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FLDS Raids and Related Items Discussion about the raids on the polygamist sect's Texas compound and the issues arising from and surrounding their beliefs and practices


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  #126  
Old 04-10-2008, 04:53 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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Yeah, Leila I agree with you, I think that the photographer misidentified the kids as belonging to FLDS.
  #127  
Old 04-10-2008, 05:08 PM
trixie trixie is offline
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Originally Posted by Leila View Post
I read the article at the link. Interesting to note that two of the mothers are Mrs. Barlow and Mrs. Johnson. Barlow, of course, is one of the names that is most common among the FLDS. Johnson was the name of "the prophet" in charge of the FLDS prior to Rulon Jeffs, who was followed by his son, Warren Jeffs. The surname of the third mother, Monica, wasn't given.

What I'm wondering is where these three women were, since they aren't allowed outside the compound? Were they at one of the factories within the compound or were they in Colorado City or Hilsdale?


They were probably at the welfare office. I'm sure they were allowed to go THERE.
  #128  
Old 04-10-2008, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by trixie View Post
[/b]

They were probably at the welfare office. I'm sure they were allowed to go THERE.
Here's an interesting chart on the history of some of the fundamentalist groups that splintered from the LDS. If you click on any of the groups, it will take you to more info about them. Scroll down for the chart, although there is lots of other interesting info too

http://www.mormonfundamentalism.com/
  #129  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:07 PM
Mygirlsadie Mygirlsadie is offline
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Is this America? 2008? What I am seeing,hearing,reading...I think it's little house on the prarie gone bad. No?
  #130  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:11 PM
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I just heard that LE has a MOLE in the FLDS for the past 4 years, and this MOLE has steadily been feeding LE information! Wow!!
  #131  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:18 PM
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http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=4625830&page=1

abcnews reports that LE saved the temple as the last place to search, and that the FDLS 'lined up about 57 people around the walls of the temple'.

I wonder if 57 was the total number of FLDS men?
  #132  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:22 PM
Mygirlsadie Mygirlsadie is offline
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Wow 4 years? That is a long time to mole around and let these girls be raped and impregnated by old men and beat etc etc..I guess they needed alot of evidence to really really make this whole thing worth it though. I hope they get the book thrown at them! I wonder if there ever was a ''Sarah'' who made a phone call?



Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
I just heard that LE has a MOLE in the FLDS for the past 4 years, and this MOLE has steadily been feeding LE information! Wow!!
  #133  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:26 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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Thank you Golfmom for sorting out the photo mess.
  #134  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:31 PM
Truly Truly is offline
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Originally Posted by Mygirlsadie View Post
Wow 4 years? That is a long time to mole around and let these girls be raped and impregnated by old men and beat etc etc..I guess they needed alot of evidence to really really make this whole thing worth it though. I hope they get the book thrown at them! I wonder if there ever was a ''Sarah'' who made a phone call?
LE cannot act until a crime has been committed. A few years ago, there was a 'rape list' circulating in a local public high school. The police were notified, but they could not do anything until a crime was committed and a victim came forward. I hope the leaders of this cult get the book thrown at them, too! And like so many have already said, let's hope that LE have all their ducks lined up neatly in a row.
  #135  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:31 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truly View Post
http://abcnews.go.com/GMA/story?id=4625830&page=1

abcnews reports that LE saved the temple as the last place to search, and that the FDLS 'lined up about 57 people around the walls of the temple'.

I wonder if 57 was the total number of FLDS men?
You would think that they'd have every available man standing there.
  #136  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:42 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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OK, this is a bunch of in depth articles written by the Phoenix New Times. They are extremely proud of everything they've uncovered. Unfortunately, no one bothered to actually do anything about what the paper reported on. Lots of reading and information on FLDS at this link.

New Times staff writer John Dougherty spent months examining the secretive, isolated polygamist Mormon communites that straddle the Arizona-Utah border north of the Grand Canyon. He found a culture of sexual abuse and psychological torment as well as the unlawful expenditure of millions of dollars in public money. And it's all been going on with little attempt by the state to help the residents or put an end to the fraud.

http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/php/s...port_id=212740
  #137  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:44 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=3054653

(snip)

Utah's attorney general says he wasn't surprised by the beds in the temple that may have been used for sex with underage brides. But he tells KSL's "Doug Wright Show" it raises fear of what else may be, like blood atonement.
"Blood atonement meant if you apostatize, the only way you're gonna be redeemed is slit your throat from ear to ear. Now, they told them, ‘It's not been brought back yet, but it could be any minute.' People lived under that fear," Attorney General Mark Shurtleff explained. Shurtleff acknowledges people have disappeared before. He hopes the 16-year-old informant surfaces.
  #138  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:45 PM
Truly Truly is offline
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You would think that they'd have every available man standing there.
lol! I suppose Warren Jeffs was in jail, and they had two more men in custody, but the math sure does add up to a lot more females than males, huh?

Blood atonement? That is creepy.
  #139  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:49 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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Interesting article. What needs to be noted is that there are only a few of these programs and they can only offer help to basically one family at a time.

http://www.ksl.com/?nid=148&sid=3054225

When leaving polygamy, where can women and children go?
  #140  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:55 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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Ervil LeBaron's polygamist group practiced blood atonement.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...on_cult/6.html

Ervil LeBaron case at Crime Library.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...ult/index.html

I can't get a quote to print from Crime Library. But at least go to the above link and read the first two paragraphs. Lebaron put a hit on his own 17 year old pregnant daughter Becky.
  #141  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:55 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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I wonder if the other known locations are investigating?

http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2007-...tion-complex/5

Jeffs began moving many FLDS members out of Hildale and Colorado City several years ago to more secure compounds in South Dakota, Texas, Colorado, Canada, Mexico, and other unknown locations.

Former FLDS members believe a massive temple under construction on a sprawling ranch near El Dorado, Texas, is the new FLDS headquarters.

Benjamin Bistline, the FLDS historian who still lives near Colorado City, says these remote areas outside Arizona and Utah are the most likely places for underage marriages to occur in the future.

"They have total control at the compounds," Bistline says. "People can't get out, and no one can get in."

There's no doubt in Bistline's mind that the FLDS will not only continue polygamy but will continue the practice of adult males marrying young girls.
  #142  
Old 04-10-2008, 07:57 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2006-...-they-preach/2

The former bishop, who asked that I not use his name because he feared reprisals from family members, is in his late 50s. He says many mainstream LDS church members his age and older privately support fundamentalist Mormon polygamists.

"One reason the polygamists were able to continue is because [mainstream] Mormons have sympathy for them and understand their reasons and knew that regular Mormons were going to come back and practice it someday," he said. "These people are considered heroes for continuing to practice polygamy."

ETA: The two religious groups are deeply intertwined. Their beliefs are based on the same scripture. They have the same founders. The key difference is that the FLDS practices what the LDS preaches.

Last edited by golfmom; 04-10-2008 at 07:59 PM. Reason: additional quote
  #143  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:02 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2006-...-polygamists/2

More possible locations:

Warren Jeffs has been moving key followers to other FLDS properties scattered across the West. In the past three years, Jeffs followers have purchased land and are erecting new compounds in Eldorado, Texas; Mancos, Colorado; and, in the most recently discovered outpost, Pringle, South Dakota. The sect also has control of a large farm near Pioche, Nevada, and holdings in Bountiful, British Columbia.
  #144  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:03 PM
trixie trixie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfmom View Post
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2006-...-they-preach/2

The former bishop, who asked that I not use his name because he feared reprisals from family members, is in his late 50s. He says many mainstream LDS church members his age and older privately support fundamentalist Mormon polygamists.

"One reason the polygamists were able to continue is because [mainstream] Mormons have sympathy for them and understand their reasons and knew that regular Mormons were going to come back and practice it someday," he said. "These people are considered heroes for continuing to practice polygamy."

ETA: The two religious groups are deeply intertwined. Their beliefs are based on the same scripture. They have the same founders. The key difference is that the FLDS practices what the LDS preaches.


AHA!!!! That is what I was saying in an ealier post that didn't go over too well. I'm so happy I've been vindicated. I said all along the Mormon church could have done something about this but they choose to look the other way. YES!
  #145  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:04 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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Another interesting story regarding blood atonement is The Mountain Meadows Massacre. Crime Library link below. Now that I've given you all your reading assignments for the evening, I expect a five page summary by class tomorrow. lol.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...ows/index.html
  #146  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:08 PM
SuziQ SuziQ is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfmom View Post
http://www.phoenixnewtimes.com/2006-...-they-preach/2

The former bishop, who asked that I not use his name because he feared reprisals from family members, is in his late 50s. He says many mainstream LDS church members his age and older privately support fundamentalist Mormon polygamists.

"One reason the polygamists were able to continue is because [mainstream] Mormons have sympathy for them and understand their reasons and knew that regular Mormons were going to come back and practice it someday," he said. "These people are considered heroes for continuing to practice polygamy."

ETA: The two religious groups are deeply intertwined. Their beliefs are based on the same scripture. They have the same founders. The key difference is that the FLDS practices what the LDS preaches.
Lmao, all the LDS women I know may have a few things to say about that! Omg, alot of men would get the crap beaten out of them. What that yahoo speaks is so NOT true!

If the LDS faith is so supportive of polygamy then why is he afraid of reprisals of his own damned family? Could it be because he's talking out of his *ass?
  #147  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:09 PM
golfmom golfmom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SuziQ View Post
Another interesting story regarding blood atonement is The Mountain Meadows Massacre. Crime Library link below. Now that I've given you all your reading assignments for the evening, I expect a five page summary by class tomorrow. lol.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notoriou...ows/index.html
This is absolutely a must read for anyone interested in the history of the Mormon religion.
  #148  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:13 PM
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txsvicki txsvicki is offline
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I hope the government is somehow able to take all of the property away in each of these states.
  #149  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:20 PM
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Leila Leila is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pepper View Post
I just heard that LE has a MOLE in the FLDS for the past 4 years, and this MOLE has steadily been feeding LE information! Wow!!
I think this is great! LE has mentioned an informant, and this may be the mole. I think it's likely that in addition to the mole, LE probably got info from those that left the sect in regards to what to look for and the usual practices and beliefs.
  #150  
Old 04-10-2008, 08:28 PM
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Thank you SuziQ and Golfmom for the crimelibrary links. That is an extrordinarily well-written site.

Mormon Mafia is right! I wonder how much they are actually involved in activities usually connected to 'regular' mafia? DeputyDawg posted a link earlier to http://www.texasmonthly.com/2004-11-01/reporter.php , which said that David Allred, who came to Eldorado to purchase the property, 'said he was a builder in Utah, and that he needed a place to take his clients, many of whom were based in Las Vegas, for hunting trips...some townspeople speculated this man's Las Vegas clients were members of the Mafia." Hmmm...
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