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JonBenet Ramsey What really happened to 6 year old JonBenet? Someone is getting away with murder. All information posted on this site is gained through published documentation on this case. It is strictly opinion only.


View Poll Results: Why would theRamseys need to stage?
Fear of Prison (includes all LE, including social services) 94 55.29%
Fear of Reactions of Relatives 2 1.18%
Fear of Losing Status 40 23.53%
Theatrical Impulse/Make the Crime Sensational (Fame) 7 4.12%
Insanity/Break With Reality 8 4.71%
Other 19 11.18%
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  #76  
Old 06-21-2010, 10:59 PM
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Staging was only 'introduced' as an explanation for the things that LE could not fit into the RDI theory.
Really? Because that's not the impression I got at ALL. I always thought it had something to do with little things like "evidence" and "crime scene experience." Silly me!

DD's right: forensic and law enforcement experts have weighed in, and they are trained specifically to know these things.
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  #77  
Old 06-21-2010, 11:53 PM
WHITEFANG WHITEFANG is offline
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Originally Posted by SuperDave View Post
Really? Because that's not the impression I got at ALL. I always thought it had something to do with little things like "evidence" and "crime scene experience." Silly me!

DD's right: forensic and law enforcement experts have weighed in, and they are trained specifically to know these things.
You are assuming the R's hadn't had a chance to pay them off?
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  #78  
Old 06-22-2010, 01:20 AM
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You are assuming the R's hadn't had a chance to pay them off?
Far as I can tell.
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  #79  
Old 06-22-2010, 01:29 AM
MurriFlower MurriFlower is offline
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Originally Posted by SuperDave View Post
Really? Because that's not the impression I got at ALL. I always thought it had something to do with little things like "evidence" and "crime scene experience." Silly me!

DD's right: forensic and law enforcement experts have weighed in, and they are trained specifically to know these things.
Perhaps I misinterpreted (that ole language barrier again) the term 'staging'? I understood it to mean that a killer (murderer really I suppose in this instance) uses items unnecessary to the killing to make it look like something it wasn't. For example in this case, where the ligatures on the hands are supposed not to have been tied until after her death in order to make it look as if she had been restrained. Or the supposedly totally unnecessary sexual abuse, to make it look as if a sex fiend had killed her. Are you saying that this is not correct?
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  #80  
Old 06-22-2010, 01:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MurriFlower View Post
Perhaps I misinterpreted (that ole language barrier again) the term 'staging'? I understood it to mean that a killer (murderer really I suppose in this instance) uses items unnecessary to the killing to make it look like something it wasn't. For example in this case, where the ligatures on the hands are supposed not to have been tied until after her death in order to make it look as if she had been restrained. Or the supposedly totally unnecessary sexual abuse, to make it look as if a sex fiend had killed her. Are you saying that this is not correct?
No, I'm saying it IS correct. Which is why I'm completely puzzled as to why you'd think I wasn't saying that.
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  #81  
Old 06-22-2010, 02:19 AM
Holdontoyourhat Holdontoyourhat is offline
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Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
Yes, but that was STAGED evidence of an intruder.
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Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
We don't know FACTUALLY whether the crime was staged ...or NOT.
I don't know but this looks like it could be...

Yes it is...

A breakthrough.
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  #82  
Old 06-22-2010, 02:47 AM
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Thats funny because for years RDI has been insisting that there is zero evidence of an intruder.

"...and an explanation of why JonBenet is dead."

Is the explanation that a left-leaning (Victory!) anti US (but not the country that it serves), anti-capitalist (fat cat) killed JBR?

Quote DD: Yes, but that was STAGED evidence of an intruder.

Quoted Holdontoyourhat: Pardon me, but how the @#$ do you know?

QuoteDeeDee: A real intruder wouldn't stage it. Wouldn't cover her up, wipe her down, probably not even hide the body in the wineceller. It is widely thought she wasn't killed in the wineceller itself. An intruder would have left her where she was killed.

Quote SuperDave: YGG!

Quote Holdontoyourhat: There is no known staging.

Quote DD: Not according to LE and forensics experts.

Quote Holdontoyourhat: They have only speculated. Staging isn't a case fact.

Quote DD: Yes, true. We are ALL speculating. We don't know FACTUALLY whether the crime was staged ...or NOT. But the opinions of professionals who see this kind of thing regularly mean a lot.

Quote MurriFlower: Staging was only 'introduced' as an explanation for the things that LE could not fit into the RDI theory.

Quote SuperDave: Really? Because that's not the impression I got at ALL. I always thought it had something to do with little things like "evidence" and "crime scene experience." Silly me!

DD's right: forensic and law enforcement experts have weighed in, and they are trained specifically to know these things.

Quote MurriFlower: Perhaps I misinterpreted (that ole language barrier again) the term 'staging'? I understood it to mean that a killer (murderer really I suppose in this instance) uses items unnecessary to the killing to make it look like something it wasn't. For example in this case, where the ligatures on the hands are supposed not to have been tied until after her death in order to make it look as if she had been restrained. Or the supposedly totally unnecessary sexual abuse, to make it look as if a sex fiend had killed her. Are you saying that this is not correct?

Quote SuperDave: No, I'm saying it IS correct. Which is why I'm completely puzzled as to why you'd think I wasn't saying that.
Bugger, now I'm even more puzzled than you are.
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  #83  
Old 06-22-2010, 03:22 AM
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Bugger, now I'm even more puzzled than you are.
Well, do we start over?
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  #84  
Old 06-22-2010, 03:26 AM
MurriFlower MurriFlower is offline
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Well, do we start over?
Dunno if the old head can handle it!
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  #85  
Old 06-22-2010, 03:33 AM
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Dunno if the old head can handle it!
I know what you mean.
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  #86  
Old 06-22-2010, 03:59 AM
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Where were the Whites at the night of the murder?? I know the showed up the next morning but where where they in the early morning hours?? Also, has it ever been thought of that maybe the intruder was a Female and its just been assumed the intruder or person is interest was a male?
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  #87  
Old 06-22-2010, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FIND'HER View Post
Where were the Whites at the night of the murder?? I know the showed up the next morning but where where they in the early morning hours?? Also, has it ever been thought of that maybe the intruder was a Female and its just been assumed the intruder or person is interest was a male?
I would think that this would make the perp pretty unique...I mean if you accept the premise that an intruder climbed in the basement window and took the child from her bed to murder her in the basement, then wrote the ransom note and left it upstairs...I admit that I would be puzzled about the motivation. It seems easy I suppose to ascribe some kind of sexual motivation to a male, or sexual obsession. But a female intruder-I mean someone completely outside the Ramsey circle? Wow.
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Old 06-22-2010, 09:34 AM
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Is it reasonable to assume the ligatures on her extremeties and the paintbrush were anything other than staging?
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  #89  
Old 06-22-2010, 12:46 PM
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If your an intruder, once you have Jonbenet in your hands, your job is done.

All you have to do is walk out the front door into your car and do whatever your heart desires to Jonbenet.

Which has always puzzled me as to why this intruder made his job much harder than it had to?

Why bother writing this poorly composed ransom note? He can simply call them later if he choses or write the note more carefully and concise at home. There is no real pressing urgency to write this damn note in the house.

Nor is it necessary to molest her in the house. He can take her into a van or even his own home and do all types of disgusting acts to her.

This guy already succeeded in the three most hardest parts of this caper.
1. breaking in
2. avoiding detection
3. subduing jonbenet.

All of which is pretty impressive from a criminal perspective.

but, Yet this guy decides to make this thing even tougher with the ransom note and garotting her in her own house.
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  #90  
Old 06-22-2010, 02:59 PM
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Is it reasonable to assume the ligatures on her extremeties and the paintbrush were anything other than staging?
Not to me.
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Old 06-22-2010, 04:03 PM
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Far as I can tell.
Well, how does that fit into your theory?
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  #92  
Old 06-22-2010, 09:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FIND'HER View Post
Where were the Whites at the night of the murder?? I know the showed up the next morning but where where they in the early morning hours?? Also, has it ever been thought of that maybe the intruder was a Female and its just been assumed the intruder or person is interest was a male?
Male DNA was found that has not been identified. May or may not be associated with the crime. But no stranger female DNA or evidence has been found anywhere on the body or crime scene.
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  #93  
Old 06-22-2010, 09:59 PM
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Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
Male DNA was found that has not been identified. May or may not be associated with the crime. But no stranger female DNA or evidence has been found anywhere on the body or crime scene.
However we don't know about any 'friendly' female DNA do we?
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  #94  
Old 06-22-2010, 10:23 PM
WHITEFANG WHITEFANG is offline
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However we don't know about any 'friendly' female DNA do we?

LHP
access
handwriting
familiarity
jealousy
dislike
capacity
motive?
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Old 06-22-2010, 10:48 PM
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However we don't know about any 'friendly' female DNA do we?
You mean like Patsy's? We haven't been told of any of her DNA. Though there should have been, especially on the longjohns Patsy dressed her in.
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  #96  
Old 06-22-2010, 11:15 PM
WHITEFANG WHITEFANG is offline
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Not to me.
No, no, no. What is wrong with you? This is the scheme the R's came up with to make their lives easier. Sure, they could have done a zillion other things to hide the killing and their accountability, but they thought it best to fake strangulation, fake a kidnapping note, let her die right in front of them instead of seeking medical help. They had it all figured out to avoid detection and you can see how well their ideas worked. No one suspected them. No one bought the note. No one accepted the staging. So, it was really the R's fault that everything fell apart.

Don't forget the key to understanding this murder mystery. They, the R's, were doomed from the beginning. When the BBBBBB and the Coroner destroyed any chance for a proper investigation, the R's paid the price and would keep on paying.
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  #97  
Old 06-22-2010, 11:18 PM
WHITEFANG WHITEFANG is offline
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Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
You mean like Patsy's? We haven't been told of any of her DNA. Though there should have been, especially on the longjohns Patsy dressed her in.
What do you think about looking at LHP more closely?
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  #98  
Old 06-22-2010, 11:40 PM
DeeDee249 DeeDee249 is offline
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Originally Posted by WHITEFANG View Post
What do you think about looking at LHP more closely?
I know many IDI look at her that way. I understand she had access, familiarity with the house, etc. But I just can't see a reason for her killing JB deliberately, and I can't see her kidnapping JB and thinking she would get away with it. Did she really think JB wouldn't tell anyone who took her? How did she think she'd get the money? Where to make the drop? WHO would pick up the money and deliver JB? Then, too, she was ruled out for handwriting match and gave DNA and hair samples.
So once again, no matter which path I'd go down as far as LHP, there is a dead end.
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Old 06-23-2010, 12:29 AM
Holdontoyourhat Holdontoyourhat is offline
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Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
Male DNA was found that has not been identified. May or may not be associated with the crime.
But don't let the fact that this unknown male DNA was found exactly where a criminal had been handling things fool you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DeeDee249 View Post
But no stranger female DNA or evidence has been found anywhere on the body or crime scene.
More accurately: of the evidence found at the crime scene, none has yet been attributed to a female. The ransom note handwriting could be female, the garrote could've been tied by a female, JBR could've been murdered by a female.
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  #100  
Old 06-23-2010, 12:51 AM
WHITEFANG WHITEFANG is offline
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But don't let the fact that this unknown male DNA was found exactly where a criminal had been handling things fool you.



More accurately: of the evidence found at the crime scene, none has yet been attributed to a female. The ransom note handwriting could be female, the garrote could've been tied by a female, JBR could've been murdered by a female.
Who else had

Access?

similar handwriting

knowledge of the floor plan

knowledge the alarm wasn't armed

how deeply JR slept

asked for money

disliked J

knowledge where she slept

where P would find note

knowledge of $118,000

had possessions of R's in her home including writing pads and felt tip pens

knowledge of rope

access to P's credit cards?

where secret room was
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