The Crown v Gerard Baden-Clay, 24th June - Trial Day 9, Week 3

[BJsleuth]

I have feeling that Gerard didn't ask many people back to his house. It was actually a fairly basic house and rented, I think he put in out that he lived at Brookfield (on 10 acres, swimming pool, room for a pony), made it sound a lot better than it was but then used Allison's depression for not being able to ask people to the house socially. In one of the partners statements ? Phil Broom? says something along the lines of "Gerard could never ask people back to his place or take Allison anywhere because of her depression". It really annoys me how her depression is being emphasised and blamed for everything.

Also in one of the partners statements they said Gerard had to resign from Flight Centre because of her depression. Didn't we discuss ages ago that Allison actually had the more senior job, Gerard did something wrong and was asked to leave so Allison felt she had to resign as the right thing to do?

Mr Baden-Clay met his wife while both worked for Flight Centre. She was managing a Flight Centre branch in Ipswich at the time, while he worked as a consultant at the Toombul store.
Mrs Baden-Clay later excelled to become the global head of human resources for Flight Centre, before she and Gerard married in 1997 and then settled in London for about a year.
Following their return to Brisbane, Mr Baden-Clay founded a real estate office with Century 21 in Taringa and his wife stepped out of the workforce to be a stay-at-home mother for her daughters.


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ed-murderer-20120615-20fa5.html#ixzz35YIVQCxS

 

[possumheart]

Yes - he was a few years below me when I was boarding at a "sister school" in Toowoomba. Close call. Phew!

Yes, the boys and girls from Toowooma Grammar and Fairholme college mix in for socials, plays and extracurricular activities. No doubt your buttocks have touched seats that his have, and mine ... :aktion1:

 

[alioop]

FFS!!!! Really defence team, REALLY!?!?? Again questioning every damn expert's years of knowledge?!?

I totally share your frustration here DW. I don't think there has been one expert here that has been 100% positive and adamant in their testimony. It makes everything seem unreliable.

And why did the prosecution not rip the investors to shreds? "...You say you knew the accused and were friends, yet you didn't know he had affairs. You didn't know he had a multitude of other debts he was paying off? That he was hitting up acquaintances in desperation for large sums of money to avoid impending bankruptcy? How good WAS your friendship? Did you every really know him, what else was he keeping from you? Did he crash your car? Why was that do you think? Oh and was he selling your place? Did it need vacuuming and hosing urgently the day ABC went missing?.." Etc.

God I'm trying to keep an open mind here, but speaking in an objective sense, seems the PT are not even trying. WTH is going on here? Seriously!?

I'm not sure I can follow this any more. It's too frustrating.

I understand your frustration but the prosecution are trying to prove a murder case and not get answers to what we would like to know. They are trying to stick to the evidence that is most relevant from each witness and not overload the jury with stuff that is interesting but not relevant. They also don't want to piss the jury off by being attack dogs on their own witnesses. If they do this then the jury gets overloaded with the emotion of this and lose focus on the really important issues. The jury have so much info to consider that the prosecution need to keep it simple for them, well as much as possible.

The defence also have a strategy for each witness, for eg the 3 friends, it was to get them to say Allison suffered depression and also that they had never made a demand to GBC for repayment of their loans, thereby trying to show that GBC was not under financial pressure in that respect.

The prosecution are doing their job and it's slowly unfolding. I must admit though Danny Boyle did the cross examining of the mornings session that I attended and it annoyed me that he started nearly every sentence with UM. Come on Danny, that's a basic no no for a public speaker. You can be trained to not do this!

 

[Total]

Sorry - just because they went to a private boys only high school does not make them "network". Brisbane private high schools are not like Britain's Eton or the US-types as depicted in movies like "SKULLS". The "old boys networks" you talk of are really just a way the fellas may keep in touch or support the schools through fundraising.
You may have some "Old Boys" who may try the "What happened on .... stays on...." but that would be more because of their own lack or morals.


<modsnip>

Sorry JK673 not in my experience. The 'Old Boy's Network' is well and truly alive. Yes, lack of morals and integrity are rife, as are other more obsequious ways of keeping the tradition alive, always attuned to current sequiteurs.

 

[Camp Chair]

As a lighthearted aside... beginning to think this trial has been brought to us by the letter C as well as the number 12. (Which in itself is an anagram of C21 - Century 21).

Cats Claw Creeper
Chinese Elm
Chamber of Commerce
Carport
Captiva
Cheesman
Christ
Cranna

 

[BJsleuth]

I understand your frustration but the prosecution are trying to prove a murder case and not get answers to what we would like to know. They are trying to stick to the evidence that is most relevant from each witness and not overload the jury with stuff that is interesting but not relevant. They also don't want to piss the jury off by being attack dogs on their own witnesses. If they do this then the jury gets overloaded with the emotion of this and lose focus on the really important issues. The jury have so much info to consider that the prosecution need to keep it simple for them, well as much as possible.

The defence also have a strategy for each witness, for eg the 3 friends, it was to get them to say Allison suffered depression and also that they had never made a demand to GBC for repayment of their loans, thereby trying to show that. GBC was not under financial pressure in that respect.

The prosecution are doing their job and it's slowly unfolding. I must admit though Danny Boyle did the cross examining of the mornings session that I attended and it annoyed me that he started nearly every sentence with UM. Come on Danny, that's a basic no no for a public speaker. You can be trained to not do this!

Um, we know someone else who ah, does that too!

 

[whatif?]

Anyone go to court today? I am planning to go tomorrow, do we still need to line up for the overflow room?

There was already a line when I got there this morning at 9, extra seats have been added and you shouldn't have any problem getting a seat. Having said that if I were you I wouldn't get there any later than 9.30.

 

[enthralled]

Yes, the boys and girls from Toowooma Grammar and Fairholme college mix in for socials, plays and extracurricular activities. No doubt your buttocks have touched seats that his have, and mine ... :aktion1:

EEEEEWWWWWWW BC germs lol

I am getting so frustrated with this trial and want to ask the Prosecution for the Dickie's to get their money back. Why aren't they nailing some of these witnesses. It sure doesn't seem to happen like it does on tv. I think even the bc's would be shocked to see that it is done differently than in the Good Wife.

 

[Total]

Trust me. The network is strong. A large established boys school, boarding boys from out west and offshore. Day boys too. Intergenerational loyalty. The Toowoomba Grammar vs Downlands' football matches are a HUGE deal. Boys emerging from Grammar to Brisbane need each other because they aren't from a Brisbane Private school. They need each other because they are almost, but not quite, top shelf - and hence, look after each other. In past years I have heard of OP fixing. The parents pay top dollar to buy their kids some social standing.
Perhaps I should get verified, but not long to go now ...

Thank you Possumheart.:loveyou:

 

[DunnoZo]

Thanks Alioop, you'r posts are always so valuable!:loveyou:

 

[Snails]

Yes, the boys and girls from Toowooma Grammar and Fairholme college mix in for socials, plays and extracurricular activities. No doubt your buttocks have touched seats that his have, and mine ... :aktion1:

Lol. I was at Glennie. Did the TGS/Glennie socials & musicals etc. I must say though that our family and many other boarding students were not the "landed gentry". Many were on Isolated Student "scholarships". It was actually cheaper for us to go to boarding school than to stay at home. The day students were another matter though - mostly the daughters of the local "elite" if there is such a thing in Toowoomba "Keeping Up Appearances".

 

[possumheart]

Awwww, you're just saying that 'cos you're Camp Chair and you are hoping for CCTV evidence - yes?

As a lighthearted aside... beginning to think this trial has been brought to us by the letter C as well as the number 12. (Which in itself is an anagram of C21 - Century 21).

Cats Claw Creeper
Chinese Elm
Chamber of Commerce
Carport
Captiva
Cheesman
Christ
Cranna

- Conference ...

 

[McCoy]

Mr Baden-Clay met his wife while both worked for Flight Centre. She was managing a Flight Centre branch in Ipswich at the time, while he worked as a consultant at the Toombul store.
Mrs Baden-Clay later excelled to become the global head of human resources for Flight Centre, before she and Gerard married in 1997 and then settled in London for about a year.
Following their return to Brisbane, Mr Baden-Clay founded a real estate office with Century 21 in Taringa and his wife stepped out of the workforce to be a stay-at-home mother for her daughters.


Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...ed-murderer-20120615-20fa5.html#ixzz35YIVQCxS

I am sure there was a little glitch in there and Gerard or his team have put "spin" on it

 

[LadyBird1]

I am sure it was stated that it was the week before Allison went missing.
I saw GBC driving this car towards me outside his house before his arrest. I thought it was still impounded....it certainly said that in the paper that morning. A few WS's doubted I had seen it....so I called The Courier Mail to verify. Even they thought it was still with the police. It was really bizarre....I described the damage and the number plate - set of all this hullabaloo about it being the wrong number plate and it was impossible for me to have seen it as it was in the paper that day that the police still had it. Phew it was tough in the early days being a websleuther!

There was a witness last week to:

Screams, Thuds, and car wheels screeching.

Forget about Ms Apps and spider phobia deflection type story; forget Flegg and his possibly politically inspired type story;
This was an entirely different witness. With no apparent ulterior motive either political or financial or even simply maybe wanting a bit of notoriety or fame.
(Maybe wanting to woven into the fabric of this story for posterity.)

Back to the witness and what she heard:

The scream, thud and car wheels screeching was followed later by another scream, thud, and car wheels screeching.

Why are we not discussing these serious events here?
Did she run for her life? After he downed her somewhere.
Did he hit her with a car?
Did he repeat same until she was subdued sufficiently?
Did he drag her by the feet somewhere near the BC house?

 

[PlainJaneDoe]

David Murray &#8207;@TheMurrayD 56s
Defence asks about serotonin syndrome. Prof Drummer agrees it can cause confusion, anxiety agitation, delirium #badenclay


David Murray &#8207;@TheMurrayD 1m
But Prof Drummer says it wouldn't be expected from people taking normal doses of Sertraline #badenclay


Kate Kyriacou &#8207;@KateKyriacou 47s
Defence asks whether Sertraline can cause serotonin syndrome. Prof Drummer agrees it can. #badenclay

The last time I asked my doctor about serotonin syndrome he laughed...

 

[toe]

Lack of a signed agreement doesn't preclude a creditor claiming a debt as long as they can prove it. From what I heard today there were draft agreements drawn up but for some reason that seemed to escape all 3 of GBC's friends they couldn't explain why they didn't sign them. These loans were supposedly paid to the business account and interest payments were initially paid so this is evidence of the loans.

I found it very odd that they did all this due diligence using accounting principles before they handed over their money, and kept a very close eye on the business including approving every single payment from the business for some time. So they were seriously wanting to protect their investments yet they didn't sign agreements. Very odd and unprofessional of these professional men.

Oddly none of them appeared to be concerned about GBC's failure to replay the loan.

 

[HoolyDooly]

Autopsy report page 14 says: 1. Subdural haemorrhage: if this was a true injury it indicates a blunt force impact to the head, probably of a moderate degree of force.

Puts up fight, scratches and hits GBC, knocked unconcious, bleeding from the head, suffocated, put in car. It kinda works.

Could attempt at preventing further screaming, covering the mouth, lead to eventual suffocation ??

 

[JK673]

Sorry JK673 not in my experience. The 'Old Boy's Network' is well and truly alive. Yes, lack of morals and integrity are rife, as are other more obsequious ways of keeping the tradition alive, always attuned to current sequiteurs.

i was also speak8ng from experience and lots of it in all boys and all girls schools in Brisbane .....many in fact

Sent using Tapatalk

 

[Amee]

SSGT CURTIS: Sorry about this. We just need to get this
sorted. What happened to the car, Gerard?

BADEN-CLAY: I had a car accident on Monday.


TRANSCRIPT
OF
POLICE RECORD OF INTERVIEW

 

[whatif?]

I understand your frustration but the prosecution are trying to prove a murder case and not get answers to what we would like to know. They are trying to stick to the evidence that is most relevant from each witness and not overload the jury with stuff that is interesting but not relevant. They also don't want to piss the jury off by being attack dogs on their own witnesses. If they do this then the jury gets overloaded with the emotion of this and lose focus on the really important issues. The jury have so much info to consider that the prosecution need to keep it simple for them, well as much as possible.

The defence also have a strategy for each witness, for eg the 3 friends, it was to get them to say Allison suffered depression and also that they had never made a demand to GBC for repayment of their loans, thereby trying to show that GBC was not under financial pressure in that respect.

The prosecution are doing their job and it's slowly unfolding. I must admit though Danny Boyle did the cross examining of the mornings session that I attended and it annoyed me that he started nearly every sentence with UM. Come on Danny, that's a basic no no for a public speaker. You can be trained to not do this!

BBM IKWYM it's so frustrating isn't it Alioop.