photo because she doesn't seem to be in any pain or distress. But her ankle look way too big and distorted for her legs.

Yes, E. Agreed. Like Pink Panther said we had discussed and made observations in the original thread. This was one of them, and it wasn't by myself. There's another photograph of this young woman in a Hercule's type pose. Undoubtedly Alcala liked to whack people in the knees. Probably the ankles as well.
 
Hi, I just have to say how disgusting it is that his mother AND his sister helped him cover up his crimes. His mother, while bad enough she would do it, isn't that uncommon, but the sister? I wouldn't cover up murder for my brother as much as I love him. The mom and sister should be imprisoned,too. They have blood on their hands!

I'm sorry. I just had to post that. I am new to the forum. I've been reading it for years but never posted.
 
Anyone who helps a murderer should be in jail also..............JMOO
 
Kimster,

Where did the original discussion thread go??? There were lots of interesting connections made there that still haven't been transferred over to these separated threads and it would be great to be able to reference the original!

: )

Its still in the forum. We closed it because in order to organize the forum, we couldn't tell which were copied and which weren't very easily. If you need any copied to a topic thread, please let us know here: Housekeeping requests (was called New forum ideas) - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
 
Has anyone been able to find any photos/images of Joyce Gaunt or Antoinette Witaker? There are lots of articles today referencing them as possible victims but not a single picture to be found!
 
Hi, I just have to say how disgusting it is that his mother AND his sister helped him cover up his crimes. His mother, while bad enough she would do it, isn't that uncommon, but the sister? I wouldn't cover up murder for my brother as much as I love him. The mom and sister should be imprisoned,too. They have blood on their hands!

I'm sorry. I just had to post that. I am new to the forum. I've been reading it for years but never posted.

LogDetective-160x160.gif


Thank goodness you joined the team after all this time! :blowkiss:
 
Has anyone been able to find any photos/images of Joyce Gaunt or Antoinette Witaker? There are lots of articles today referencing them as possible victims but not a single picture to be found!

I'm snooping around. I did find this more detailed article about Witaker: "Antionette Witaker, 13, known by her friends and family as Tony, was a tough girl who would often fight with her mother and run away from home. But Tony had a romantic streak; she loved to write poetry and sign her work in elegant longhand, according to a 1978 Seattle Times story.

She had been living in a foster home when she walked out the door with the unknown man with long reddish-colored hair on the night of July 9, 1977.

A week later, her body was found, fully clothed and propped up on her hands and knees, in a vacant lot in the 2200 block of Northeast 95th Street in Lake City. Seattle police said it appeared that her body had been there for about a week."

Read more: http://www.tri-cityherald.com/2010/03/26/953715/california-killer-investigated.html#ixzz0jL5yLfjG


The article also said she is African-American and that's why there wasn't much interest in her case. :( It makes me sick to think that.
 
http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-alcala-other-victims-identified,0,1874604.story

The photos are just a fraction of the more than 1,000 images investigators found in Alcala's storage locker when he was arrested for the 1979 murder of 12-year-old Robin Samsoe in Huntington Beach.

Detectives have withheld about 900 pictures because they are too sexually explicit, while others have been cropped for release, Thomas said. He said he didn't know why his predecessors didn't release the photos years ago.



I think he was grooming me. He showed me all these pictures he had taken.

He showed me pictures of nude boys and some of them were so striking that they stick in my mind today," Leedom said.


I've been wondering if Alcala was part of a kiddie-*advertiser censored* ring. He even worked for Roman Polanski who obviously was into sex with children. Is this something he's been doing all his adult life? Was he selling these pictures? Are they all his? I was assuming that he took all the pictures, so I was looking only for possible victims that would fit within the time frame of when he was not incarcerated. But what if these people's pictures were taken by someone else, engaging in the same activity. Along with others here, I've run across a few girls who look very much like the UID image, but I did not mention them, because the time frame is off. Maybe if we are finding ver good likenesses we should be posting them anyway, in the event he acquired these pictures from someone else. Like this one that looks like Amy Billig:

Long haired brunette with eyes half closed - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I also wonder what he was doing in Denmark? Was he involved in an international kiddie-*advertiser censored* ring? Heck, maybe he met his old boss Polanski there! Back in the early 60's and early 70's there would have been no "internet ring" to post these kinds of pictures on, but they sure as heck existed and I believe they just were sold in person or via the mail, possibly through the want ads with some kind of coded entry?

I found this statistic on child *advertiser censored* before the internet: "Before the Internet between one-fifth and one-third of people arrested for child *advertiser censored* were also involved in actual abuse."


http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...CRKayU&sig=AHIEtbQOy937KZqlOnWUV7HYJcWx5yf4Ag

A bit more on child *advertiser censored* before the internet: (snipped from here: http://www.popcenter.org/problems/child_pornography/1#endref2)

The treatment of children as sexual objects has existed through the ages, and so too has the production of erotic literature and drawings involving children. However, *advertiser censored* in the modern sense began with the invention of the camera in the early nineteenth century. Almost immediately, sexualized images involving children were produced, traded, and collected.[1]Even so, child *advertiser censored* remained a restricted activity through most of the twentieth century. Images were usually locally produced, of poor quality, expensive, and difficult to obtain. The relaxation of censorship standards in the 1960s led to an increase in the availability of child *advertiser censored*, and, by 1977, some 250 child *advertiser censored* magazines were circulating in the United States, many imported from Europe
 
Interesting question about child *advertiser censored* given the connection to Polanski.
 
Has anyone been able to find any photos/images of Joyce Gaunt or Antoinette Witaker? There are lots of articles today referencing them as possible victims but not a single picture to be found!

PP, I did. I saw Kim gave you one. Buried back here a few posts I found and posted her photograph (Gaunt's) and photographs taken at the place her body was found.

Sadly I couldn't find any of Antoinette, but I haven't given up.

PP, it's post #15 on this thread. Someone named Webb obviously had a great interest in the case of Gaunt. She or someone took quite a few photos of Seward Park. There was also the body of another woman found there. Hope that helped.
 
http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-alcala-other-victims-identified,0,1874604.story

The photos are just a fraction of the more than 1,000 images investigators found in Alcala's storage locker when he was arrested for the 1979 murder of 12-year-old Robin Samsoe in Huntington Beach.

Detectives have withheld about 900 pictures because they are too sexually explicit, while others have been cropped for release, Thomas said. He said he didn't know why his predecessors didn't release the photos years ago.




This little girl. Something is way not right. Maybe I am looking too much into it. It appears something happened to the left side of her mouth top and bottom. She has a bandage on her pinky finger, but she's a kid so that could be any kid. Her chin looks out of line or something. Again maybe it's just me. Her left arm I see a birthmark. I wouldn't like this photograph no matter who took it. Just something about it.


http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg





I think he was grooming me. He showed me all these pictures he had taken.

He showed me pictures of nude boys and some of them were so striking that they stick in my mind today," Leedom said.


I've been wondering if Alcala was part of a kiddie-*advertiser censored* ring. He even worked for Roman Polanski who obviously was into sex with children. Is this something he's been doing all his adult life? Was he selling these pictures? Are they all his? I was assuming that he took all the pictures, so I was looking only for possible victims that would fit within the time frame of when he was not incarcerated. But what if these people's pictures were taken by someone else, engaging in the same activity. Along with others here, I've run across a few girls who look very much like the UID image, but I did not mention them, because the time frame is off. Maybe if we are finding ver good likenesses we should be posting them anyway, in the event he acquired these pictures from someone else. Like this one that looks like Amy Billig:

Long haired brunette with eyes half closed - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

I also wonder what he was doing in Denmark? Was he involved in an international kiddie-*advertiser censored* ring? Heck, maybe he met his old boss Polanski there! Back in the early 60's and early 70's there would have been no "internet ring" to post these kinds of pictures on, but they sure as heck existed and I believe they just were sold in person or via the mail, possibly through the want ads with some kind of coded entry?

I found this statistic on child *advertiser censored* before the internet: "Before the Internet between one-fifth and one-third of people arrested for child *advertiser censored* were also involved in actual abuse."


http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q...CRKayU&sig=AHIEtbQOy937KZqlOnWUV7HYJcWx5yf4Ag

A bit more on child *advertiser censored* before the internet: (snipped from here: http://www.popcenter.org/problems/child_pornography/1#endref2)

The treatment of children as sexual objects has existed through the ages, and so too has the production of erotic literature and drawings involving children. However, *advertiser censored* in the modern sense began with the invention of the camera in the early nineteenth century. Almost immediately, sexualized images involving children were produced, traded, and collected.[1]Even so, child *advertiser censored* remained a restricted activity through most of the twentieth century. Images were usually locally produced, of poor quality, expensive, and difficult to obtain. The relaxation of censorship standards in the 1960s led to an increase in the availability of child *advertiser censored*, and, by 1977, some 250 child *advertiser censored* magazines were circulating in the United States, many imported from Europe

Billylee, That's very interesting. Ya know it crossed my mind about Polanski as well and his class.

There's one image released of the little girl in the yellow dress that immediately made me cringe. Even though there's other images of very young kids in the photos they released something about the little yellow dress girl just hit me in the pit of my stomach.


http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg
 
Billylee, That's very interesting. Ya know it crossed my mind about Polanski as well and his class.

There's one image released of the little girl in the yellow dress that immediately made me cringe. Even though there's other images of very young kids in the photos they released something about the little yellow dress girl just hit me in the pit of my stomach.


http://cnnnancygrace.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/00263.jpg

It looks like she has green shorts, you can just see a bit of green in the pic.
 
It would be nice to know which were identified, other than the ones we know,
 
Interesting question about child *advertiser censored* given the connection to Polanski.

I read a biography of Roman Polanski years ago and it did not portray him as a pedophile per se. Was never found with any child *advertiser censored*. He was taking pictures of a 13 year old model being "pimped" sort of by her mother, got very drunk, took her home and raped her. Seemed to be an isolated incident involving underage girls.
 
I have never heard of any other serial killers that had an accomplice other than the Hillside Strangler. I can't picture Alcala having a partner. I see him as a secretive loner. He may have committed many many murders without getting caught. An accomplice or witness of any kind to his activities would be dangerous and I just can't see it. Back then you never heard of *advertiser censored* rings. They may have existed but you never heard about them.
 
How is it possible that NO NEWS AGENCY has been able to find out where on earth he was doing time while in the military??? Why is this such a difficult piece of information to find?
 

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