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Caylee Anthony 2 years old Not reported missing for a month after she was last seen.


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  #126  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:52 AM
sacrablue sacrablue is offline
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The problem with the kidnap ploy scenario is the outline of the heart sticker on the duct tape. The latent fingerprint examiner didn't just make that up. KC would not have applied that loving touch if she wanted it to look like a heartless kidnapping and murder.
Ok, I will back off the duct tape. Really does not matter.
As soon as George smelled the Pontiac at the tow yard, he knew something terrible happened. Trust me the smell of a decom body is 10-30x any garbage smell. On the way back home or at home he told Cindy there was a dead body in the Pontiac and they better start putting together what happened. The Pontiac was parked in the garage which would help the smell a little because of temperature.
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  #127  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:54 AM
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Apparantly, logicalgirl. I was trying to clarify but I don't know that I succeeded.
Those who insist GA was the caregiver are forgetting one point - surely it would be child neglect to leave your child with someone you have declared is a pedophile - maybe worse than apparently leaving your child with an imaginary nanny...
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  #128  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:55 AM
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That's an interesting theory, but duct tape would not have stuck to anything that was "wet"........
Exactly, that is why the tape could not be used as a patch but had to be wrapped completely around the head and hair two or three times to be secured.
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  #129  
Old 07-25-2011, 10:55 AM
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Ok, I will back off the duct tape. Really does not matter.
As soon as George smelled the Pontiac at the tow yard, he knew something terrible happened. Trust me the smell of a decom body is 10-30x any garbage smell. On the way back home or at home he told Cindy there was a dead body in the Pontiac and they better start putting together what happened. The Pontiac was parked in the garage which would help the smell a little because of temperature.
There was a point after that when he backed it out into the street and removed the battery - does anyone remember when that was?
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:00 AM
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George tells Cindy you better get your butt in the garage and clean up the Pontiac. Cindy is probably in total disbelief that anything this terrible could happen. Probably snips back a George and George says you deal with it then, it's your worthless daughter, you clean up the mess but I am telling you right now you had better start thinking about what we are going to do because somebody died and that somebody was in that car.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:01 AM
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this is NOT what GA says in ths interview. I have transcribed that part, omitting some of the filler language:

GA:"I have an extra key, I'll go get it. She was adamant about that."

GVS: Not letting you into the car?"

GA: "Yeah. 'She's still telling me I'll get it. Give me a minute I'll get it.' I said; 'KC, I'm capable of reaching inside your car, and I got it. As she opened up the trunk of the car..."

CA: "The gas cans are there."

GA: "She's the one who took the gas cans."


So he sugar coated it here, leaving out KC's abrupt behavior and f-bomb. At that time they were still trying to protect KC. That's it.
What jumps out at me in this interview that I'd forgotten about or didn't hear the first go around because this story was told in so many different ways, is that:

SHE opened the trunk and HE got the gas cans out.. and that chock out too.

There is no mention of her beligerent attitude and F-bombs, and there is no mention of a body, garbage, a terrible smell or anything else out of the ordinary. Just that he realized she was the one that stole the gas cans.
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  #132  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:05 AM
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Exactly, that is why the tape could not be used as a patch but had to be wrapped completely around the head and hair two or three times to be secured.
If the body was in the stage of decomp that it was leaking - wouldn't the hair be wet also....(sorry gross conversation?) I think there is no doubt it was put on either immediately after she died, or before...which would mean FKC would have dried her off very well after "drowning" in the pool to place duct tape on her and have it stick - and that would also mean if she was in the pool as Baez is trying to convince us - even drying Caylee off - her hair would still be wet....
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  #133  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:07 AM
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What jumps out at me in this interview that I'd forgotten about or didn't hear the first go around because this story was told in so many different ways, is that:

SHE opened the trunk and HE got the gas cans out..

There is no mention of her beligerent attitude and F-bombs, and there is no mention of a body, garbage, a terrible smell or anything else out of the ordinary. Just that he realized she was the one that stole the gas cans.
This gas can 'F' day was June 24 so 8 days after death. I would guess there is no way George got near that trunk. If he said he did I would challenge.
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  #134  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by eleni777 View Post
What jumps out at me in this interview that I'd forgotten about or didn't hear the first go around because this story was told in so many different ways, is that:

SHE opened the trunk and HE got the gas cans out.. and that chock out too.

There is no mention of her beligerent attitude and F-bombs, and there is no mention of a body, garbage, a terrible smell or anything else out of the ordinary. Just that he realized she was the one that stole the gas cans.
No where has it ever said George got the gas cans out of the trunk - but the depos said FKC went ahead of him, took the gas cans out of the trunk, threw them on the ground and said here's your f-ing gas cans. We went over and over this long before Caylee's remains were found.

And interview with Greta means nothing because no one knows who cut what out of an interview before it was aired. Maybe Greta doesn't like "f" words on her show and told George he wasn't allowed to say that on the "air". A depo is a depo...
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  #135  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:13 AM
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If the body was in the stage of decomp that it was leaking - wouldn't the hair be wet also....(sorry gross conversation?) I think there is no doubt it was put on either immediately after she died, or before...which would mean FKC would have dried her off very well after "drowning" in the pool to place duct tape on her and have it stick - and that would also mean if she was in the pool as Baez is trying to convince us - even drying Caylee off - her hair would still be wet....
OK, I am a guy who lives on a farm. Duct tape and dead animals are a common site. Anything wet I would wipe off with paper towel a little and then tape. The tape adheres to itself as long as tape stays dry. So I would wipe area to be tapped or pat and put one loop of tape around. The second loop will stick tightly to first loop. Because of the shape of the object, hour glass, the tape will not slide and will remain in place for a long time.
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  #136  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:19 AM
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No where has it ever said George got the gas cans out of the trunk - but the depos said FKC went ahead of him, took the gas cans out of the trunk, threw them on the ground and said here's your f-ing gas cans. We went over and over this long before Caylee's remains were found.

And interview with Greta means nothing because no one knows who cut what out of an interview before it was aired. Maybe Greta doesn't like "f" words on her show and told George he wasn't allowed to say that on the "air". A depo is a depo...

Exactly, logicalgirl. The bolded "I got it" that Eleni is referring to is essentially GA's way of saying to KC "I can do it myself", not that he was the one who took the cans from the trunk.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:19 AM
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OK, I am a guy who lives on a farm. Duct tape and dead animals are a common site. Anything wet I would wipe off with paper towel a little and then tape. The tape adheres to itself as long as tape stays dry. So I would wipe area to be tapped or pat and put one loop of tape around. The second loop will stick tightly to first loop. Because of the shape of the object, hour glass, the tape will not slide and will remain in place for a long time.
Well, I am a city girl who has many reasons to use duct tape and I do know it will not stick to anything that is wet. How would you wipe off hair enough that the tape would even begin to stay in place with the ends stuck together? It would have slipped and slid all over the place and never held the mandible in place for close to six months under those conditions - and yet it did. Because it was stuck to the hair mass. The hair mass surely would have originally had to be dry to have it stick.

I just tried this when I got out of the shower. No tape on my hair, which an inch or so shorter than Caylee's and no sticky stuff either. just slid right off.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:20 AM
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This gas can 'F' day was June 24 so 8 days after death. I would guess there is no way George got near that trunk. If he said he did I would challenge.
Just still trying to make sense of it all... We will never know what exactly went down because they (CA, GA, KC) all lie. The thing is he wants to get into the trunk for something entirely different and finds that his stolen gas cans are there too.

The AS she opened the trunk of the car statement tells me he is near the vehicle. He's either in the garage looking directly into the trunk or right in the doorway of the door that goes from the garage into the house with a view of the trunk... because Greta says "the gas cans are there"...and GA says "she took the gas cans"..the flow of the conversation points in a direction that he can SEE that they are in the trunk.

IMO Greta makes an huge mistake because she doesn't let him finish this statement. He pauses long enough at the "As she opens the trunk of the car..." and Greta jumps in and leads him with "the gas cans are there", I wonder if Greta had allowed GA to finish his thought what would he have said.

After this we get the multiple stories of KC's f-bombing him and blocking him from the trunk

Which story is the TRUTH? That's the million dollar question.
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  #139  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:25 AM
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George tells Cindy you better get your butt in the garage and clean up the Pontiac. Cindy is probably in total disbelief that anything this terrible could happen. Probably snips back a George and George says you deal with it then, it's your worthless daughter, you clean up the mess but I am telling you right now you had better start thinking about what we are going to do because somebody died and that somebody was in that car.
George went to work as soon as they got home, Cindy sprayed around and wiped with Febreeze, the police were on their way and arriving as George got home....and interestingly enough, the CSI said the trunk of the car was not particularly clean.

I think if FKC took the time to triple bag Caylee, she also took the time to throw away anything she was wearing at the time of the crime also. No way would she be leaving evidence in the car, besides the decomp fluid, which apparently was a fact about dead bodies she did not know, and had not made plans for. If she had known, no way would she have left the body in the trunk for the period of time she did.
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  #140  
Old 07-25-2011, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by eleni777 View Post
What jumps out at me in this interview that I'd forgotten about or didn't hear the first go around because this story was told in so many different ways, is that:

SHE opened the trunk and HE got the gas cans out.. and that chock out too.

There is no mention of her beligerent attitude and F-bombs, and there is no mention of a body, garbage, a terrible smell or anything else out of the ordinary. Just that he realized she was the one that stole the gas cans.

He's saying "and I got it". In other words, "I can handle this". If he were referring to getting the gas cans himself, GA would have said "I got them".

Also, if GA were referring to himself getting the gas cans out of the car, he wouldn't have said "I got it (them)" before "she opened the trunk.."
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:30 AM
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Well, I am a city girl who has many reasons to use duct tape and I do know it will not stick to anything that is wet. How would you wipe off hair enough that the tape would even begin to stay in place with the ends stuck together? It would have slipped and slid all over the place and never held the mandible in place for close to six months under those conditions - and yet it did. Because it was stuck to the hair mass. The hair mass surely would have originally had to be dry to have it stick.

I just tried this when I got out of the shower. No tape on my hair, which an inch or so shorter than Caylee's and no sticky stuff either. just slid right off.
I got a roll of duct tape and then put my head under the faucet. I still have a head of hair. Lightly dried with towel..4 seconds took a 12 inch strip of duct tape and put over my head in tooth ache position and tape adhered to the point it hurt to pull it off.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:31 AM
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Just still trying to make sense of it all... We will never know what exactly went down because they (CA, GA, KC) all lie. The thing is he wants to get into the trunk for something entirely different and finds that his stolen gas cans are there too.

The AS she opened the trunk of the car statement tells me he is near the vehicle. He's either in the garage looking directly into the trunk or right in the doorway of the door that goes from the garage into the house with a view of the trunk... because Greta says "the gas cans are there"...and GA says "she took the gas cans"..the flow of the conversation points in a direction that he can SEE that they are in the trunk.

IMO Greta makes an huge mistake because she doesn't let him finish this statement. He pauses long enough at the "As she opens the trunk of the car..." and Greta jumps in and leads him with "the gas cans are there", I wonder if Greta had allowed GA to finish his thought what would he have said.

After this we get the multiple stories of KC's f-bombing him and blocking him from the trunk

Which story is the TRUTH? That's the million dollar question.
Two points - FKC's car was not in the garage, and since she was just popping home for something and was with Tony L , not living at home at the time, there would have been no reason for her to have backed her car into the driveway. So it was either parked nose in on the driveway, or it was parked on the street. Walking out of their usual house entry through the garage, George would not be able to see into FKC's car trunk.

And I do not recall George ever saying he "saw" the gas cans in the trunk. He didn't walk to the trunk with her - she was already in mid temper tantrum at being "caught" with the gas cans.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:31 AM
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Just still trying to make sense of it all... We will never know what exactly went down because they (CA, GA, KC) all lie. The thing is he wants to get into the trunk for something entirely different and finds that his stolen gas cans are there too.

The AS she opened the trunk of the car statement tells me he is near the vehicle. He's either in the garage looking directly into the trunk or right in the doorway of the door that goes from the garage into the house with a view of the trunk... because Greta says "the gas cans are there"...and GA says "she took the gas cans"..the flow of the conversation points in a direction that he can SEE that they are in the trunk.

IMO Greta makes an huge mistake because she doesn't let him finish this statement. He pauses long enough at the "As she opens the trunk of the car..." and Greta jumps in and leads him with "the gas cans are there", I wonder if Greta had allowed GA to finish his thought what would he have said.

After this we get the multiple stories of KC's f-bombing him and blocking him from the trunk

Which story is the TRUTH? That's the million dollar question.
There is no discrepancy in what GA says happened, except he was more liberal with KC's behavior when he testified on the stand. He wanted to get the cans himself because he suspected KC stole them, but she beat him to it. Period.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:34 AM
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I got a roll of duct tape and then put my head under the faucet. I still have a head of hair. Lightly dried with towel..4 seconds took a 12 inch strip of duct tape and put over my head in tooth ache position and tape adhered to the point it hurt to pull it off.
Was your hair umm oily? I had just shampooed mine, and it was dripping and my face was still wet ....why the toothache position?

Mine did not stick.....at all.

Edited to add - further experiments need to wait until evening. I am supposed to be working and just don't feel I should be talking to clients with bits of duct tape stuck to my hair....LOL
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:34 AM
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George went to work as soon as they got home, Cindy sprayed around and wiped with Febreeze, the police were on their way and arriving as George got home....and interestingly enough, the CSI said the trunk of the car was not particularly clean.

I think if FKC took the time to triple bag Caylee, she also took the time to throw away anything she was wearing at the time of the crime also. No way would she be leaving evidence in the car, besides the decomp fluid, which apparently was a fact about dead bodies she did not know, and had not made plans for. If she had known, no way would she have left the body in the trunk for the period of time she did.
One thing to remember with decomp stuff, the sun/heat activate the molecules (cadaverscine and putricine) that enter our nostrils. When decomp area is cooled/shaded it slows down molecules and smell is not as pungent.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:39 AM
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Was your hair umm oily? I had just shampooed mine, and it was dripping and my face was still wet ....why the toothache position?

Mine did not stick.....at all.

Edited to add - further experiments need to wait until evening. I am supposed to be working and just don't feel I should be talking to clients with bits of duct tape stuck to my hair....LOL
I would have to demonstrate I guess but there is one thing about duct tape. You can submerge the tape in water and the rubber cement backing will loose 90% of its stickem. But once the tape dries it will become very sticky again.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:39 AM
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Exactly, that is why the tape could not be used as a patch but had to be wrapped completely around the head and hair two or three times to be secured.

But it wasn't wrapped around two or three times, it was three separate pieces measuring 9 - about 11 inches, not one round and round....
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:39 AM
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Ok, I will back off the duct tape. Really does not matter.
As soon as George smelled the Pontiac at the tow yard, he knew something terrible happened. Trust me the smell of a decom body is 10-30x any garbage smell. On the way back home or at home he told Cindy there was a dead body in the Pontiac and they better start putting together what happened. The Pontiac was parked in the garage which would help the smell a little because of temperature.
What really surprises me is the amount of sleuthers who can't entertain the notion that GA knew what he smelled, but the fact that he didn't find a body in the trunk just took over, gave him false hope.

The horror of what he smelled was quelled with the relief of not seeing a body, and that allowed him to soldier on. It allowed him to deny his worst fears for a little while longer.

Most bereaved family members hold on to false hope, even in the face of the obvious. GA and CA were not in any frame of mind to be conspiring on a strategy. To be at that point, you would have to also believe that they had already accepted that Caylee was dead, and had processed it, gotten over their grief and shock, and suspected KC.
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:43 AM
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There was no video available, but I'm not aware it was discredited.
I'm not sure if it was either. But why wouldn't the PT utilize that if it would help with the timeline. They insisted last person to see Caylee was George at 12:50 and thisWalmart sighting was around 4pm. So unless they discredited it they didn't have their timeline correct. I would think that the absolute time that the child was seen alive would be most important to the case. JMO
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Old 07-25-2011, 11:44 AM
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The best evidence the prosecution had never got used and for the life of me I can't understand why. They had the cans containing the smell there in the court room. I would love to know if the molecules associated with decomp were still there. If so this would have made believers out of skeptics.
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