NC - Zahra Clare Baker, 10, Hickory, 9 Oct 2010 - #21 - Page 6

simlyme · #**126** 10-23-2010, 04:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

I think that's a blog. I'm not sure if we can trust that source JMHO.

Oh, I hope its not true, because now Im thinking ,wouldnt that be putting the cart before the horse? Considering what Dubs specialty is.
And why would she need that kind of attorney right now, she hasnt been charged with anything that would warrent this kind of attorney.
Thanks for informing on that source.

Kat · #**127** 10-23-2010, 04:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lauriej

..i can't for the life of me understand what all of these men ( and more have been uncovered here since.. ) saw ------in EB. ( ??? )

http://www.wbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13329351
who is elisa baker?

Interesting article but why in the world would Mr. Rivenbark (the writer) give her parents full names and her Mom's flippin maiden name? Good lord that's but intrusive. Poor people. <sigh>

Sin City · #**128** 10-23-2010, 04:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

How would the pedo angle work?

I can't work it out in my head. I'm not shutting it down I just can't see how that would work? Thanks to anyone that takes the time to explain to me

I'm not fully convinced of the pedo angle, but it's stuck in my head. LE would probably find evidence with a forensic investigation of their computers. Unless, a throw away phone was used for most of the negotiating. Sick, I know. I'm sorry.

agathawannabe · #**129** 10-23-2010, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbrnmw2

I really really pray they are being monitored in my Criminology class the instructor was constantly telling us to look deeper if someone seemed to continually insert theirself into a case Like overly friendly to investigators and victims family

I wholeheartedly agree

Virgogalsue · #**130** 10-23-2010, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nosee_Parker

I've been tossing something around in my head the past few days, I can't even bring myself to say it out loud. Since the media report about EB having a British interest who gave her around $10K ... well, *choke* does anyone think that she could be responsible for offering Zahra to a pedophile?

I'm even ashamed to type that out, but why would he be giving her money? We've already realised (<see the red squiggly - i.e. realized!) that she's been involved in illegal and unsavoury things. Would she stoop that low?

Nope, I can't go along with that idea. There are too many family/friends who have evidence of treatment more immediate!
I think EB probably had a new man (a better opportunity) online.

Sociopaths chew up individuals until the next better opportunity comes along!

It could be the man from london...but I would bet it was a man who was closer, and could offer her a more immediate 'fix' or 'gratification'

madelyn · #**131** 10-23-2010, 04:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

How would the pedo angle work?

I can't work it out in my head. I'm not shutting it down I just can't see how that would work? Thanks to anyone that takes the time to explain to me

U ask how the pedo angle would work? Easy as pie for morally depraved to enter int'l chatrooms, find someone "suggesting" that he'd like pics of kids, then offer the pics to him AFTER exchanging phone numbers or secure way to communicate. At that point EB (an old hand at finding guys in international chat venues) would take the pics, send them, and collect. Ten grand would be a pittance for a wealthy creep to pay, over a period of a year or so. Perhaps he wanted more. A visit? A video? A person???

That's how it would work. Too easy for her to pass up, being versed in net-flirtation as she was.

Kat · #**132** 10-23-2010, 04:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madelyn

U ask how the pedo angle would work? Easy as pie for morally depraved to enter int'l chatrooms, find someone "suggesting" that he'd like pics of kids, then offer the pics to him AFTER exchanging phone numbers or secure way to communicate. At that point EB (an old hand at finding guys in international chat venues) would take the pics, send them, and collect. Ten grand would be a pittance for a wealthy creep to pay, over a period of a year or so. Perhaps he wanted more. A visit? A video? A person???

That's how it would work. Too easy for her to pass up, being versed in net-flirtation as she was.

okay.

What does that have to do with Zahra being missing and probably murdered?

Sin City · #**133** 10-23-2010, 04:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

okay.

What does that have to do with Zahra being missing and probably murdered?

Yes, LE has stated this is a murder investigation. However, one can bet that the FBI has or is investigating a pedo angle also.

madelyn · #**134** 10-23-2010, 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

okay.

What does that have to do with Zahra being missing and probably murdered?

Everything. One, it could explain the british connection and the money involved. Two, it signposts EB as capable of selling child porn for money. IF she'd do that, she'd possibly sell the child outright, or ATTEMPT to. Three, someone willing to sell pics of a child would think zip of murdering said child when LE was about to close in. Four, it could explain the "missing" part.
More to this but I have a stomach ache from writing this much. Alka Seltzer and a good night's rest and I'll give u more tomorrow.

Kat · #**135** 10-23-2010, 04:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sin City

Yes, LE has stated this is a murder investigation. However, one can bet that the FBI has or is investigating a pedo angle also.

Possibly. I just wanted to have someone sketch out the pedo angle and how that would work. I have no clue.

As for FBI sure they would probably look at the computers for anything. Including pedo contacts. I'm not sure they found anything they were listed as out at the dump searching for the mattress. Who knows at this point KWIM?

Just was curious. JMHO.

Kat · #**136** 10-23-2010, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by madelyn

Everything. One, it could explain the british connection and the money involved. Two, it signposts EB as capable of selling child porn for money. IF she'd do that, she'd possibly sell the child outright, or ATTEMPT to. Three, someone willing to sell pics of a child would think zip of murdering said child when LE was about to close in. Four, it could explain the "missing" part.
More to this but I have a stomach ache from writing this much. Alka Seltzer and a good night's rest and I'll give u more tomorrow.

I'm sorry you feel bad now.

If you feel up to it tomorrow though I would really like to hear your theory and how you outline that theory and support it.

I don't have a theory yet.

At this point in time any theory could be valid. We just don't have enough info.

Do I think it's a pedo? No I don't. But I'm not going to shut down anyone's theory before I've heard it. Take care, and feel better!

Sin City · #**137** 10-23-2010, 04:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

Possibly. I just wanted to have someone sketch out the pedo angle and how that would work. I have no clue.

As for FBI sure they would probably look at the computers for anything. Including pedo contacts. I'm not sure they found anything they were listed as out at the dump searching for the mattress. Who knows at this point KWIM?

Just was curious. JMHO.

Kat, I'm following you. I also wonder if AB is taking LE on a wild goose chase. We just don't know much.

Kat · #**138** 10-23-2010, 04:34 AM

Theories by members are one of my fav parts of WS. I rarely come up with one very quickly, in fact it takes me so long it's a foregone conclusion by the time I come up with who did it.

Prayers for Zahra

madelyn · #**139** 10-23-2010, 04:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

I'm sorry you feel bad now.

If you feel up to it tomorrow though I would really like to hear your theory and how you outline that theory and support it.

I don't have a theory yet.

At this point in time any theory could be valid. We just don't have enough info.

Do I think it's a pedo? No I don't. But I'm not going to shut down anyone's theory before I've heard it. Take care, and feel better!

I have no theories. I'm just speculating here at WS. My guess, which is a guess, is that it's 50/50 or better that EB was into selling ped pics online to rich creeps overseas, and that it impacted Z's well-being. Maybe someone wanted to see a video. Maybe Zahra was injured during the creation of one of these videos. Perhaps things went too far. Just a guess. No solid theories. As Scotty might say, "Damnit Jim, I'm an accountant, not a criminologist."
Just tossing out some stuff my friend. Take care, and we can brainstorm more at another time.

Mrs G Norris · #**140** 10-23-2010, 04:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoeticSoul

Thanks

LOL loved the last one!

Does anyone else find it strange that they posed for a wedding photo holding their marriage certificate as if it were a trophy? I found that odd. I mean.. I've been to allot of weddings and I've never seen anyone do that. Is it a a custom in AU? IDK

Erm, no, it's not a custom here, and I've never seen it either, perhaps as a benefit for the immigration officials?

rbrnmw2 · #**141** 10-23-2010, 04:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mrs G Norris

Erm, no, it's not a custom here, and I've never seen it either, perhaps as a benefit for the immigration officials?

Or she told so many lies to family they probably said I will believe it when I see proof or something along those lines

Mrs G Norris · #**142** 10-23-2010, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by simlyme

Lisa Hires new prominent attorney, OMG ,what next,

http://primewriter.com/news-1246-headlines/?p=10752

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kat

I think that's a blog. I'm not sure if we can trust that source JMHO.

MSM links
http://www2.hickoryrecord.com/news/2...ase-ar-478084/
http://www.dubslawfirm.embarqspace.c...law/4532635515

Dubs is one of about 10 Catawba County attorneys permitted to defend clients facing the death penalty. Even though Baker has not been charged with Zahra’s murder, the case has gained nationwide attention and Hurley has decided that it is appropriate to appoint Dubs because of the likelihood that Baker will eventually be charged with the crime, Dubs explained.'

and, also from article.....

'Zahra Baker’s stepmother has been in the Catawba County jail since Oct. 10, and she’s had frequent visits from three people: her attorney Scott Reilly, attorney Lisa Dubs and private investigator Steve Elhers.

Lisa Dubs confirmed Friday that she has been assigned to Baker’s case as provisional council. According to court records, Dubs’ role is to “Conduct a preliminary investigation, determine if the defendant is indigent and needs appointed counsel, and protect the defendant’s rights pending appointment of trial counsel.”

So sounds like once they find EB indigent LD will withdraw in favour of a court appointed attorney to take the case to trial.

Advice to EB: Plead now, while you still have good attorneys working with you to negotiate a deal, if you go to trial its the DP fo shizzer. JMO

rbrnmw2 · #**143** 10-23-2010, 05:40 AM

I keep going over in my head what could have happened at first I thought medical neglect but given EB's suspected Muchausen by Proxy that would have given her lots of attention I am now thinking it was a deliberate act out of some sick type of jealousy as far as AB goes I think he is a weak willed person who wouldn't disobey her and helped her in the cover-up Someone had to have helped her being that Mattresses are involved IMO

BritsKate · #**144** 10-23-2010, 05:44 AM

Just a couple of thoughts to throw out:

My husband and I have a pic of us signing our marriage certificate in Scotland. It was the photographer's prompting but after 3 years, 5000 miles, lots of court proceedings, a GAL investigation and a few grand to get us there I would have posed upside down hanging from the rafters had they asked me to. There was an extreme amount of both jubilation but also relief we'd finally made it. International relationships can be taxing at times to put it mildly.

Also...just food for thought...AB wouldn't have to necessarily be 'dumb' to be preyed upon by a psychopath (narcissist, sociopath, whatever you want to call it). People afflicted with cluster b personality disorders are master manipulators. They are chameleons and can appear to be whatever you desire. My theory, IMO, is that EB sold AB a whole different novel and once he and Zahra were in the States they were stuck. Please realise I am not excusing the father's action/inaction. I told my husband (the step) that if I (the bio) ever hurt our kids I would expect him to nail my a$$ to the wall personally. And I would do the same.

SewingDeb · #**145** 10-23-2010, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mytime

They found the mattress near the trailer park.

http://www.wbtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=13297637

This is also from your link and it is what one poster was searching for:
"They need to come back and do some more," said Tabitha Haas.

Haas said Adam and Elisa Baker were spotted in the neighborhood about three weeks ago.

"They came here at night," Haas said.

Peggy Johnson claims a few days later, "the most awful smell was coming up out of the manhole in my yard."

She said authorities lifted the lid and looked inside, but only for a few seconds.

"They's another manhole in the holler that they need to come back and look at," Johnson said.

The place she talked about is hidden in a valley area behind a vacant trailer. It is in the same area where the couple was spotted.

Nosee_Parker · #**146** 10-23-2010, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BritsKate

Just a couple of thoughts to throw out:

My husband and I have a pic of us signing our marriage certificate in Scotland. It was the photographer's prompting but after 3 years, 5000 miles, lots of court proceedings, a GAL investigation and a few grand to get us there I would have posed upside down hanging from the rafters had they asked me to. There was an extreme amount of both jubilation but also relief we'd finally made it. International relationships can be taxing at times to put it mildly.

Also...just food for thought...AB wouldn't have to necessarily be 'dumb' to be preyed upon by a psychopath (narcissist, sociopath, whatever you want to call it). People afflicted with cluster b personality disorders are master manipulators. They are chameleons and can appear to be whatever you desire. My theory, IMO, is that EB sold AB a whole different novel and once he and Zahra were in the States they were stuck. Please realise I am not excusing the father's action/inaction. I told my husband (the step) that if I (the bio) ever hurt our kids I would expect him to nail my a$$ to the wall personally. And I would do the same.

I tend to wonder about AB feeling 'stuck' in a foreign country with limited funds to leave coupled with his supposed falling out with his family over the move. He appears to me as the caveman type - i.e. 'man earn bacon, woman cook it'. Perhaps he found it difficult to accept defeat, call his mother and admit the move was wrong and ask for financial help and emotional support to bring himself and his daughter home. Just my opinion of course, one of the many possibilities we can throw around to arrive at some type of motive/conclusion.

The pedo theory is more than likely impossible, just trying to wrap my head around why someone would want to harm such a beautiful and defenseless child.

I still maintain there are a couple of issues here:

1) Visa troubles for AB

2) His apparent lack of judgement and the realisation he had made a huge mistake marrying her and relocating to the US.

Nosee_Parker · #**147** 10-23-2010, 06:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SewingDeb

This is also from your link and it is what one poster was searching for:
"They need to come back and do some more," said Tabitha Haas.

Haas said Adam and Elisa Baker were spotted in the neighborhood about three weeks ago.

"They came here at night," Haas said.

Peggy Johnson claims a few days later, "the most awful smell was coming up out of the manhole in my yard."

She said authorities lifted the lid and looked inside, but only for a few seconds.

"They's another manhole in the holler that they need to come back and look at," Johnson said.

The place she talked about is hidden in a valley area behind a vacant trailer. It is in the same area where the couple was spotted.

What's a 'manhole' in the US? I call a 'manhole' the small entry area into a roof.

Patty G · #**148** 10-23-2010, 06:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nosee_Parker

What's a 'manhole' in the US? I call a 'manhole' the small entry area into a roof.

Wikipedia (Thumbnails)
Wikipedia (Thumbnails)

SewingDeb · #**149** 10-23-2010, 06:22 AM

It's usually a hole leading to water and sewer drains. There is a heavy metal cover, usually round in North Carolina) that can be lifted so a man/woman can go into the sewer to work.

It is a possible place to hide a body and should definitely be checked by police if there is a strong smell and it's located where E and A had been seen during the night a few weeks ago.

Wikipedia (Thumbnails)
Wikipedia (Thumbnails)

SewingDeb · #**150** 10-23-2010, 06:25 AM

You beat me to it, Patty. : )

The smell from the manhole really bothers me and I hope it has been thoroughly checked out.