AZ - Gabriel Johnson, 8 months, 26 Dec 2009 - last seen in Texas - #12

[W8nC]

My impression.....could very well be wrong....it's happened before....

On the 20th, EJ called the babysitter and arranged for her to come sit on the 23rd. On the 23rd, the babysitter came and watched Gabriel in the hotel room. EJ went out and met the prospective adoptive parents at a park, some park. She made an agreement with them to hand over Gabe, and possibly collected some up-front cash from them. When she returned to the hotel, she had money (paid the sitter), was happier than when she left (had an agreement in place regarding Gabe), and was having an argument on the phone with someone. I'd guess the argument may have been with Tammi, and may have been about the agreement she'd just made, which Tammi didn't like.

Then on the 26th or early on the 27th, she hands Gabe over to the new parents in the hotel room. She doesn't give them the car seat or all the other baby stuff because they have their own, don't want/need it.

This answers why she said she "met the couple" in the park, but then later says she "handed over Gabe" at the hotel. And she may have not wanted to take Gabe with her the first time she met them because she didn't trust that they wouldn't just take him and run off without giving her something in return? Or maybe didn't want to hand him over without first talking it over with Tammi, and then when Tammi gave her grief about it, decided to turn him over anyway. OR maybe she thought the park thing was a cop/Logan set-up?

Just my own speculation, opinion......no facts to back up any of this.....jusst thinking online...

[panthera]

Originally Posted by passionflower

After listening to the show, my heart fell.
I think our Angel Gabriel is gone.
The full text to Logan was very detailed...........as one speaker said.
I am beginning to think it did happen, similiar to that.
Like kc, throw away baby and go party!! New life! New ID. New state.........
If he was sold EJ would have money and could tell where he is.
This all back fired on the Smith's who thought they had Gabriel without any hitches.
$500. could be just a couple 'tricks'...........
The Smith's have to pretend there is hope.........to throw LE off of them.
His tiny body may never be found.......if EJ threw him away, it's to late.
They threw everyone off with a live baby.
Smith's & Eliz is very VAGUE about everything!

I lost more hope with the reminder of the high price that could be brought in for selling a healthy, Caucasian baby and the money she didn't have with her when arrested. Maybe when she left Arizona that was the intention and something had been set up for her to do so, so she cleaned him up, took the pictures, but maybe it fell through? Maybe the prospective adoptive parents backed out? And they won't come forward now because they were involved in something illegal? So if that happened, then I could see EJ getting rid of him like she texted Logan and moving on with her new life in Florida. Just a few thoughts. MOO

[TakeABiteOuttaCrime]

Originally Posted by mamaeb

I think this was on paperwork Elizabeth was turning in to give guardianship to the Smiths, not the Birth certificate, but I may be wrong.
And they had LM as dad and CC as a possible dad.

Not Guardianship papers, I remember TS talking about helping her to get her custody and child support going. Paternity docs.

[mamaeb]

Originally Posted by mydailyopinions

What is so sad about the thought that she needed time away from him is that she was just away from him for what 10 days? Too, she was on the run..
I would think that being on the run the last thing on her mind would be her nails..
But then again, just like with Casey, a scared mother who had their child kidnapped (sarcasm and all) got a tattoo..

so true!! I didn't even think of that

[not_my_kids]

Originally Posted by LadyL

ok, TPS admitted she wrote CC's name on the court documents
do we know if she SIGNED his name? or just filled it in?

they showed the document on one of the news shows, and it appears to be filled in on the form, printed, not signed. For those papers, the man in question doesn't have to sign.

[time]

mamaeb...

can we reconstruct your examples from the show with the SS#s and such to put them out to the public and broader media - you get credit of course!

[Kamille]

Originally Posted by SallyManda

So if this was posted previously please forgive me. Jack used to run a soundtrack/music production company in Nashville. I just think this is interesting.

http://deon.sogospelnews.com/index/c...-disc-factory/

Interesting find SallyManda. Looks like JS is worth a few bucks or at least he was. Wonder if he still owns the business?

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville...17/story3.html

[mydailyopinions]

I really hope that soon LE will release what they know of all her locations so that some kind of ground search can begin. It has been so long now that he has been missing..
If he is still alive and in San Antonio with a couple, then maybe the fear of searchers going door to door will convince this couple to take him in safely..

This is just way too sad!

[Gypsy Road]

Does EJ have a lawyer yet? I wonder how often LE is talking to EJ? How unbelievably frustrated they must be. ARGH!

[mamaeb]

Originally Posted by time

mamaeb...

can we reconstruct your examples from the show with the SS#s and such to put them out to the public and broader media - you get credit of course!

sure. actually.... if anything I'd rather is say a "websleuth poster" (not my real name or screen name) and also some of the stuff I got from here.

[time]

Originally Posted by Truthwillsetufree

I don't really think that many Mothers are studying KC as a "How To Kill A Child And Get Away With It" manual, nor do I think they are using WS as a guide either. I do , however, believe when someone is this off balanced and has a child in their care and someone else takes advantage of the situation instead of alerting authorities that a child may be in danger is a crime in and of itself. Not many women especially this young are going to leave the country, and leave their family/friends behind most don't even have a passport to do so. I could be wrong too!

I agree ... well thought out post

[panthera]

Originally Posted by mydailyopinions

What is so sad about the thought that she needed time away from him is that she was just away from him for what 10 days? Too, she was on the run..
I would think that being on the run the last thing on her mind would be her nails..
But then again, just like with Casey, a scared mother who had their child kidnapped (sarcasm and all) got a tattoo..

Sorry I don't have the link to the particular show, but it was discussed on Nancy's show along with EJ going shopping for clothes.

[passionflower]

Originally Posted by Gypsy Road

Does EJ have a lawyer yet? I wonder how often LE is talking to EJ? How unbelievably frustrated they must be. ARGH!

Yes, IIRC.....court appointed

[time]

Originally Posted by mamaeb

sure.

I think posting it on Gabriel's facebook would be good?

[panthera]

Originally Posted by not_my_kids

they showed the document on one of the news shows, and it appears to be filled in on the form, printed, not signed. For those papers, the man in question doesn't have to sign.

I think her merely filling in his name in her writing and submitting it to the court would be fraud. MOO

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[panthera]

Originally Posted by mydailyopinions

I really hope that soon LE will release what they know of all her locations so that some kind of ground search can begin. It has been so long now that he has been missing..
If he is still alive and in San Antonio with a couple, then maybe the fear of searchers going door to door will convince this couple to take him in safely..

This is just way too sad!

Or it could be, if he is with a couple, that they aren't really from San Antonio but just went there to meet her. Searches would also have to extend to all towns around SAT, imo.

[DairyGirl]

One thing Tricia said on the show which is true is that people are divided on whether or not they think Gabriel is alive or not. I was hoping he was since there is zero evidence of him being killed but with all the time that has passed it is looking less likely. Unless he is out of the country or being kept locked up I would think someone would have come forward. With all the LE and FBI on this case they should have been some leads by now. EJ is not a rocket scientist, although she may be very smart, she wasn't smart enough to keep herself from getting caught and fairly soon, too. I don't think that she could have covered her tracks that well nor do I think that the adoptive parents, if there are any, could have forseen having an untracable phone and internet. I had hope for a time because I kept hearing that LE had "indications" that he was alive but they never said what those indications were. I thought I read somewhere that one of those indications was a time stamp picture of Gabriel taken after she sent LM those text messages. I wish LE would share more of what they know if they do have reasons to be optimistic.

[Gypsy Road]

Originally Posted by panthera

I think her merely filling in his name in her writing and submitting it to the court would be fraud. MOO

or at least conspiracy to commit fraud? TS admitted on national tv that she suggested EJ put down CC.

[passionflower]

Originally Posted by Kamille

Interesting find SallyManda. Looks like JS is worth a few bucks or at least he was. Wonder if he still owns the business?

http://www.bizjournals.com/nashville...17/story3.html

He was successful as this article in 2002..........
Why did he move to from Nashville??

[LadyL]

Originally Posted by TakeABiteOuttaCrime

Not on the BC, on the paternity pleadings that were filed with the court.

yeah, I edited it to say court documents and what i was wondering is if it was signed; if she forged his signature

or just filled his name in somewhere in a box

[time]

I think Tricia and mamaeb did excellent on Levi's show - what it reinforced for me though is just how many talking heads are commenting on this case that have not researched it much. That's truly depressing. I hope some of the insights on the research other have done on Gabriel's case will make it to the media. Good grief, and the real research is much more interesting than the pablum that is presented.

Maybe Gabriel's facebook page will gain more media attention? Maybe that is a venue to start? I know Gabriel's family appreciates all the support and perhaps the media could then be pointed towards Gabriel's page?

[Tricia]

Originally Posted by W8nC

Excellent Caller!!!

I HOPE this caller is already a WebSleuther.....not trying to OUT her, just hope we have this woman's intelligence in our group already. :-)


DID THAT SHOW JUST END IN THE MIDDLE OF HER CALL?????

I agree that last caller was a gem of a person. I hope she is a member of Websleuths.

OK, here comes the part where I explain what I was TRYING to say as opposed to what flew out of my mouth.

My point was that it is not unheard of for a child to be sold for a small amount of money. Hence the connection to the money E had on her.

One of the theories being tossed around is that money came from the person who has Gabriel. Be it she sold him or they gave her money to help out.

I know my opinion about the Smith's is in the minority here but I am not as up to date on everything as you all are and I should be. I am judging them by what I know, what I have read here, and how they appear to me on TV.

Feel free to convince me otherwise. LOL. Next time I am on we can discuss my change of heart if I have one.

Thanks for all your nice comments and thank you for not screaming at me if you dsagree.

Love Tricia
PS. Didn't you love that first caller?LOL. Someone I banned from long ago who just can't get over it.

[panthera]

Originally Posted by Gypsy Road

or at least conspiracy to commit fraud? TS admitted on national tv that she suggested EJ put down CC.

I don't believe the Smiths know where Gabriel is now, but they definitely have a lot of involvement in his disappearance and should be charged accordingly. In other words, without their "assistance" it's very possible EJ wouldn't have taken him to Texas and he may not be missing now. MOO

[TakeABiteOuttaCrime]

EJ could have just walked away from this baby, left GJ with his father and lived this life she says she was going to go live.

IMO, Everything EJ has done up untill now is JUST SO THAT NO ONE WOULD LOOK DOWN ON HER AS NOT BEING THERE FOR HER CHILD OR BEING A BAD MOTHER.

She even admits to something similar to this by saying that everybody commended me when I gave the baby up for adoption the first time. Whats wrong with now? When that reporter interviewed her at her GF's house with TS in the room.

What I want to know is.. She used the word " everybody " when she said commended her. Where is THIS list? 2 is a couple, 3-4 is a few, 5-9 is several and more than 10 is many. How many is " everybody "?