Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #12

[Cherwell]

Originally Posted by goldielox

Maybe the parents wanted the kids to have British or dual nationality so came over to the UK for the births. Is the mother British?

I think that's a very likely explanation. Not sure about the mother's nationality - given the forenames there could well be a mainland European background.

Originally Posted by PolkSaladAnnie

he laments his love of his g/f for "finally" coming into his life. Rather telling for one deemed so astute, clever and intelligent. To me this indicates a haunting hole of insecurity or ... non-disclosed issues.

But then .... that's just my own wild speculation ... lol

It certainly is wild speculation, because what it actually says is

“Last but not least I want to thank my girlfriend Tanja Morson for her support in the last difficult month of my PhD. I am very happy she entered my life.”

It seems to me no more than an understated yet pleasing acknowledgement.

[kINGFISHER]

You only have to look on the web plenty out there about CC of A and Somerset

[Deckard]

Originally Posted by goldielox

I think it would take more than a chink in a wall of a rented flat to end up on the sex offenders list Deckard. I mean how the heck would you prove who the person who created the hole was, and whether they'd actually peeked through it?

I'm not discounting a peep hole having been there (there's nowt so strange as folk as they say..) but I really struggle to see this as being the reason or catalyst as to why he may have killed her.

This is a really good question and one of the main reasons I think the crime was committed in flat 1.

Say JY made her way round to flat 1 after discovering the hole. After she burst in to satisfy her own need to see VT's side of the adjoining wall she may have discovered the camera, receiver maybe even the laptop in bedroom 2 of the setup. (Bedroom 2 adjoins both JY's bathroom and her bedroom). VT would be "bang to rights" in this scenario. Maybe she had poked at the micro camera from her side and discovered it that way.

Either way the cat is out of the bag. Pandora's box has been opened. A voyeur seeks to keep their victim at arm's length. What is their state of mind when the secret is out?

Even the less prolific voyeurs I have seen sentenced on a google search got 5 years on the register. Although rare, there are cases out there of fingered peeping tom's committing the ultimate act.

Who knows what digital data could have been stored on a laptop. There could be hours of footage that he did not want to see the light of day.

This is purely speculation but you have to ask yourself why would he have murdered a neighbour who he didn't even talk to? JY's father said they didn't know each other.

We know she was not sexually assaulted. We know she had no injuries visible apart from the abrasion to the neck. Doesn't sound like an interrupted rapist who found the time to take the body to Longwood Lane imo.

[kINGFISHER]

Originally Posted by PolkSaladAnnie View Post
he laments his love of his g/f for "finally" coming into his life. Rather telling for one deemed so astute, clever and intelligent. To me this indicates a haunting hole of insecurity or ... non-disclosed issues.

But then .... that's just my own wild speculation ... lol

I WOULD SAY YOU HAVE A VALID POINT THERE.

[aneurin]

Originally Posted by veggiefan

The sad fact is that A&S have been identified by Her Majesty's Inspector of Constabulary as a "high to medium cost force compared to its peers, which employs slightly more police officers than its peer forces", but which then goes on to score poor results in comparison with other forces (3 on a scale of 4 in almost every category). In particular, HMIC cites "The number of serious sexual offences, including rape, that have been solved is below the average for peer forces".

On the other hand;

"The force has traditionally been strong in investigating homicides and tackling major crime."

(http://www.hmic.gov.uk/PoliceReportC...ID=0&ForceID=1)

Just as well we're talking about a homicide here then. The CPS got convictions in 36 out of 38 homicide cases for A&SC in 2010. That's a conviction rate of almost 95%, which was significantly above the national average.

Originally Posted by veggiefan

A&S have 27 unsolved murders on their books, compared with the adjoining forces of Wiltshire (none at all), Gloucestershire (one) and Devon & Cornwall (7).

According to Freedom of Information Act Request No 466/2010-1708, Devon & Cornwall actually had 12 unsolved murders outstanding between 1.1.60 and 31.12.10. The Avon and Somerset Constabulary consider that they have 23 unsolved murders, 4 of which actually predate 1960, so a true comparison would be 12 against 19. (And whilst CPS figured show that they prosecuted 38 A&SC homicide defendants in 2010, it prosecuted 21 D&CC defendants, so 19 versus 12 probably reflects nothing more than the relative incidence of that offence.)

I presume that these figures were taken from the FOIA request that the BBC made (See 'When the murder trail goes cold' - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/magazine/8662635.stm). The trouble is that the different forces gave different answers; the Met only counted back as far as 1996, whilst Tayside Police went all the way back to 1886. Devon & Cornwall only went back to 1976 for the BBC, but gave a different answer when they were asked to go back to 1960. Thus the figures aren't necessarily comparable; the Gloucestershire figure of 1 unsolved murder is only since 2004; A&SC have 3 unsolved murders since 2004.

In any case one should note that in order to 'solve' a homicide all the police have to do is charge someone and get them to court. The JY murder will count as being solved the minute that the case of R v VT opens at Bristol Crown Court, irrespective of whatever verdict that may follow. (Perish the thought that police forces might simply charge someone simply to make their numbers look good.)

Also note that if A&SC had 27 unsolveds when the BBC asked the question early last year, but now have 23, it implies that they've cleared 4 in the past year. Not bad going that.

Originally Posted by veggiefan

In addition, they've been criticised for significant public expenditure on high-profile cases that have failed in the courts, such as the acquittal of all nine men charged with the Bristol gangland shootings.

Well that case does date back to 2006; the allegation being that the nine men constituted a gang who were responsible both for the murder of two men shot outside the Spotlight nightclub in Croydon and for a failed drive-buy shooting in Bristol on the same night which nevertheless left two women seriously injured. Whatever criticisms were made of the failure to convict in this case were largely directed at the CPS, who were responsible for the decision to roll both cases into one, and the Met, who were responsible for the majority of the significant public expenditure incurred. (Meticulous paperwork apparently.)

In any event the fact that the odd motor vehicle does indeed get sprayed by machine gun fire on the streets of Bristol, does rather underline the fact that A&SC faces rather different challenges compared to some of its neighbouring forces. You don't get that sort of thing down in Redruth you know.

Originally Posted by veggiefan

Add to that the fact that VT was charged on the day before a high-level review had to start due to the lack of progress in the case, and the scene is set for those at grass-roots level to come up with something, or face the prospect of the entire force being merged with one of its more successful neighbours.

Only time will tell, but if the case against VT collapses when it goes to court, it could well be the death-knell of A&S, given the government's wish to reduce the number of separate police forces we still have.

If the "case against VT collapses when it goes to court" then CPS will take the rap. It will be a solved murder as far as A&SC are concerned (see above).

The previous government had various plans to merge police authorities. These were abandoned in 2006, after what is usually referred to as 'widespread public opposition'. I'm not aware that the current government has any specific wish to promote police mergers for any reason other than the usual cost-saving/efficiency arguments. I would also very much doubt that the Home Office would take any particular view regarding A&SC simply because of just one homicide case, even if it is one that has generated acres of coverage in the tabloid press.

[notsure]

Originally Posted by kINGFISHER

Originally Posted by PolkSaladAnnie View Post
he laments his love of his g/f for "finally" coming into his life. Rather telling for one deemed so astute, clever and intelligent. To me this indicates a haunting hole of insecurity or ... non-disclosed issues.

But then .... that's just my own wild speculation ... lol

I WOULD SAY YOU HAVE A VALID POINT THERE.

...except for the fact that it's a misquote.

[kINGFISHER]

Originally Posted by notsure

...except for the fact that it's a misquote.

oh dear silly me.

[veggiefan]

Originally Posted by aneurin

In any case one should note that in order to 'solve' a homicide all the police have to do is charge someone and get them to court.

So, if the case against VT collapses in court, and LE later discovers who really killed JY and brings that person to court, will they count that as has having "solved" two murders, or will they count it as "solving" the same murder twice over?

Something fishy in all this 'solving', it seems to me!

Originally Posted by aneurin

(Perish the thought that police forces might simply charge someone simply to make their numbers look good.)

Joking aside, that's the thing that most worries me.

[veggiefan]

On the subject of "solving" crimes, I've just remembered that many years ago I had my car stolen from a council car park. The police were doubtful that I'd ever see it again, but to my amazement I had a call from someone in a nearby town about a week later, who said my car was blocking her drive, and did I know it wasn't locked? (She'd found my telephone number in a diary in the glove box).

I dutifully reported the recovery to the police, and the desk seargeant said "Congratulations, we'll record that as another crime solved, in that case".

Solved? I was flabbergasted!

[naturally suspicious]

Just as an aside,I spoke to son and girlfriend today..she reported that PS is a very nice man...

just odds and ends of info...

[Salem]

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Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #13 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Found Deceased UK - Joanna Yeates Clifton, Bristol, 17 December 2010 - #13 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

Thanks,

Salem