George Zimmerman's Injuries

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by highflyer

I know what it sounds like.

No to be argumentative, but there is only two sounds a NON fired slide makes. One is if you slide it all the way back to the locked position, which would be ONE click, and would eject a round, followed by the LOUD sound of it being released, which didn't happen. The other is if it was, as you have speculated, iirc, sliding it back to check if a round is loaded, which would be only ONE loud sound as it was released.

Interestingly enough, BOTH of these options require BOTH hands to accomplish, and that would be pretty tough if GZ was on the phone at the same time.

[Harmony2]

Originally Posted by LambChop

Plus it was raining that night and there is no grass clippings on his head but LE reported he did have some on his back. If he moved his head to the grass you would think he'd have clippings on the back of his head and the blood would have been smeared. LE said GZ's jacket was wet in the back???? jmo

Hi Lambchop!! :seeya:

Not sure if you were asking if GZ's jacket was wet in the back but it does mention it on page 7 of this partial police report..

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/package...ice-report.pdf

[Donjeta]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

We will have to wait for the autopsy, but a 9mm shot through the chest at close range could easily pass straight through, leaving a bleeding opening out the back. Yes, it would be senseless to try and STOP that bleeding, as the person would bleed through the front, but after shooting him, in a panic reaction (not due to guilt, but merely due to the fact that shooting someone is a traumatic event, even for the shooter), he could easily have though he could stop the bloodflow. :twocents:

I am waiting for the autopsy too.

However, the funeral director had this to say:

GRACE: You did see the gunshot wound. Can you tell me where on his chest was the wound if you could tell after autopsy?

KURTZ: Well, it appeared to me that it was in the upper chest area. That`s where the (INAUDIBLE).

GRACE: Did you see any other injuries on Trayvon Martin`s body?

KURTZ: Not that I could tell.

GRACE: Richard Kurtz, joining us, funeral director who handled Martin`s body.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../28/ng.01.html

He doesn't mention seeing an exit wound.

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by Donjeta

I am waiting for the autopsy too.

However, the funeral director had this to say:

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIP.../28/ng.01.html

He doesn't mention seeing an exit wound.

I can see that on one hand, but I could also see not mentioning the EXIT wound, as it was a given. I mean lets be honest, he stated that he so NO wounds on TM at all. He didn't say "except the gaping hole in his chest", as it was a given. The autopsy should be quite revealing.

[LambChop]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

I can see that on one hand, but I could also see not mentioning the EXIT wound, as it was a given. I mean lets be honest, he stated that he so NO wounds on TM at all. He didn't say "except the gaping hole in his chest", as it was a given. The autopsy should be quite revealing.

TM was shot with a hollow point. They are designed to flatten or shatter, no exit wounds usually.

http://www.ehow.com/info_8500781_bullets-shatter.html

[highflyer]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

No to be argumentative, but there is only two sounds a NON fired slide makes. One is if you slide it all the way back to the locked position, which would be ONE click, and would eject a round, followed by the LOUD sound of it being released, which didn't happen. The other is if it was, as you have speculated, iirc, sliding it back to check if a round is loaded, which would be only ONE loud sound as it was released.

Interestingly enough, BOTH of these options require BOTH hands to accomplish, and that would be pretty tough if GZ was on the phone at the same time.

It does take two hands. But putting the cellphone between your jaw and shoulder works well in a pickle.

[Donjeta]

This is another quote more specifically saying that he didn't see where an exit wound
would have been. I assume that he hesitates a little because he got to see the body after the autopsy and who knows what all was done there.

L. O`DONNELL: And I know you`re not a medical examiner, but did you
see two wounds on the body? Did you see one that would have been an
entrance wound and one that would have been an exit wound?

KURTZ: I only saw what I considered the entrance wound. I can`t --
I couldn`t tell where the exit wound, no.

L. O`DONNELL: So you only saw the entrance wound, and was that in
the chest, as we`ve heard?

KURTZ: Yes, sir.

L. O`DONNELL: Funeral Director Richard Kurtz -- I want to thank you
very much for helping us with this information tonight.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46894844.../#.T6MPidVIt84

[LambChop]

Originally Posted by Harmony2

Hi Lambchop!! :seeya:

Not sure if you were asking if GZ's jacket was wet in the back but it does mention it on page 7 of this partial police report..

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/package...ice-report.pdf

Thanks, yes. I know it's in the initial police report. And we can see when he's at the station one of the officers pick something off of GZ's jacket. Hopefully it grass. lol

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by highflyer

It does take two hands. But putting the cellphone between your jaw and shoulder works well in a pickle.

Then wouldn't the phone have ALSO picked up a movement against the mic as he did this?

[highflyer]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

Then wouldn't the phone have ALSO picked up a movement against the mic as he did this?

It should. Still wonder if there wasn't someone else involved. Did wife go to Target with George?

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by Donjeta

This is another quote more specifically saying that he didn't see where an exit wound
would have been. I assume that he hesitates a little because he got to see the body after the autopsy and who knows what all was done there.



http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/46894844.../#.T6MPidVIt84

"I only saw what I considered the entrance wound. I can`t --
I couldn`t tell where the exit wound, no."

OR, he could have been briefed on what he COULD and COULDN'T say, and slipped up. "I can't..." sounds like he was about to say he COULDN'T say anything....OOOOORRRR, in the abcence of info, my mind may be DIGGING for conspiracy, LOL.

[Donjeta]

Do we know that GZ wasn't using a headset?

[LambChop]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

"I only saw what I considered the entrance wound. I can`t --
I couldn`t tell where the exit wound, no."

OR, he could have been briefed on what he COULD and COULDN'T say, and slipped up. "I can't..." sounds like he was about to say he COULDN'T say anything....OOOOORRRR, in the abcence of info, my mind may be DIGGING for conspiracy, LOL.

I don't know for sure but I don't think a funeral director would be turning the body over. They are only concerned with the areas that you are able to view as far as I know. jmo

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by LambChop

I don't know for sure but I don't think a funeral director would be turning the body over. They are only concerned with the areas that you are able to view as far as I know. jmo

Even though they usually use wrap around clothing, they still have to dress the body for the funeral. They do, most certainly, turn the body.

[suzihawk]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

"I only saw what I considered the entrance wound. I can`t --
I couldn`t tell where the exit wound, no."

OR, he could have been briefed on what he COULD and COULDN'T say, and slipped up. "I can't..." sounds like he was about to say he COULDN'T say anything....OOOOORRRR, in the abcence of info, my mind may be DIGGING for conspiracy, LOL.

Briefed by who?

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by suzihawk

Briefed by who?

Not sure, but perhaps a representative of the coroners office when the body was transferred? Or perhaps when he was notified of the interview, he APPROACHED the PD and ASKED what he could and couldn't say. Didn;t have to be OFFICIAL or anything, a simple, "Hey, this is a racially charged and sensitive case, watch what you say to the press..."

[Donjeta]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

Not sure, but perhaps a representative of the coroners office when the body was transferred? Or perhaps when he was notified of the interview, he APPROACHED the PD and ASKED what he could and couldn't say. Didn;t have to be OFFICIAL or anything, a simple, "Hey, this is a racially charged and sensitive case, watch what you say to the press..."

I can see that but I am not sure why he or the police would have thought that not mentioning an exit wound would have helped the racially sensitive situation.

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by Donjeta

I can see that but I am not sure why he or the police would have thought that not mentioning an exit wound would have helped the racially sensitive situation.

The location of the exit wound can be used to indicate bullet trajectory. Suppose, per the exit wound, the trajectory indicated that TM was STANDING when he was shot? Supposed it indicates that TM was straddling GZ and in close proximity, thus dictating that TM was attacking GZ? The first could lead to a lynch mob killing GZ, the second could lead to a conspiracy theory and riots.

[stilettos]

Originally Posted by LambChop

TM was shot with a hollow point. They are designed to flatten or shatter, no exit wounds usually.

http://www.ehow.com/info_8500781_bullets-shatter.html

Yes LambChop, and they are designed to kill...no other reason for them. Those who want to do maximum damage to those they shoot in order to kill, are IMO the ONLY people who would use that ammo.

[LambChop]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

Even though they usually use wrap around clothing, they still have to dress the body for the funeral. They do, most certainly, turn the body.

Well they didn't with my husband. They told me to bring something they could cut. It was not wrap around clothing and families almost always bring the clothes in for their loved ones to be dressed and buried in. Plus most bodies are still in rigor so turning might be challenging. My understanding was they cut and tuck. That seemed logical to me at the time. jmo

[LambChop]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

Even though they usually use wrap around clothing, they still have to dress the body for the funeral. They do, most certainly, turn the body.

Sounds like a question for Grandmaj.

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by stilettos

Yes LambChop, and they are designed to kill...no other reason for them. Those who want to do maximum damage to those they shoot in order to kill, are IMO the ONLY people who would use that ammo.

Yep. Because I do not pull my gun unless I feel a VALID life threatening situation is at hand. I do not shoot to WOUND, for a number of reasons. Number one, pistols are very inaccurate due to the short barrel length and maximum damage to neutralize the threat is the goal. Number two, shooting a gun out of someones hand or shooting them in the leg is the stuff of Hollywood. When you pull your gun, you aim for the largest traget a human has, body mass. And third, and MOST important, when that criminal comes at me, to take my stuff, harm my family, or harm me, and I only wing them, some bleeding heart jury will make me work for the rest of my life to support this lowlife who wanted to harm us.

I carry a gun, because I cannot carry a cop, and when seconds count, the police are only minutes away.

[highflyer]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

Yep. Because I do not pull my gun unless I feel a VALID life threatening situation is at hand. I do not shoot to WOUND, for a number of reasons. Number one, pistols are very inaccurate due to the short barrel length and maximum damage to neutralize the threat is the goal. Number two, shooting a gun out of someones hand or shooting them in the leg is the stuff of Hollywood. When you pull your gun, you aim for the largest traget a human has, body mass. And third, and MOST important, when that criminal comes at me, to take my stuff, harm my family, or harm me, and I only wing them, some bleeding heart jury will make me work for the rest of my life to support this lowlife who wanted to harm us.

I carry a gun, because I cannot carry a cop, and when seconds count, the police are only minutes away.

What "stuff" that you have could possibly be worth a human life?

[zenreaper]

Originally Posted by highflyer

What "stuff" that you have could possibly be worth a human life?

MY stuff, and the "human life" is that of a person who hold NO respect for law and order, thus I hold none for them. It is such beliefs that its only STUFF and we shouldn't KILL to protect it that has allowed our criminal justice system to evolve into what it has. I hold no harm or ill will to those who do not threaten me. But if you are suggesting that I should NOT respond with force, because the intruder MIGHT only want to take my stuff, and NOT rape my daughter, you are sorely mistaken.

[highflyer]

Originally Posted by zenreaper

MY stuff, and the "human life" is that of a person who hold NO respect for law and order, thus I hold none for them. It is such beliefs that its only STUFF and we shouldn't KILL to protect it that has allowed our criminal justice system to evolve into what it has. I hold no harm or ill will to those who do not threaten me. But if you are suggesting that I should NOT respond with force, because the intruder MIGHT only want to take my stuff, and NOT rape my daughter, you are sorely mistaken.

Thank you.