CA- Kyle - Teen held captive for a year-Waiter Trial

[adnoid]

Originally Posted by SeriouslySearching

...I fault any organization for allowing an adult to be placed in an organization without a complete and thorough background check which should include a home visit plus a check of the partner/SO/spouse...

My son and daughter go to Catholic school. I am not allowed to even take her and her friends to a volleyball team function unless my fingerprints are on file with the school and all my background check information is on file and current. I am the treasurer of the parent's club and I know the school President, the Principal, lots of the staff and faculty, but that doesn't matter - no kids in my car unless I've been checked out, and recently. And the parents have to pay for it themselves, so it's not a burden to the school.

[SeriouslySearching]

I applaud them for taking the extra precautions neccessary to protect children, Ad. It is a positive step. To have the parent who wants to be involved foot the tab sounds reasonable. It also gives an added layer to help weed out people with ill intentions if they have to pay for their own past history to come out.

[SoobsinMI]

Originally Posted by twinkiesmom

These are non-profit organizations....It's not going to happen...there aren't the resources. They do perform criminal background checks on all leaders and volunteers.

I agree. Even our school system, only runs background checks, they don't go into each home to run forensic tests for volunteers. It's isn't practical.

[MeoW333]

Originally Posted by adnoid

My son and daughter go to Catholic school. I am not allowed to even take her and her friends to a volleyball team function unless my fingerprints are on file with the school and all my background check information is on file and current. I am the treasurer of the parent's club and I know the school President, the Principal, lots of the staff and faculty, but that doesn't matter - no kids in my car unless I've been checked out, and recently. And the parents have to pay for it themselves, so it's not a burden to the school.

That's an excellent policy to have; prevents a lot of worrying, and potential danger!

[SoobsinMI]

Originally Posted by adnoid

My son and daughter go to Catholic school. I am not allowed to even take her and her friends to a volleyball team function unless my fingerprints are on file with the school and all my background check information is on file and current. I am the treasurer of the parent's club and I know the school President, the Principal, lots of the staff and faculty, but that doesn't matter - no kids in my car unless I've been checked out, and recently. And the parents have to pay for it themselves, so it's not a burden to the school.

But none of that would have worked in this case. The couple didn't have a record. Someone is advocating a home visit/search/questioning of children in the home....for Scout leaders and volunteers? CPS can't even get their act together to perform all those things when they have leads and a case.

[SoobsinMI]

Originally Posted by SeriouslySearching

I applaud them for taking the extra precautions neccessary to protect children, Ad. It is a positive step. To have the parent who wants to be involved foot the tab sounds reasonable. It also gives an added layer to help weed out people with ill intentions if they have to pay for their own past history to come out.

My two younger kids are in Catholic school. I volunteer a LOT, usually at least weekly, and have for several years. I don't know that I could afford to foot the bill for all of that, on top of tuition, fundraisers, book fairs, and miscelaneous checks here and there. The school does a criminal background check, but no fingerprints, etc. And again, it wouldn't matter in this and many cases, if there is no criminal background.

[youshouldveknown]

No one said anything about forensic tests. An unannounced home visit to make sure there are no skeletons in the closet doesn't cost anything. Somebody's hiring you, right? That person can swing by, for 10 or 15 minutes, and just look around. Why wait until after they're hired and have an opportunity to hurt children to say 'you know, that looks suspicious' when you might be able to catch something suspicious before hiring? With a 10 minute visit?

It doesn't cost a thing. Just a little bit of time.

I don't have children myself, but when I pick up my friend's baby from daycare every so often, I still get carded, and I still have to get my friend on the phone to make sure it's okay for me to take her home. I'm on the list, and they know me there, but it doesn't matter. They always apologize and I tell them 'It's okay, I know she's safe here.'

[SeriouslySearching]

I don't think we know enough about this couple to say there aren't any records on them. They could have slipped through the cracks and those records just haven't surfaced yet.

[miimaa]

Originally Posted by dreamweaver

On Nancy Grace tonight, they said he was already out of the hospital and in foster care. Again. Couldn't they have kept him in the hospital, even for an emotional/psychological trauma?

You're kidding? Back in foster care? That is so sad this boy has no family to take him. Breaks my heart.

[youshouldveknown]

Originally Posted by SoobsinMI

And again, it wouldn't matter in this and many cases, if there is no criminal background.

That's my point. Just because there is no criminal background doesn't mean these people won't hurt your children. At least with an unannounced home visit, you can see the environment they live in, see the state of their children, see what they're like in their home, ect.

[ishouldbworking]

Originally Posted by Vegas Bride

Years ago I worked with a black man who had the most startlingly blue eyes.

Something about appearance here thats giving me the creeps, watching Nancy Grace and they keep showing the pictures of the man and woman, is it just me or does anyone else wonder if they might be blood related, to me they look like they could be brother/sister, their eyes are so simmilar.

VB

i think the same thing. their noses are eerily similar too!

[adnoid]

Originally Posted by MeoW333

That's an excellent policy to have; prevents a lot of worrying, and potential danger!

When I was going through this I asked the person from the school if anything has ever come up. She said no - but when told about the background check, people have decided not to become volunteers after all. I don't know what the check would uncover - I've only been arrested once and it was dismissed, and it was also 30 years ago - but clearly some people would rather not be checked out, I'm assuming because they themselves know what's in their background.

[twinkiesmom]

Originally Posted by youshouldveknown

No one said anything about forensic tests. An unannounced home visit to make sure there are no skeletons in the closet doesn't cost anything. Somebody's hiring you, right?

We're not talking about people being hired...we're talking about unpaid Girl Scout leaders and moms who volunteer....not exactly a high risk population for child predators.

[twinkiesmom]

Originally Posted by Titan

You are right....I was a GS leader for many years and there was never a background check or me or my co-leader. I even became Service Unit Manager and a background check was never performed.

Was this a long time ago? Because they're doing the checks now, both the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts....my son even had to attend an abuse awareness training to convert from Cub Scout to Boy Scout.... I doubt the adult leaders are ever allowed to be alone with a scout and there are always parent volunteers around.

[twinkiesmom]

Originally Posted by youshouldveknown

That's my point. Just because there is no criminal background doesn't mean these people won't hurt your children. At least with an unannounced home visit, you can see the environment they live in, see the state of their children, see what they're like in their home, ect.

Do you perform these unannounced home visits on all your kids' friends parents or are you preventing your kids from socializing with other kids? No play dates or sleepovers?

At some point, you just have to trust people or not trust them.

[adnoid]

Originally Posted by twinkiesmom

Do you perform these unannounced home visits on all your kids' friends parents or are you preventing your kids from socializing with other kids? No play dates or sleepovers?

At some point, you just have to trust people or not trust them.

My kids have never been to the house of a friend unless either my wife or myself has visited first, and vice versa.

Moderator hat now - thread creep alert. Let's stay on topic here, if we want to go further on child rearing stuff let's start a thread in the Jury Room.

[Lyn1001]

Originally Posted by mysteriew

Does anyone know if when the kid ran from the youth home- did they report him missing? Has anyone seen his name to see if we could check the missing reports?

A problem with foster kids is that sometimes they do runaway. And a problem with DFS is they don't often look for them. Or report them as missing. Considering the agency is charged with both protecting and caring for underage children, I have a real problem with that. Too many times those kids end up like this kid, in some kind of trouble or danger and no one is even looking for them.

I can't speak about any other state's system, but I can speak about mine. If a foster child runs away, the worker has to go to court (within 24 hours) and file to have the child placed on the list for police to pick up if they're found. The child is also put on the NCMEC list. The worker is required to go to frequent court dates to update the court on the efforts made to find the child. I have personally been out with other workers when they got a tip on where a child was. The police are often called as backup and because they have the order to pick the child up. However, if you contact everyone you know who knows the child, and they don't know where the child is, there's not much you can do to find the kid. Yes, if you get a tip a kid is at a house, you go check it out, but they do not have to let you in to look for the kid. You can also call the police if you get a tip, but that doesn't mean the kid is there. If you get a tip a child is in another state, you coordinate with that state to get a pick up order and tell them where you think the kid might be. Most of these kids are street smart. If they don't want to be found, they won't. Workers honestly do try to find kids (at least the ones in my county), but it's not easy. And when you have no leads, what are you supposed to do?

[SeriouslySearching]

I am waiting on more to come out today with the hearing. Anything on that yet?

[SeriouslySearching]

Originally Posted by twinkiesmom

Was this a long time ago? Because they're doing the checks now, both the Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts....my son even had to attend an abuse awareness training to convert from Cub Scout to Boy Scout.... I doubt the adult leaders are ever allowed to be alone with a scout and there are always parent volunteers around.

There are times the adult leaders are alone with a scout even if it isn't "allowed".

[LinasK]

Originally Posted by miimaa

You're kidding? Back in foster care? That is so sad this boy has no family to take him. Breaks my heart.

Nancy Grace got it wrong, today's newspaper said he is still hospitalized. "He was hospitalized in Tracy in critical condition and was transferred Wednesday to a medical facility in Sacramento County, where he is in protective custody." You don't go from critical care to foster care in such a short period of time. I'll get the article, it's a local story- front page headlines here.
Torture suspect had history of abusing Tracy boy, other children, court records say
By Steven Harmon and Mike Martinez Staff Writers
Posted: 12/03/2008 09:37:00 AM PST
SACRAMENTO — The guardian of the 17-year-old boy police say was tortured and abused for the past year in Tracy had previously been arrested on suspicion of beating him with martial arts sticks, a spatula, a broomstick and a clothes hanger in Sacramento County, court documents show.
A previously sealed probation report from Sacramento County Superior Court details alleged abuses committed by Caren Ramirez, 43, who was arrested Tuesday night in Berkeley in connection with the case.
Ramirez had been previously identified as the boy's aunt, but police said late Wednesday that Ramirez is not a blood relation but had been granted custody of the boy by his mother before her death. more at link:http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_11128173

[youshouldveknown]

Originally Posted by twinkiesmom

We're not talking about people being hired...we're talking about unpaid Girl Scout leaders and moms who volunteer....not exactly a high risk population for child predators.

Wouldn't a child predator volunteer for such a job? I think that's the highest risk population. This woman who was keeping this child in her laundry room was a child predator, with children of her own. And she was volunteering with the Girl Scouts. All it would have taken was someone to look through her home to find an emaciated boy sleeping on her laundry room floor.

[lizzybeth]

Originally Posted by LinasK

Nancy Grace got it wrong, today's newspaper said he is still hospitalized. "He was hospitalized in Tracy in critical condition and was transferred Wednesday to a medical facility in Sacramento County, where he is in protective custody." You don't got from critical care to foster care in such a short period of time. I'll get the article, it's a local story- front page headlines here.
Torture suspect had history of abusing Tracy boy, other children, court records say
By Steven Harmon and Mike Martinez Staff Writers
Posted: 12/03/2008 09:37:00 AM PST
SACRAMENTO — The guardian of the 17-year-old boy police say was tortured and abused for the past year in Tracy had previously been arrested on suspicion of beating him with martial arts sticks, a spatula, a broomstick and a clothes hanger in Sacramento County, court documents show.
A previously sealed probation report from Sacramento County Superior Court details alleged abuses committed by Caren Ramirez, 43, who was arrested Tuesday night in Berkeley in connection with the case.
Ramirez had been previously identified as the boy's aunt, but police said late Wednesday that Ramirez is not a blood relation but had been granted custody of the boy by his mother before her death. more at link:http://www.contracostatimes.com/ci_11128173

Poor child. I bet his mom thought he would be well taken care of after she passed.

[youshouldveknown]

Originally Posted by twinkiesmom

Do you perform these unannounced home visits on all your kids' friends parents or are you preventing your kids from socializing with other kids? No play dates or sleepovers?

At some point, you just have to trust people or not trust them.

I can't have children.

But if I did have children, I would absolutely visit the home of anyone who is to assume care of my child. In dropping my child off for a sleepover, I would like to be invited in. I'd want to talk to the parents. I don't think this is over protective. My parents did the same for me when I was a kid. It's a matter of safety.

The subject is closed.

[SeriouslySearching]

I agree. It is a very high risk population for child predators. They tend to insert themselves where they are the authority figures. Predators can be male or female.

People were seeing this boy outside and commenting on his emaciated looks plus asking questions of why he wasn't in school etc. It is so disgusting to me that someone didn't call and report it. They didn't need to be inside the house to know that something was wrong with the situation!!

[Tricia]

Is the boy's first name Kyle?

This is such a horrific story that hopefully it will bring much needed changes and added protections to the foster system.