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  #801  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:27 AM
Bobarino Bobarino is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epiphany View Post
Announced this week, no clothes were on the body when discovered. Do not know if that included panties, but stated no shirt and no jeans on body.
Is there a link on this? I must have missed something. I thought they said the pants and shoes were off of her, but the rest was still on her?

TIA
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  #802  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:27 AM
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hollyblue hollyblue is offline
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Originally Posted by krowdkat View Post
I personally don't believe the attack took more than 5 minutes. Only because rage is usually spontaneous and it's very rare to stop rage and then start up again.

It has happened, as I have followed cases where torture went on for days. However, based on surveillance video, we have a relatively small time frame inre to Joran. His rage was instantaneous, and deadly. And then he fled. 5 minutes (no more than 8) in my opinion.

Have you ever made a 2 minute speech? It seems like a lifetime.
I guess what bothers me the most is the fact that normally such a brutal beating is a "personal" attack against a victim, and he had just met her. How could he have that much rage against someone he barely knew? That is scary indeed and very troubling. One sick puppy walking around for a long time if you ask me.
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  #803  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:29 AM
krowdkat krowdkat is offline
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Originally Posted by Kat View Post
I had thought early on that it was like a blitz attack. Do you think so too? Given the amount of rage that was behind the assault?
I personally do, Kat. He may have alterior sex or theft motives leading Stephany there. I really don't think he planned on killing her, yet his rage, for lack of his other plans successes took over.
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  #804  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:31 AM
Bobarino Bobarino is offline
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"One sick puppy ..."

Interesting choice of words, since he supposedly killed his own family dog for the thrill of it.
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  #805  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:35 AM
krowdkat krowdkat is offline
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Originally Posted by hollyblue View Post
I guess what bothers me the most is the fact that normally such a brutal beating is a "personal" attack against a victim, and he had just met her. How could he have that much rage against someone he barely knew? That is scary indeed and very troubling. One sick puppy walking around for a long time if you ask me.
Hollyblue, it's people like you that give me faith in society. It is unfortunate that the news media doesn't publish 50% of their broadcast on the nice things that good people do, but that's not sensational for some reason or another.

IMO, everything was personal to Joran in his current state of mind. Any rejection from ANYONE at that point in time would prove fatalistic. So, yes, even though he had only known Stephany for a few days, Joran was a very desperate man looking for any excuse to blame anyone other than himself. Stephany was just simply a convienant source to take out all his inappropriate rage.
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  #806  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Bobarino View Post
Is there a link on this? I must have missed something. I thought they said the pants and shoes were off of her, but the rest was still on her?

TIA
I don't have a link -- but I belive that Stephany was sound with her panties (red and black), her sanitary napkin, her blouse and bra. She was missing shoes and jeans.
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  #807  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:37 AM
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Originally Posted by krowdkat View Post
Any rejection from ANYONE at that point in time would prove fatalistic. So, yes, even though he had only known Stephany for a few days, Joran was a very desperate man looking for any excuse to blame anyone other than himself. Stephany was just simply a convienant source to take out all his inappropriate rage.
Yes ... the rejection triggered the suppressed rage at his situation, life, women in general.
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  #808  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:39 AM
Woe.be.gone Woe.be.gone is offline
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Night all. Prayers for strength for all mothers who are concerned about their children tonight.
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  #809  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:40 AM
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hollyblue hollyblue is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobarino View Post
Thanks. That's what I presumed. And that's why the NG link above I posted has some important stuff, that I hadn't seen before. It notes which bruises are red, and which are green e.g.. I think the feet discoloration was noted as green, from your excellent post just now, that would indicate bruising post-mortem. I have said, if this monster was brutal with her when she was alive, can you imagine how he treated her corpse?
Bobarino, it's just my opinion, but knowing how Nancy has gone ape with the eyeball, I'd think that if Stephany's finger had been severed---we would definitely know about it; although I do agree that we may not have all the details of her injuries.

On another note, you mentioned last night of the suspicious telephone number of DeVries (sp)...conspiracy, etc. Can you explain why the telephone number seems conspiratorial to you? TIA
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  #810  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:43 AM
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Kat Kat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bobarino View Post
Thanks. That's what I presumed. And that's why the NG link above I posted has some important stuff, that I hadn't seen before. It notes which bruises are red, and which are green e.g.. I think the feet discoloration was noted as green, from your excellent post just now, that would indicate bruising post-mortem. I have said, if this monster was brutal with her when she was alive, can you imagine how he treated her corpse?
Bobarino we have so many registered nurses here on this board that I can't answer about the bruising. I have seen posts by those nurses that describes the different stages of bruising. I thought green ones were older bruises that were healing? I could be very wrong about that!

Hopefully one of our medical members will post another description.

As for the finger comment on the NG show, I have to go back and look at her transcript because I did watch that particular show with one eye but I was very distracted and we were still at the hotel when it aired. IIRC she might have been saying No----finger, open wound. I have to go back because she and her guests tend to talk over one another (not an insult lol).

I have to sign off in a few, dateline is coming on here at 8 PM and I want to see the coverage of the JVDS they are having.

Good night all and prayers for Stephany's family.
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  #811  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:43 AM
Bobarino Bobarino is offline
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I think it was all over very quickly. Could have been only 2-3 minutes once it began. I think he goes off easily, quickly and totally, and obviously not only has no concern for the life of another human being, he didn't even take into consideration that this was happening in a room rented to his name. He certainly didn't plan for this due to the location. But once something sets him off, he goes total.

She probably only went into the eroom with him and took him in her car, because he acted maybe soft and sweet and totally non-threatening.

I have even thought to myself that he may be real smooth in regards to something else...

Maybe at one point she said to him, "hey you know I'm gay", and smooth guys actually say something like, "cool, I'm gay too, but don't tell anyone else here." Or such, and together with his act, felt he was a non-threat, despite his size. And I think he tried to scam her first for money, and she said no thanks. And she resisited all his scams, and he then went for the physical robbery, and she tried to stop him from taking her belongings, or else he grabbed her ATM cards or such and held her by the throat to get her PINS, and she maybe struck out at him. This type would go ballistic at the first attempt to strike at him. And especially if she did something like try to kick his groin.

Earlier I asked, RE the elbow, if anyone knows if he took martial arts? Now I ask if anyone here knows if she took martial arts"??

TIA

Above is MOO.
  #812  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:45 AM
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Salem Salem is offline
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Hey Everybody - lets stay on topic here.

I'll start a new thread in just a few minutes.

Salem
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  #813  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:45 AM
Bobarino Bobarino is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brazen View Post
I don't have a link -- but I belive that Stephany was sound with her panties (red and black), her sanitary napkin, her blouse and bra. She was missing shoes and jeans.
Thanks. That's what I recalled.
  #814  
Old 06-20-2010, 01:46 AM
brazen brazen is offline
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Originally Posted by Kat View Post
,,,I see mental illness and personality disorders as two distinct diagnosis and I find that if the perp is suffering from untreated or undertreated mental illness I have a bit of sympathy for them. Not much but a bit. (Andrea Yates as an example) Branzen - I agree.

I have no sympathy at all for a perp that has (diagnosed) or blantantly appears to have a personality disorder. (Susan Smith, Melissa Huckaby etc...as other examples oh and Ted Bundy too). Brazen - I do, personality disorders are not the fault of those who have them, however, much they need to be removed from society.

As for AVDS I haven't paid her much attention. Brazen - on the contrary, I believe, more and more, that she will be critical in understanding JVDS.
My
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