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Old 12-29-2010, 09:38 AM
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OK - Broken Arrow woman who relied on faith healing charged after son dies

Woman who relied on faith healing charged with neglect after son dies

A woman was charged with child neglect Tuesday in connection with the death of her 9-year-old son, for whom she had not sought medical attention because of her religious beliefs, court records state.

Susan M. Grady, 42, formerly of Broken Arrow, prayed with others over her son, Aaron Gregory Grady, when he became ill on June 2, 2009, according to an affidavit filed Tuesday in Tulsa County District Court. His condition worsened, and he died June 5, according to the affidavit.

The medical examiner listed complications of diabetes mellitus as Aaron’s cause of death, the affidavit states.

Susan Grady told Detective Mikka Mooney that she is a member of the Church of the First Born and “believes in faith-based healing through prayer,” according to the affidavit, which was written by Mooney.

The circumstances in this case are rare, said First Assistant District Attorney

Doug Drummond, who said he hasn’t seen a case with similar facts in his 14 years with the Tulsa County District Attorney’s Office.
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Grady could face up to life in prison if convicted.
---

the story, at
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/artic...0_Awoman335941
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Old 12-29-2010, 03:50 PM
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We have a thread about a religious group, The Followers of Christ in Oregon, who also rely only on prayer for healing. They have lost an inordinate number of children to highly preventable deaths. The state stepped in a few years ago and started prosecuting and has also removed a number of children. It's so so sad to see a child die when it is absolutely unnecessary.

Excuse me, we have two threads:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...llowers+christ

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sho...llowers+christ
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Old 12-29-2010, 04:13 PM
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A link to other cases involving Church of the First Born (see first post)

http://www.rickross.com/groups/firstborn.html
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Old 12-29-2010, 05:01 PM
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The number of cases is appalling!! I checked the same site for articles about the Followers of Christ and yes, they're there also:

http://www.rickross.com/groups/foc.html

When you see the enormity of this problem, it's shocking. And unacceptable, IMO.
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Old 12-29-2010, 05:08 PM
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The number of cases is appalling!! I checked the same site for articles about the Followers of Christ and yes, they're there also:

http://www.rickross.com/groups/foc.html

When you see the enormity of this problem, it's shocking. And unacceptable, IMO.
I know! I was expecting maybe a handful and was stunned when I saw so many.
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Old 12-30-2010, 11:12 AM
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We have discussed this issue a good deal here at WS.

I am always curious that a community of people who claim to believe strongly in the power of prayer do not believe that prayer is an acceptable treatment for physical disease and distress. That's fascinating to me. It indicates that many of us who give lip service to prayer's power don't have any real faith in it at all.

These stories always make me look closely at my own belief in prayer's power and how weak that belief truly is.
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Old 12-31-2010, 06:11 PM
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My stepfather was a minister. His stance was that prayers go hand and hand with medicine. My mother is an RN (retired) and we got great medical treatment when needed as well as the normal prayers to get better.

So, why no medicine along with those prayers? I will never understand why any parent will not get the medical care needed for their children.

Moo
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Old 12-31-2010, 06:22 PM
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My stepfather was a minister. His stance was that prayers go hand and hand with medicine. My mother is an RN (retired) and we got great medical treatment when needed as well as the normal prayers to get better.

So, why no medicine along with those prayers? I will never understand why any parent will not get the medical care needed for their children.

Moo
Exactly, same here, prayers + medicine-wise. When I was a precocious eight- or nine-year-old brat ("So, why can't God just heal people?"), it was explained to me that God, the same as He made us all, certainly made doctors, and that doctors - using medicine, which was also made by people made by God - were His means for healing us.

It's always baffled me that some who profess faith in the same God I do, somehow miss this easy-to-follow explanation.
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Old 12-31-2010, 06:23 PM
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Originally Posted by southcitymom View Post
We have discussed this issue a good deal here at WS.

I am always curious that a community of people who claim to believe strongly in the power of prayer do not believe that prayer is an acceptable treatment for physical disease and distress. That's fascinating to me. It indicates that many of us who give lip service to prayer's power don't have any real faith in it at all.

These stories always make me look closely at my own belief in prayer's power and how weak that belief truly is.
I believe in the power of prayer and positive thought and intention completely. I also believe that medical science was given us to treat our ills. I believe that God helps those who help themselves. I believe in affording myself of the aids available to me.

I am always curious when these faith healing folk do NOT afford themselves of medical intervention. How do they know that the answer to their prayers wasn't "go to the hospital, I have people there who know what to do. People I have inspired to go into medicine and heal the sick are there waiting to help" ??
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Old 12-31-2010, 08:12 PM
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I believe in the power of prayer and positive thought and intention completely. I also believe that medical science was given us to treat our ills. I believe that God helps those who help themselves. I believe in affording myself of the aids available to me.

I am always curious when these faith healing folk do NOT afford themselves of medical intervention. How do they know that the answer to their prayers wasn't "go to the hospital, I have people there who know what to do. People I have inspired to go into medicine and heal the sick are there waiting to help" ??
BBM

Perhaps that is the answer that some who believe in prayer hear. And perhaps they go to the hospital and die - that happens all the time. There are no guarantees.

But why do we want to charge people who believe differently with a crime? I think it's the child factor that makes it feel "criminal". Most people wouldn't have a "problem" with an adult who chooses to treat themselves medically with prayer and prayer only....but when that same adult makes a similar decision for a child, many of us cry "abuse" and the law often supports this stance.

We believe more in our own human medical "power" and "knowledge" than in the power of prayer to a Force that, in a different circumstance, we would credit with the ability to grant miracles. Our faith is very limited.
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Last edited by southcitymom; 12-31-2010 at 08:17 PM.
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Old 12-31-2010, 08:16 PM
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Originally Posted by wfgodot View Post
Exactly, same here, prayers + medicine-wise. When I was a precocious eight- or nine-year-old brat ("So, why can't God just heal people?"), it was explained to me that God, the same as He made us all, certainly made doctors, and that doctors - using medicine, which was also made by people made by God - were His means for healing us.

It's always baffled me that some who profess faith in the same God I do, somehow miss this easy-to-follow explanation.
With all due respect, wfgodot (and, FWIW, I have NO problem visiting a doctor for a physical ailment), surely God does not need humans to help effect healing. That's not to say He doesn't use humans in that regard, but I'm hard-pressed to believe that we are the only means at His disposal.
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Old 12-31-2010, 08:24 PM
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With all due respect, wfgodot (and, FWIW, I have NO problem visiting a doctor for a physical ailment), surely God does not need humans to help effect healing. That's not to say He doesn't use humans in that regard, but I'm hard-pressed to believe that we are the only means at His disposal.
True, our understanding of the process may differ.
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Old 12-31-2010, 09:41 PM
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Woman charged with neglect in son's death jailed, released on bail

---
Susan Grady, 42, was charged Tuesday in connection with the June 2009 death of Aaron Gregory Grady from complications related to diabetes. Grady told detectives that she did not seek medical attention for her son because she “was trying to live by faith and felt like God would heal him,” according to a police affidavit filed Tuesday.

Grady surrendered to Tulsa County sheriff’s deputies and was booked into the Tulsa Jail around 10:45 a.m. She posted $10,000 bond and was released by noon, according to jail records.
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The leader of the Tulsa church said Wednesday that he doesn’t preach about denying medical attention, but he said God’s word proves that faith is all that is needed.

the rest, with picture, at
http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/artic...0_Awoman473327
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Old 01-02-2011, 10:59 AM
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This is one of those hot button issues that always causes debate and makes me think of the situation from many disparate angles.

I am all for religious freedom within certain bounds. I am not for absolute religious freedom when it involves making life altering/threatening decisions about children.

i.e. marriage of child brides (sometimes multiple) to skeevy old men who think they are God promised the same. Withholding known established medical treatment to a child because God will handle it. Performing exorcisms on children that are not vetted through the appropriate church channels (Cathlolisism does allow for exorcism but it happens extremely infrequently and is supervised with medical personnel ready to intervene if it is necessary).

I have an aunt. She has some very serious mental illnesses. She often becomes very zealous in her religious beliefs when she is amping up for another breakdown. She hears voices and when feeling religious, thinks they are God. Those voices often tell her to do really dumb things. Things that could (and have in the past) hurt her or others.

When my sister was an infant and my aunt lived with us. Those voices told her my infant sister was the devil and that she needed to kill her to save all the rest of us from a horrible fate.

I am all for freedom of religion. But some folks get carried away. Sometimes mental illness can skew a persons faith making it a dangerous thing. That is why I am okay with public scrutiny and intervention in situations where a persons life or safety could be adversly affected by someone's well intentioned faith.
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:47 PM
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My grandmother (God rest her) was the most amazing woman in my life. She lived her faith every day. She was a polio survivor (struck at 6 months in 1904). She had ten siblings and lived on a small farm in Texas. Her parents sold everything they could to get some money for Ma (the name everyone called this gracious lady) to get medical help. They took her by wagon to see a specialist in Houston--225 miles away. The doctors treated her and taught her mother about a new technique called physical therapy. She learned to walk. She went to school. She learned to drive. She married and raised 3 incredible daughters. She had the strength to walk out of her marriage in the 1930s (!!) when she learned that her pastor husband was molesting his daughters and others in the church. She went on to live with each of her daughters and to help raise the four grandchildren. I was blessed to have this woman live in our home and help raise me for 7 glorious years. She taught me about strong faith and to never ever feel sorry for yourself or to pity others but to step in and do something. The woman literally glowed with goodness and wisdom. And, she had a wicked sense of humor.

One day, the subject of prayer came up. I had just learned of a person who didn't believe in doctors and I was confused. I must have been around 8 years old. I'll never forget how she counseled me. She simply said, "Prayer is a powerful force but you look both ways before you cross the street, don't you?"

That woman's life lessons come back to me day in and day out. She was the reason we decided to adopt children with disabilities. We've tried very very hard to carry on her legacy. We teach them to pray but we also teach them to use all the tools at their disposal for a happy and healthy life.

She passed nine years ago as my father, in his lovely Irish baritone sang her over the threshold with "Shall We Gather at the River". She was 97.
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Old 01-02-2011, 12:51 PM
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I believe in the power of prayer and positive thought and intention completely. I also believe that medical science was given us to treat our ills. I believe that God helps those who help themselves. I believe in affording myself of the aids available to me.

I am always curious when these faith healing folk do NOT afford themselves of medical intervention. How do they know that the answer to their prayers wasn't "go to the hospital, I have people there who know what to do. People I have inspired to go into medicine and heal the sick are there waiting to help" ??
Exactly!
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