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Lisa Irwin Missing! 10 mo old Lisa Irwin disappeared from her crib in the middle of the night. Where is she?


View Poll Results: Lisas parents, inncoent or guilty of something to do with it
innocent totally 8 6.30%
Guilty 82 64.57%
innocent but complicit in some way 7 5.51%
Don't know 30 23.62%
Voters: 127. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 11-20-2012, 07:08 PM
Clutchbag Clutchbag is offline
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Lisas parents

Innocent or guilty of something to do with their babys disappearance

Ive read the reports, the theories, the chats and comments and I have come to a position that they are innocent, at least presumed because there is much halluballoo around the case, nothing points to me they are complicit, there are bits and pieces which could mean anything, the cadaver dog worries me but i will allow that to be a fluke

i say this cos i donated to them even when i thought it was fishy, but was just my suspicious mind today i got a card from them thanking me for my donation signed by both and two photos of little lisa in it, i felt guilty thinking they got rid of her, and that she is out there,just goes to show how easy it is to post on boards when it comes to personal contact it makes u think, their little angel was taken
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Old 11-20-2012, 07:11 PM
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My answer of "unsure" isn't there so I won't vote. Still on the fence until i see some solid evidence from LE
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Old 11-20-2012, 07:23 PM
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I'm with Dewey. There's no choice for either "undecided" or "on the fence".
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:02 PM
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Damn, sorry,MODS, please add option for dont know
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:03 PM
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After 13 & 1/2 months, I still haven't seen, read or heard enough evidence for me to pronounce either parent guilty of harming and or disposing of Lisa.
I do leam more toward Lisa having been abducted, more so with each passing month.
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Old 11-20-2012, 08:09 PM
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Thing is there are many so called abductions whichare notand it makes you cynical which is fair enough but always try give benefit of the doubt until many red certain red flags appear i guess

db and ji are no casey or mccanns
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Old 11-20-2012, 10:41 PM
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Well, as a parent, never having experienced my child missing, I just feel that I would have more of a freak out than deb or Jeremy. Personally, I don't think one could get me to stop yelling to anybody who would listen! My child is missing! Please please please help me find my child! Interview me, take a polygraph, rule me out! Let's get on with finding my child! Im pretty sure I would be like that. And they have not given me that impression.
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Old 11-20-2012, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag View Post
Damn, sorry,MODS, please add option for dont know
I wasn't sure if the Mods would see this so I sent them a note, not sure if it's possible for them to add it now or not, but we'll see.

ETA: Thank you Mods!
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Last edited by Dewey2Me1MoThyme; 11-20-2012 at 11:04 PM. Reason: ETA:
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Old 11-20-2012, 11:33 PM
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this is a link to the most recent poll... with 65% saying they believe a parent (or both) are guilty... i doubt anyone has changed their mind since it was taken...


The Debit Card and TV Appearances-- - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:

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Old 11-21-2012, 11:20 AM
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Morning, and Happy Thanksgiving !


JMO ... but I voted G U I L T Y ...

There are just so many things that point to "guilt" of Deb and Jeremy IMO ...

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Old 11-21-2012, 02:51 PM
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Yes, not sure why we need two polls...

Actually, this would be the third poll about it.

This is the second one:

what are your thoughts now? *re-re-poll* - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

The first one was before that.
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Old 11-21-2012, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag View Post
Thing is there are many so called abductions whichare notand it makes you cynical which is fair enough but always try give benefit of the doubt until many red certain red flags appear i guess

db and ji are no casey or mccanns


db and ji are no casey or mccanns I agree 1000% with this.
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  #13  
Old 11-22-2012, 03:05 AM
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clutch--

would you be willing to elaborate why these parents differ from kc and the mccanns? which things are definite "red flags" for you? just want to get a better picture of what you see that those here who see guilt might be misinterpreting...

thanks!
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:

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Old 11-26-2012, 09:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag View Post
nothing points to me they are complicit, there are bits and pieces which could mean anything, the cadaver dog worries me but i will allow that to be a fluke

just read something that caught my attention: in the mccann forum you "argue" so passionately that grime's dog eddie's alerts were credible, legitmate, convincing etc... in the LI case grime used morse instead of eddie (meaning: same trainer/handler and training methods)and you even commended the dog's work w/ bianca... can you explain your opposite opinion in this case? what's different? thanks.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Sleuthing Madeleine's disappearance.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - the cadaver dog
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:


Last edited by redheadedgal; 11-26-2012 at 10:07 PM. Reason: exlpain spelled wrong
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Old 11-27-2012, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redheadedgal View Post
just read something that caught my attention: in the mccann forum you "argue" so passionately that grime's dog eddie's alerts were credible, legitmate, convincing etc... in the LI case grime used morse instead of eddie (meaning: same trainer/handler and training methods)and you even commended the dog's work w/ bianca... can you explain your opposite opinion in this case? what's different? thanks.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Sleuthing Madeleine's disappearance.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - the cadaver dog

hi redhead im here



I had no idea mr grime was on the lisa irwin case, that changes things for me
i know many usa dog handlers allot alerts to all sorts of scenarios ie inthe casey anthony case the man in the dock said the dog can alert to toenails or something
i dont know if american cadaver dogs are trained different from british ones but for the record from what i know of mr grime and his dogs they do NOT alert to semen body odour nail clippings period blood dirty diapers urine dead animals etc e etc and all other thingsused to excuse the alerts of cadaver dogs as innocent, as ivesaid onthe maddie case if that were true these dogs would bebarking every five seconds all over the place
in the maddie case the dogwas taken to many places and never alerted anywhere inall those places, only inthe places and possessions of the mccanns

this doesnt bode well as mr grime and his dogs have an excellent record

Last edited by Clutchbag; 11-27-2012 at 09:18 PM.
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clutchbag View Post
hi redhead im here



I had no idea mr grime was on the lisa irwin case, that changes things for me
i know many usa dog handlers allot alerts to all sorts of scenarios ie inthe casey anthony case the man in the dock said the dog can alert to toenails or something
i dont know if american cadaver dogs are trained different from british ones but for the record from what i know of mr grime and his dogs they do NOT alert to semen body odour nail clippings period blood dirty diapers urine dead animals etc e etc and all other thingsused to excuse the alerts of cadaver dogs as innocent, as ivesaid onthe maddie case if that were true these dogs would bebarking every five seconds all over the place
in the maddie case the dogwas taken to many places and never alerted anywhere inall those places, only inthe places and possessions of the mccanns

this doesnt bode well as mr grime and his dogs have an excellent record
There are pictures/videos of what appears to be Mr Grime & his dog(s) at Jeremy Irwin's house. I agree that their record does seem pretty impressive. I am always amazed at the mind-blowing things that dogs are able to do!
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Old 11-28-2012, 12:14 AM
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thanks clutch...

yes, video indicates that at least one of grime's dogs was used in this case... both vids show mr grime on the scene:

http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/region_...lisa%27s-house

http://news.yahoo.com/video/kansasci...-27013087.html
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:

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Old 11-28-2012, 12:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redheadedgal View Post
thanks clutch...

yes, video indicates that at least one of grime's dogs was used in this case... both vids show mr grime on the scene:
http://www.kshb.com/dpp/news/region_...lisa%27s-house

http://news.yahoo.com/video/kansasci...-27013087.html

I may have missed it, ..but I wasn't aware there was a video of the dog or handler that made the hit at the Irwin home on Oct. 17. The one indicated on the search warrent.
These video's seem to be from the Oct 19th search warrent. Is it known what dog or handler was used on the 17th?
Thanks.
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Old 11-28-2012, 03:50 PM
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i have no idea about the 17th... but we all are aware that 7 specific items were taken from the home on the 19th... why?


(do people really think LE/FBI brings in incompetent dogs? the fact this seems to be more believeable than the fact that something very hinky is going on with these parents and this case... smh )
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:

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Old 11-28-2012, 05:44 PM
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also-- grime is under contract to the FBI... if he was there on the 19th i don't think it's too much of an assumption to believe he was present only two days earlier...
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  #21  
Old 11-28-2012, 06:22 PM
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thanks ksstormy and redheadedgal for the videos and info

I dont think that dog handler is Mr Grime but I could be wrong, his dog looks like eddie, rip and bless his little cotton socks, also similar to keela, the blood dog, if it was mr grime and the cadaver dog indicated he would have used keela or if not usingher anymore another blood scenting dog to find forensics if no body was found

has it been reported anywhere it was Mr Grime?
  #22  
Old 11-28-2012, 06:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Little Ol Me View Post
I may have missed it, ..but I wasn't aware there was a video of the dog or handler that made the hit at the Irwin home on Oct. 17. The one indicated on the search warrent.
These video's seem to be from the Oct 19th search warrent. Is it known what dog or handler was used on the 17th?
Thanks.

the cadaver dog hit in the home on the 17th and a warrant was then issued to search and or remove items from the home, is how i understand it, see original documents here

http://media2.nbcactionnews.com/NWT/...winwarrant.pdf
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Old 11-28-2012, 08:44 PM
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you don't think this is grime? (and most likely morse... definitely not keela)




grime from dec 2011 @ detroit re: d'andre lane/bianca jones murder trial:



same gray hair... same facial expression...
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what the massei motivation report against knox and sollectio really shows:

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Old 11-28-2012, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by redheadedgal View Post
you don't think this is grime? (and most likely morse... definitely not keela)




grime from dec 2011 @ detroit re: d'andre lane/bianca jones murder trial:



same gray hair... same facial expression...


that is him ok unsure if it was him at irwins
  #25  
Old 11-29-2012, 04:11 PM
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redheadedgal, i have looked again at the videos and have to agree it does seem like mr grime, after all, hes changed a little from 2007 i guess and here is a picture of morse about three quarters of the way down this page

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id421.html

certainly looks like the springer spaniel in the video

as I said before, mr grime has had considerable success and has wonderful and very stringent testing and training methods, so it changes everything for me in this case

This is a useful blog with lots of info on mr grimes dogs and cases worked on

http://eddieandkeela.blogspot.co.uk/
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