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Annie Le Yale grad student goes missing and turns up murdered in her lab! Her body is found buried in a wall on her wedding day. Who could do this to Annie?


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  #76  
Old 09-18-2009, 10:33 PM
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Will the autopsy also include toxicology tests? In case she was given a sedative before killed? They didn't mention any defensive wounds or bruising on the body, did they?
I think toxicology is routinely included. Don't know if it will be in the report, but I'm betting it will be. We may not hear the evidence until it's presented in court, from what I understand.
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:16 PM
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I think toxicology is routinely included. Don't know if it will be in the report, but I'm betting it will be. We may not hear the evidence until it's presented in court, from what I understand.

I can absolutely confirm that toxicology was ordered within the scope of the post
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:24 PM
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Will the autopsy also include toxicology tests? In case she was given a sedative before killed? They didn't mention any defensive wounds or bruising on the body, did they?

Toxicology is performed on all homicide death (and many many others ) seen at the CT ME's office. Screening for barbiturates and benzodiazepines are part of the routine testing (urine) and quantatiative levels are determined from other body fluids.

The gross anatomy evaluation has NOT been released at this time, will definitely be released during the trial BUT CT is NOT the same as other States (ie Fla) where documents are released to the general public.
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:26 PM
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Toxicology is performed on all homicide death (and many many others ) seen at the CT ME's office. Screening for barbiturates and benzodiazepines are part of the routine testing (urine) and quantatiative levels are determined from other body fluids.

The gross anatomy evaluation has NOT been released at this time, will definitely be released during the trial BUT CT is NOT the same as other States (ie Fla) where documents are released to the general public.
So if we won't have access to the documents, will we still have access to the information, via court proceedings?

Further, aside from the autopsy information presented in court, is there a possibility there will be some autopsy information not presented in court, so we may never know the full contents of the autopsy?
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:40 PM
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So if we won't have access to the documents, will we still have access to the information, via court proceedings?

Further, aside from the autopsy information presented in court, is there a possibility there will be some autopsy information not presented in court, so we may never know the full contents of the autopsy?

More than likely some of the information will be "leaked" (but not by me!) and some of the information will be available during the court case, UNLESS sealed by the court! or redacted, again by the court.

Anser to the second part: possibly.....for example, the actual weight of the organs.
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Old 09-19-2009, 12:38 AM
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Trying not to be indelicate here, but I'm not sure there is a nice way to phrase it... Given the rumors that went around regarding dismemberment, and the report that the perp did not cut up the body - and knowing how a body changes as it decays, is there a possibility that the police might have been forced to dismember her in order to get her out of the chase?


NO WAY...they would have cut open the wall in order to get her out. No way would they destroy her body and and possibly any evidence that would lead them to her killer. It's very easy to cut open a wall, much easier than cutting open a car - which is done everyday to get dead people out.
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Old 09-19-2009, 12:54 AM
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Joypath, I just wanted to say thank you for joining Websleuths. Your insight seems very keen. Thanks for the discussion regarding scratches and dismemberment. I saw on the news, as well as online, that Raymond had scratches on his chest. Then it was reported in the media that he had scratches on chest, arm, and back. Then puffster informed one of his/her sources said Annie was cut up pretty bad. The the media mentioned dismemberment. I've been going with she was cut so bad she could have looked dismembered. Now it's back to square one with just scratches on his chest. That's what the chief said, so that's what I'm going with...until it's confirmed. I have to say, though, everything puffster has posted from his/her sources has ended up being correct. That gives me reason to pause. I hurried to logon and acknowledge you. Your information is much needed. Thanks so very much.

Can't keep my eyes open any longer. Sweet dreams everyone.

Jersey



Agent Scully, Sloof, RDM64 - welcome to all of you, too. With the exception of the horrible circumstance, the interacting dialogue is incredibly interesting. Very nice to get so many different perspectives from varios avenues related to this mystery, and be able to put it all together as a group. Thanks!

Last edited by Jersey*Girl; 09-19-2009 at 01:14 AM. Reason: Addition of other members.
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  #83  
Old 09-19-2009, 06:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Shlock Homes View Post
Will the autopsy also include toxicology tests? In case she was given a sedative before killed? They didn't mention any defensive wounds or bruising on the body, did they?
he had defensive wounds. She was struck.

I think the odds are she was punched in the face and strangled (hence the blood on the accused's shoes)
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Originally Posted by debirlfan View Post
Trying not to be indelicate here, but I'm not sure there is a nice way to phrase it... Given the rumors that went around regarding dismemberment, and the report that the perp did not cut up the body - and knowing how a body changes as it decays, is there a possibility that the police might have been forced to dismember her in order to get her out of the chase?
No, they got her out intact. they opened the wall to make that easy and to look for and protect other evidence besides the body itself (things belonging to the perp)
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  #84  
Old 09-20-2009, 04:00 PM
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Angry

Does anyone know if Annie was sexually assualted in any way by this creep?
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  #85  
Old 09-20-2009, 08:39 PM
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Does anyone know if Annie was sexually assualted in any way by this creep?

Per standard protocol, a sexual assault kit evaluation was processed....results are NOT released, keep watch IF the Oct. 6 day in court results in significant changes in the charges.
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  #86  
Old 09-21-2009, 01:42 PM
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http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...jtrH2luFH8HrtI

I just saw this, and while it's not quite autopsy results, it is something that would be noted in the autopsy. Let me know if there is a better place to discuss.
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Old 09-21-2009, 05:14 PM
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I am a fan of Nancy Grace on facebook, and she said that she will be talking about this on her show tonight.
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Old 09-21-2009, 05:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Noway View Post
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...jtrH2luFH8HrtI

I just saw this, and while it's not quite autopsy results, it is something that would be noted in the autopsy. Let me know if there is a better place to discuss.
Thank you Noway - I can't believe what I just read. Bones broken to fit Annie in the small space!!!! How sick!!! No doubt that this guy is as barbaric as a caveman and as sick as they come. YIKES!!!
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:30 PM
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Originally Posted by noway View Post
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/nationa...jtrh2lufh8hrti

i just saw this, and while it's not quite autopsy results, it is something that would be noted in the autopsy. Let me know if there is a better place to discuss.
o......m.......g......
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Old 09-21-2009, 07:55 PM
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The New Haven police chief made a statement today saying that (specifically) the New York Post article about AL's body being mangled is incorrect. He says that he's correcting the misinformation at the request of the State's Attorney.

http://www.courant.com/news/connecti...,2304773.story
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:22 PM
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I have a feeling it is correct. They said they're trying to stop leaks, so maybe they're trying to use reverse psychology with this one.

Let's assume he did crush her, how could he have done it? It's not possible with one's bare hands. Maybe something mechanical.
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Old 09-21-2009, 10:29 PM
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Thank you Noway - I can't believe what I just read. Bones broken to fit Annie in the small space!!!! How sick!!! No doubt that this guy is as barbaric as a caveman and as sick as they come. YIKES!!!
On Nancy Grace's show tonight, LE is saying that report is not true!!
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Old 09-21-2009, 11:06 PM
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On Nancy Grace's show tonight, LE is saying that report is not true!!
I challenge LE to prove it!
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Old 09-21-2009, 11:23 PM
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I challenge LE to prove it!

Whereas I challenge the news organization to prove their commentary and site the statements in scientific terms or present the gross anatomy diagram, I will add that after 5 days of decomposition, the body to the casual observer would appear quite traumatized and difficult to observe, especially as one considers the effects of gravity on the body.
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Old 09-21-2009, 11:34 PM
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Personally, if the story is wrong, I'm very glad.
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Old 09-21-2009, 11:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Shlock Homes View Post
I have a feeling it is correct. They said they're trying to stop leaks, so maybe they're trying to use reverse psychology with this one.

Let's assume he did crush her, how could he have done it? It's not possible with one's bare hands. Maybe something mechanical.

Unfortunately, it is possible to fracture human bones with bare hands and definitely dislocate bones when the victim is deceased. IF one were to do this damage, think chest compression to snap ribs, strong, hard downward pulling to disjoint the arm sockets, backward pressure to snap a wrist and the opposite twisting to snap an ankle, violent twisting to dislocate a patella, a backward hard pressure to disarticulate a cervical juncture.....and then of course the heavy duty boots to make even more body modifications.

Easier to use something mechanical and heavy: perhaps a feed cart?

Now that I've added the possible manner of disarticulation and fracture, remember that IF these actions were perpretrated, the body has absolutely NO muscle tone, rigor had not yet set in, and the body would be similiar to a "rag doll" to manipulate. Remember also that irregular bone breakages can protrude thru the skin causing even more leakage than the typical purge of death.
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Old 09-22-2009, 12:40 AM
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I think it's just the Post's usual MO of sensationalism. I'd definitely believe something the Chief said, particularly when he quotes the state's attorney as having made the request, over the Post.
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Old 09-22-2009, 01:08 AM
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Unfortunately, it is possible to fracture human bones with bare hands and definitely dislocate bones when the victim is deceased. IF one were to do this damage, think chest compression to snap ribs, strong, hard downward pulling to disjoint the arm sockets, backward pressure to snap a wrist and the opposite twisting to snap an ankle, violent twisting to dislocate a patella, a backward hard pressure to disarticulate a cervical juncture.....and then of course the heavy duty boots to make even more body modifications.

Easier to use something mechanical and heavy: perhaps a feed cart?

Now that I've added the possible manner of disarticulation and fracture, remember that IF these actions were perpretrated, the body has absolutely NO muscle tone, rigor had not yet set in, and the body would be similiar to a "rag doll" to manipulate. Remember also that irregular bone breakages can protrude thru the skin causing even more leakage than the typical purge of death.
The description you give is so very vivid! My problem is that I can see animal Clark doing those very acts of violence. I don't care for the psychopath, I think he's capable of the worst. If I remember correctly, most all the leaks thus far have been acknowledged as accurate.
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Old 09-22-2009, 09:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Chili Fries View Post
I think if his worst injuries were on his neck and back then Annie could have pulled his shirt over his head, which is something that commonly happens in fights
Hmm, I truly doubt she was tall enough or strong enough to do that. She was very small in build, and he looks stocky and strong. But yes, she could have scratched him under his shirt if they struggled.

I think the reason we don't see any cuts on him is simple - the wounds had healed by the time he was arrested.
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Old 09-22-2009, 06:18 PM
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Originally Posted by joypath View Post
Unfortunately, it is possible to fracture human bones with bare hands and definitely dislocate bones when the victim is deceased. IF one were to do this damage, think chest compression to snap ribs, strong, hard downward pulling to disjoint the arm sockets, backward pressure to snap a wrist and the opposite twisting to snap an ankle, violent twisting to dislocate a patella, a backward hard pressure to disarticulate a cervical juncture.....and then of course the heavy duty boots to make even more body modifications.

Easier to use something mechanical and heavy: perhaps a feed cart?

Now that I've added the possible manner of disarticulation and fracture, remember that IF these actions were perpretrated, the body has absolutely NO muscle tone, rigor had not yet set in, and the body would be similiar to a "rag doll" to manipulate. Remember also that irregular bone breakages can protrude thru the skin causing even more leakage than the typical purge of death.
We own real estate and I can picture just the type of space where Annie's body was found. The dimensions of spaces like this can vary widely. Our plumbers have installed many access doors to them that are indeed about the size of a computer monitor. And the depth behind them can often be less than a foot. They're usually no bigger than they need to be -- landlords want as much usable square footage as possible. It makes me wonder if the NY Post article isn't more accurate than LE claims in their denial.
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