IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #35

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From all the above posts and thanks, I know I don't have the most popular opinion, but I still don't think the family is involved, if I am wrong I will word bash the hell out of them and jump on the band wagon. :)
 
hambirg said:
But just out of curiosity, what would his motive have been? That's what hangs me up here. I don't see a motive.
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Guilty knowledge could happen by accident and not be anything he intended to do. Knowing the wrong person or something like that. But I don't really see much evidence for it.

I don't believe that theory any more than any other at this point, but I don't believe it any less, either.
 
skeet said:
From all the above posts and thanks, I know I don't have the most popular opinion, but I still don't think the family is involved, if I am wrong I will word bash the hell out of them and jump on the band wagon. :)
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Well, I don't believe the family was involved either and I'm still stuck on MK!
But, I do appreciate seeing other posts that can keep this thread going. There are a lot of ideas and theories being posted that do make sense and that's what makes WS special. Everyone has a right to their opinion.
 
We really need to be furnished with some more information in order for us to effectively assist LE in solving this case. However, the lack of info from LE to the public leads me to believe they have someone on their radar and I hope they are dotting their "I's" and crossing their "T's" (which I suspect is what they are doing) and preparing for an arrest.

regarding the suspicious vehicle lead; I wonder if LE was making sure there was not more than the one vehicle of that type "seen" in the area. I seriously doubt MJK drove such a vehicle as his was a newer model (of course, we do not have knowledge of all vehicles he had access to - but he would most likely require dependable transportation for his job).

I have a feeling there was forensic evidence on either the bicycles and/or E's purse (no evidence to support, just a gut feeling) and wonder if they were awaiting results. If this is the case, MJK could be ruled out because his "f.e." is on file. Could it be that the person responsible has never been arrested and there is no "f.e." of him on file in any databases? Absolutely. JMO
 
watcher9 said:
As a side note, I found another case with two girls missing - one 12 and one 13 - that happened six years earlier than Lyric and Elizabeth. MK was in prison then.

Two girl cousins disappeared from their backyard in San Bernardino County CA on a Sunday evening March 26, 2006.
http://someoneismissing.com/california/tiffany-bartholow-rachelle-marques.htm

Here is their thread on WS.
CA CA - Tiffany Bartholow and Rachel Marques - 2008 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community
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I searched the CA Missing person database and they are not listed. Must have been found.

http://dojapp.doj.ca.gov/missing/default.asp?action=NoHit
 
hambirg said:
But just out of curiosity, what would his motive have been? That's what hangs me up here. I don't see a motive.
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This goes back to a question I asked in the early days - who profits?

If its not sexually motivated then other motives must be considered. (I'm only guessing no assault).

Who benefited from the girls disappearing?

Eta: there could be more than one motive....or one motive everyone agreed on for the "abduction" and another (perhaps hidden) motive for their deaths.
 
SapphireSteel said:
This goes back to a question I asked in the early days - who profits?

If its not sexually motivated then other motives must be considered. (I'm only guessing no assault).

Who benefited from the girls disappearing?

Eta: there could be more than one motive....or one motive everyone agreed on for the "abduction" and another (perhaps hidden) motive for their deaths.
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I understand what you are getting at, but it still doesn't make much sense to me. If there was some type of conspiracy, I would expect that the one with the hidden motive would have wound up dead.

Idk. . .but keeping an open mind.
 
Wonder if the abduction ( or whatever it was) began as a prank, a threat, or even to demand money or drugs as ransom for the "hostage's " release and things just went very wrong ?
Maybe the girls were gagged improperly and they suffocated, or were drugged and they overdosed, or a hit to the head was lethal, panic set in and both of the girls were murdered to cover up a lesser crime ?...
 
dotr said:
Wonder if the abduction ( or whatever it was) began as a prank, a threat, or even to demand money or drugs as ransom for the "hostage's " release and things just went very wrong ?
Maybe the girls were gagged improperly and they suffocated, or were drugged and they overdosed, or a hit to the head was lethal, panic set in and both of the girls were murdered to cover up a lesser crime ?...
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That would explain the way LE seemed quite sure they were alive at first.
 
dotr said:
Wonder if the abduction ( or whatever it was) began as a prank, a threat, or even to demand money or drugs as ransom for the "hostage's " release and things just went very wrong ?
Maybe the girls were gagged improperly and they suffocated, or were drugged and they overdosed, or a hit to the head was lethal, panic set in and both of the girls were murdered to cover up a lesser crime ?...
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Yup makes a whole lot of sense to me.

I think its a lot darker though.

I believe the plan was to "disappear" the girls temporarily. The girls may have even been in on the plan "we're playing a joke on gramma" which would explain their last minute insistence on another bike ride, their rush to get there as suggested by the cctv, and LE saying the girls were still alive maybe disguised.

I don't believe their deaths were accidental though. I believe one party had a secret plan. A Freudian slip by someone close that "x didn't have time to murder them" before they were even found, sealed it for me.

Hopeful loved ones NEVER use the word "murder" unless they know or suspect it. They refuse even think their missing loved one is dead, let alone murdered! In the early days at least.

I'm also aware Lyric was about to be a witness in a trial. She may have been the true target and Lizzie was collateral damage...or, Lizzie may have been witness to something in Lyrics life so had to be eliminated as well.
 
B4igo2it said:
who profits you ask? I am telling you, child *advertiser censored* is BIG money and those involved do not give a darn about who gets harmed in their perverse pleasures.

http://m.wcfcourier.com/news/local/...5936-874d-02f7a343984a.html?mobile_touch=true
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I agree it's big business, but I don't recall ever hearing about a double abduction/double murder being connected to child *advertiser censored*. That's why I don't think this terrible crime is related to child *advertiser censored*. If the girls had been abducted and never found, the child *advertiser censored* motive would seem slightly more feasible to me. JMO.
 
If we think money is the motive, who has profited financially thus far?
 
iamnotagolem said:
If we think money is the motive, who has profited financially thus far?
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I don't think money was the motive. Although I am open to other motives being a possibility, my number 1 question from day 1 is the basis of my number 1 belief...

"Who benefited from Dan changing his plea and ultimately going to prison???"

It is my belief and only my opinion that the girls were kidnapped to ensure that Dan didn't speak or narc on his accomplices, dealers, or suppliers. When he kept going back and forth, changing his plea, prolonging his court appearances, or even narced on someone to get lighter sentence (which hasn't been made public), etc, the girls were killed.

Just curious, has there been any mention of trials, apprehension, or jail time for his known accomplices...

http://www.ktiv.com/story/19152101/search-for-missing-girls-continues

Are they still "on the run", in jail, or home? If and when they were apprehended or sentenced, did they still have time before to kill and dispose of the girls?
 
Marilynilpa said:
I agree it's big business, but I don't recall ever hearing about a double abduction/double murder being connected to child *advertiser censored*. That's why I don't think this terrible crime is related to child *advertiser censored*. If the girls had been abducted and never found, the child *advertiser censored* motive would seem slightly more feasible to me. JMO.
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But when you think about it, what do we hear about child *advertiser censored* and trafficking? We know it's prevalent, but you rarely hear of arrests, etc. Except for the occasional college professor who has it on his work laptop, then reports it stolen when he's due for a new one.....

http://m.kwwl.com/w/main/story/107760538/

Or was that was regular *advertiser censored*....
 
BunnyHop said:
On another case, I need our resident dog expert member name. TIA.

It's funny spelling. SOS!

Granny deux? Please help me out. :loveyou:
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Graihnne Dhu ?? or something close to that, think its Gaelic...
 
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