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  #426  
Old 05-05-2012, 11:59 PM
Lu-Lu Lu-Lu is offline
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Originally Posted by CaseClosed View Post
In some cases overseas, the trial has been moved to another jurisdiction and jury selection has been from other areas not directly connected to the crime. Is that possible in Australia or does the trial happen in the jurisdiction no matter what? Does anybody know?
The trial is always in the jurisdiction that the crime was committed. If this goes to trial it will be in the Brisbane Supreme Court.
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  #427  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:01 AM
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Cccclllaareb Cccclllaareb is offline
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Thank you for saying that Bobbie Elliot, I feel very strongly about this issue as well. Those with psychiatric conditions are stigmatised enough as it is.
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  #428  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:02 AM
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Have a few comments/responses so thought I’d just list them all in point format.

1. On the roundabout – I did wonder whether a vehicle switch was made here, but there isn’t anywhere to pull up/off at the roundabout itself. You would have to pull in to either the shopping centre carpark on the left or the little side-lane that runs along-side the roundabout (travelling inbound from Khollo creek). Incidentally, if you wanted to attempt to avoid the camera, you would use this side-lane as it bypasses the roundabout and takes you directly onto Brookfield rd. (I'm not sure where the 2nd camera is located though but I have heard it is there)

2. On the testing conducted at the roundabout on Friday night – I still can’t understand why timing is relevant. The time it would take to drive to or from location A to B is easily calculated without needing to actually drive a vehicle on the route. In both instances you are estimating the probable speed as well. There is either some other reason we haven’t thought of yet or it’s simply ‘mind-games’ going on.

3. On the question of taking the roundabout route rather than using Rafting Ground rd to drive OUT to Khollo creek – If you took Rafting Ground road, you ending up at a set of traffic lights which you would have to stop at and wait for a light change. These traffic lights are only triggered (to change from red to green) if a car pulls up here. These traffic lights are very well-lit at night and it’s an extremely open area - everyone can see you - you would stand out like a sore thumb!

4. On the condition of the body – It was reported that there were no visible signs of ‘foul play’ (rather than ‘trauma’). To me this suggests no visible gunshot wounds, stab/cut wounds or such. I don’t think broken bones would be classed as signs of ‘foul play’??

5. About the partner and the $300,000 loan – this report reads “His company, Settle Westside, took out a $300,000 loan with a former business partner in December 2011. The business partner now works for a competing real estate agency.”

http://www.news.com.au/life-and-care...-1226340594889

I think we may all be confusing the 'business partner' with the 'mistress' - they could be 2 different people.....unless it has been reported somewhere??

There are so many good questions and thoughts being raised by everyone, it’s almost hard to get your mind to follow through on each one! I think it’s great that everyone feels comfortable with voicing (posting) their thoughts. I was trying to remember where I have read/heard the saying along the lines of – when something seems complicated and complex sometimes the explanation/reason is the simplest.
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  #429  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:06 AM
Lu-Lu Lu-Lu is offline
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This is interesting...

Traffic was stopped for about 20 minutes on Friday night so police could time a white vehicle going around the Kenmore roundabout, and driving up Brookfield Rd, where the victim lived.


http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/a...-1226347683137

Was the car going around really slowly, so trying to ascertain an average speed it may have been travelling for the total trip from the house to the dumping site??
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  #430  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:07 AM
naturaljustice naturaljustice is offline
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What if GBC and ABC had an argument for who knows what reason (affair, finances or any of the other suggestions that have been put forward). He tries to grab her and hold her and she gets upset and scratches at his face and chest. It calms down a bit, she goes to watch tv, GBC doesn't want to deal with it and goes off to bed last seeing her watch tv. She is sitting there upset and angry watching tv and decides to go for a walk to clear her head. And I know this is a long shot and no-one wants to hear it but...

WHAT IF

She does go for a walk and is attacked by a completely unrelated person or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible? Can anyone be 100% sure that GBD was involved.

Also, what if GBC was not 100% about the time and thought it was 10 pm he saw her but in fact it was a bit earlier say 9.30 pm that he went to bed and ABC was emotional and walked off to cool down after an argument. Could she have walked to where the screams were reported.

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC. Just some thoughts anyway will happily take criticism.

I know this is a long shot but could it be possible. For the girls I'm hoping that the father is not involved although my stomach and heart tell me different
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  #431  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:15 AM
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Re: Moggill2 and timing at roundabout. They are able to do an estimate of the time it takes to drive distances, but generally they aren't at the fastest possible speed (for instance).

I believe it was Gangitano's murder in Templestowe. They conducted numerous tests to see if Jason Moran (correct me if I'm wrong) could get from Gangitano's house to a bottle shop where he bought alcohol from (he knew they had cameras). After a massive amount of trials they finally realised it could be done in # of minutes.
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  #432  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:17 AM
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I have been reading all day where I left it last night and some interesting topics and theories have been discussed....One thing that has never been queried is what in fact GBC did all day on the Thursday..
Was he at work?
Did he meet with clients?
Who did he see that day?
Did he meet with his Mistress?
Did he pick the kids up?
WHAT WAS GBC DO ON THURSDAY...HOW DID HIS DAY START AND END?

Another theory on the round about question was that maybe ABC told someone she was heading towards the Roundabout and this happened at a particular time just before 10...Maybe they were timing how long it would take her to get home from when she told someone she was there until the time she got home??

RE: The Conference...It is possible that ABC and GBC were planning to go together and this is why she had arranged a sleepover for her children because maybe they had planned to stay overnight or have dinner and wouldn't be back until late??

With the age range of the children I would imagine that they were staying with close friends or relatives because why would all 3 girls go to a sleepover presuming that they were all going to the one house? I think both ABC and GBC had planned to be out that night til late otherwise one of them would of picked the children up or would of just stayed home with them??

I still believe that Mr BC SNR has some knowledge of the events...

Can someone tell me the significance of having BWANA number plates and also do we know what Mr BC SNR did for a living?

GBC's Sister really has a lot to lose in this because her husband has built his reputation on being a trustworthy Minister and a God loving citizen....How does someone like this detract themselves form this situation?
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  #433  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by naturaljustice View Post

WHAT IF
... or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible?

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC(
I am sure we have explored these other scenarios. If she were hit by a MV and dumped it would be unprecedented. People run.
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  #434  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:20 AM
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also, what if bbc picked abc up after hair appt(if she had one) drove her to dumping ground so they could talk away from the children, argued violently, accidently killed her, panicked and dumped her body, all in the time frame between 7pm and 8pm, then drove home,maybe telling the children mummy is out and will be home later, then when children asleep, between 11pm and 4am drove back to salon to collect her car, is the salon near the roundabout? then maybe walking back to collect his car? just another idea
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  #435  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:21 AM
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Originally Posted by naturaljustice View Post
What if GBC and ABC had an argument for who knows what reason (affair, finances or any of the other suggestions that have been put forward). He tries to grab her and hold her and she gets upset and scratches at his face and chest. It calms down a bit, she goes to watch tv, GBC doesn't want to deal with it and goes off to bed last seeing her watch tv. She is sitting there upset and angry watching tv and decides to go for a walk to clear her head. And I know this is a long shot and no-one wants to hear it but...

WHAT IF

She does go for a walk and is attacked by a completely unrelated person or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible? Can anyone be 100% sure that GBD was involved.

Also, what if GBC was not 100% about the time and thought it was 10 pm he saw her but in fact it was a bit earlier say 9.30 pm that he went to bed and ABC was emotional and walked off to cool down after an argument. Could she have walked to where the screams were reported.

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC. Just some thoughts anyway will happily take criticism.

I know this is a long shot but could it be possible. For the girls I'm hoping that the father is not involved although my stomach and heart tell me different
Someone did suggest this earlier, about the possibilty of a being hit by a car and then dumped.
We were then reminded of the house being the crime scene and their cars being impounded and searched. So I guess that's what makes it unlikely. Given the info that has been released it would appear that it was someone that was involved with the family in some way.

There have been no calls for people to be looking out for a car with damage or an altercation where a woman was dragged in to a car etc.

But yes I find it interesting that the majority of the theories include GBC. For the kids sake I hope it wasn't him...
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  #436  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:24 AM
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[quote=coolcat;7876905]Can someone tell me the significance of having BWANA number plates and also do we know what Mr BC SNR did for a living?

Coolcat, Bwana is a term that Africans use when referring to their "boss". Having come from Rhodesia, I can tell you that it doesn't sit well with me that he uses that term on his number plates. It infers he is the "boss man", top cocky, master. All terms that do not belong in Australian society.
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  #437  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:25 AM
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also, what if bbc picked abc up after hair appt(if she had one) drove her to dumping ground so they could talk away from the children, argued violently, accidently killed her, panicked and dumped her body, all in the time frame between 7pm and 8pm, then drove home,maybe telling the children mummy is out and will be home later, then when children asleep, between 11pm and 4am drove back to salon to collect her car, is the salon near the roundabout? then maybe walking back to collect his car? just another idea
I'd say that's plausable and the argument in the house could have been with BC snr and it was he who helped get the car?
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  #438  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:26 AM
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What if GBC and ABC had an argument for who knows what reason (affair, finances or any of the other suggestions that have been put forward). He tries to grab her and hold her and she gets upset and scratches at his face and chest. It calms down a bit, she goes to watch tv, GBC doesn't want to deal with it and goes off to bed last seeing her watch tv. She is sitting there upset and angry watching tv and decides to go for a walk to clear her head. And I know this is a long shot and no-one wants to hear it but...

WHAT IF

She does go for a walk and is attacked by a completely unrelated person or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible? Can anyone be 100% sure that GBD was involved.

Also, what if GBC was not 100% about the time and thought it was 10 pm he saw her but in fact it was a bit earlier say 9.30 pm that he went to bed and ABC was emotional and walked off to cool down after an argument. Could she have walked to where the screams were reported.

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC. Just some thoughts anyway will happily take criticism.

I know this is a long shot but could it be possible. For the girls I'm hoping that the father is not involved although my stomach and heart tell me different
Unfortunately it is hard not to include GBC as the main suspect. The first police to arrive after he reported her missing saw something that troubled them.

I'm thinking that they argued (for whatever reason) and she was assaulted and fled the home fearing her safety. Her assailant/s followed in a white car and found her at or near the round-a-bout and forced her into the car.

What the first police on the scene saw is unknown. Blood? Signs of a struggle? How did they know she was dead before they found her body?
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  #439  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:26 AM
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[quote=clem1970;7876917]
Quote:
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Can someone tell me the significance of having BWANA number plates and also do we know what Mr BC SNR did for a living?

Coolcat, Bwana is a term that Africans use when referring to their "boss". Having come from Rhodesia, I can tell you that it doesn't sit well with me that he uses that term on his number plates. It infers he is the "boss man", top cocky, master. All terms that do not belong in Australian society.
Oh my, say's a lot about his personality...
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  #440  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:26 AM
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Originally Posted by naturaljustice View Post
What if GBC and ABC had an argument for who knows what reason (affair, finances or any of the other suggestions that have been put forward). He tries to grab her and hold her and she gets upset and scratches at his face and chest. It calms down a bit, she goes to watch tv, GBC doesn't want to deal with it and goes off to bed last seeing her watch tv. She is sitting there upset and angry watching tv and decides to go for a walk to clear her head. And I know this is a long shot and no-one wants to hear it but...

WHAT IF

She does go for a walk and is attacked by a completely unrelated person or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible? Can anyone be 100% sure that GBD was involved.

Also, what if GBC was not 100% about the time and thought it was 10 pm he saw her but in fact it was a bit earlier say 9.30 pm that he went to bed and ABC was emotional and walked off to cool down after an argument. Could she have walked to where the screams were reported.

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC. Just some thoughts anyway will happily take criticism.

I know this is a long shot but could it be possible. For the girls I'm hoping that the father is not involved although my stomach and heart tell me different
He stated she was watching the Footy Show (i don't watch it, hence don't know at what time the Footy Show starts). Also, the house is on acreage. If she left the house to cool down, she would have probably just walked outside around their property, maybe up the driveway upto the road, but not further. A poster said it was very cold that night and following morning, therefore it is strange that she was not wearing a jumper (if she want for a walk). Her parents and best friend believed right from the word go that this was all very strange, out of character for her. The police suspected foul play from the beginning. They have never appealed for info regarding any other cars or strange people in that area, etc.

The police know who did it and are just getting their case together, waiting for the release of the cause of death. It was reported yesterday that they already have the autopsy results, but not the cause of death, probably waiting for toxicology and tissue analysis. The autopsy must be supporting their case, otherwise they would have now appealed for info from the public about any new things. They are not publicly excluding the husband. They know the public is mostly thinking the husband is the culprit and am sure they would pretty quickly announce if is NOT a person of interest. They haven't done that.
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  #441  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:36 AM
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Originally Posted by naturaljustice View Post
What if GBC and ABC had an argument for who knows what reason (affair, finances or any of the other suggestions that have been put forward). He tries to grab her and hold her and she gets upset and scratches at his face and chest. It calms down a bit, she goes to watch tv, GBC doesn't want to deal with it and goes off to bed last seeing her watch tv. She is sitting there upset and angry watching tv and decides to go for a walk to clear her head. And I know this is a long shot and no-one wants to hear it but...

WHAT IF

She does go for a walk and is attacked by a completely unrelated person or hit by a car and taken by this person and dumped. Do you think this possible? Can anyone be 100% sure that GBD was involved.

Also, what if GBC was not 100% about the time and thought it was 10 pm he saw her but in fact it was a bit earlier say 9.30 pm that he went to bed and ABC was emotional and walked off to cool down after an argument. Could she have walked to where the screams were reported.

As I said unlikely but no-one seems to be putting out any possibilities not realated to GBC. Just some thoughts anyway will happily take criticism.

I know this is a long shot but could it be possible. For the girls I'm hoping that the father is not involved although my stomach and heart tell me different

possible but unlikely... then again lots of things are possible
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  #442  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:37 AM
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Quote:
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Also, the house is on acreage. If she left the house to cool down, she would have probably just walked outside around their property, maybe up the driveway upto the road, but not further. A poster said it was very cold that night and following morning, therefore it is strange that she was not wearing a jumper (if she want for a walk).
If she knew her life was at risk and was escaping her assailant, she wouldn't have had time to make sure she was dressed appropriately for weather conditions. Also she may have been re-dressed after her death into running clothes, hence why GBC said she went for a run. jmo
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  #443  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:39 AM
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Originally Posted by alicat View Post
Re: Moggill2 and timing at roundabout. They are able to do an estimate of the time it takes to drive distances, but generally they aren't at the fastest possible speed (for instance).

I believe it was Gangitano's murder in Templestowe. They conducted numerous tests to see if Jason Moran (correct me if I'm wrong) could get from Gangitano's house to a bottle shop where he bought alcohol from (he knew they had cameras). After a massive amount of trials they finally realised it could be done in # of minutes.
Excellent point! I think you might be on to something there!

That timing business has been really bugging me!

The reality would be that in a court of law saying "we calculated that to drive from A to B would take X minutes....." might have less standing/impact than saying "we conducted numerous tests...."
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  #444  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:39 AM
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Regardless of being romantically involved or NOT, was the lady interviewed by police three times the same lady that now works at Remax that used to work with GBC as business partner or one that works with him NOW???

Police refer to this lady as ex-collegue. Maybe she was able to cast a light on the family and the situation, as opposed to being involved as such.
Their home, his belongings and his workplace - a Century 21 real estate franchise - have been raided. Police have taken a laptop, computer equipment, a hard drive, and other boxes and bags of evidence.
A woman who worked alongside the Baden-Clays at the agency has also been interviewed extensively, although why this particular colleague has been questioned is unclear.
Mrs Baden-Clay's grief-stricken parents, Geoff and Priscilla Dickie, hinted at the underlying discontent in their daughter's life in an interview with a Brisbane newspaper. Mrs Dickie said her daughter wasn't the type to complain.

http://m.smh.com.au/national/friend-...504-1y489.html
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  #445  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:40 AM
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The Footy Show for rugby league is on from 9.30 to 10.30pm. Correct me if I'm wrong as I think it's a dreadful show and don't watch it! But there is another footy show for the AFL on straight after it.
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  #446  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:41 AM
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also, what if bbc picked abc up after hair appt(if she had one) drove her to dumping ground so they could talk away from the children, argued violently, accidently killed her, panicked and dumped her body, all in the time frame between 7pm and 8pm, then drove home,maybe telling the children mummy is out and will be home later, then when children asleep, between 11pm and 4am drove back to salon to collect her car, is the salon near the roundabout? then maybe walking back to collect his car? just another idea
Or possibly has someone else collect the car handing them the keys t the round about - This would seem a bit odd to a by stander? Maybe they were timing someone else's alibi ( ie BC SNR?) I still wonder why them would tke BC Snr's hard drive from his home..? What were they thining by taking that? They certainly haven't raided ABC's family home or her best friends??

The answer may lie in the contents of ABC's iphone....I wonder if they checked the manhole in both GBC's roof and also BC Snr's roof? This is where they found alot of evidence at Ivan Milat's home they even found it in the walls....?

I like other's in this from want to believe GBC is Innocent but I really think there are underlying circumstances that point straight at him...But for the record I want to say that he didn't do this alone...Someone else know's exactly what happened and they are protecting him.

I think the sister suspects something but is to afraid of what might happen to all of the Family?

I know if this happened to me and I had died regardles of murder or natural causes that both my Family and my husbands family would be congragating together...Talking things through and consoling one another..In my experiences with death this is what most famlies do...Isn't it odd that these to Families seem to be at logger heads for some apparent reason....That reason IMO is what the motive will be for Killing ABC????
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  #447  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:41 AM
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Hi everyone, first time poster but had read all previous threads.
My friend works at the Hair Salon in Kenmore Plaza (for non-locals it is not the shopping centre at the roundabout but about 1km down the road), she told me Allison had her hair done on Thursday evening. All the staff were questioned the following morning. They were asked what Allison's demeanor was, what she said, what was she wearing, what time did she leave. My friend said she was happy and relaxed. She was discussing the conference which she was attending the following day. It was with Pathways, she was training to become a Pathways facilitator (works with small groups of children or one-on-one). My friend also mentioned Allison said the girls were at a sleep-over at the in-laws and she had a "night off". I know this conflicts with other info. She was not wearing her walking clothes. I didn't ask her what time Allison left, I presumed it was before 8pm and that's why the police changed the times, perhaps 8pm was the last time someone else besides GB-C saw her.
The staff were also questioned the Tuesday after Allison's body was found, they were asked more specifically about any marks, bruises or scratches she had on her neck, chest, arms and hands.
  #448  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:41 AM
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If she knew her life was at risk and was escaping her assailant, she wouldn't have had time to make sure she was dressed appropriately for weather conditions. Also she may have been re-dressed after her death into running clothes, hence why GBC said she went for a run. jmo
IMO - I also think she may have been dressed in that clothes after the fact to support his story. I am a mother and i don't think I would leave the property if someone was chasing me, knowing that my kids could be in danger from my out of control husband. Just my view.
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  #449  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:42 AM
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I guess if the police turned up and he was all disheveled looking, the place was a mess, maybe smelt of alcohol, hadn't slept etc it would raise alarm bells. Because if he supposedly slept all night he'd look rested and relatively calm because he's realised she's not home but wouldn't be overly stressed at that point. But if he'd been up all night covering up a murder then he'd look pretty scraggly and stressed one would think. Certainly if his demeanor and looks didn't match his story alarms bells would be raised.
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  #450  
Old 05-06-2012, 12:45 AM
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I do agree with you all it's unlikely and as you have all pointed out there is a lot of circumstances that support the gbc theories. I'm just hoping it wasn't for the sake of the children. It is just so sad.
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