Nancy Cooper, 34, of Cary, N.C. #21

christine2448 · #1 08-17-2008, 02:07 PM

Please continue GENERAL discussions here. Look around Nancy has her own forum, there are several threads started on specific topics to try and stay organized.

Links to previous and similar threads can be found toward the bottom of the page.

Newbies.....

I am sad such a tragedy is bringing us all together.

I advise everyone to read the RULES of WS, Long and Short Version .

Bob&Bob · #2 08-17-2008, 02:16 PM

What was the time and day when you saw the crooked
license tag?

momto3kids · #3 08-17-2008, 02:17 PM

I agree RC...I absolutely do believe the 3rd SW was for LTF.
Card access, child care, computers, lockers....just too much @LTF to not check it out and see what ole Brad buddy was really doing there.

Skittles · #4 08-17-2008, 02:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raisincharlie

Wow - thats quite a security set up they have.

Seems to me you may have just made a case for the "undisclosed location"

RC:

Do you mean that if LE couldn't find Nancy's ID that would give them grounds for a warrant to search locked lockers at LTF?

momto3kids · #5 08-17-2008, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob&Bob

What was the time and day when you saw the crooked
license tag?

Around 6 to 7 pm....

SleuthyGal · #6 08-17-2008, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by momto3kids

I agree RC...I absolutely do believe the 3rd SW was for LTF.
Card access, child care, computers, lockers....just too much @LTF to not check it out and see what ole Brad buddy was really doing there.

Yes it does seem like this would be a logical 3rd place to search and they would need a warrant to do so. You have at least 2 factors:

1. Her LTF card is not in her possession
2. Her husband said he went to LTF

Smart to check things out there, esp. if there are a lot of "resources" he could use while there.

momto3kids · #7 08-17-2008, 02:24 PM

Skittles thank you so much for the wonderful insight to LTF. I have not joined, but my kids go quite a bit as a guest. It has really helped me to understand some things I had questions about. I do know that the employee's can't get by the desk without having their card swiped. I knew they were stringent with their rules.

This does show what a great organized fitness club this is.

I hope BC realizes this also and what he did at LTF will come back to haunt him IMO

DogWood · #8 08-17-2008, 02:26 PM

In looking for a picture of the BMW sedan, I ran across these again. Note picture #11. They were all over the SUV, inside and out. Looks like test kits everywhere.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/pho...y/1142714.html

With regard to the sedan...There is a picture of it in the driveway here http://www.bluelineradio.com/news714.html about half-way down the page. Not only does the plate look straight in that picture, it appears to be trunk lid not the bumper part of the car. He should have noticed that any time he opened the trunk. Hmmm.

momto3kids · #9 08-17-2008, 02:29 PM

Another thing BC could have done and it appears he didn't...call SH to go to Johnson Lake and check for NC. SH practically lives across the street from the parking lot.

Did he call SH? NO

BC didn't want help he wanted to cover his butt and was backed up against the wall by JA.
PRICELESS as you say RC!

SleuthyGal · #10 08-17-2008, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by momto3kids

I have not joined, but my kids go quite a bit as a guest. It has really helped me to understand some things I had questions about. I do know that the employee's can't get by the desk without having their card swiped. I knew they were stringent with their rules.

This does show what a great organized fitness club this is.

Hearing the description of the great facility and all they have there, it makes me wish I lived closer so I could join (it just wouldn't make sense for me). I'm available if anyone for any reason feels they need/want to bring a guest there!

raisincharlie · #11 08-17-2008, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skittles

RC:

Do you mean that if LE couldn't find Nancy's ID that would give them grounds for a warrant to search locked lockers at LTF?

Could be a combination of reasons actually. For instance if it came to LE's attention that Brad went there on Saturday and used his own card in a time frame that he said he was looking for Nancy - LE would want to review the computer records and any surveillance video that may exist, they would be wondering why he checked in, if he did. The warrant would be necessary to check the computer records as that data is private information.

If Nancy's card was missing but it was found the card was swiped at LTF on that Saturday and Brad and several others say she ran with nothing - LE is going to research those records for that reason. If the records show she checked in - and no one has reported seeing her - chances are yes they are going to want to look in lockers to see if she left anything or if someone else did that is unaccounted for by someone.

To me the undisclosed location is a location LE does not want someone in paticular to know they are searching. To me that suggests it is not a residence for sure and definitely not a residence that would be known to a potential suspect. This pretty much leaves commercial facilities - LTF possibly, a storage unit possibly for examples. LTF would require a warrant because it is a private membership only facility - therefore the members have an expectation of privacy - warrant essential.

DogWood · #12 08-17-2008, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal

Yes it does seem like this would be a logical 3rd place to search and they would need a warrant to do so. You have at least 2 factors:

1. Her LTF card is not in her possession
2. Her husband said he went to LTF

Smart to check things out there, esp. if there are a lot of "resources" he could use while there.

My only question would be why they would wait until the 25th of July to search LTF? LE knew about his trip there pretty early on from his affidavit, if not sooner.

EntreNous · #13 08-17-2008, 02:35 PM

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Here's another thing I've often thought about (and mentioned before): here you have a good friend (perhaps a 'best' friend) who goes into FULL ON PANIC MODE when NC fails to show up within a 1-hr window of the time they were to get together.

Now I don't know JA at all; never heard of her before this case. I have friends who are occasionally late or occasionally get tied up doing something and our plans get shifted as a result. Things don't quite start on time (I'm a punctual person so this sometimes drives me crazy). But WHY would a friend go into PANIC MODE so quickly? UNLESS that friend was already fearful that something might happen to her friend...the friend who is in a very estranged rel'p...said rel'p having gone back into "hate mode," as mentioned by the wife the night before, at the party.

Friends don't usually go into this full on panic mode within a 3 hr timeframe. Unless said friend is like my 80 year old mother who is the Olympic Champion of Worrying (Guiness Book of World Records-level), something hit her that morning...her intuition was telling her DANGER WILL ROBINSON, DANGER!

She knew. In her GUT she knew. She probably wasn't even consciously aware of it but a certain knowledge or 'knowing' was given to her on a very unconcious level.

BTW, I had the same thing happen to me the day I found out my brother had been found dead. And there is no explanation for it that can be explained by our 5 basic senses.

I did that too SG!!!

I totally understand what you're talking about.

My BIL was in the end stages of brain cancer (GBM), after fighting for 2+ years. I'd moved in with my sister to help care for him. Our mom lived less than a 1/2 mi. from my sister's house and would come over every day around noon and stayed 'til about 6 pm. Sometimes she'd be later if she went shopping, etc. Until one Friday she didn't arrive. By 12:30 I was calling her. I had a terrible feeling. At 1 pm I was in panic mode and my sister thought I was crazy. I jumped in the car and drove to her house and that's when I found her. She'd had a hemorrhagic stroke and died that night.

Yes, she could have been out at the grocery or any number of places but I knew, I just knew something had happened to her.

That may be exactly what happened with JA. She was sincerely distraught in that phone call.

Women's intuition or whatever you want to call it can be a strong signal that something is terribly wrong.

SleuthyGal · #14 08-17-2008, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raisincharlie

To me the undisclosed location is a location LE does not want someone in particular to know they are searching. To me that suggests it is not a residence for sure and definitely not a residence that would be known to a potential suspect.

So if LTF were the subject of that 3rd SW, then BC would NOT have been notified that LTF was being searched?

Is there a reason he would have been notified about the Cisco SW but not this 3rd location? Because Cisco is also a commercial facility, not owned by Brad.

EntreNous · #15 08-17-2008, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal

So if LTF were the subject of that 3rd SW, then BC would NOT have been notified that LTF was being searched?

Is there a reason he would have been notified about the Cisco SW but not this 3rd location? Because Cisco is also a commercial facility, not owned by Brad.

I have to question that too. There's too many employees at LTF for that not to have hit the grapevine.

I'm sticking with the SH theory. They possibly wanted his DNA.

raisincharlie · #16 08-17-2008, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DogWood

My only question would be why they would wait until the 25th of July to search LTF? LE knew about his trip there pretty early on from his affidavit, if not sooner.

Very good question.

My thought on this is there would have been no reason to check on Brad's story of where he went and what he did until they found and identified Nancy and ruled her death a homicide. The order of warrants that we "know" of seems to follow a progression - house - work place of husband - at this point it becomes apparent they are looking closely at him. Perhaps the delay was based on prioritizing the desired information.

momto3kids · #17 08-17-2008, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DogWood

In looking for a picture of the BMW sedan, I ran across these again. Note picture #11. They were all over the SUV, inside and out. Looks like test kits everywhere.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/pho...y/1142714.html

With regard to the sedan...There is a picture of it in the driveway here http://www.bluelineradio.com/news714.html about half-way down the page. Not only does the plate look straight in that picture, it appears to be trunk lid not the bumper part of the car. He should have noticed that any time he opened the trunk. Hmmm.

You are correct...the tag is on the trunk lid. I just checked a 325 and it is that way. Hmmm

Bob&Bob · #18 08-17-2008, 02:44 PM

Why were you outside his driveway at 6-7 pm? By the way,
what day was it?

raisincharlie · #19 08-17-2008, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal

So if LTF were the subject of that 3rd SW, then BC would NOT have been notified that LTF was being searched?

Is there a reason he would have been notified about the Cisco SW but not this 3rd location? Because Cisco is also a commercial facility, not owned by Brad.

BC has no right to a copy of the Cisco search warrant - that belongs to Cisco alone as it is their property being searched. I doubt Brad was notified. The undisclosed location - unless that property belongs to BC - he would not be entitled to a copy of that warrant either and LE would not be required to notify him of that either.

SleuthyGal · #20 08-17-2008, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EntreNous

Until one Friday she didn't arrive. By 12:30 I was calling her. I had a terrible feeling. At 1 pm I was in panic mode and my sister thought I was crazy. I jumped in the car and drove to her house and that's when I found her. She'd had a hemorrhagic stroke and died that night.

Ooooh I'm so sorry EntreNous. I'm so sad for your loss. Tragic.

In my case it was truly weird. My brother lived alone in PA. I of course lived in NC, my parents were in FL at the time. It was the day of my Bday and I was getting into my car to go meet friends for dinner. As I got in my car this loud voice (in my head) said for me to be "very careful and not let anything happen to me...some important news was coming." This voice was so loud and so insistent that I actually answered it out loud! I said, "Okay, okay I'll be careful! Look I'm putting on my seatbelt! I always put on my seatbelt!" BTW, I don't normally hear voices and I am perfectly sane. As I was driving to the resto I then thought of how I hadn't heard from my brother on my Bday...which was not unusual at all...he usually did not send a card, but for some reason I thought of him and not hearing from him.

3 hours later I found out my brother had been found dead in his bed...he was apparently found right at the time I was getting in my car to go to dinner. Heart attack. Had been dead for 2 days. When my parents couldn't get ahold of him they called the local police in his hometown who broke down his apt. door and found him. I knew none of this until hours later.

raisincharlie · #21 08-17-2008, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DogWood

In looking for a picture of the BMW sedan, I ran across these again. Note picture #11. They were all over the SUV, inside and out. Looks like test kits everywhere.

http://www.newsobserver.com/news/pho...y/1142714.html

With regard to the sedan...There is a picture of it in the driveway here http://www.bluelineradio.com/news714.html about half-way down the page. Not only does the plate look straight in that picture, it appears to be trunk lid not the bumper part of the car. He should have noticed that any time he opened the trunk. Hmmm.

CCBI is certainly picking over that SUV pretty good - even under it and taking photographs. Looks like they were definitely concerned about the X5. Thanks DogWood - very interesting.

SleuthyGal · #22 08-17-2008, 02:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raisincharlie

BC has no right to a copy of the Cisco search warrant - that belongs to Cisco alone as it is their property being searched. I doubt Brad was notified. The undisclosed location - unless that property belongs to BC - he would not be entitled to a copy of that warrant either and LE would not be required to notify him of that either.

Raisin, why do you think LE let it be known that Cisco was the recipient of that 2nd SW and yet the 3rd SW is 'undisclosed?' Any ideas on that? It's not like the public doesn't know that BC is being looked at...

DogWood · #23 08-17-2008, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by raisincharlie

Very good question.

My thought on this is there would have been no reason to check on Brad's story of where he went and what he did until they found and identified Nancy and ruled her death a homicide. The order of warrants that we "know" of seems to follow a progression - house - work place of husband - at this point it becomes apparent they are looking closely at him. Perhaps the delay was based on prioritizing the desired information.

Good point. Thanks!

EntreNous · #24 08-17-2008, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal

Ooooh I'm so sorry EntreNous. I'm so sad for your loss. Tragic.

In my case it was truly weird. My brother lived alone in PA. I of course lived in NC, my parents were in FL at the time. It was the day of my Bday and I was getting into my car to go meet friends for dinner. As I got in my car this loud voice (in my head) said for me to be "very careful and not let anything happen to me...some important news was coming." This voice was so loud and so insistent that I actually answered it out loud! I said, "Okay, okay I'll be careful! Look I'm putting on my seatbelt! I always put on my seatbelt!" BTW, I don't normally hear voices and I am perfectly sane. As I was driving to the resto I then thought of how I hadn't heard from my brother on my Bday...which was not unusual at all...he usually did not send a card, but for some reason I thought of him and not hearing from him.

3 hours later I found out my brother had been found dead in his bed...he was apparently found right at the time I was getting in my car to go to dinner. Heart attack. Had been dead for 2 days. When my parents couldn't get ahold of him they called the local police in his hometown who broke down his apt. door and found him. I knew none of this until hours later.

Wow, I too am sorry for your loss SG.

It is strange, the alarms that can be set off by our senses when we somehow "know" something is way wrong. I have no doubt that one day we'll figure out how that works and how to harness that energy.

It kind of reminds me of the movie "Minority Report". They heavily researched the information in that film and what they used are actually things that leading scientists predict will be considered commonplace one day.

raisincharlie · #25 08-17-2008, 03:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleuthyGal

Raisin, why do you think LE let it be known that Cisco was the recipient of that 2nd SW and yet the 3rd SW is 'undisclosed?' Any ideas on that? It's not like the public doesn't know that BC is being looked at...

Someone with more experience than I with warrants could probably give you the correct answer or at least a better answer than I can. It could be on Nancy's Dr. for all we know or the children's Dr. just never know with Hippa laws, could be a good reason to not disclose the location.

Just my thought - they have a suspect and they do not want anyone, suspect and the public to know where they are going. With that said, this is why I do not believe that warrant was served on a residence. The person being served is not bound to keep the information secret and may discuss it if they wish. If this warrant was served on one of BC's friends I suspect they would have told him about it. If it was served on one of Nancy's friends, I think the grapevine is too strong to not have the information escape somwewhere.