Maricopa Jane Doe 1999 Thread #2 - Page 14

VASHLEY88 · #**326** 05-01-2008, 08:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

I thought this might be the case. My feeling was that because they were instructing us to call and ask for a request form, the report most likely was not a matter of public record. How can we get around the fact that we're not interested in the COD or how it happened, but just the potentially identifying factors? Any ideas? Suzi knows what we're doing here....

Suzi must be thinking, "how the hell is knowing the toxicology information and the weight of her lungs going to help these people identify her?!"

I guess making an inquiry to the ME office and stating just that.. that we don't want any information on her initial examination for death-related purposes.. but want additional information pertaining to features she may have had prior to death.

Did she have any scars?

Did she have any birthmarks?

What, exactly in detail did her tattoo look like? How big was it?

Was her hair naturally straight/curly/wavy?

What did her teeth look like? Were they gapped, crooked, straight?

Besides the location where she was first picked up, what on her body makes them believe she may have been a prostitute or living on the streets?

Those are all questions I want to know, and I think are important in identifying her, and I believe they have that information somewhere!

Fairy1 · #**327** 05-01-2008, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

Suzi must be thinking, "how the hell is knowing the toxicology information and the weight of her lungs going to help these people identify her?!"

I guess making an inquiry to the ME office and stating just that.. that we don't want any information on her initial examination for death-related purposes.. but want additional information pertaining to features she may have had prior to death.

Did she have any scars?

Did she have any birthmarks?

What, exactly in detail did her tattoo look like? How big was it?

Was her hair naturally straight/curly/wavy?

What did her teeth look like? Were they gapped, crooked, straight?

Besides the location where she was first picked up, what on her body makes them believe she may have been a prostitute or living on the streets?

Those are all questions I want to know, and I think are important in identifying her, and I believe they have that information somewhere!

Suzi has already implied that we know everything there is to know from the ME report. That's why this "new" information about the ring is so disturbing to me. If there actually was a ring, then we don't really know everything there is to know. And....it makes me wonder what else has been overlooked or omitted. AND, it has also been implied that Alonzo and Lindsay have nothing more to add and have obviously never been charged. If this case is still under investigation - other than determining her identity - WHY???

believe09 · #**328** 05-01-2008, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

Suzi has already implied that we know everything there is to know from the ME report. That's why this "new" information about the ring is so disturbing to me. If there actually was a ring, then we don't really know everything there is to know. And....it makes me wonder what else has been overlooked or omitted. AND, it has also been implied that Alonzo and Lindsay have nothing more to add and have obviously never been charged. If this case is still under investigation - other than determining her identity - WHY???

Plus, if the A and L said she was getting high, then she should have tested for it when they got her to the ER-they would have looked for other drugs as well so they knew how to treat her...

VASHLEY88 · #**329** 05-01-2008, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

Suzi has already implied that we know everything there is to know from the ME report. That's why this "new" information about the ring is so disturbing to me. If there actually was a ring, then we don't really know everything there is to know. And....it makes me wonder what else has been overlooked or omitted. AND, it has also been implied that Alonzo and Lindsay have nothing more to add and have obviously never been charged. If this case is still under investigation - other than determining her identity - WHY???

This case just doesn't seem like it was combed over too well. I am only implying that her case may still be being investigated because I have read various times they were "not satisfied" with AF and LD's stories/answers and they have recently been involved in a follow up of the case.

What else is there to follow up on?

VASHLEY88 · #**330** 05-01-2008, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by believe09

Plus, if the A and L said she was getting high, then she should have tested for it when they got her to the ER-they would have looked for other drugs as well so they knew how to treat her...

Yes, if she tested positive for THC then AF and LD were probably telling the truth about that, but it was never mentioned if she did have that or any other drug in her system. I don't think it's relevant to identifying her, though. I mean, it could be if she was a regular pot smoker or something and she was known for it.

It's just that if the ring was mentioned then, and the ME office claims that all of the information they can possibly give to identify her is posted on the site, I'm not quite sure I believe that if other possessions are just coming up because people have paid for newspaper articles. If no one had done that, the ring still wouldn't exist to us.

I wonder if they searched Alonzo's car for anything that may have been hers..

Fairy1 · #**331** 05-01-2008, 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

Yes, if she tested positive for THC then AF and LD were probably telling the truth about that, but it was never mentioned if she did have that or any other drug in her system. I don't think it's relevant to identifying her, though. I mean, it could be if she was a regular pot smoker or something and she was known for it.

It's just that if the ring was mentioned then, and the ME office claims that all of the information they can possibly give to identify her is posted on the site, I'm not quite sure I believe that if other possessions are just coming up because people have paid for newspaper articles. If no one had done that, the ring still wouldn't exist to us.

I wonder if they searched Alonzo's car for anything that may have been hers..

That's what I mean - whatever drugs may have been in her system are really not relevant to determining her identity. If she had anything with her in that car, my guess is they threw it somewhere in the desert! Do we know if anything's ever been found? LE may not be totally happy with the answers they got from A & L, but it's been 9 1/2 years and no charges have ever been filed. AND, Suzi Dodt claims they have been questioned again recently and nothing new was uncovered. I'm beginning to lose hope....

VASHLEY88 · #**332** 05-01-2008, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

That's what I mean - whatever drugs may have been in her system are really not relevant to determining her identity. If she had anything with her in that car, my guess is they threw it somewhere in the desert! Do we know if anything's ever been found? LE may not be totally happy with the answers they got from A & L, but it's been 9 1/2 years and no charges have ever been filed. AND, Suzi Dodt claims they have been questioned again recently and nothing new was uncovered. I'm beginning to lose hope....

We're pretty much stuck right now. If we have all of the information needed to determine her identity, I don't know what else to do. LE is obviously as baffled about this case as the rest of us. And sadly, some cases do go unsolved. I guess sometimes they just weren't meant to be solved. Although I want an outcome to this case, a name, and closure for her.. it seems pretty impossible at this point. The two people in the car are sticking to their story, and MJD is not alive to tell what really happened.

Maybe she did jump out. Maybe she just didn't want to live anymore. And in 10 years, having no one step forward to give her an identity..I can kind of see why..

Fairy1 · #**333** 05-01-2008, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

We're pretty much stuck right now. If we have all of the information needed to determine her identity, I don't know what else to do. LE is obviously as baffled about this case as the rest of us. And sadly, some cases do go unsolved. I guess sometimes they just weren't meant to be solved. Although I want an outcome to this case, a name, and closure for her.. it seems pretty impossible at this point. The two people in the car are sticking to their story, and MJD is not alive to tell what really happened.

Maybe she did jump out. Maybe she just didn't want to live anymore. And in 10 years, having no one step forward to give her an identity..I can kind of see why..

Oh that makes me want to cry! But it's true. Hard as it is to believe, there really doesn't seem to be anyone looking for her. And with that in mind, we can't overlook the fact that any family she may have had allowed her to go out into a hard world at a very young age to fend for herself. If they didn't care then, it stands to reason they don't care now. Poor little baby. And there are so, so many more just like her out there - and plenty of scumbags waiting for them...

Fairy1 · #**334** 05-01-2008, 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auburnmommyof2

I found this article and am glad to see someone is helping these girls. Has anyone contacted the founder about MJD? She might be able to help.

http://www.phoenixmag.com/lifestyle/...-prostitution/

This is AWESOME!!! Great find Auburnmommy. Every major city in the US should build their own center based on this model. FGS - it sure seems that underage prostitution is an epidemic - and not just in Phoenix! Frightening to think how many sick, freaky bast**ds are patronizing this trade.

And I definitely think we should contact the founder and see if she has any ideas about what direction we should take. Sounds like this center is only for adults, so maybe some of the residents were around when MJD was "working" - if she really was???

VASHLEY88 · #**335** 05-02-2008, 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

This is AWESOME!!! Great find Auburnmommy. Every major city in the US should build their own center based on this model. FGS - it sure seems that underage prostitution is an epidemic - and not just in Phoenix! Frightening to think how many sick, freaky bast**ds are patronizing this trade.

And I definitely think we should contact the founder and see if she has any ideas about what direction we should take. Sounds like this center is only for adults, so maybe some of the residents were around when MJD was "working" - if she really was???

I agree! And, even if she was working as a prostitute, there is no reason to demean her just because that's what she did to survive. If she had no family to care for her, that's probably all she thought she had. And it's so sad to think about.

There are many sick, perverted and downright disgusting individuals out there who prey on helpless, innocent children. Promising them jewelry, marriage and a better life, but just using them and taking away any profit they make, and making them believe they can never better themselves. It sickens me to read how much they brainwash, abuse and belittle them, and treat them as "property". AND the johns who hire them for their own selfish pleasure disgust me. I've been reading up on this, too. Because, MJD really does sort of fit the profile, from what we know, anyway. I mean we could be totally wrong, but I guess it's best to rule the worst case scenario out first, right?

VASHLEY88 · #**336** 05-02-2008, 12:28 AM

What ever came of that theory that she may have been trafficked from Russia? Did they do a DNA comparison between MJD and that young girl?

Fairy1 · #**337** 05-02-2008, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

I agree! And, even if she was working as a prostitute, there is no reason to demean her just because that's what she did to survive. If she had no family to care for her, that's probably all she thought she had. And it's so sad to think about.

There are many sick, perverted and downright disgusting individuals out there who prey on helpless, innocent children. Promising them jewelry, marriage and a better life, but just using them and taking away any profit they make, and making them believe they can never better themselves. It sickens me to read how much they brainwash, abuse and belittle them, and treat them as "property". AND the johns who hire them for their own selfish pleasure disgust me. I've been reading up on this, too. Because, MJD really does sort of fit the profile, from what we know, anyway. I mean we could be totally wrong, but I guess it's best to rule the worst case scenario out first, right?

You're right. But even if she was a prostitute, it's not relevant to what we're trying to accomplish. If she was, the best we can hope for is that someone from that world remembers her, knows her name, where she came from and maybe some of her story. That's why I believe going to the founder of Natalie House (is that right?) might be our best bet right now. What do you think? It doesn't sound like we can rely on A or L for any valuable information.

VASHLEY88 · #**338** 05-02-2008, 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

You're right. But even if she was a prostitute, it's not relevant to what we're trying to accomplish. If she was, the best we can hope for is that someone from that world remembers her, knows her name, where she came from and maybe some of her story. That's why I believe going to the founder of Natalie House (is that right?) might be our best bet right now. What do you think? It doesn't sound like we can rely on A or L for any valuable information.

You're right. I think that sounds like a very good idea, perhaps all of us should compile something together about our MJD, and send it to Natalie's House, and ask some of the women who may have been working around that time if they recognize her?

VASHLEY88 · #**339** 05-02-2008, 12:39 AM

http://www.protectchild.org/newsite/

That's the site to contact the foundation.

Fairy1 · #**340** 05-02-2008, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

http://www.protectchild.org/newsite/

That's the site to contact the foundation.

I'm on it going to send them an e-mail right now!

VASHLEY88 · #**341** 05-02-2008, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

I'm on it going to send them an e-mail right now!

Great! I hope we get a reply soon!

Auburnmommyof2 · #**342** 05-02-2008, 12:54 AM

I'm so glad I found the information about Natalie House today. Thank you for emailing them. I've had a busy evening and am just now checking the recent posts. If MJD was brought here from another country, how would someone go about doing that? Are these people smuggled into our country? If so then there wouldn't be any kind of record right?

Fairy1 · #**343** 05-02-2008, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auburnmommyof2

I'm so glad I found the information about Natalie House today. Thank you for emailing them. I've had a busy evening and am just now checking the recent posts. If MJD was brought here from another country, how would someone go about doing that? Are these people smuggled into our country? If so then there wouldn't be any kind of record right?

The Doe Network has listings from other countries. I have checked them all and - with the exception of Elena Soldatova - have not found any possible matches. Suzi Dodt has advised that Elena was too old to have been MJD.

We have discussed the possibility that she was kidnapped or tricked into a prostitution ring. Depending on where she came from and the circumstances of her life, her family (if she has one!) may not have any reason to believe she was in danger. Or may not have the resources necessary to search for her.

I have noticed that many of the missing persons postings from outside the US are pretty sketchy. Some don't even have eye color or other basic (and important!) characteristics.

Fairy1 · #**344** 05-02-2008, 01:17 AM

I'm going to have to call it a night. I did send a message to Natalie's House explaining what we're doing and asking if they and/or their residents would consider taking a look at MJD and her case. I'll let you all know if I hear anything as soon as I can!

VASHLEY88 · #**345** 05-02-2008, 01:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fairy1

The Doe Network has listings from other countries. I have checked them all and - with the exception of Elena Soldatova - have not found any possible matches. Suzi Dodt has advised that Elena was too old to have been MJD.

We have discussed the possibility that she was kidnapped or tricked into a prostitution ring. Depending on where she came from and the circumstances of her life, her family (if she has one!) may not have any reason to believe she was in danger. Or may not have the resources necessary to search for her.

I have noticed that many of the missing persons postings from outside the US are pretty sketchy. Some don't even have eye color or other basic (and important!) characteristics.

I noticed that too. Well, goodnight! (I read your last post) And thank you for contacting Natalie's House! I hope we get feedback soon!

VASHLEY88 · #**346** 05-02-2008, 01:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Auburnmommyof2

I'm so glad I found the information about Natalie House today. Thank you for emailing them. I've had a busy evening and am just now checking the recent posts. If MJD was brought here from another country, how would someone go about doing that? Are these people smuggled into our country? If so then there wouldn't be any kind of record right?

Yes, they are smuggled. False passports and ID's can probably be made for them if they fly. And I'm sure flying into Mexico and walking right over the border is pretty easy as some of the border is wide open. And if the US finds someone in our country who is not a legal citizen, they are deported.

No, if she is from another country, it's likely there is no record of her in the US.

Auburnmommyof2 · #**347** 05-02-2008, 01:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VASHLEY88

Yes, they are smuggled. False passports and ID's can probably be made for them if they fly. And I'm sure flying into Mexico and walking right over the border is pretty easy as some of the border is wide open. And if the US finds someone in our country who is not a legal citizen, they are deported.

No, if she is from another country, it's likely there is no record of her in the US.

Thank you, that is so frustrating! I just want to know if she had an accent. That would help alot. Sounds like the two in the car are sticking to their story though.

phenolred · #**348** 05-02-2008, 08:06 AM

I wonder if she had anything in her pockets receipts money, Or maybe condoms or something that made them think she was a prostitute.

believe09 · #**349** 05-02-2008, 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phenolred

I wonder if she had anything in her pockets receipts money, Or maybe condoms or something that made them think she was a prostitute.

Certainly possible...and I have to respectfully state that anything is relevant to determining her ID. If she had drugs in her system, she had to get them from somewhere. If she was under 18, she had to pay for the things she had somehow since there is no obvious family associated with her or an employer who recognized her...or at least someone who wanted to run to the coroners office and ID her when the story was fresh.

Hard to believe that she is not at the very least a runaway who was living a high risk lifestyle. The area she was allegedly picked up was dangerous...so it is hard to believe that she was there totally alone with no one else for protection. not that she wasn't, I am just saying.

It may very well be her age that is keeping people who might have recognized her quiet....or as someone else suggested, if she was an abduction/non custodial parent, it would be tough to report her missing.

absinthe · #**350** 05-02-2008, 11:44 AM

Hi everyone. Lots of good discussion yesterday!

I was thinking that maybe someone should ask Suzi Dodt if we should suspend our efforts for the time being. It seems like LE is making progress on the case, what with the recent updates to MJD's ME page, etc. Perhaps LE does have info that they just can't share, because they are building a case, or don't want a crime syndicate to know just how much info they have? I'm feeling very in the dark on this one. I spend a lot of time thinking about this case, and I'd like to use my efforts elsewhere if they aren't helping on this case.