Madeleine died 'after large sleeping pill overdose'

Rino · #1 09-13-2007, 03:23 PM

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/liv...n_page_id=1811
Madeleine McCann died of an overdose of sleeping pills, it was reported tonight.

A respected French newspaper said it had seen evidence that body fluids found in the boot of her parents' hire car proved the missing girl had been sedated.
France Soir said DNA analysis of the fluids showed the four-year-old had ingested larged quantities of sleeping pills. The newspaper said it had seen "hard evidence", now in the hands of the Portuguese authorities, about Madeleine's "death".........

Guilhem Battut, an investigative journalist with the paper, said a report outlining how she died was already with Portuguese prosecutors. He said scientific analyses of the fluids found in the car boot "prove that the little girl had ingested medicines, without doubt sleeping pills, in large quantities". These would have caused "an overdose", said Battut's report.

(snip)

I posted this in another thread, but I thought it was very interesting and didn't want it buried.

Trino · #2 09-13-2007, 03:32 PM

Interesting, but how did Madeline get the sleeping pills? Kate? Gerry? Or, did she take them herself?

Rino · #3 09-13-2007, 03:34 PM

Either way it looks like the negligence went far beyond leaving them unattended.

Trino · #4 09-13-2007, 03:35 PM

Agreed. The McCanns surely know what happened.

Taximom · #5 09-13-2007, 03:46 PM

This makes me want to sit on the fence again. My own children (especially when they were her age) have thought pills were candy and wanted some. Same with the liquids. They look like kool-aid to them.

Fortunately the lids have been on (child-proof cap) when we've left them in reach accidentally. Normally everything is up high and locked, but sometimes they were left out. :( I'm blessed that nothing happened to my children.

If this was purely accidental, I can see where they would want to cover it up being doctors and all. It's not something I would do though, and it's certainly not what should have been done. IF that's the case here anyway. Who knows.

Maybe she took the pills and then threw up, getting it in her hair. That mixture (stomach contents) might have been in the numerous hairs found in the trunk.

Thanks for the updates.

Pinkhammer · #6 09-13-2007, 03:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trino

Interesting, but how did Madeline get the sleeping pills? Kate? Gerry? Or, did she take them herself?

When the parents are either drunk or hungover every single day on holiday, it's easy to see how they could get mixed up dosing their kids with sedatives. I think the sedatives were administered by one of the parents, and they gave poor little Maddie double or triple so Mrs. Fenn wouldn't report her crying, while they caroused with their swinger friends and 14 bottles of wine.

teacherbees · #7 09-13-2007, 03:57 PM

Even if Madeleine took the pills on her own, I'm still holding the parents culpable.

First, they left a three old alone. You can't trust three year olds and, as doctors, Kate and Gerry should know better than most the horrible possible ramifications of doing so.

Secondly, back to the doctor thing. Where the heck were these pills if Madeleine got into them? Two doctors should most certainly know better than to leave medicines ANYWHERE out in the open with children in the house, especially if they're callous and selfish enough to leave three babies home alone while they go out and party.

If it's true that Madeleine died of an overdose, I think the theory is more likely to be that Gerry and Kate both gave her a good strong dose, without knowing that the other one did. This was a "hysterical" child who was getting in the way of their good times and they were tired of dealing with her.

Stupid, stupid people. Geez, it makes me fume to think that there were so many resources available to them to make sure their children were looked after. But NO, they think it's just peachy to leave their kids alone in a strange country.

If they'd taken the advice of the resort and obtained childcare for their BABIES, Madeleine would be alive today. I don't care how you slice and dice it, the McCanns caused their daughter's death. Pure and simple.

Pinkhammer · #8 09-13-2007, 03:58 PM

Taximom, it has been reported that syringes were found in the apartment, leading police to believe that the sedatives were given to the children as shots, not pills.

Unless Gerry and Kate have another little "habit"...besides the alcohol.

Guruinu2 · #9 09-13-2007, 03:59 PM

I hope that hair samples from the twins are tested....If there are indications of sedatives It would be very telling IMO.

NK57 · #10 09-13-2007, 04:03 PM

This one takes me off the fence. I had a patient/client a few years back who would grind up her ambien sleeping medication and give it got her PDD pre-school age daughter. She saw nothing really wrong with it as it made bed time "tolerable" and she was able to get her "mommy time" by 8:00 pm. She didn't care that it was unsafe for her child or that it had cumulative effects. CPS was referred in this case. The child ended up being placed with the paternal grandparents in this case. So... I am not surprised at this turn of events.

Nancy

Pinkhammer · #11 09-13-2007, 04:10 PM

Guru, they better get those samples before Gerry has the kids get a "buzz" cut!

Taximom · #12 09-13-2007, 04:12 PM

Thanks for all the "extra" info. I forgot about the syringes. I also hold the parents responsible!

Ca-Sun · #13 09-13-2007, 04:13 PM

Maybe the children were sedated to be sure they wouldn't wake up while the parents were out to dinner, having a great time with their friends.

SleuthMom · #14 09-13-2007, 04:14 PM

The report speaks of a LARGE dose of pills, unless team Mc Cann is more stupid than we think, I don't think they would give the child a large dose just to keep her quiet...not to that "large" amount. The large dose seems to be that could be the girl taking it on her own or someone deliberately killing her.

Pinkhammer · #15 09-13-2007, 04:16 PM

Do you think it would be much easier to give an accidental overdose by syringe than by pills? I know kiddos have a hard time swallowing pills and are often reluctant to do so.

Guruinu2 · #16 09-13-2007, 04:20 PM

Unless they were sugar coated gummy bear sleeping pills I have yet to hear about, I doubt that a three or 4 year old child would be interested in consuming "Large amounts of them".

NK57 · #17 09-13-2007, 04:20 PM

I would not be surprised if they were adult pill that had been mortered in to powder and given with oral syringe.

Nancy

Pinkhammer · #18 09-13-2007, 04:20 PM

Also...a deliberate killing? That is chilling. Can a mother hate an innocent child so much as to plan and premeditate her murder? Why was the nanny left behind in England? Why did Kate not bring her mom, Mrs. Healy along, to watch the kids, as Fiona (last name?) did??? Why did the McCanns not take advantage of all the various child care options afforded by the resort?

Was it all preplanned this way, so that Kate could get rid of her "hysterical" child in a foreign country, far from the scrutiny of the excellent British police agencies?

BrendaStar · #19 09-13-2007, 04:21 PM

Sounds like they sedated the kids so they would sleep soundly while mom and pops were out to dinner and boozing it up with the wine. Perhaps Maddie woke up and took some more of the candy?

Everyone knows that young kids get up during the night. They are thirsty or have to go to the washroom or miss their parents. It's not so much of a stretch that they would give them something so that they would sleep soundly and not wake up while they were with their friends. Afterall, they are doctors.

If this is actually true, it reeks of child abuse.:doh:

Guruinu2 · #20 09-13-2007, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkhammer

Also...a deliberate killing? That is chilling. Can a mother hate an innocent child so much as to plan and premeditate her murder? Why was the nanny left behind in England? Why did Kate not bring her mom, Mrs. Healy along, to watch the kids, as Fiona (last name?) did??? Why did the McCanns not take advantage of all the various child care options afforded by the resort?

Was it all preplanned this way, so that Kate could get rid of her "hysterical" child in a foreign country, far from the scrutiny of the excellent British police agencies?

Sounds to me like they might be cheap, hiding something or both. I wonder what expenses they would have incurred with the various baby sitting options available to them?

Brefie · #21 09-13-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinkhammer

Also...a deliberate killing? That is chilling. Can a mother hate an innocent child so much as to plan and premeditate her murder? Why was the nanny left behind in England? Why did Kate not bring her mom, Mrs. Healy along, to watch the kids, as Fiona (last name?) did??? Why did the McCanns not take advantage of all the various child care options afforded by the resort?

Was it all preplanned this way, so that Kate could get rid of her "hysterical" child in a foreign country, far from the scrutiny of the excellent British police agencies?

Has it been established that they have a nanny?

SleuthMom · #22 09-13-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Do you think it would be much easier to give an accidental overdose by syringe than by pills? I know kiddos have a hard time swallowing pills and are often reluctant to do so.

Oh yes, is much easier by syringe than by pills. Madeleine was only three years old and quite an active child, MOST kids IF they may get into an accident wont' swallow a LAGE amount of pills...they do not taste nothing like candy! The report speaks of a LARGE amount.

Quote:

Can a mother hate an innocent child so much as to plan and premeditate her murder?

Unfortunately, CAN happen. Even more if she is a woman who wants to live a certain lifestyle and she is having three kids (3 and under) and is unable to control them. Does anyone know if Kate suffered of post-partum depression?

Morag · #23 09-13-2007, 04:26 PM

There have been varying translations (from English to Portuguese back to English) of what Mrs. Fenn heard Madeleine saying on the night of May 1. Originally, it was Daddy, Daddy, I'm hungry, I'm hungry. Then Daddy, Daddy, I eat, I eat. The most recent version was Daddy, Daddy, I swallow, I swallow. Did she swallow pills?

NK57 · #24 09-13-2007, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morag

There have been varying translations (from English to Portuguese back to English) of what Mrs. Fenn heard Madeleine saying on the night of May 1. Originally, it was Daddy, Daddy, I'm hungry, I'm hungry. Then Daddy, Daddy, I eat, I eat. The most recent version was Daddy, Daddy, I swallow, I swallow. Did she swallow pills?

Wow thats scary. I wonder what Daddy did when she didn't "take her medicine like a good girl".

Morag · #25 09-13-2007, 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthMom

...Even more if she is a woman who wants to live a certain lifestyle and she is having three kids (3 and under) and is unable to control them. Does anyone know if Kate suffered of post-partum depression?

Here's a quote from the media thread:

''...it was Kate who usually took care of the children, putting them to bed regularly, while Gerry played tennis or rested by the pool. The deposition of the senior British citizen (Pamela Fenn), who occupied an apartment on the floor above the one that was used by the McCanns, also indicates that Kate sometimes became violent. She lost control, and it was easy to hear the girl’s screams, calling out for her father. Another witness, also a British citizen, refers the same scenario. Kate seemed to have moments of aggression towards her children, while the father, although more absent, revealed more emotional control.''

Apparently this scenario of depression and agression is spelled out in Kate's journal/diary. Now I wonder who the other British citizen is? Is it one of the Tapas group, perhaps Dianne Webster?