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JonBenet Ramsey What really happened to 6 year old JonBenet? Someone is getting away with murder. All information posted on this site is gained through published documentation on this case. It is strictly opinion only.


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  #26  
Old 01-16-2007, 09:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMO8778
CK,re: Vermont,was that the man that was 'too short to go to prison' case?
I had not heard anything about either one of these sub human beings height. In both cases the judge did not sentence them to time but rehabilitation courses. There was such an outcry the first judge ultimately gave the man like 9 months time. This second one. No time that I am aware of . Only intensive rehabilitative counseling. Lot of good that does the 4 year old he abused over 10 times....... Makes me physically ill. CK
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  #27  
Old 01-17-2007, 08:12 AM
snowqueen snowqueen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMO8778
I agree.I thought his behavior sounded like sheer SHOCK.It was obvious he was totally taken by surprise when JB's body was found.
As far as Atlanta,we are supposed to beleive that his anger is inexplicable ..but no one gets angry without good reason.I can't imagine how I would react if I saw and realized the things he likely did,and with the parents behaving the way they did..over-anxious to go on TV,but not talking to or cooperating with LE.I think I'd flip.
I have no link but I have read that Fleet White was acting strangely before he left Denver for JB's funeral. So much so that Fernie would not let him on the corporate plane to fly to Atlanta and even after arriving in Atlanta John's brother wanted Fleet and Priscilla moved out of his house to a motel.

SO - IMO - Fleet started acting strangely before he found out John and Patsy were going on CNN.
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  #28  
Old 01-17-2007, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowqueen
I have no link but I have read that Fleet White was acting strangely before he left Denver for JB's funeral. So much so that Fernie would not let him on the corporate plane to fly to Atlanta and even after arriving in Atlanta John's brother wanted Fleet and Priscilla moved out of his house to a motel.

SO - IMO - Fleet started acting strangely before he found out John and Patsy were going on CNN.
This is all according to John Ramsey - many months after the murder when relationships with the Whites had completed broken down and quite frankly, we need to take it with a pinch of salt. There are two sides to every story and we've only heard John Ramsey's. He is NOT a reliable source. Take this for example:-

This is from John Ramsey's October 1998 deposition - John Ramsey took an OATH for this deposition:-

Quote:
18 Q. Is it true that there was an altercation between

19 you and Mr. White in Atlanta around the time of the

20 memorial service?
21 MR. CRAVER: I don't understand the potential
22 relevance of that at all. At this stage, I have to judge
23 whether that's a question intended to embarrass or harass
24 him. Where are you going with this, Lee?
25 MR. HILL: I'm looking for sources. I'm looking
Page 49
1 for people who have an ax to grind with Mr. Ramsey.
2 MR. CRAVER: All right. I'll allow him to
3 answer the question.
4 A. There was no altercation.
5 Q. This is with all respect, sir, as I said to you
6 earlier. And I appreciate you hearing my clarification.
7 MR. CRAVER: Okay.
8 Q. We had been informed that there was some sort of
9 dispute or disagreement, that police were called. Is that
10 all hog-wash?
11 A. To my knowledge, yeah. I am not aware of any of
12 that.
Then in DOI - page 295, John is referring to the exact incident which Lee Hill asked him about in the deposition

Quote:
"But the altercation didn't go away. Fleet's behavior seemed so unreasonable and out of place that it was frightening....."
There is another source which I have seen which confirms that the police were called to the altercation which John Ramsey denied happened - under oath - and then proceeded to write about in his book. I don't have time to look for that just now but I *think* it was a detective who confirmed it in another deposition or interview.

This isn't some trivial little incident that someone could understandably forget about - this was an event which John Ramsey described as "frightening" - the police were called out. Yet he denied it happened - under oath. If you read his deposition at acandyrose's, you will see that it was to be sealed. As far as John Ramsey was concerned, his testimony (i.e. liles) would never be made public.

This is precisely why I am leery of the man.
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  #29  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuisanceposter
I posted at Topix once to see if my hometown would be listed, and it wasn't - it said I was from a town several states away, and I have broadband.

Well, Ames, Freshwater said there would be some changes, but I have yet to see any. The CTV JBR board has some real issues with people who have trouble maintaining a polite and "professional" attitude...it's always been like that over there. That situation with someone copying your post from here to put up there just for mockery is not the first time I have seen people at CTV do so.
I did go back to courttv, only for a few seconds though....to check and see what, or IF any changes had been made, and I didn't see any either. I was informed though that it IS against the rules to copy and post other people's posts, without their permission. You CAN paraphrase, but then you risk someone taking you out of context.
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  #30  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles

I only really recognise some posters at CTV - like Rashamon who is a member here and LouiseDelmar who posts as Tipper everywhere else and who is or used to be a member here.
LouisaDelmar is the person that copied and PASTED my post from these boards, onto the courttv boards!
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  #31  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMO8778
CK,re: Vermont,was that the man that was 'too short to go to prison' case?
I heard about that case....was that not the dumbest thing you have ever heard? To short to go to prison? That would be laughable, if it wasn't so sad. Didn't the judge in that case, resign because people were giving her a hard time?
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  #32  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
<snipped
I don't think anyone killed JonBenet to get at her father - I think that is one of the most ludicrous theories of all actually. I believe it takes a special kind of madness or evil to torture and kill a beautiful, defenceless child. There are many ways in which an enemy could have destroyed John Ramsey without harming an innocent child - and with much less risk too.
<snipped>
I believe that this "intruder did it theory to get back at her father", is absurd...I agree with you. And we are supposed to believe that the "intruder" hated John so much that he killed his daughter, and brought in a magazine with him with faces of John's co-worker's X'd out, and a HEART drawn around John's picture (wow...he must have "really" hated him alot to have drawn a HEART around his picture!), and also the ransom note...there was not one single use of profanity....which, IMO...would be inconsistant with an intruder that HATED John, to the point that he killed his daughter. Those two reasons, alone...make me know that an intruder that hated John, did not kill his daughter.
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  #33  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowqueen

SO - IMO - Fleet started acting strangely before he found out John and Patsy were going on CNN.
I am sure, IMO...that it was only because he was traumatized by the whole thing. He was their friend.....wouldn't you be traumatized if you were over at a friends house, because their child had been "kidnapped", and then later her body was brought up from the basement? I sure would be!! I would have to seek therapy....no doubt about it. But, that wouldn't mean that I committed the crime.
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  #34  
Old 01-17-2007, 10:51 AM
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I think FW started acting strangely on 12/26, when he watched JR find JonBenet's body and began to seriously question what exactly what happened to her and how involved her parents were, if at all.

I see nothing suspicious about this. As Priscilla said, "We fed her her last meal." They had just seen JB, very much alive, the evening before she was found dead. She'd been at their house, and she was their daughter's best friend. No doubt the Whites were traumatized, doubly so to have to question whether or not their good friends the Rs were involved in what happened to a defenseless child the same age as their own little girl.

I don't think anyone killed JonBenet to get back at JR. Anyone who studied the family prior to this crime would have been aware that JB was Patsy's favorite child, not JR's, and JR spent what little time he had for his family more often with Burke than with JonBenet.
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  #35  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuisanceposter
I think FW started acting strangely on 12/26, when he watched JR find JonBenet's body and began to seriously question what exactly what happened to her and how involved her parents were, if at all.
Yes,I think he saw or heard something not yet revealed to the public,and realized there was something going on regarding the R's involvment in her death.
I went beserk over a lawyer keeping part of the money *I was supposed to get when I refi'd my house ...so I can NOT imagine what the White's were feeling..it must have been a thousand times worse!!!!!
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something to ponder:

When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:54-57
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  #36  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:14 AM
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On that note,I can't help but think at least part of it had something to do with the tape that was supposedly on JB's mouth.I think it was said the tape wouldn't have stuck to her,and my guess is that's prob. why he went back downstairs to look at it.Even at that early stage,he knew that something wasn't quite right !!
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something to ponder:

When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:54-57
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  #37  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:16 AM
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I think Fleet White's behaviour was consistent witha nervous breakdown and/or post traumatic stress disorder.
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  #38  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMO8778
On that note,I can't help but think at least part of it had something to do with the tape that was supposedly on JB's mouth.I think it was said the tape wouldn't have stuck to her,and my guess is that's prob. why he went back downstairs to look at it.Even at that early stage,he knew that something wasn't quite right !!
Yes, I agree. I am sure that with all that he saw and/or heard.....and with his gut instinct....he knew that something wasn't right.
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  #39  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
I think Fleet White's behaviour was consistent witha nervous breakdown and/or post traumatic stress disorder.
I feel really sorry for the man and his family!
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  #40  
Old 01-17-2007, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ames
I feel really sorry for the man and his family!
I do too.It really irked me when I read suspicions about them at other forums.I quit going to others partly b/c of that.
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something to ponder:

When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:54-57
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  #41  
Old 01-17-2007, 12:14 PM
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I agree, ladies. It would be different if there was something that tied the Whites to the crime scene or body other than people think FW acted suspicious. Fiber evidence, fingerprints, DNA, something. But all they have is the claims of some woman proven to be suspicious herself, and somehow the IDI keep failing to mention that this woman said JR is a molester as well...
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  #42  
Old 01-17-2007, 12:51 PM
snowqueen snowqueen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
This is all according to John Ramsey - many months after the murder when relationships with the Whites had completed broken down and quite frankly, we need to take it with a pinch of salt. There are two sides to every story and we've only heard John Ramsey's. He is NOT a reliable source. Take this for example:-

This is from John Ramsey's October 1998 deposition - John Ramsey took an OATH for this deposition:-


Then in DOI - page 295, John is referring to the exact incident which Lee Hill asked him about in the deposition



There is another source which I have seen which confirms that the police were called to the altercation which John Ramsey denied happened - under oath - and then proceeded to write about in his book. I don't have time to look for that just now but I *think* it was a detective who confirmed it in another deposition or interview.

This isn't some trivial little incident that someone could understandably forget about - this was an event which John Ramsey described as "frightening" - the police were called out. Yet he denied it happened - under oath. If you read his deposition at acandyrose's, you will see that it was to be sealed. As far as John Ramsey was concerned, his testimony (i.e. liles) would never be made public.

This is precisely why I am leery of the man.
If I am not mistaken all three incidents were discussed in Perfect Murder/Perfect Town which was first published 1/4/99. I question if Schiller used JR's depostion as the source for his book.
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  #43  
Old 01-17-2007, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMO8778
On that note,I can't help but think at least part of it had something to do with the tape that was supposedly on JB's mouth.I think it was said the tape wouldn't have stuck to her,and my guess is that's prob. why he went back downstairs to look at it.Even at that early stage,he knew that something wasn't quite right !!
JMO: What is meant by "the tape wouldn't have stuck to her". I am not following.
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  #44  
Old 01-17-2007, 12:55 PM
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There is not one shred of evidence to link Fleet White to this murder. The FWDI brigade excuse away every aspect of Ramsey behaviour and accuse this man on nothing more than speculation.

The fact is that the Whites gave DNA, they spoke with police and urged the Ramseys to do likewise. Later, the wrote letters demanding that a special prosecutor be appointed to investigate the case. They have spoken out against those who have made money from the case and have steadfastly refused to speak with tabloids or Internet junkies.

It is a travesty to see the way in which they are torn to shred by a group of utterly vicious people who seem clueless about the facts of the case.
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  #45  
Old 01-17-2007, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowqueen
If I am not mistaken all three incidents were discussed in Perfect Murder/Perfect Town which was first published 1/4/99. I question if Schiller used JR's depostion as the source for his book.
Sorry, could you elaborate. I'm not following you.
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  #46  
Old 01-17-2007, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
Sorry, could you elaborate. I'm not following you.
Fernie not allowing FW to fly the corporate plane to Atlanta.
JR's brother asking that FW & Priscilla be moved from his home to a motel.
The confrontation FW had w/JR following JB's funeral.
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  #47  
Old 01-17-2007, 01:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snowqueen
Fernie not allowing FW to fly the corporate plane to Atlanta.
JR's brother asking that FW & Priscilla be moved from his home to a motel.
The confrontation FW had w/JR following JB's funeral.
Sorry, I thought you were referring to three incidents in my post!

I don't think John's deposition was public when Schiller wrote his book. INterestingly, in the same depo, John also denied that they were particularly friendly with the Stines prior to the murder - yet the two couples had vacationed together only weeks before the murder - without the children!
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  #48  
Old 01-17-2007, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
Sorry, I thought you were referring to three incidents in my post!

I don't think John's deposition was public when Schiller wrote his book. INterestingly, in the same depo, John also denied that they were particularly friendly with the Stines prior to the murder - yet the two couples had vacationed together only weeks before the murder - without the children!
And did I read somewhere that the Stines moved to Atlanta shortly after the Ramseys? I'd like to google for more info about them. Do you know - was Glen the father, Susan the mother, and Doug the son? And how old was Doug when JB was murdered, if you know?
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  #49  
Old 01-17-2007, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solace
JMO: What is meant by "the tape wouldn't have stuck to her". I am not following.
I recall reading that either the tape didn't have much glue on it and wouldn't have adhered to her face,or JB's face wasn't dry enough for it to stick(from mucous,and I think it was said she threw up too?)yet JR says he 'ripped it off' her mouth,but that wouldn't have been possible.Her face does have some dried mucous or something on it in the autopsy photos,so that sounds likely.
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something to ponder:

When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:54-57
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  #50  
Old 01-17-2007, 04:08 PM
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JMO8778 JMO8778 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jayelles
There is not one shred of evidence to link Fleet White to this murder. The FWDI brigade excuse away every aspect of Ramsey behaviour and accuse this man on nothing more than speculation.

The fact is that the Whites gave DNA, they spoke with police and urged the Ramseys to do likewise. Later, the wrote letters demanding that a special prosecutor be appointed to investigate the case. They have spoken out against those who have made money from the case and have steadfastly refused to speak with tabloids or Internet junkies.

It is a travesty to see the way in which they are torn to shred by a group of utterly vicious people who seem clueless about the facts of the case.
well-said.I think they've behaved in the most caring ways possible.
__________________
something to ponder:

When the corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and the mortal have put on immortality, then shall we be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.

O death, where [is] thy sting? O grave, where [is] thy victory?

The sting of death [is] sin; and the strength of sin [is] the law.
But thanks [be] to God, which giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1 Corinthians 15:54-57
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