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Lisa Irwin Missing! 10 mo old Lisa Irwin disappeared from her crib in the middle of the night. Where is she?


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  #301  
Old 03-17-2012, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by SyraKelly View Post
I am just letting people know-they had a dog and what they said in the interview!!!
Yes, this is correct. That portion of the Judge Jeanine interview is not included in my list of DB and JI statements in the reference forum, because there is no video available for it. The only source I can find is the Seamus Oreily statement analysis site, which is not allowed to be linked on WS iirc.
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Old 03-17-2012, 03:52 PM
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D/J have a dog-its a lab mix-they even say it was on the back deck that night and it would have bark at a stranger-its in the Judge Pirro interview--so either way if that dog was outside or inside it would bark!!
Like I said, I thought the same thing, thanks for reminding me where I heard this. So, what's strange, Jim Spellman says they don't have a dog. Did they get rid of it? Maybe they took the dog with them when they left the house?

Seems as though Megyn Kelly mentions a dog as well on her tour of the outside of the house.
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  #303  
Old 03-18-2012, 01:49 PM
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Maybe, but it could be that LE obtained his DNA because the garage wasn't locked. ..Why check his DNA if the garage was locked?
They took DNA of all people known to have ever entered that house. I know of no less than 6 people - only 2 of them named by the media (Shane and the teen) - that had DNA and fingerprints taken. 2 of them have not even been in the house for 3+ years. I am sure there are far more than the 6 that I know of also.
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Old 03-18-2012, 01:52 PM
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It's never been said the back door was unlocked, the one going to the garage. Seems as though they'd mention it. Tacopina says the garage was off it's rails or something, but that was never mentioned before.

To take the DNA of the teen who had the garage code makes me think the garage was locked.
But there are also 2 other points of possible entry in the back. Not just the garage door. There is also a slider and a deck door. Those could also be potential entry points from the back. And both have the potential to be unlocked or jimmied open.
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:03 PM
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D/J have a dog-its a lab mix-they even say it was on the back deck that night and it would have bark at a stranger-its in the Judge Pirro interview--so either way if that dog was outside or inside it would bark!!
Which could mean that if an intruder was back there, it was not a stranger. Jim Spellman even mentioned in one of his live reports that the dogs was no longer even barking at him and his crew - a crew carrying cameras, sound etc - things any dog would bark at initially. I have never thought it was random. This enforces it to me.
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:06 PM
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they took dna of all people known to have ever entered that house. I know of no less than 6 people - only 2 of them named by the media (shane and the teen) - that had dna and fingerprints taken. 2 of them have not even been in the house for 3+ years. I am sure there are far more than the 6 that i know of also.
sb, pn, db, & ji?
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Old 03-18-2012, 02:08 PM
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Which could mean that if an intruder was back there, it was not a stranger. Jim Spellman even mentioned in one of his live reports that the dogs was no longer even barking at him and his crew - a crew carrying cameras, sound etc - things any dog would bark at initially. I have never thought it was random. This enforces it to me.
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:00 PM
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Which could mean that if an intruder was back there, it was not a stranger. Jim Spellman even mentioned in one of his live reports that the dogs was no longer even barking at him and his crew - a crew carrying cameras, sound etc - things any dog would bark at initially. I have never thought it was random. This enforces it to me.
again-those are their words-not mine-they know their dog better than anyone!!
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:12 PM
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They took DNA of all people known to have ever entered that house. I know of no less than 6 people - only 2 of them named by the media (Shane and the teen) - that had DNA and fingerprints taken. 2 of them have not even been in the house for 3+ years. I am sure there are far more than the 6 that I know of also.
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:20 PM
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So-if the dog knew the kidnapper or intruder-that makes the suspect pool small.It has to be someone that knows the family-why can't the police find anything from this small pool of suspects- LE checked all the names that D/J gave them-J said they cleared all those people-so that makes the suspect pool even smaller.I think if it was someone close to the family and known to the dog-LE would have found something.There have been no arrest-which leaves me to believe they are looking elsewhere for the suspect! JMO
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:24 PM
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sb, pn, db, & ji?
If you are asking me if those are in the 6 then, no. My 6 that I know of do not include them. I am assuming that they did for them, but the 6 I know of, 2 I saw with my own eyes ( the 2 listed in the media) and 4 others that have told me personally that they have. 2 of those 4 haven't even been in the house for more than 3 years. The other 2 are from the neighborhood and have not been mentioned by the media at all yet in the case.
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Old 03-18-2012, 03:59 PM
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The neighbor's dog was in their back yard. I used to think the bradley/Irwins had a dog, but I was wrong.
I thought the neighbour said she lets her dog out before bed, but I didn't think it stayed outside all night per her..
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Old 03-18-2012, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by SyraKelly View Post
So-if the dog knew the kidnapper or intruder-that makes the suspect pool small.It has to be someone that knows the family-why can't the police find anything from this small pool of suspects- LE checked all the names that D/J gave them-J said they cleared all those people-so that makes the suspect pool even smaller.I think if it was someone close to the family and known to the dog-LE would have found something.There have been no arrest-which leaves me to believe they are looking elsewhere for the suspect! JMO
However there have been countless cases where the real perp was cleared only to be arrested, charged and convicted years later. I think LE needs to restart their investigation with a new fresh set of eyes that don't have blinders on. Coming into a case clean often develops new leads regardless of who the guilty party(s).
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Old 07-29-2012, 10:10 PM
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Maybe an intruder entered the garage via an unlocked door, went up the stairs into the computer room. He then went into the kitchen and pocketed the cell phones and then proceeded straight to Lisa's room. He then left via the same route used to enter. JMO.
I'm revisiting a post I made back in March because of more recent posts suggesting that since there's no evidence of an intruder, DB/JI must be guilty of Lisa's disappearance.

My questions are as follows. Is it possible for an intruder to come into Lisa's home and take her away without leaving any obvious signs of doing that?

If a door was unlocked or if the intruder used a "bump key" would there be evidence that an intruder forcibly entered the home?

If an intruder was wearing gloves would he leave fingerprints or any touch DNA?

Anyone's thoughts about this would be most welcome.
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Old 08-05-2012, 06:11 PM
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i'm revisiting a post i made back in march because of more recent posts suggesting that since there's no evidence of an intruder, db/ji must be guilty of lisa's disappearance.

My questions are as follows. Is it possible for an intruder to come into lisa's home and take her away without leaving any obvious signs of doing that? imho. . No.

if a door was unlocked or if the intruder used a "bump key" would there be evidence that an intruder forcibly entered the home? not necessarily, but why would the window screen be bent then? What intruder would come through an unlocked door or use a bump key, turn on the lights, steal the phones, take bl and then what? Run around and bend the screen on the window while hanging on to bl? That doesn't make any sense.

if an intruder was wearing gloves would he leave fingerprints or any touch dna? idk. . .not necessarily. But i think there would likely be some kind of footprints, etc. . .also what about noise? The dog would have barked, or bl would have made some noise. The boys were home too and they hadn't been drinking. I think they would have heard an intruder moving around.

anyone's thoughts about this would be most welcome.
moo. . .
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Old 08-06-2012, 06:57 AM
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You'd think an intruder would be heard, but then there are all those cases where we know an intruder was present and nobody heard a thing. Like that recent case in Oklahoma where a man broke in, killed the dog and raped a four year old girl, and her stepdad didn't hear anything. And that was in a small trailer, not even a house.
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Old 08-06-2012, 08:44 AM
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I don't think the intruder being heard would be an issue. Some kids that age can sleep through a hurricane, and even if they woke up it might be they wouldn't take any notice. It's different if you're a spinster living alone and wake up hearing someone's in your house, you'll know at once they're up to no good, but if it's a home with multiple occupants and if the intruder didn't make any strange noises kids might just assume that mom or dad is up and go back to sleep and never even remember having woken up by footsteps.

I know I can walk through my home, watch tv and even occasionally hoover without waking up my children.
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Old 08-06-2012, 01:32 PM
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I do not think it is an issue that an intruder was not heard. People do sleep deeply, and often do not hear things in the house unless it is very loud. Someone opening a door would not have to wake someone up.
Did Jessia Lunsford Father not say neither he nor his parents heard jessica being taken and there were no signs of forced entry (I seem to remember the grandparents were accused of involvement). I have known people who were broken in to whilst they slept and did not notice anything until the morning. I also have known people who have returned home, and only when they noticed small things missing did they realised they had been broken in to as there was no sign of forced entry (bit spooky to think you woudl never know if someone had been in your home).

As for the dog, someone mentioned it only bark at people it knew, but quite quickly stopped barking at Spellman. If it is the case the dog was about, and did only bark at strangers, there is also the possibility that someone had been watching the house, and the dog recognized them. If someone was planning to break into a home and steal a baby then they might very well watch the place, be a bit friendly to the dog. I will also say my dog was a coward so whilst he would bark at strangers he would only do so when he was nice and safe, if someone had broken in he would have hidden and kept quiet (and I have known yappy dogs to actually do this).

But as Lisa is so young it makes me think she was taken because someone wanted a baby. That makes me think the family may have been followed by someone who saw them out and about with Lisa, perhaps even near places where people with babies go( baby clinics etc). Hospital maternity units (at leats here) tend to have high security so someone wanting a baby would perhaps avoid hospitals and target families in other situations. (I wonder if the dog barked as much with women?)
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Old 08-06-2012, 04:35 PM
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While I do agree that it's possible for an intruder not to be heard, given all the other circumstances, I still do not believe that this was possible in this case.

Why would an intruder bend the window screen? Why would they even mess with a window on the street side of the house?

If it was an intruder that was there specifically to steal a baby, why take the phones. . .that can be traced and pinged and make it more likely to get caught? And according to DB and JI, the intruder used one of the phones to call MW. I just don't believe that any intruder that was smart enough to break in and steal BL without leaving any traces of being there would be dumb enough to use one of the phones to call a friend. That monster that broke into that trailer and raped the 4yr old didn't use one of the phones to call home, kwim?

And of course, the biggest one for me, is the dog hit in the bedroom. I don't believe an intruder would have killed BL within the home and laid her on the floor of the bedroom where DB and possibly one or both of the boys were sleeping. I also believe those items taken during the SW were most likely hit on too.
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  #320  
Old 08-06-2012, 07:35 PM
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While I do agree that it's possible for an intruder not to be heard, given all the other circumstances, I still do not believe that this was possible in this case.

Why would an intruder bend the window screen? Why would they even mess with a window on the street side of the house?

If it was an intruder that was there specifically to steal a baby, why take the phones. . .that can be traced and pinged and make it more likely to get caught? And according to DB and JI, the intruder used one of the phones to call MW. I just don't believe that any intruder that was smart enough to break in and steal BL without leaving any traces of being there would be dumb enough to use one of the phones to call a friend. That monster that broke into that trailer and raped the 4yr old didn't use one of the phones to call home, kwim?

And of course, the biggest one for me, is the dog hit in the bedroom. I don't believe an intruder would have killed BL within the home and laid her on the floor of the bedroom where DB and possibly one or both of the boys were sleeping. I also believe those items taken during the SW were most likely hit on too.
I would say that the bent screen could be a sign of someone trying to stage a break in. Or it could be a sign of an intruder attempting to gain entry via that window and deciding that it was not a good idea.

As for an intruder taking the cell phones, why not? There small and can be easily transported out of the home by simply putting them in a pants pocket. I didn't learn about tracing the location of a turned off cell phone until I started to follow this case. In regards to the phone call to MW, why is it dumb for an intruder to call her number but not dumb for DB/JI to call that same number?

The "dog hit" is the most incriminating thing pointing towards DB/JI. Certain items were removed from the house after the "dog hit". Further testing of those items may have been inconclusive as to supporting the possibility of Lisa being dead and laying on the floor. We just don't know of any test results to help us understand what may have happened. So in my opinion there's not enough evidence to tell me that DB/JI harmed Lisa.

Without any corroborating evidence to support that Lisa was dead and on that bedroom floor, I have to say that I have some doubts about DB/JI being guilty of harming Lisa.
JMO.
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Old 08-06-2012, 08:07 PM
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I do not think it is an issue that an intruder was not heard. People do sleep deeply, and often do not hear things in the house unless it is very loud. Someone opening a door would not have to wake someone up.
Did Jessia Lunsford Father not say neither he nor his parents heard jessica being taken and there were no signs of forced entry (I seem to remember the grandparents were accused of involvement). I have known people who were broken in to whilst they slept and did not notice anything until the morning. I also have known people who have returned home, and only when they noticed small things missing did they realised they had been broken in to as there was no sign of forced entry (bit spooky to think you woudl never know if someone had been in your home).

As for the dog, someone mentioned it only bark at people it knew, but quite quickly stopped barking at Spellman. If it is the case the dog was about, and did only bark at strangers, there is also the possibility that someone had been watching the house, and the dog recognized them. If someone was planning to break into a home and steal a baby then they might very well watch the place, be a bit friendly to the dog. I will also say my dog was a coward so whilst he would bark at strangers he would only do so when he was nice and safe, if someone had broken in he would have hidden and kept quiet (and I have known yappy dogs to actually do this).

But as Lisa is so young it makes me think she was taken because someone wanted a baby. That makes me think the family may have been followed by someone who saw them out and about with Lisa, perhaps even near places where people with babies go( baby clinics etc). Hospital maternity units (at leats here) tend to have high security so someone wanting a baby would perhaps avoid hospitals and target families in other situations. (I wonder if the dog barked as much with women?)
There was the dog that belonged to the Irwin household then there was also the German Shepherd type dog who lived next door whose fence came very close to the front side of the Irwin house. This dog was ferociously barking and lunging at the fence during one of the media interviews just outside of the home, I think it was Fox news. IMO, there is no way a stranger could have been lurking about outside the home trying to find a way into the house without the dogs making a heck of a racket.
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Old 08-06-2012, 10:40 PM
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There was the dog that belonged to the Irwin household then there was also the German Shepherd type dog who lived next door whose fence came very close to the front side of the Irwin house. This dog was ferociously barking and lunging at the fence during one of the media interviews just outside of the home, I think it was Fox news. IMO, there is no way a stranger could have been lurking about outside the home trying to find a way into the house without the dogs making a heck of a racket.
BBM

Of course you are right lone. <modsnip> AGAIN, no strange fibers, hair, fingerprints, footprints, et al., NADA. But posters keep insisting IDI. I wonder why, I wonder why?


Last edited by 4Jacy; 08-06-2012 at 11:55 PM. Reason: the thread name shows the discussion topic. if you disdain those who are open to IDI, then perhaps forgo this thread.
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Old 08-06-2012, 10:53 PM
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There was the dog that belonged to the Irwin household then there was also the German Shepherd type dog who lived next door whose fence came very close to the front side of the Irwin house. This dog was ferociously barking and lunging at the fence during one of the media interviews just outside of the home, I think it was Fox news. IMO, there is no way a stranger could have been lurking about outside the home trying to find a way into the house without the dogs making a heck of a racket.
Hi lonetraveler. Are you basing your opinion about the neighbors dog's ability as a watch dog from a single news video?

Is this the same neighbor dog that Jim Spellman (CNN not Fox) talked about?
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Anyway, the first few times I went back there the next door neighbor dog bark loudly at me the whole time i was back there. After going back there many times I think the dog got to know me and he would trot back and see what was going on but not bark.
It's a medium size dog...probably a mix breed (aka mutt).
If your talking about a different dog I would like to know some details about it.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Questions for CNN reporter Jim Spellman - Q & A Only **NO DISCUSSION HERE PLEASE**
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Old 08-06-2012, 11:13 PM
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BBM

Of course you are right lone. <modsnip> AGAIN, no strange fibers, hair, fingerprints, footprints, et al., NODA. But posters keep insisting IDI. I wonder why, I wonder why?

Hi 4Jacy. <modsnip>

I feel that asking if it's possible for an intruder to have taken Lisa and not left things that you mention like fibers, hair, fingerprints, footprints, and DNA as being an honest question. I'm not sure what "NODA" is. For all we know, LE does have some forensic evidence to support an intruder taking Lisa.

Anyway, I'm just curious about peoples thoughts about the possibility that an intruder could have entered the Irwin house and removed Lisa without leaving obvious signs behind.

Last edited by RANCH; 08-06-2012 at 11:42 PM. Reason: reference to/quote from modsnipped post
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Old 08-06-2012, 11:58 PM
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Hi 4Jacy. <modsnip>

I feel that asking if it's possible for an intruder to have taken Lisa and not left things that you mention like fibers, hair, fingerprints, footprints, and DNA as being an honest question. I'm not sure what "NODA" is. For all we know, LE does have some forensic evidence to support an intruder taking Lisa.

Anyway, I'm just curious about peoples thoughts about the possibility that an intruder could have entered the Irwin house and removed Lisa without leaving obvious signs behind.
In this day and age I believe it is highly improbable, if not impossible to enter a home and take a child without any obvious clues.
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