Websleuths
Go Back   Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community > Crimes and Trials > Trials > Victoria Stafford

Notices

Victoria Stafford discuss all aspects of this case!


Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #676  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:03 PM
Kamille's Avatar
Kamille Kamille is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,446
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailor Bug View Post
She said he had killed Tori soon after he said he was going to stop visiting.

Derstine suggests McClintic thought Rafferty helped her out, and she didn't want him to go to police on her.

RaffertyLFP: Derstine said it was McClintic who initiated contact with Rafferty after the crime

RaffertyLFP: Derstine said that Rafferty and McClintic maintained contact because both feared the other would go to the police
Who gave her money to put minutes on her phone?

MOO
The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:
  #677  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:05 PM
OhSoCurious's Avatar
OhSoCurious OhSoCurious is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Toronto, ON
Posts: 190
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyladi View Post
Because they both didnt trust each other. They probably made a packed, well he did with her because he knew she would get busted and that is why she said she would take the fall and he loooooved that he was just making sure she would follow through. I am sorry she did not come up with this concocted plan he did. JMO
The <modsnip> pact<modsnip> was likely TLM would keep him out of it, if he helped her in what she needed or demanded. JMO

Last edited by Salem; 05-07-2012 at 09:59 PM. Reason: no need to 'help' others, thanks.
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to OhSoCurious For This Useful Post:
  #678  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:05 PM
jenniferleia jenniferleia is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 65
That's it?!?!? Wow. I bet he will be found guilty. JMO
The Following 8 Users Say Thank You to jenniferleia For This Useful Post:
  #679  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:06 PM
daisy.faithfull's Avatar
daisy.faithfull daisy.faithfull is offline
RIP Joey, Summer, Gianni & Joey Jr.
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 3,040
Have we seen any proof that TLM was the first to make contact, I don't remember that.
__________________
The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to daisy.faithfull For This Useful Post:
  #680  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:06 PM
crazyladi's Avatar
crazyladi crazyladi is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
I work in the hotel industry and see what people do when they think no one who knows them are looking ... Plenty of well know men have had hundreds of women and brag about it ... Does that make them child rapists?

Besides, I know a few bartenders that have had plenty of women, more then MR ...

Rape is not about sex ... It is about power and control ...
No but it says something about the person. To me Rafferty couldnt get enough sex and once the women realized that "something was off about him" they took off. He was very secretive so its not just that he was a male whore.

People dont randomly just rape a child. They have fantasized about it and yes I do believe he did fantasize about raping a child.

I am just glad I am not a juror to make this choice with all that I have heard from the beginning from all directions.
__________________
May you rest in peace.....Tori Stafford

Missing but never forgotten Nicole Louise Morin last seen July 30th 1985

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32372
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to crazyladi For This Useful Post:
  #681  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:07 PM
crazyladi's Avatar
crazyladi crazyladi is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by daisy.faithfull View Post
Have we seen any proof that TLM was the first to make contact, I don't remember that.
Considering he was the one knocking on her door after the first time out, makes me think this is just not true whatsoever. I dont believe it at all. JMO
__________________
May you rest in peace.....Tori Stafford

Missing but never forgotten Nicole Louise Morin last seen July 30th 1985

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32372
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to crazyladi For This Useful Post:
  #682  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:07 PM
JayFriend JayFriend is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 606
Twitter
Quote:
RaffertyLFP:
Derstine said that Rafferty and McClintic maintained contact because both feared the other would go to the police [via Twitter]
This says it all. They were both in it together and covering for each other.

Guilty as charged.
The Following 14 Users Say Thank You to JayFriend For This Useful Post:
  #683  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:11 PM
crazyladi's Avatar
crazyladi crazyladi is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamille View Post
Who gave her money to put minutes on her phone?

MOO
Good point!!! And her phone was the old flip up phone too no, or was that carols or did they share the same phone?
__________________
May you rest in peace.....Tori Stafford

Missing but never forgotten Nicole Louise Morin last seen July 30th 1985

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32372
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to crazyladi For This Useful Post:
  #684  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:12 PM
Kamille's Avatar
Kamille Kamille is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,446
Quote:
Originally Posted by daisy.faithfull View Post
Have we seen any proof that TLM was the first to make contact, I don't remember that.
Probably in the phone records. It had been over a month since CM had her phone on and all of a sudden within a day or two of the crime...voila...phone is working again. On a long Easter weekend no less. Now who is the one with stacks of cash and a bag of percs for sale?

MOO
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:
  #685  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:16 PM
Alison's Avatar
Alison Alison is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Sudbury Ontario
Posts: 378
Am logging off for a while but would just like to point an observation out to my fellow sleuthers. I know I have been off in some of my posts and for that I appologize. However I just want to add because someone adds "respectfully" or "JMO" before a post does not make the post not rude.
__________________
Sympathy is prejudice disguised as pity.
The Following 13 Users Say Thank You to Alison For This Useful Post:
  #686  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:16 PM
Sailor Bug's Avatar
Sailor Bug Sailor Bug is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,242
Last Updated: May 7, 2012 3:32pm


http://www.lfpress.com/news/london/r.../19725376.html
__________________
"The dead cannot cry out for justice; it is a duty of the living to do so for them."
★★★★★ ღ♥Lois McMaster Bujold♥ღ ★★★★★
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Sailor Bug For This Useful Post:
  #687  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:19 PM
BorgQueen's Avatar
BorgQueen BorgQueen is offline
Eradicated User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 595
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
Being a 28 year old man with an ative sex life does not make him a pedophile rapist ... If I understand it correctly it is the opposite ...
A 28 year old man with a preference for single mothers might.

Then again, it might not. We don't know what he thinks or wants. And even if he thought about it doesn't mean he acted it out.


Point: lots of 'possibly', 'maybe', 'might'... either way, nothing is definite -- we can't read his mind.

JMO
__________________
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to BorgQueen For This Useful Post:
  #688  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:19 PM
sillybilly's Avatar
sillybilly sillybilly is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: State of Confusion, Canada
Posts: 6,817
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
Rape is not about sex ... It is about power and control ...
<rsbm>

That is a well-known fact Tahorn, and I believe that MTR did not have power and control in his romantic relationships. Sex he had, but relationships did not flourish (except TLM who he probably didn't think of as a keeper anyway). I believe it was the week prior to Tori's murder that he had broken up with AL (whom he had known from his earlier days). She broke it up too. IIRC, AL was the ONLY one who testified who brought MTR to tears as she left the courtroom.

Possibly the rape of a female child was all about power and control ... that he did not have over his relationships with adult women.

JMO
The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to sillybilly For This Useful Post:
  #689  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:21 PM
Tahorn Tahorn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: B.C
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyladi View Post
Considering he was the one knocking on her door after the first time out, makes me think this is just not true whatsoever. I dont believe it at all. JMO
She arranged him to have access in dentention ... He wasn't even able to talk on the phone until she arranged it ...
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Tahorn For This Useful Post:
  #690  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:22 PM
nursebeeme's Avatar
nursebeeme nursebeeme is offline
WS Super Moderator
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: sipping coffee at the Purple Rose Theatre
Posts: 52,141
Quote:
Originally Posted by OhSoCurious View Post
It was not proven that she did not either. The extreme likelihood is there of some remote acquaintance. Poor Tori, skipped along and chatted with too much trust for stranger danger. JMO
bbm: I completely disagree with what I bolded... We see it case after case after case again. Perpetrators are cunning and know what to say to get what they want.



eta: to name a recent case: Ryan Brunn took a picture of little Jorelys Rivera's roller skate (that he stole) and told her he had found it... and she walked off with him to a vacant apartment where she was raped, murdered, and then dumped into a trash compactor.

Yes. it happens. And yes, kids are happily lured away...
__________________
This bee my opinion
The Following 19 Users Say Thank You to nursebeeme For This Useful Post:
  #691  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:23 PM
Tahorn Tahorn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: B.C
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyladi View Post
Considering he was the one knocking on her door after the first time out, makes me think this is just not true whatsoever. I dont believe it at all. JMO
Why? Only evidence is TLM
The Following User Says Thank You to Tahorn For This Useful Post:
  #692  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:23 PM
crazyladi's Avatar
crazyladi crazyladi is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
She arranged him to have access in dentention ... He wasn't even able to talk on the phone until she arranged it ...
Because she was in love with him and he pretended he cared for her, took her to look at rings, having sex with her etc etc. Sorry she arranged it for that reason not for any other reason. They are Bonnie and Clyde through and through. He just think he isnt going to get caught.
__________________
May you rest in peace.....Tori Stafford

Missing but never forgotten Nicole Louise Morin last seen July 30th 1985

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32372
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to crazyladi For This Useful Post:
  #693  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:24 PM
Sailor Bug's Avatar
Sailor Bug Sailor Bug is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 3,242
Rafferty was in touch with CM TLM's Mother...

Passing messages to one another, I'm sure

jmo
__________________
"The dead cannot cry out for justice; it is a duty of the living to do so for them."
★★★★★ ღ♥Lois McMaster Bujold♥ღ ★★★★★
The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Sailor Bug For This Useful Post:
  #694  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:24 PM
crazyladi's Avatar
crazyladi crazyladi is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Somewhere over the rainbow
Posts: 1,300
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
Why? Only evidence is TLM
ummm well she was there no?? JMO
__________________
May you rest in peace.....Tori Stafford

Missing but never forgotten Nicole Louise Morin last seen July 30th 1985

http://websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32372
The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to crazyladi For This Useful Post:
  #695  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:28 PM
jenniferleia jenniferleia is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 65
When TLM said she cut out pieces of the back seat....she never said the bottom back seat. Maybe it was the backrest of the backseat. Maybe it was all cut up, and then replaced with a new one right after the murder.
The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to jenniferleia For This Useful Post:
  #696  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:30 PM
Tahorn Tahorn is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: B.C
Posts: 278
Quote:
Originally Posted by crazyladi View Post
ummm well she was there no?? JMO
If she says so ...
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tahorn For This Useful Post:
  #697  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:31 PM
Kamille's Avatar
Kamille Kamille is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,446
Quote:
Originally Posted by jenniferleia View Post
When TLM said she cut out pieces of the back seat....she never said the bottom back seat. Maybe it was the backrest of the backseat. Maybe it was all cut up, and then replaced with a new one right after the murder.
Speaking of the back seat, noticed that Derstine conveniently skipped over that entirely.

MOO
The Following 12 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:
  #698  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:32 PM
Kamille's Avatar
Kamille Kamille is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 6,446
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tahorn View Post
She arranged him to have access in dentention ... He wasn't even able to talk on the phone until she arranged it ...
He wouldn't even have known she wanted to arrange that if he wasn't in contact with her mother.

MOO
The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Kamille For This Useful Post:
  #699  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:35 PM
Shasta Shasta is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 84
Thank you to all of those members such as Robynhood, Sailorbug, n/t and others who kept the tread alive for Tori today.

Many sleuthers here predicted this would be the weak tack the defence would take but I can't understand why Derstine needed a 4 day weekend to cobble it together. Looking forward to what the Crown has to say tomorrow.

Good night. It's late evening here in the KSA.
The Following 18 Users Say Thank You to Shasta For This Useful Post:
  #700  
Old 05-07-2012, 04:35 PM
Ardy Ardy is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 546
In my opiinion, the Crown has to put something together tomorrow that makes sense and is supported by real evidence, not speculation and conjecture, that proves MR is guilty. After today, I think the jury will choose to disregard all of TLM's testimony.

Nobody will want to vote for conviction of such serious charges, based on testimony from such an unreliable witness.

The Crown knew they had a problem with TLM from the outset, and have tried to mitigate the damage, but Derstine has brilliantly brought TLM's credibility as the main issue in the trial.

It is an issue the Crown is probably loathe to defend.

JMO.............
The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Ardy For This Useful Post:
Closed Thread

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Trial Thread, Weekend Discussion May 4-5, 2012 Waiting for Closing Arguments SoSueMe Victoria Stafford 589 05-07-2012 11:33 AM
trial thread: 5/3-4/2012 nursebeeme Gabriel Johnson 94 05-07-2012 10:12 AM


© Copyright Websleuths 1999-2012 New To Site? Need Help?
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.1
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 09:02 AM.

Advertisements

Pre-Order Imperfect Justice: Prosecuting Casey Anthony today!