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Old 04-12-2010, 11:12 AM
Kentjbkent Kentjbkent is offline
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I am at a loss about the discussion of "unresponsive" in the police report. Tricia and Kent spoke with one of the first responders at the scene. Their position, which they stated a number of times, is that "unresponsive" meant "refusing to answer questions."

RHPD says he was refusing to answer questions. That is their official position.

Whether or not that follows the experience of our fellow WSers in the medical field, RHPD says that is what they meant.

I guess this is why I feel like we are going in circles a little bit here...RHPD is not prevaricating. So you believe them or you do not.

Here is my question-why would they lie? To cover up the fact that they did not investigate why this man was naked and sleeping in a dumpster covered with scabies? I guess my question would be why would they investigate it? ST Jos didnt call them and tell them that THEY had found evidence of a crime...I mean once BK was cleaned up, and gone over with a fine tooth comb, the hospital did not alert RHPD to wounds that they might have missed.

I would think that this supports RHPD's story. I am certain that if there was evidence that ST JOS did call RHPD and RHPD had opted NOT to open an investigation, this would have surfaced with the allegations when this story first broke in the media in 2007.
Just to clarify for ya Believe (cause all this circle turning is making us all dizzy! 0

This is what the incident report states (notice lack of term "unresponsive")

"The subject was semi conscious but would not respond to us. Cpl. Potts had dispatch notify EMS and they arrived within several minutes. EMS transported the subject to St Josephs Hospital."

The word "unresponsive" came into play when Sue Usry attended the Dr Phil show and spoke briefly from the audience. She used the term "unresponsive" at that time (4 years after the fact).
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Old 04-12-2010, 11:38 AM
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Just to clarify for ya Believe (cause all this circle turning is making us all dizzy! 0

This is what the incident report states (notice lack of term "unresponsive")

"The subject was semi conscious but would not respond to us. Cpl. Potts had dispatch notify EMS and they arrived within several minutes. EMS transported the subject to St Josephs Hospital."

The word "unresponsive" came into play when Sue Usry attended the Dr Phil show and spoke briefly from the audience. She used the term "unresponsive" at that time (4 years after the fact).
Thanks kent. OK, let's say that Sue Usry decided that BK was in fact unresponsive-did she mean that he wasnt talking? Did he respond to stimuli? She did not use the term unconscious, right? I mean "unconscious" is pretty clear.

I doubt she was implying that he did not respond to stimulus-after all she would have access to her own EMT report.

I think we are in the same spot-some will choose to believe that unresponsive means something along the lines of not being able to respond. And some will believe that he was choosing not to respond.

We cannot turn back the clock, so we have to take into account the actions of a highly regarded police force and a highly regarded hospital.

At the risk of repeating myself from some of the posts I have made on the starting from scratch thread-you would have to believe that multiple institutions had failed this one man in order for his story to hold up. If you find this to be likely, then you will continue to believe his story on some level. What I mean is you would have to believe RHPD, St Jos, GA Regional, Memorial and JC Lewis Health Center have something against this man. After all Memorial wanted a huge amount of money in order to give BK his records, BK is not shy about sharing his very, very low opinion of the JC Lewis Health Center/Union Mission, Michael Elliott and Grace House, and NB appealed to both Garden City PD, Jack Kingston and the FBI for assistance because of RHPD.

Except Memorial gave him his medical records. For free. Except there has been nothing to date that shows RHPD's response to BK's discovery was anything but acceptably routine. Except ST Jo's found no cause for his amnesia and transferred him to GA Regional for a psych admit. Except JC Lewis Health Center repaired BK's vision and gave him a job in exchange for room and board.

Email Michael Elliott about BK-he is pretty honest regarding his interactions and knowledge of him. I have spoken with him a few times.
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  #353  
Old 04-12-2010, 11:56 AM
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Well, I must say I am getting a little bit dizzy on this merry go round we have
going here.

I have to agree with some posters that you believe what you want to believe.
Everything is seen by our own perception of the universe.

For me, BK knowingly perpetuated a lie.
Don't know why.
Not sure I want to know.

IF< IF, he truly does NOT know his identity,
he can ask for help, with a good explanation
of what the heck he has been up to
the last 3 years...since 2007.

Otherwise, I never did like merry go rounds,
time to get off and go do something else.
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Voice4theSilent View Post
From what I understand, BK was pretty much blind when he was discovered....and since we can rule out that he became blind during a beating (since he had no injuries when he was found sleeping next to the dumpster) he would have been blind prior to his discovery. That would probably rule out a longshoreman, merchant ship worker, etc. (or coming to "see the ocean".) I looked up missing cruise ship passengers and none matched his description. Don't know about the fingerprints but others on here could answer that questions for you, I am sure.
OMG-you all keep sucking me back in, lol. There are all kinds of "blind." Functionally, legally, visually impaired etc...We know he had cataracts that were removed and his vision was corrected to some degree because it is reported by an independent party, IE Union Mission.

We have had a number of possible matches who had fingerprints on fingerprint cards, not in databases. At some point they had a run in with the law and were fingerprinted, but the prints were never scanned into a database.

So how would they pop up? Against BK's I mean....
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
Well, I must say I am getting a little bit dizzy on this merry go round we have
going here.

I have to agree with some posters that you believe what you want to believe.
Everything is seen by our own perception of the universe.

For me, BK knowingly perpetuated a lie.
Don't know why.
Not sure I want to know.

IF< IF, he truly does NOT know his identity,
he can ask for help, with a good explanation
of what the heck he has been up to
the last 3 years...since 2007.

Otherwise, I never did like merry go rounds,
time to get off and go do something else.
I just love you dream....
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:34 PM
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I was looking at John Does again this morning and it made me think... (I know, that does not happen often )

Another possible reason BK may have gone off radar a long time ago, is because he was either military AWOL (I know, we have the fingerprint issue, but I am not 100% convinced that the military has every fingerprint) or perhaps BK was a draft dodger and never came home.
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Julessleuther View Post
I was looking at John Does again this morning and it made me think... (I know, that does not happen often )

Another possible reason BK may have gone off radar a long time ago, is because he was either military AWOL (I know, we have the fingerprint issue, but I am not 100% convinced that the military has every fingerprint) or perhaps BK was a draft dodger and never came home.
There was a fire years ago in a Military Records building and a lot of records were destroyed.
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:45 PM
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I had cataracts so bad I was past legally blind in both eyes and it happened in a short time. I could not watch tv, see the computer screen. I could not see peoples faces. Surgery got me to 20/20 vision and no reading glasses.
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
Well, I must say I am getting a little bit dizzy on this merry go round we have
going here.

I have to agree with some posters that you believe what you want to believe.
Everything is seen by our own perception of the universe.

For me, BK knowingly perpetuated a lie.
Don't know why.
Not sure I want to know.

IF< IF, he truly does NOT know his identity,
he can ask for help, with a good explanation
of what the heck he has been up to
the last 3 years...since 2007.

Otherwise, I never did like merry go rounds,
time to get off and go do something else.



Amen!
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Old 04-12-2010, 12:57 PM
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Long story to lead to my point

Several years ago, we had the most unpleasant boss, who I'll call John Doe. JD was about 300#, unfriendly, curt, overbearing, etc. Our bosses are a revolving door, so we had 5 or 6 roll in and out over the next few years when we got yet another boss, also named John Doe. We all joked how funny it was that we'd had so many bosses that they had to get one with the same name.

This 2nd John Doe was a triathlete, funny, never seemed stressed--total opposite of the 1st John Doe.

He worked with us for about a MONTH before he told us in a staff meeting that he was the SAME GUY who'd been our boss several years before. NEVER in a million years would we have put that together. Looked different, acted different...

Just saying, people can completely change, even as adults, and even people who see them every day might not recognize them at all.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:00 PM
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Just a quick FYI on scabies from someone who had them....I got them as a child from someone who lived in a group home (family friend) and there was no sexual or unusually close contact. I understand you can get them from clothing, blankets etc. Also it required (for me) multiple visits to a doctor and skin scrapings to diagnose, you don't see mites crawling on folks. I find it unlikely that an EMT would notate scabies, maybe a rash with a notation for suspect scabies or rule out scabies.
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Old 04-12-2010, 02:14 PM
Kentjbkent Kentjbkent is offline
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OMG-you all keep sucking me back in, lol. There are all kinds of "blind." Functionally, legally, visually impaired etc...We know he had cataracts that were removed and his vision was corrected to some degree because it is reported by an independent party, IE Union Mission.
We have had a number of possible matches who had fingerprints on fingerprint cards, not in databases. At some point they had a run in with the law and were fingerprinted, but the prints were never scanned into a database.

So how would they pop up? Against BK's I mean....
And FYI...according to BKs own admission, this surgery took place 9 months after he was found....and I need to find the link, but in one interview, BK made reference to the surgery that "fixed his eye"...eye...not EYES....
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  #363  
Old 04-12-2010, 02:18 PM
Kentjbkent Kentjbkent is offline
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Originally Posted by Voice4theSilent View Post
From what I understand, BK was pretty much blind when he was discovered....and since we can rule out that he became blind during a beating (since he had no injuries when he was found sleeping next to the dumpster) he would have been blind prior to his discovery. That would probably rule out a longshoreman, merchant ship worker, etc. (or coming to "see the ocean".) I looked up missing cruise ship passengers and none matched his description. Don't know about the fingerprints but others on here could answer that questions for you, I am sure.

That is a WHOLE other area of discrepancies (extent, etc) based on various statements made by BK and NB independently...

Worthy of looking into...if one had any interest in continuing to pursue this issue of fraud, but am pondering what the point would be anymore...
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  #364  
Old 04-12-2010, 02:20 PM
Kentjbkent Kentjbkent is offline
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Just a quick FYI on scabies from someone who had them....I got them as a child from someone who lived in a group home (family friend) and there was no sexual or unusually close contact. I understand you can get them from clothing, blankets etc. Also it required (for me) multiple visits to a doctor and skin scrapings to diagnose, you don't see mites crawling on folks. I find it unlikely that an EMT would notate scabies, maybe a rash with a notation for suspect scabies or rule out scabies.
Would you believe it if it were reflected on hospital records from an ER doctor?

Just wondering...
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  #365  
Old 04-12-2010, 03:21 PM
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I had cataracts so bad I was past legally blind in both eyes and it happened in a short time. I could not watch tv, see the computer screen. I could not see peoples faces. Surgery got me to 20/20 vision and no reading glasses.
I don't know how this happened with you, Dr. Fessel, but it's my understand if a person has the beginnings of cataracts and are put on a medication like Prednisone, their vision can rapidly deteriorate. It happened with a dear little dog I used to have. And this should serve as a warning to everyone, people and pets.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:21 PM
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I sometimes have insomnia and one night about a year ago I read many of the threads. I pored over pics posters would place here to look at and compare. For nights in a row I would puzzle over this case.

This case has fascinated me! At a point, tho, I became pretty convinced that just maybe Benjaman had amnesia, then slowly remembered who he was and just let the story go on and on.

All of you regulars on this case worked long and hard for Benjaman out of the goodness of your hearts. I am sorry that it has ended this way. I feel that Benjamin owes it to all of you to come back and tell his story. I have been at WS for a long time before I registered, and I can safely say that I have never posted with as many truly good people as I have here at WS.

JMO, but I feel all of you who have worked so hard deserve to know who this man is. Maybe no names, but know where he is from and what had happened.

JMO
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:46 PM
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Would you believe it if it were reflected on hospital records from an ER doctor?

Just wondering...
I wasn't really making a statement of my belief or disbelief either way. I was attempting (though maybe not clearly) to explain #1)why the scabies info may not have been obvious right away and may have been referred to as ant bites and #2)just to say that scabies need to be "diagnosed" they're not visible to the naked eye.
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:48 PM
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Red face

I think NB and Bk have other plans...
There will most likley be a book and possibly a movie after (Fitzpatrick? the lady doing the DNA) identifies him..
How wonderful for them all .. they will all be shining in the spotlight!

Will I buy the book and watch the movie?

You bet I will!

Quote:
Originally Posted by LaLaw2000 View Post
I sometimes have insomnia and one night about a year ago I read many of the threads. I pored over pics posters would place here to look at and compare. For nights in a row I would puzzle over this case.

This case has fascinated me! At a point, tho, I became pretty convinced that just maybe Benjaman had amnesia, then slowly remembered who he was and just let the story go on and on.

All of you regulars on this case worked long and hard for Benjaman out of the goodness of your hearts. I am sorry that it has ended this way. I feel that Benjamin owes it to all of you to come back and tell his story. I have been at WS for a long time before I registered, and I can safely say that I have never posted with as many truly good people as I have here at WS.

JMO, but I feel all of you who have worked so hard deserve to know who this man is. Maybe no names, but know where he is from and what had happened.

JMO
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Old 04-12-2010, 03:52 PM
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I really had to give it some thought before believing this story was a fraud. The reason was that I could not belive someone would do this to people trying to help him and because nobody has came forward to say "oh I recognize him, he's a scam artist" This did go on for a while before people got wise to it and it is just hard to swallow that someone could do something like this. it is all confusing and hard to imagine and wrap your mind around. maily becasue it is still a mystery, just a different kind now. So if people do not believe it yet, give them time, it will come to them. It's all kinda glaringly obvious to me now. And by all means, if you belive him, continue to help him on your own time.
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:03 PM
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I think NB and Bk have other plans...
There will most likley be a book and possibly a movie after (Fitzpatrick? the lady doing the DNA) identifies him..
How wonderful for them all .. they will all be shining in the spotlight!

Will I buy the book and watch the movie?

You bet I will!
I actually said the same thing to someone off line,Zaha!!!
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Zaha View Post
I think NB and Bk have other plans...
There will most likley be a book and possibly a movie after (Fitzpatrick? the lady doing the DNA) identifies him..
How wonderful for them all .. they will all be shining in the spotlight!

Will I buy the book and watch the movie?

You bet I will!

Fiction is always a good thing.

Especially since there will ALWAYS be speculation if BK refuses to provide any proof his story has any truth to it and he hasn't known his identity since the morning he was found laying next to that dumpster and simply chose not to tell anyone.

Kind of like Dalles McKinseys books.......

JMO
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Old 04-12-2010, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Zaha View Post
I think NB and Bk have other plans...
There will most likley be a book and possibly a movie after (Fitzpatrick? the lady doing the DNA) identifies him..
How wonderful for them all .. they will all be shining in the spotlight!

Will I buy the book and watch the movie?

You bet I will!
Ooooh, is that a
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Old 04-12-2010, 07:34 PM
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Vetted Leads from AASU Flyer thread

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I copied and pasted this from Believe09 .. bolded by me

The Center for Justice Administration at Armstrong University constructed a flyer in late August of 2009, which was distributed via LE channels beginning in September. All of my personal info was on it for contact, so forgive me if I do not post a copy of the flyer here, lol-I could not figure out how to redact it. The preference of NB was that the leads requiring further investigation be forwarded to her and her "team." You will see in this thread that it was relatively easy to vet the majority of them. I wanted you guys to get a sense of what was called in and from where....

Who is her team? I wonder if Benjaman is even part of it.. or if it's a one person team..
I also wonder what was done with the leads.. especially the Minister R. N..

Last edited by Wendy101; 04-12-2010 at 07:37 PM. Reason: spelling
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Old 04-12-2010, 07:47 PM
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Another one of the questions that was never really answered Zaha; despite it being asked several times.

Whatever those leads were seemed to have been sucked into a deep black hole in the galaxy somewhere........ Kind of like the numerous questions asked of Mr. Kyle in the questions thread specifically for him. More of nothing.
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Old 04-12-2010, 07:58 PM
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Vetted Leads from AASU Flyer thread

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I copied and pasted this from Believe09 .. bolded by me

The Center for Justice Administration at Armstrong University constructed a flyer in late August of 2009, which was distributed via LE channels beginning in September. All of my personal info was on it for contact, so forgive me if I do not post a copy of the flyer here, lol-I could not figure out how to redact it. The preference of NB was that the leads requiring further investigation be forwarded to her and her "team." You will see in this thread that it was relatively easy to vet the majority of them. I wanted you guys to get a sense of what was called in and from where....

Who is her team? I wonder if Benjaman is even part of it.. or if it's a one person team..
I also wonder what was done with the leads.. especially the Minister R. N..
I will have to go back and check-I am pretty sure I ccd FBI Bill on all tips that went directly to NB and BK. Some of the folks who made contact called him directly as well. It was pretty transparent FWIW. Some required more digging than others, some were obviously not a match. There were a few that kept me up because I was so sure we finally had a match... Would have been nice given the almost 1000.00 cell phone bill I ended up with, lol!!!!!
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