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JonBenet Ramsey What really happened to 6 year old JonBenet? Someone is getting away with murder. All information posted on this site is gained through published documentation on this case. It is strictly opinion only.


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  #1  
Old 06-03-2004, 08:02 AM
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New Grand Jury?

Jury cloaked in secrecy

Panel has been meeting in Boulder, but target a mystery

By Charlie Brennan, Rocky Mountain News
June 3, 2004

Grand juries typically operate behind closed doors, but one that has met several times over the past four months in Boulder County is particularly shrouded by secrecy.

The criminal matter being investigated is unknown even to Boulder Police Chief Mark Beckner and Boulder County Sheriff Joe Pelle, the county's two top law officers.

The use of grand juries in Boulder County is particularly unusual. One has not met on a criminal investigation in Boulder since the grand jury hearing the JonBenet Ramsey murder case disbanded in October 1999 after serving 13 months without returning an indictment.

JonBenet, 6, was found slain in her home on Dec. 26, 1996. The case remains unsolved.

"Usually, grand juries are never used" in Boulder County, said Pat Wittreich, county jury commissioner. But she confirmed a grand jury of 12 men and women, plus four alternates, was empaneled Feb. 9.

Citing grand jury secrecy rules, Wittreich would not identify the case Wednesday or reveal how many times the panel has met.

Wittreich said the prosecutor leading the grand jury is Chief Trial Deputy Bryan Quiram. Quiram was not involved in the Ramsey grand jury.

"I can't confirm or deny" that a grand jury is meeting, said Boulder District Attorney Mary Keenan.

"I can't tell you anything about it. It's an area we have to be very careful about," she said.

Bill Wise, assistant Boulder district attorney for 28 years until retiring in January 2001, said, "I can't recall the last time that a grand jury met on a criminal matter (in Boulder), other than Ramsey."

Colorado judicial districts typically have a grand jury sworn in and available for potential service at all times, but they are ordinarily convened on an as-needed basis.

The largest ongoing crime story in Boulder County in recent months has been the allegation that, since 1997, nine women were sexually assaulted by University of Colorado football players or recruits.

Although Attorney General Ken Salazar announced May 11 that his special prosecutor's investigation into the CU scandal would produce no sexual assault charges, it was disclosed May 20 that a state grand jury would investigate other potential wrongdoing stemming from that probe.

That grand jury is meeting in Denver. It is scheduled to reconvene on June 11.

Another high-profile case from Boulder that remains unsolved is the Dec. 21, 1997, slaying of 23-year-old CU student Susannah Chase.

Boulder police announced in January of this year that new DNA technology that can point to a suspect's ethnicity told them that Chase's killer was likely a Hispanic or American Indian.

Police Chief Beckner said Wednesday he did not know what matter was before the grand jury. He said even if it did involve the Ramsey case, he would not necessarily know about it.

Beckner's department has not had control of the Ramsey case since December 2002. He agreed to Keenan's office taking charge at that time because JonBenet's parents had said publicly they had lost faith in the Boulder department's competence and objectivity, and would not cooperate any further as long as it remained under Beckner's control.

Three more key developments in the Ramsey case came in quick succession the following spring:

• On March 31, 2003, in Atlanta, U.S. District Judge Julie Carnes dismissed a civil case brought against the Ramseys by Boulder journalist Chris Wolf, who claimed they had libeled him for stating in their book The Death of Innocence that Wolf was a suspect in their daughter's death.

Based on the evidence she reviewed - which was limited to those documents and exhibits submitted by attorneys in the libel case, and not the entire 40,000-plus pages of the criminal investigative file - Carnes ruled, "There is virtually no evidence to support (the theory) that they murdered their child, but abundant evidence to support their belief that an intruder entered their home . . . and killed their daughter."

• One week later, April 7, 2003, Keenan issued a statement supporting Carnes' decision.

"I agree with the court's conclusion that 'the weight of the evidence is more consistent with a theory that an intruder murdered JonBenet than it is with a theory that Mrs. Ramsey did so,' " Keenan said at that time.

". . . Since Mr. and Mrs. Ramsey have not even been charged, much less convicted, they must be presumed innocent and must be treated accordingly."

• Then, in June 2003, Keenan announced the hiring of Tom Bennett, who had retired as a detective from the Arvada Police Department two years earlier, to work exclusively on the Ramsey case 20 to 30 hours a week.

At that time, Keenan said that Bennett and other personnel in her office were collectively devoting 70 to 100 hours per week on solving JonBenet's murder.

John and Patsy Ramsey, with their now 17-year-old son Burke, left Colorado in 1997 and now live in Charlevoix, Mich.


http://rockymountainnews.com/drmn/lo...934486,00.html
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  #2  
Old 06-03-2004, 12:30 PM
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Wouldn't that be something...

If this really was for the Ramsey case.

I am keeping my fingers crossed.
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  #3  
Old 06-03-2004, 12:43 PM
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I thought for a long time that JBR's murder would never be resolved(at least in my lifetime) BUT I am starting to have hope that due to JR's running for office in MI(what an ego he has to think he can pull that off! sheesh! Its astounding!!)it will bring much needed ,new attention to the case and pressure on Boulder to at least TRY to resolve this ..............so here's hoping!!!!!!!!
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  #4  
Old 06-03-2004, 12:49 PM
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Nedthan Johns Nedthan Johns is offline
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what John Ramsey is doing...

Is egniting this case again, only this time BIG players are getting involved that want to Bring Ramsey down. It’s like OJ trying to win an academy award, IT JUST AINT’ GOING TO HAPPEN. Ramsey has put himself up with the big wigs, the elite crowd. Something John and Patsy have always ASPIRED to be, but never will. Their excessive egos keep pushing them to where they aren’t wanted. The political crowd won’t stand for this. He is going to fall and fall hard, and hopefully the right people will make sure that justice is served for his little girl, he so publically has shown he doesn’t care for.
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  #5  
Old 06-03-2004, 02:01 PM
BrotherMoon BrotherMoon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedthan Johns
I am keeping my fingers crossed.
S.B.T.C F. Saved By The Crossed Fingers. You better have a lot of fingers.
Get real, this GJ is about CYA and football, Boulder has priorities.
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  #6  
Old 06-03-2004, 02:41 PM
Honeybee Honeybee is offline
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Well, Bro, I think you're right.
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  #7  
Old 06-03-2004, 02:43 PM
BarnGoddess BarnGoddess is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherMoon
S.B.T.C F. Saved By The Crossed Fingers. You better have a lot of fingers.
Get real, this GJ is about CYA and football, Boulder has priorities.
I rarely follow the JBR case as intently as I did years ago. I have read the books, listened to Dan Kaplus and Mike Rosen on KOA and browse the forums to read on occasion. I didn't even know about JBR forums before the Laci Peterson Case. Living in Colorado, we get the Rocky Mountain News at work. Just finished reading it and thought I would slip over from the Laci forum to see if what I read was under speculation.

I don't think that this jury is about football. Didn't Salazar say there would be no intictments or criminal charges brought against any players, recruits or students for sexual misconduct, rape, harrassment, etc?

I finished the article and just did a Hmmmmm......
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  #8  
Old 06-03-2004, 03:30 PM
popcorn popcorn is offline
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If it is for JonBenet and on the up and up, we would have heard about a fresh pile of dirt down in Georgia.
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  #9  
Old 06-03-2004, 03:51 PM
BrotherMoon BrotherMoon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BarnGoddess

I don't think that this jury is about football. Didn't Salazar say there would be no intictments or criminal charges brought against any players, recruits or students for sexual misconduct, rape, harrassment, etc?

I finished the article and just did a Hmmmmm......
The words Grand Jury, indictment and Boulder shouldn't be used in the same sentence. The GJ in the Ramsey case was used to test opinion and the political/leagal waters with respect to protecting the Boulder bureaucracy.

Could you turn the horse trough 180 degrees?
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  #10  
Old 06-03-2004, 03:56 PM
Shawna Shawna is offline
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Maybe a terrorist cell was found in Boulder and everything is being kept quiet. If there was a terror plot in Boulder I doubt Al Quaeda is responsible. Lee Hill , the Boulder Patriot Militia group and AIM are up to something sinsiter.
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  #11  
Old 06-03-2004, 04:04 PM
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Nedthan Johns Nedthan Johns is offline
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BrotherMoon

I guess those crossed fingers didn't work, you are right...

http://ws0101.promedia.net/webnews/w....RiYv_EAR.html

The lawsuits are still pending and so is a grand jury investigation believed to be looking into whether university funds were used to hire call girls.
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  #12  
Old 06-03-2004, 04:13 PM
popcorn popcorn is offline
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Denver vs Boulder

Aren't there two seperate Grand Juries?

"Although Attorney General Ken Salazar announced May 11 that his special prosecutor's investigation into the CU scandal would produce no sexual assault charges, it was disclosed May 20 that a state grand jury would investigate other potential wrongdoing stemming from that probe.

That grand jury is meeting in Denver. It is scheduled to reconvene on June 11."
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  #13  
Old 06-04-2004, 03:22 AM
BrotherMoon BrotherMoon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shawna
Maybe a terrorist cell was found in Boulder and everything is being kept quiet. If there was a terror plot in Boulder I doubt Al Quaeda is responsible. Lee Hill , the Boulder Patriot Militia group and AIM are up to something sinsiter.
Al Qaida doesn't need to infiltrate Boulder, the leftist, de-constructionist, neo-beatnik, neo-hippie, resurgent earth mother Godess, counter culture is already well entrenched.

What an oxymoron; Boulder Patriot.

I like the new coinage though; sinsiter.
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  #14  
Old 06-04-2004, 03:26 AM
BrotherMoon BrotherMoon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nedthan Johns
The lawsuits are still pending and so is a grand jury investigation believed to be looking into whether university funds were used to hire call girls.
AUM takes on a new meaning in Boulder; Ahhhhhhh...mmmmmm!
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  #15  
Old 06-04-2004, 03:44 AM
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Tricia Tricia is offline
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The Grand Jury is not doing anything "Ramsey" thank goodness.
http://rockymountainnews.com/drmn/l...2937353,00.html

Ramsey case not on the docket
But Boulder DA sheds no more light on jury's business

By Charlie Brennan, Rocky Mountain News
June 4, 2004

A grand jury meeting in Boulder County is not considering the JonBenet Ramsey case, the county's chief prosecutor said Thursday.

Boulder District Attorney Mary Keenan made that declaration in the wake of a Rocky Mountain News report that a grand jury empaneled Feb. 9 in Boulder had met several times since that date on an undisclosed case.

The use of grand juries is rare in Boulder. The last known time one was utilized was for the Ramsey case in 1998-99, before it disbanded after 13 months with no indictments issued.

"There is no Boulder grand jury looking into the Ramsey case, or anything relating to the Ramsey case," Keenan said.

The previous day, she had declined to discuss the grand jury's business at all, citing the secrecy rules that apply to grand juries in Colorado. On Thursday, she still refused to reveal what the grand jury is doing.

News that a grand jury was meeting in Boulder prompted numerous calls to Lin Wood, the Atlanta attorney who has represented the Ramsey family for several years.

Wood said John Ramsey remains upbeat about the prospect of progress in the ongoing investigation into the Christmas night 1996 murder of his 6-year-old daughter, for which Keenan's office now has lead responsibility.

"He expressed optimism to me that progress was being made, but said nothing specific beyond that," Wood said.

Boulder Chief District Judge Roxanne Bailin signed an order on Feb. 10 keeping the names of the current Boulder grand jurors secret; absent such an order, grand jurors' names are public record.

*snip*

`````````````````````````````````````````

I am so glad to hear this news.
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  #16  
Old 06-04-2004, 08:23 AM
Shylock Shylock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tricia
The Grand Jury is not doing anything "Ramsey" thank goodness.
I am so glad to hear this news.
Yes...The reputations of Helgoth, Oliva, and Sum Yung Gai have been spared for the time being.
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  #17  
Old 06-04-2004, 08:27 AM
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But that of Mary Keenan has not considering a Grand Jury for crimes in her jurisdiction is meeting in Denver.
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  #18  
Old 06-04-2004, 10:51 PM
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the good,the bad, and the funny

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shylock
Yes...The reputations of Helgoth, Oliva, and Sum Yung Gai have been spared for the time being.
The good, the bad, and the funny.

Considering that there is such a flimsy connection between the case and Helgoth and the fact his DNA wasn't a match, it seems like a waste of time to include him as a possible suspect.

The other day I looked for a sample of Oliva's writing at Webb. but couldn't find the archived thread. At the time just about everybody said it looked pretty similar to the note. And most of them weren't even believers in Oliva to begin with. For those who think Patsy wrote it based on samples, looking at this other writing could be a good comparison. Its a lot easier to say that one person has unique characteristics if you have never had anything similar to compare them to.

Who knows, if the DNA was eventually matched to someone in a 3rd world database, he might have his 15 min. of fame. LOL
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  #19  
Old 06-05-2004, 01:35 AM
gretchen gretchen is offline
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No way will the Ramsey case ever go before the Grand Jury again. I have lost all hope that this case will be legally solved. I will say, however, my God is a knowing God, and nothing escapes Him.
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  #20  
Old 06-05-2004, 05:47 AM
BrotherMoon BrotherMoon is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gretchen
No way will the Ramsey case ever go before the Grand Jury again. I have lost all hope that this case will be legally solved. I will say, however, my God is a knowing God, and nothing escapes Him.
I also have a hard time grasping no-thing, so I don't fault your God for not being able to understand it.
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  #21  
Old 06-05-2004, 11:09 AM
Maikai Maikai is offline
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The first GJ was a political move....

remember the timing? Steve Thomas submitted his resignation letter to the media....the media started buzzing around the Governor at the time...and a few days later, they called a GJ. IMO, it was done to get the media off the Governor's back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gretchen
No way will the Ramsey case ever go before the Grand Jury again. I have lost all hope that this case will be legally solved. I will say, however, my God is a knowing God, and nothing escapes Him.
There's also an unsolved case of an 86-year old man that was killed at a convenience store/gas station--GJ could be for that, as well as other crimes.
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  #22  
Old 06-05-2004, 11:43 AM
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A political move?

Kinda like the legal blackmail agreement Hunter and Smit had. The timing there tells it all
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  #23  
Old 06-05-2004, 01:47 PM
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This is what the GJ is investigating....

BOULDER — A grand jury is investigating the Longmont homicide of 86-year-old Charles Wilson.

Boulder County chief trial deputy Bryan Quiram confirmed Thursday that a grand jury was convened Feb. 9 in Boulder to examine evidence in the 2003 slaying of the gas station clerk at Peerless Tyre, 1380 S. Main St.

“The general purpose of the grand jury is to investigate the Charles Wilson homicide,” Quiram said.

~~~SNIP~~~

Details of grand jury proceedings fall under strict secrecy rules, and almost all people associated with the case Thursday declined to comment about the details of the investigation.

Longmont police Chief Mike Butler also would not comment on the grand jury but said he hoped the investigation would come to a conclusion soon.

Wilson, of Erie, was found dead in a small attendant’s booth early in the morning of Feb. 13, 2003, but police believe he was shot in the abdomen late Feb. 12.

Police initially labeled David Rodriguez, 22, as their main suspect but last November said their focus had changed to Ervey Delval, 20.

Delval was a passenger in Rodriguez’s Chevrolet Suburban, which was pulled over at a Loaf ’N Jug convenience store, 200 Lashley St., about 12:30 a.m. Feb. 13 for driving with expired license plates, according to police.

Rodriguez was arrested for lying to police about his identity and on an unrelated assault warrant.

A box of .25-caliber bullets and a holster were found in Rodriguez’s vehicle, according to police.

Wilson was found dead at about 4:45 a.m. Feb. 13, after family members asked officers to check on him after he was hours late coming home from his shift at the station. Detectives believe he was killed between 9 p.m. and midnight Feb. 12.

Rodriguez is still reportedly living in Longmont. Police believe Delval has fled to Mexico. Calls to Rodriguez’s last known address went unreturned Thursday.

Earhart said detectives have investigated the theory that Delval shot Wilson and that Rodriguez drove the getaway vehicle — a Chevrolet Silverado — to a relative’s house before driving away in the Suburban that was later pulled over.

~~~SNIP~~~

No gun has been recovered in the investigation.

In early February, police handed over the case to Quiram, the prosecutor leading the grand jury.

When taking over the case, Quiram said, “Sometimes, you come to a point where a couple of extra heads really aren’t a bad thing.”

Those heads are now a grand jury of 12 men and women and four alternates.

Grand juries are rare in Boulder County. The last one made public was empanelled in 1998 to investigate the JonBenet Ramsey homicide. It was dissolved in October 1999 with no indictments.

Former chief trial deputy Trip DeMuth said Thursday that Boulder County convenes a grand jury once every five years “on average.”

DeMuth, who retired in 2000 after 17 years as a prosecutor, said grand juries in Boulder County have been mainly used for drug cases and homicides.

Prosecutors, DeMuth said, have a great influence over grand juries because they are the only attorneys allowed to speak to the panel, except for lawyers subpoenaed to testify.

“There is a saying: ‘A prosecutor could indict a ham sandwich,’” DeMuth said. “As a general rule, the grand jury will follow the recommendation of the prosecutor.”

~~~SNIP~~~
I tried the hyperlink, but it took me to today's Daily Times Call instead of yesterday's.

http://www.forumsforjustice.org/foru...ead.php?t=4784

This is where I originally posted the story.
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