WA - Unidentified Male: "Lyle Stevik", Grays Harbor, 17 Sept 2001 - #3 - Page 2

docwho3 · #26 09-22-2007, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SeriouslySearching

You did a great job, DocWho! However, there are problems with the notes which you and CCL brought to my attention. Thanks! I got all of my information from your saving them.

Altho...what if it wasn't his belt? What if he WAS waiting on someone and he finally showed up? Maybe he wasn't suicidal at all! Maybe the guy targeted this man? Our Lyle did not write all of the notes...and until they can prove it otherwise, I have to believe someone had to be in the room with him directly before his death. It would explain why the room was swept clean of his identity. Anything that our Lyle had on his person could have been taken by another.

I have no problem with various theories of how he died but coldcase man wants to ID the man, whether he is a murder victim or a suicide. Once the ID is known other things should fall into place.

I will make this comment. I trust coldcaseman's conclusions about the case. The actual images of the scene and the dead person (not the retouched ones) all came from cold case man so they could be placed by me online where we might all see them to help in our WS investigation. Those not shown were deemed a bit too graphic and he did not wish to upset those viewing the images. I have not heard from cold case man in some time now but the case has not moved any on our end so I can understand that. Having said that, I still think that theorizing is good as long as, in the end, the man is ID'd.

I have been working on ID'ing the belt and buckle to see where it was sold. So far I have not had success.

Edited to add: You may note that on some pages you can see what looks like writing imprints showing on or through the paper. I was told that in some cases this is from the page being stored in a file over years next to other pages which resulted in ink transfer. In some cases the cause is not known. It could be evidence that Lyle wrote something else on a page that was on top of the paper we see in the picture. I just do not know.

In at least one instance there are fingerprints showing through from the back side of the page in the picture because it was stored against a page of prints copies, if I correctly remember what I was told about it.

LisainWV · #27 09-22-2007, 08:49 AM

The notes....

Usually, when I am asked to fill out personal info like Lyle had to do at check-in, I'm in a hurry and I don't care if they can read it or not - I just quickly fill in the blanks. And, it's usually messy, I link letters that I normally wouldn't. Plus, he's leaving them a wrong address - I think he perhaps just changed his handwriting as part of his "cover."

For the Room - he's sitting in his room debating what he is going to do, decides he should leave money for the room, calmly writes the note. I think this note is probably true to his handwriting.

Suicide seems to be larger and bolder - just like the thought. I think he wrote this when he made his decision as a reinforcement to his brain.

Just my thoughts.

outofthedark · #28 09-22-2007, 01:15 PM

This link contains two PMs of "Lyle" (www.find-missing-children.org/Posters/poster229.htm) one of the photos is similar to the front facial shot but taken on a different angle and the other is a different profile shot

SeriouslySearching · #29 09-22-2007, 01:35 PM

I don't know if I mentioned it, but in the articles I put in above...there was a story about how they have a group of dental students etc. which travel to villages in Alaska to take care of people where they live. Is it possible they could have information to lead us to Lyle's identity and have not been contacted? I think it would be worth a shot for LE to contact them.

Lisa~ I don't think it matters when it comes to certain aspects of our handwriting. There are characteristics which are present no matter how fast or slow we write. It depends on our brains.

coldcaseman · #30 09-22-2007, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LisainWV

The notes....

Usually, when I am asked to fill out personal info like Lyle had to do at check-in, I'm in a hurry and I don't care if they can read it or not - I just quickly fill in the blanks. And, it's usually messy, I link letters that I normally wouldn't. Plus, he's leaving them a wrong address - I think he perhaps just changed his handwriting as part of his "cover."

For the Room - he's sitting in his room debating what he is going to do, decides he should leave money for the room, calmly writes the note. I think this note is probably true to his handwriting.

Suicide seems to be larger and bolder - just like the thought. I think he wrote this when he made his decision as a reinforcement to his brain.

Just my thoughts.

You are correct. He filled out the registration and the "for the room" note with his usual handwriting. I believe he wrote out "suicide" in formal block letters to see how it looked. It is like people who shoot themselves will fire two shots, one into the air, and one into themselves. They are getting their courage up, seeing how loud the shot will be, make sure everything is working, etc. You are going to kill yourself, so you write out what you are going to do, to see the word in print. Either that, or I had wondered if he had written a letter to family or friends informing them that he wouldn't be coming home, and he wanted to make sure he spelled suicide correctly. I don't support that theory as much now, as he would have written it in his usual handwriting. Plus, there was no indication that he had envelopes, stamps, and such. The finality of seeing the word in print makes more sense.

outofthedark · #31 09-22-2007, 06:04 PM

Welcome back CCM!!!

SeriouslySearching · #32 09-22-2007, 06:13 PM

Hi and Welcome, ColdCaseMan! You are just the person to answer some of the nagging questions I have! Nice to meet you.

LisainWV · #33 09-22-2007, 09:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthedark

Welcome back CCM!!!

DITTO!!!

coldcaseman · #34 09-23-2007, 01:40 AM

Thanks all. I hadn't checked the site for awhile. I'll pop in more frequently to answer your questions if I can. I appreciate all your efforts.

docwho3 · #35 09-23-2007, 07:34 AM

Forgive my asking if we have already covered this in the past:

Anyone notice anything about the buckle especially anything that could either be a scratch, a thread or an engraved L?

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...le/buckle3.jpg

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...le/buckle2.jpg

Problem is I don't have another pic that shows the mark. Later images have the tine (can't remember the exact name for it at moment) covering that part of the buckle.

Before now I always assumed that if it was anything significant it would already have been looked into and that is probably still true. But if all else fails I sometimes resort to questioning the obvious.

Al_B · #36 09-23-2007, 08:10 AM

I am not certain how it would hae gotten there but here is where it sits metal to metal.http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...e/blttip2b.jpg

docwho3 · #37 09-23-2007, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Al_B

I am not certain how it would hae gotten there but here is where it sits metal to metal.http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...e/blttip2b.jpg

True but I can't be sure if the mark is caused by that metal on metal contact or if the mark was already there and was just hidden by by the tine.

Anyone finding similar marking on their own belt buckles?

rmf · #38 09-23-2007, 02:49 PM

Welcome back, coldcaseman. I'm glad you're here.

Just a couple things:

Update on fliers: thanks to everyone who sent stamps. The fliers were sent to Idaho, Montana, Alberta, British Columbia and Alaska tribes. CCM and I chatted via PM last night and he encourages the fliers. He says that anything we can do will help

. Thanks again to those who pitched in.

About the "suicide" word written on the peice of paper: I believe Lyle left that as a sign for whoever found him, but realized that was absurd because whoever found him would realize it was a suicide without it being pointed out. So at that point I think he crumpled up the peice of paper and threw it away. I think he made the letters larger to catch the reader's attention which is why it looks different than the motel registration form.

I am glad the belt is being researched, I think it is worth trying to track down the origins.

grievousangel · #39 09-23-2007, 04:04 PM

Were his fingerprints distributed in Canada as well as throughout the U.S.?

outofthedark · #40 09-23-2007, 06:22 PM

Quote:

British Columbia

I live in BC, so which areas are you doing?

rmf · #41 09-23-2007, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthedark

I live in BC, so which areas are you doing?

Fliers have been mailed to all the recognized native tribes in British Columbia, which number about 100.

rmf · #42 09-23-2007, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grievousangel

Were his fingerprints distributed in Canada as well as throughout the U.S.?

Yes, according to ccm the fingerprints were run through the FBI and RCMP with negative results.

shellbee · #43 09-23-2007, 07:02 PM

Does anyone know how Canadians are taught to write the numbers one and seven? Is it similar to Europe where the sevens are crossed and the ones have a little flag?

Also, regarding the run together writing, maybe Lyle was left-handed.
My eldest son and one of my brothers is left-handed and both tend toward that lazy style due to the way they hold their wrist.

outofthedark · #44 09-23-2007, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Does anyone know how Canadians are taught to write the numbers one and seven? Is it similar to Europe where the sevens are crossed and the ones have a little flag?

That's how I write my ones and sevens

coldcaseman · #45 09-23-2007, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grievousangel

Were his fingerprints distributed in Canada as well as throughout the U.S.?

Yes, they were run through the FBI, RCMP, and AFIS (Automated Fingerprint Identification System). I ran them through AFIS on the chance that, even if Lyle had never been arrested or had his fingerprints on file, he might have committed a crime where fingerprints were located, but it was an unsolved crime. His fingerprints weren't in any of the systems.

Spazkat9696 · #46 09-23-2007, 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outofthedark

That's how I write my ones and sevens

That's how I write mine as well.

Meyahna · #47 09-26-2007, 03:09 PM

I wonder if he couldn't be Arab, maybe he was already depressed and after the attacks he got fed up of life even more because probably at that time Arabs were looked at as unwanted. Like Lyle Stevick who was accused of being communist maybe he felt he was looked at like a terrorist.

outofthedark · #48 09-26-2007, 03:38 PM

I had a dream about Lyle where he was identified and his first name started with an L

Does anyone have the feeling that Lyle might have been adopted?

Teresa Larson · #49 09-26-2007, 11:38 PM

[size=3]What would make you think he was adopted? He is definitely NOT Arabic. I am pretty sure DNA testing would rule that out. I believe he is a Native American. IMO

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rmf · #50 09-26-2007, 11:56 PM

I totally agree Teresa, I think he's Native American or Native Canadian - or a mix of a native tribe with something else.

And if he were adopted, then we can carry that hypothesis further in that his parents must have REALLY wanted a child badly. Most people who adopt do. So one would THINK they'd be looking for him. I think the Native theory makes sense because many reservations are remote and it is not unusual for people to take off and not come back.
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