Questions (and answers)

[Invisible]

I am confused about what would have been Annie's job duties in the lab as opposed to what Raymond's job duties were. It would seem to me that he would have been in charge of keeping cages clean, etc. I am unclear about what Annie could have done (or not done) that would have angered him. It doesn't seem to me that she would have been charged with "mouse cleanliness" in any way, it would have been his job.

Not wearing booties, lab coats, etc. in the lab would have endangered her research, so it seems that she would have been careful about that.

What am I missing?

[Sloof]

Originally Posted by Noway

What is Ray's sister's name who works at the Yale lab?

What is Ray's brother-in-law's name who works at the Yale lab?

TIA

Clark's fiancee, sister Denise Kent and brother-in-law Shawn Kent are also animal lab technicians. Yale spokesman Tom Conroy said they remain employed by the university, but he would not say whether they've returned to work. Clark was suspended after his arrest last week.


Read more at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/0..._n_296032.html

[JL50ish]

Did anyone else hear yesterday that LE is exploring the possibility that Clark was using steroids and this may have been the result of 'roid rage?

(I heard a brief mention, but no details.)

[JL50ish]

Does anyone know if that Tuesday was going to be Annie's last day to work before her wedding?

I heard that relatives were arriving the next day in NYC (the location of the wedding), so possibly Clark told her that he needed to discuss how the rats would be cared for while she was gone. Does anyone know if Annie was going to work the rest of the week?

[Emily Booth]

Originally Posted by JL50ish

Does anyone know if that Tuesday was going to be Annie's last day to work before her wedding?

I heard that relatives were arriving the next day in NYC (the location of the wedding), so possibly Clark told her that he needed to discuss how the rats would be cared for while she was gone. Does anyone know if Annie was going to work the rest of the week?

It's not really clear? Maybe someone else can do better? Meanwhile, here's some reported info on the wedding plans:

“Lucky I’m in love with my best friend,” Le wrote in a posting on Facebook, one of several about the marriage, according to the Register. Others included details about the ceremony, the reception and the honeymoon in Greece.

foxnews.com

Family friend Joelle Ward said Sunday that Ngoc-Tuyet Bui always spoke proudly of Le, a high achiever all through school, and that Bui and Le had recently discussed both the excitement and stress of planning a wedding.

"They were very pleased that she was getting married -- and to whom she was marrying," Ward said.

Le's cousin David Nguyen said that Le and her fiance had come to Santa Ana this summer for a reception involving dozens of relatives who couldn't travel to New York for the wedding. The bride-to-be wore a white wedding dress, Nguyen said.

The wedding was "something she was looking forward to," he said. To her family, the notion that she'd had cold feet and run away was absurd. "We would say that would be the last case."

chicagotribune.com

[Skigirl]

Originally Posted by JL50ish

Does anyone know if that Tuesday was going to be Annie's last day to work before her wedding?

I heard that relatives were arriving the next day in NYC (the location of the wedding), so possibly Clark told her that he needed to discuss how the rats would be cared for while she was gone. Does anyone know if Annie was going to work the rest of the week?

I don't know for sure either, but most Tuesday classes also meet on Thursdays and if she was a TA, she may have planned to stay in New Haven through her morning class on Thursday but leave right afterward without going to the lab -- which would mean that Tuesday was to be her second to last day in the lab, Wed. was to be her last in the lab, Thursday her last teaching day.

[Emily Booth]

Add'l wedding info:

Deborah Kiley, owner of Deborah’s Hairloft in Huntington, was planning to do Le’s hair and makeup this morning. “She wanted a slick back bun and very simple makeup,” Kiley said. “She wanted everything perfect.”

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_c...#ixzz0S4PX4vi9

It's not really clear when the guests were arriving? They could've started arriving Thursday or Friday. Upon re-reading the article, if Annie had booked a mani/pedi in Huntingon Friday, then her last day in New Haven would be Thursday. This jibes w/ Skigirl's post above!

[Labrat]

Originally Posted by Invisible

I am confused about what would have been Annie's job duties in the lab as opposed to what Raymond's job duties were. It would seem to me that he would have been in charge of keeping cages clean, etc. I am unclear about what Annie could have done (or not done) that would have angered him. It doesn't seem to me that she would have been charged with "mouse cleanliness" in any way, it would have been his job.

Not wearing booties, lab coats, etc. in the lab would have endangered her research, so it seems that she would have been careful about that.

What am I missing?

If he were the room tech, he would be responsible for changing cages, providing adequate food and water, caging supplies for weaning. The researcher is (usually) responsible for weaning their own animals, and for cleaning up after their own work. Cages must be opened inside a hood, and you are responsible for cleaning up any spilled bedding, mouse feces, etc. and wiping down the hood when you are finished. You usually must take dirty empty cages to a specific area for cleaning, make sure you put any syringes into the sharps container, any dead animals must be disposed of properly.

Not cleaning up after yourself makes extra work for the room tech and annoys and can endanger the research of people sharing the room.
I can tell you from my own experience there are people who do not clean up after themselves, open cages outside the hood, leave a pile of dirty cages on the floor, leave cages overcrowded...

[Emily Booth]

Well, it's my turn to ask a question -- what day was RC initially interviewed by the FBI? Wednesday Sept 8? Did the polygraph take place the same day?

[Noway]

Originally Posted by Emily Booth

Well, it's my turn to ask a question -- what day was RC initially interviewed by the FBI? Wednesday Sept 8? Did the polygraph take place the same day?

September 8 was Tuesday. She was reported missing around 9 by roommate but case file has time as 2240 (10:40 p.m.)

When Clark was initially interviewed by federal agents shortly after Le was reported missing, he acknowledged seeing Le in the laboratory, the source said. He then was asked to take a polygraph test, which he failed, sources said.

Federal authorities also issued polygraph tests to anyone who had access to the laboratories, including Clark's girlfriend, Jennifer Hromadka, who is also a animal lab technician. She passed her polygraph test, the source said.

http://www.courant.com/news/connecti...0,857789.story

Still looking for exact dates.

IIRC, this was the day after Annie disappeared, September 9, that he was cleaning up, putting cleaning supplies away.

http://www.nhregister.com/articles/2...--_annie19.txt

Clark became a potential suspect early in the investigation. Even as FBI agents were scouring 10 Amistad St. for any sign of Le, who disappeared Sept. 8 and was last seen entering the building. Clark was seen cleaning up in an area where authorities now believe Le was killed.

During questioning, agents noticed injuries to his chest, arms and head that suggested he could have been in a struggle, and he failed a polygraph test, sources said.

Sept. 9: Search For Le expands, more than 100 agents involved http://www.wfsb.com/news/20817193/detail.html

FBI involved as of September 10 (maybe before). http://newhaven.fbi.gov/pressrel/2009/nh091009.htm

September 10, 2009 2:15 PM
State police with bloodhounds searched the area where Le was last seen, and authorities were continuing to search nearby, Yale Police Chief James Perotti said in a statement. The FBI was assisting, and investigators also were reviewing images from closed-circuit cameras, Perotti said. Her fiance, professors, colleagues, friends and family also were helping, Perotti said. http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09...in;contentBody

September 11, 2009 9:58 AM
Asked about the possibility of foul play, Yale spokesman Tom Conroy said Thursday, “There's no evidence of it at this time.”
http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09...in;contentBody

FBI had identified a person of interest by September 12. http://www.courant.com/news/breaking...,1443333.story

September 14, 2009 4:30 PM
The source told CBS News’ correspondent Randall Pinkston that the suspect has failed at least one polygraph lie detector test and possibly more. The suspect has not been formally charged, but is not at large.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09...y5310688.shtml

[PatientOne]

Will RC's HS girlfriend's rape story be admissible testimony in the trial? She also hinted in a Good Morning America interview recently that he used other means of control when they were dating (choking, beating???) but said LE has asked her not to comment in detail. Does there have to be proof (like photos of bruises sustained) of any other means he used or would her testimony be enough (if it's even allowed)?

[Emily Booth]

Thanks Noway! And, thank you for catching my mistake!

It looks like RC was interviewed either the 9th or 10th? I think by the 11th, the same info about the FBI was being repeated.

[Noway]

Originally Posted by Emily Booth

Thanks Noway! And, thank you for catching my mistake!

It looks like RC was interviewed either the 9th or 10th? I think by the 11th, the same info about the FBI was being repeated.

It's my belief, based on what I found today, that September 9 was their interview (LE saw him cleaning up); September 10 was the polygraph (of several people who'd been in building) and by September 11, media reports were talking about a person of interest who had scratches, bruises, etc., and who had failed the polygraph. LOL and I know we're not supposed to post "I thinks" but not one dang reporter could finish a sentence with "was interviewed by FBI on _____ and failed a polygraph on September _____."

And just so I have them where I can find them ... I broke the link so the video isn't actually showing (at least I hope that works)

FBI Helping In Search of Missing Girl
On Thursday, September 10, FBI searched Annie Le's off-campus apartment.
http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=XtBVmXOvUjg&feature=related

Bloody clothing found in ceiling tiles on September 12.
http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=XtBVmXOvUjg&feature=related

Police news conference on body found
http://www.youtube.com/
watch?v=UXeHXvttArE&feature=channel
Body found September 13; assuming it is Annie. Introduces various law enforcement types working on case. No further comment.

[Emily Booth]

New question! And, if you made it thru my very looooong post at the evidence thread, you'll know why!

Did RC play softball Sun Sept 6 and Wed Sept 9?

[Shlock Homes]

Originally Posted by PatientOne

Will RC's HS girlfriend's rape story be admissible testimony in the trial? She also hinted in a Good Morning America interview recently that he used other means of control when they were dating (choking, beating???) but said LE has asked her not to comment in detail. Does there have to be proof (like photos of bruises sustained) of any other means he used or would her testimony be enough (if it's even allowed)?

Is this the only relationship Ray Clark had besides the woman he is dating? Not to make light of abuses, but do we know at what stage in the relationship this alleged rape occurred? Were they in the midst of it? Was there friction between the two. I doubt it would be allowed because it happened many years earlier, and it sounds like a case of he said she said. Did they do a rape kit?

[eyes4crime]

Originally Posted by Shlock Homes

Is this the only relationship Ray Clark had besides the woman he is dating? Not to make light of abuses, but do we know at what stage in the relationship this alleged rape occurred? Were they in the midst of it? Was there friction between the two. I doubt it would be allowed because it happened many years earlier, and it sounds like a case of he said she said. Did they do a rape kit?

What does 'stage in a relationship' have to do with being raped?

[Shlock Homes]

Originally Posted by eyes4crime

What does 'stage in a relationship' have to do with being raped?

I took my message out because it didn't fall in line with the direction of the thread. Is there a better place to reply?

[Shlock Homes]

When did the police actually start looking for her body?

From various articles around the internet including the one below, it sounds like they didn't start searching for her body in the chases until they got the blueprints, and they seem to point to Saturday. Am I to understand that from Wed to Fri, they didn't look in any of the wall chases in the basement?

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refere..._le/index.html

"Four days after her disappearance, the police reportedly found bloody clothes above ceiling tiles in the lab building on Amistad. Armed with blueprints, investigators continued searching the building for clues"

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?se...rld&id=7012062

"On Saturday, investigators took what appeared to be blueprints to the building."

[Noway]

Originally Posted by Shlock Homes

When did the police actually start looking for her body?

From various articles around the internet including the one below, it sounds like they didn't start searching for her body in the chases until they got the blueprints, and they seem to point to Saturday. Am I to understand that from Wed to Fri, they didn't look in any of the wall chases in the basement?

http://topics.nytimes.com/top/refere..._le/index.html

"Four days after her disappearance, the police reportedly found bloody clothes above ceiling tiles in the lab building on Amistad. Armed with blueprints, investigators continued searching the building for clues"

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?se...rld&id=7012062

"On Saturday, investigators took what appeared to be blueprints to the building."

In the beginning, it was a missing person's case. They were not looking for a body. But after viewing surveillance videos, there was no evidence that Annie Le had left the building. They had no evidence that she was a victim of foul play.

At the point where they found bloody clothing (Saturday) they began to suspect foul play. When they found her body, it became a homicide.

The FBI spokesperson (Kim M.) said that evidence had been found, but that evidence had not yet been connected to Annie. And also said that the FBI was still not ready to determine whether this was a missing person's case or a case of foul play.

And then LE announced that a body had been found and while the body had not been officially IDd yet by ME, they were assuming it was Annie Le.

In answer to your Q, once they found the bloody clothing and suspected foul play, they looked again. I've read conflicting reports about whether the dogs brought in at first were S&R (vs. cadaver) dogs. S&R dogs would not have found her scent nor would they have smelled decomp. The dogs brought in on Sunday were cadaver dogs, and based on what I read, it was a dog who alerted to the place where she was found.

Here is evidence thread where we discussed this. (Might not be on right page ...)

[Shlock Homes]

That is what is confusing about the status of the case. If they brought in dogs earlier, and they were confused with the scent because of the animals, when did that occur? Fri? or Sat? When they bring in cadaver dogs, I think that means they suspect homicide.

If she was not seen leaving the building on Tuesday, what would lead them to think she wasn't dead and somewhere in the lab? I haven't been able to get an adequate answer from anyone as to whether someone could exit that lab area without being seen on surveillance. Or was the camera disabled during a particular time, which led them to wonder if she had exited the building or was moved to another part of the building?

[JBean]

Remember this is not a discussion thread. It is a Q&A for objective ,factual type questions as opposed to opinions. This thread is for reference.

thanks.

[Noway]

Originally Posted by Shlock Homes

That is what is confusing about the status of the case. If they brought in dogs earlier, and they were confused with the scent because of the animals, when did that occur? Fri? or Sat? When they bring in cadaver dogs, I think that means they suspect homicide.

If she was not seen leaving the building on Tuesday, what would lead them to think she wasn't dead and somewhere in the lab? I haven't been able to get an adequate answer from anyone as to whether someone could exit that lab area without being seen on surveillance. Or was the camera disabled during a particular time, which led them to wonder if she had exited the building or was moved to another part of the building?

Just a note: A search dog looks for a scent unique to Annie (alive). A cadaver dog looks for the scent of death (all dead bodies smell the same).


September 10:
The bloodhounds had been part of the search since Thursday, as had more than 100 law enforcement officials from the various agencies.

http://www.yaledailynews.com/news/un...ected-killing/

September 10:
NEW HAVEN, Conn. (AP) The search for missing Yale student Annie Le expanded Thursday as police used search dogs and reviewed security camera footage in the hopes of finding the 24-year-old Yale University graduate student who vanished less than a week before her wedding.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09...y5300869.shtml

AND

Thursday, September 10, 2009 11:41 a.m.
Police search 10 Amistad St. with bloodhounds

The Connecticut State Police have brought in bloodhounds to assist in the search for Le at 10 Amistad St., where she was last seen, and a detailed search of the surrounding area is continuing today, Perrotti wrote.

http://www.cbsnews.com/blogs/2009/09...y5300869.shtml

September 13:
Five days after Le's disappearance, members of the state police crime squad, with the assistance of a cadaver dog, discovered her fully clothed body in the research building at 10 Amistad St. She was wearing the same clothes seen in a video of her entering the building last week, a source said.
...

Investigators had attempted to bring a cadaver dog into the building earlier in the week, but because of the large number of animals in the laboratory, the dogs were unable to do a thorough search.
http://www.courant.com/news/connecti...0,857789.story

Read WS post that said they brought in German Shepherd (cadaver?) dogs on Friday and will try to find source for that comment.

See next post for info on when (media reports) cadaver dogs began searching.

[Noway]

The big break in the case came from a German shepherd named Max and his handler, State Trooper Nick Leary. Max is trained in body recognition. He was first sent to search through large amounts of garbage that had been sent out for incineration. On Sunday he was taken to the basement of the Yale lab building, where he picked up Annie Le’s scent.

Max is a cadaver dog. Could it be that dog hit on garbage incinerator/contents and that is what lead to the Hartford facility?

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/n...0,330116.story

And then when he was taken to the basement, he hit on Annie's remains?


From this article, it looks like the cadaver dogs (German shepherds) were brought in on September 12. (September 13, 2009 By MATTHEW CHAYES AND ANDREW STRICKLER)

Investigators scoured the university research building yesterday, with dozens of officials going in and out of the lab on Amistad Street and searching it with German shepherds.

http://www.newsday.com/news/search-f...sEnabled=false

This would make sense of the comment (same link as above) of Kim Mertz's comment:

Yesterday, Mertz confirmed that "items that potentially could be evidence have been seized" and would be tested. "None have yet been associated with Annie Le at this time," she said.

"We are not in the position today to conclude whether this is a missing person's case or whether criminality is involved," Mertz said.

I will categorically say a body has not been found," she said.

The clothes were not Annie's ... so they didn't know whether they were connected to her case and whether foul play was involved.

BUT that would give them reason to bring in cadaver dogs, esp. because by now, they had not found surveillance of Annie leaving the building.

[Shlock Homes]

I've seen bits and pieces of information about Annie Le's family situation and upbringing, but what about Ray Clark?

I just know he has a sister and brother in law. What about other family members? Did him and his sister grow up with parents? I haven't heard anything about his parents in the news, unless I missed it somewhere.

Edit: Okay, now that I think of it, his father did enter the picture when Clark was holed up in that Motel, if I'm not mistaken. Otherwise, there hasn't been much talk about his family. Did he grow up in a middle class family household? Are his parents still married?

[Chanler]

Originally Posted by Shlock Homes

I've seen bits and pieces of information about Annie Le's family situation and upbringing, but what about Ray Clark?

I just know he has a sister and brother in law. What about other family members? Did him and his sister grow up with parents? I haven't heard anything about his parents in the news, unless I missed it somewhere.

Edit: Okay, now that I think of it, his father did enter the picture when Clark was holed up in that Motel, if I'm not mistaken. Otherwise, there hasn't been much talk about his family. Did he grow up in a middle class family household? Are his parents still married?

Hi, Shlock Homes, I've wondered about the same thing. Except for the father's motel appearance (which I had forgotten about), they seem nowhere in sight. But at this stage of very overwhelming events, what could they do? What can one say, especially if the evidence seems compelling? They don't want reporters camping out at their doorstep, as in the Anthony case, and, in any case, the crime itself probably seems unthinkable to them.

Legal defenses for murder trials are very expensive, but it doesn't seem that his family is able to mount even a modest effort in that direction.