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  #751  
Old 04-07-2012, 08:55 AM
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http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news...od-altercation

Interesting I have just been able to watch the video to this article, Tracy Martin walks up to reporter on scene and he doesn't know its Trayvon's dad.
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  #752  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peliman View Post
It can be debated what suspicious behavior is. I/E

Suspicious Behavior:
What Is It?

A person isn't suspicious, his/her behavior is!

Here is a list of some suspicious signs and behavior:

A person running: If he or she were looking about furtively, as if he or she were being watched or chased.

http://www.rpi.edu/dept/public_safet...uspicious.html
From your link:

One or more people sitting in a parked car checking out the area: They may be lookouts for a crime in progress (burglary/robbery) or for plotting a crime.


So it appears TM would have been within his rights to be suspicious of GZ. jmo
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Old 04-07-2012, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrienne37 View Post
I haven't seen this photo of Trayvon before. I love it. Such a nice looking kid. Such a tragic story. Arrest George Zimmerman NOW!


Thank you for sharing this. It's heartbreaking.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mdana View Post
Her statements are contradictory and actually give credence to GZ calling the police, because it was apparently odd to be walking in the neighborhood. From the CNN article page 1.

"I thought it was rather loud, but I had just shut my window because it had just started pouring out rain," the witness said. "And then I thought, 'Oh, my gosh, who's out there walking their dog in the rain?'

Actually, I think this statement points out perfectly how UNjustified GZ's suspicion was. When she thinks there is someone outside, she doesn't automatically assume, "Someone's coming to rob me!" or "Someone's coming to kill me!" even though, presumably, she has also lived in this neighborhood where there have been recent break-ins.

No, she assumes that someone is walking their dog. So, not an unusual thing, but something that has to be done in the rain sometimes. Like getting home if you walked somewhere before the rain started.
  #754  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:18 AM
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Originally Posted by angelmom View Post
Thank you for sharing this. It's heartbreaking.



Actually, I think this statement points out perfectly how UNjustified GZ's suspicion was. When she thinks there is someone outside, she doesn't automatically assume, "Someone's coming to rob me!" or "Someone's coming to kill me!" even though, presumably, she has also lived in this neighborhood where there have been recent break-ins.

No, she assumes that someone is walking their dog. So, not an unusual thing, but something that has to be done in the rain sometimes. Like getting home if you walked somewhere before the rain started.
Which also could explain why TM started to run. jmo
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  #755  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LambChop View Post
From your link:

One or more people sitting in a parked car checking out the area: They may be lookouts for a crime in progress (burglary/robbery) or for plotting a crime.


So it appears TM would have been within his rights to be suspicious of GZ. jmo
Absolutely. Both are within their rights to be suspicious, and very wary, of each other. They are NOT within their rights to bang each other's head on the ground.

At that point, whoever is getting their head pounded is within their rights to shoot the other to death.

This is the core of the entire thing, and all the rest of the story is just extraneous information.

If one is getting their head pummeled by the other, he is within his rights to kill in self-defense. Period.
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  #756  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:39 AM
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Originally Posted by JeannaT View Post
Absolutely. Both are within their rights to be suspicious, and very wary, of each other. They are NOT within their rights to bang each other's head on the ground.

At that point, whoever is getting their head pounded is within their rights to shoot the other to death.

This is the core of the entire thing, and all the rest of the story is just extraneous information.

If one is getting their head pummeled by the other, he is within his rights to kill in self-defense. Period.
I am not at all convinced GZ's head was pummeled into the ground it doesn't make sense and there wasn't enough time. No matter how you add it up,going by the time the gf's call ended and the shot on the 911 call was from 44 sec to 1 min.
IMO that was not enough time for this life or death fight GZ claims took place. MOO

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  #757  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by rbrnmw2 View Post
I am not at all convinced GZ's head was pummeled into it doesn't make sense and there wasn't enough time. No matter how you add it up,going by the time the gf's call ended and the shot on the 911 call was from 44 sec to 1 min.
IMO that was not enough time for this life or death fight GZ claims took place. MOO

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How many times can you bang your head on the ground in 44 seconds? A lot.

Even 10 seconds of banging your head on the ground is enough to cause deadly injuries -

I'm certain his injuries, however severe or slight they may be, have been documented. I feel like I've seen enough documentation of them in the CNN video, but I would bet there are much better photos out there.
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  #758  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:43 AM
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I just noticed that the building on Retreat View has SIX units, not 5 like the one across from it on Twin Trees. This will affect my image. I'll repost in a few.
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  #759  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LambChop View Post
From your link:

One or more people sitting in a parked car checking out the area: They may be lookouts for a crime in progress (burglary/robbery) or for plotting a crime.


So it appears TM would have been within his rights to be suspicious of GZ. jmo
Yes, it would only make sense TM would have been suspicious of GZ. Both of them suspicious of the other.
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  #760  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by angelmom View Post
Thank you for sharing this. It's heartbreaking.
What a handsome photo of Trayvon. He certainly had a fondness for hoodies. It's usually hot in Florida and my parents live there so I'm there alot. I don't know many people in Florida who have such a big selection of hoodies. I am a huge hoodie fan. I have so many of them but I'm a woman so I don't think anyone would consider me a thug but it's sad to know that his love for hoodies may have played a role in his demise.

Does anyone feel any certain way about the fact that if Trayvon was not suspended he would not have been there in the first place. This fact keeps bothering me. I'm not blaming the victim but I just want to go back in time and change the actions that caused him to be suspended.
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  #761  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m00c0w View Post
I thought Tracy Martin's recounting of the events was unassailable truth? What happened?
The SPD told Tracy Martin the wrong location possibly?? Why the vitriol toward Tracy Martin a grieving father? IMO

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  #762  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchvixen View Post
What a handsome photo of Trayvon. He certainly had a fondness for hoodies. It's usually hot in Florida and my parents live there so I'm there alot. I don't know many people in Florida who have such a big selection of hoodies. I am a huge hoodie fan. I have so many of them but I'm a woman so I don't think anyone would consider me a thug but it's sad to know that his love for hoodies may have played a role in his demise.

Does anyone feel any certain way about the fact that if Trayvon was not suspended he would not have been there in the first place. This fact keeps bothering me. I'm not blaming the victim but I just want to go back in time and change the actions that caused him to be suspended.
No. If it hadn't been Trayvon, it would have been someone else's child and soon. The one thing Frank Taafe has said that I believe is that GZ had "fed up issues." JMO.

As for the hoodies, my teen boys have all sorts of them. In addition to the ones they have chosen themselves with "Las Vegas" or a favorite college mascot on them, a hoodie is actually part of the team uniform package for every sport they are on in high school. So they have a football one, a lacrosse one, etc. for each season every year. We have tons of them.

And wearing them when it's hot? My middle one wears his even when it is blazing out. We used to call the one that he was allowed to wear to school with the uniform his "woobie" because I practically had to wash it while he was asleep!
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  #763  
Old 04-07-2012, 09:58 AM
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Originally Posted by LambChop View Post
Mary C said the argument started a couple of houses down and TM ended up getting shot right near her back porch. No wonder they are pulling everything from the websites. jmo
How do you know they are pulling everything from the websites? They can't change GM's police report though?
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  #764  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Peliman View Post
Yes, it would only make sense TM would have been suspicious of GZ. Both of them suspicious of the other.
A few days ago attorney Ben Crump told Piers that he believed that TM went to his death not knowing who GZ was. He just thought it was a person attacking him. What a scary feeling in the dark of night to be assaulted by an ex-bouncer, a bully really. The more I read about GZ the more I see him as a bully. He would have made a scary police officer.
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  #765  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:07 AM
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Florida Statutes 776.012(1) states: "A person is justified in the use of deadly force and does not have a duty to retreat if he or she reasonably believes that such force is necessary to prevent imminent death or great bodily harm to himself or herself or another, or to prevent the imminent commission of a forcible felony."

http://www.tcpalm.com/news/2012/apr/...artner=popular
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  #766  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by RANCH View Post
I didn't here her say that in CNN interview. That would be a much bigger story than the one she gave. SPD withholding certain 911 calls would be huge.
She may not have said that, but her description of what she saw and heard and the detail from last night's interview that she held the phone up to the screen so the operator could hear the argument, does NOT match any of the released 911 calls.

One thought - did she actually call 911 or did she call a non-emergency number for SPD? I think the 911 calls were only released because the Martin attorneys had asked for them and for GZ's call. If the Martin's request was too specifically worded (original report by GZ and 911 calls about the event) and this woman (and others) called a non-emergency number, a sneaky city attorney could have considered that the other calls were not included in the request.

IMO, JMO, etc.
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  #767  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by JeannaT View Post
A witness has an attorney? ??

I'm sorry to be dense, but what does that mean "and held phone up to screen". Does that mean she photographed what she saw with her phone?

It strains the imagination to think of how GZ got injuries to the back of his head when he was on top during a fight. Also it strains the imagination to think how Trayvon would be losing a hand to hand fight with GZ.
I can think of several other ways Zimmerman could have gotten an injury to the back of his head that evening, if any such injury exists. Moo
Could you please elaborate on why you find it so imagination straining to see Trayvon losing a fight to Zimmerman? You have said this a number of times, and I don't think you have explained how you have come to feel this way. I would really like to know your thoughts on this.

Last edited by Inabsentia; 04-07-2012 at 10:59 AM.
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  #768  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by i.b.nora View Post
Here is one source for the ambulance audio:

Trayvon Martin Ambulance Audio Recording - YouTube
This recording clears up where the body of TM was located.

Lying in the grass [1:29]......Behind 2831 Retreat View Circle in the backyard [1:52]

This is the residence of Selma Mora Lamilla and her roommate Mary Cutcher.

Mr. Martin was about 35 feet off from the location he showed us. I can't fault a grieving father for that. I'd still be trying to remember my own name.

**Please accept my apologies for any confusion caused by the earlier image posted last night showing the Retreat View addys. I overlooked the fact that the building has 6 units as opposed to the 5 that I counted on Twin Trees**
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File Type: jpg TMBody6.jpg (96.0 KB, 26 views)
File Type: jpg TMSelma.jpg (107.6 KB, 24 views)
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  #769  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by frenchvixen View Post
What a handsome photo of Trayvon. He certainly had a fondness for hoodies. It's usually hot in Florida and my parents live there so I'm there alot. I don't know many people in Florida who have such a big selection of hoodies. I am a huge hoodie fan. I have so many of them but I'm a woman so I don't think anyone would consider me a thug but it's sad to know that his love for hoodies may have played a role in his demise.

Does anyone feel any certain way about the fact that if Trayvon was not suspended he would not have been there in the first place. This fact keeps bothering me. I'm not blaming the victim but I just want to go back in time and change the actions that caused him to be suspended.
Absolutely not. Trayvon's parents were divorced. Was he not supposed to visit with his father? Perhaps his dad had every other weekend visitation? If Trayvon hadn't been suspended and was just up visiting for the weekend, would it have made it a sadder story? How dare Trayvon be suspended from school, let's just murder him and be done with it.

< mod snip >



~jmo~


~jmo~

Last edited by fran; 04-07-2012 at 12:52 PM. Reason: wild accusations, unsubstantiated and inflamatory, PLEASE be careful with your words
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:19 AM
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Just a reminder...

We all should be able to give OUR OPINION without being told we are dishonest etc. ITS OUR OPINION, so if you don't see a link to show something as fact its an opinion. If you want to argue a point that is perfectly fine. We need to respect each others opinons as long as its within TOS. We know what that is... Right?

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  #771  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by frenchvixen View Post
A few days ago attorney Ben Crump told Piers that he believed that TM went to his death not knowing who GZ was. He just thought it was a person attacking him. What a scary feeling in the dark of night to be assaulted by an ex-bouncer, a bully really. The more I read about GZ the more I see him as a bully. He would have made a scary police officer.
I understand what you're saying but GZ has also said TM was the one who attacked him and to be honest I'm not sure who attacked who.
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:22 AM
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  #773  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Inabsentia View Post
I can think of several other ways Zimmerman could have gotten an injury to the back of his head that evening, if any such injury exists. Moo
Could you please elaborate on why you find it so imagination straining to see Teayvon losing a fight to Zimmerman? You have said this a number of times, and I don't think you have expained how you have come to feel this way. I would really like to know your thoughts on this.
My son is a grappler, and when I go to grappling tournaments I can almost always tell who will win the match just by glancing up at the two opponents on the mat before the match begins. It's not height or weight, or really anything tangible. I think actually it's not some hoodoo psychic skill I have, my guess is almost everyone in the audience can look at two men and tell which will win the match.

When I look at GZ and Trayvon, I pick Trayvon. It's my opinion.
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  #774  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:24 AM
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Originally Posted by JeannaT View Post
Absolutely. Both are within their rights to be suspicious, and very wary, of each other. They are NOT within their rights to bang each other's head on the ground.

At that point, whoever is getting their head pounded is within their rights to shoot the other to death.

This is the core of the entire thing, and all the rest of the story is just extraneous information.

If one is getting their head pummeled by the other, he is within his rights to kill in self-defense. Period.



when Mr Martin decided to defend himself against his attacker/assailant Mr Zimmerman he had every right to fight off this man who stalked then confronted and attacked him. It was Mr Martin's right to fight off his attacker. Sadly Mr Zimmerman chose to first attack, then kill.
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Old 04-07-2012, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by JeannaT View Post
My son is a grappler, and when I go to grappling tournaments I can almost always tell who will win the match just by glancing up at the two opponents on the mat before the match begins. It's not height or weight, or really anything tangible. I think actually it's not some hoodoo psychic skill I have, my guess is almost everyone in the audience can look at two men and tell which will win the match.

When I look at GZ and Trayvon, I pick Trayvon. It's my opinion.


my son was a wrestler as well. He would have been the one assumed to lose but went to States twice because it isn't always the one we think will win who takes the matches.

If only Mr Zimmerman had chosen to stay in his vehicle and allow the real law enforcement to do their job instead of taking it upon himself to assail Mr Martin <<< my opinion.
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