VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #6

[cady]

Perhaps this POI could have had an attorney assist him to the police station to tell what he knows 5 or 6 days ago?

JMO It's possible that he does have an attorney and has talked to LE by now. He probably got an attorney yesterday after the presser, so we shall see. If he has an attorney he has probably clammed up per advice. If there is a presser today or tonight, we may be able to tell whether he has a lawyer or not...........hopefully, lol JMO

 

[leilarose68]

We're back to the smart bit again. And I am still agreeing to disagree.

then you really haven't read about many crimes. many many innocent people get locked up for crimes they didn't do. a lot of these people didn't have lawyers/had really horrible ones.

 

[missgulfsouth]

and plenty of things could have happened after hannah left the bar that have nothing to do with the dreads guy.

sigh.
again.
he can help them out with that part of it, right?

oh, i forgot. he is too smart to do that.

 

[birdbox]

How do you know she didn't then attempt to return home, decided to sleep in some woods, and die of hypothermia? Maybe she committed suicide later that night.

You keep saying it's evidence, I am saying it's not.

Evidence would be her body and then the manner of death. The manner of death is the evidence used to determine whether a crime has been committed.

Hmmm...sleep in woods would be out of character, it would seem for a girl in a sparkle short shirt. She was coherent enough to text a friend saying she was lost, she could have easily sent another text saying, come pick me up, I am at the Shell Station on 14th. I think you are correct in the semantic, literal context that there is no evidence that we, the public are aware of. However, LE don't usually waste a bunch of resources on a person they think fell asleep in the woods, or was depressed enought to commit suicide in the woods. I think the interest in the this board pertaining to this girl is perhaps that all of this is OUT OF CHARACTER for her to be missing, even though she was drunk. Compounded by the fact that she was seen talking to a guy who DID NOT come forward even after REPEATED requests by family and LE for anyone who saw her to come forward. Any logical person could summize that foul play is involved here at this point. I am thinking....except for those who stick to an entirely literal interpretation of everything, and in that case, why come to this forum in the first place?? If I thought this thread was about a drunk girl who fell in a river or committed suicide, I wouldn't waste my time here...that would be very non-interesting to me personally.

 

[darmela]

What I question is the crime part. Hannah could have died of alcohol poisoning and JM covered that up instead of calling 911, kwim? We just don't know.

I think the alcohol poisoning is an interesting point since one of the symptoms is "mental confusion." Maybe she really did feel like she was lost when she sent that text message. People do stupid things when they are inebriated, which might explain why she briefly hooked up with Dreads. After that, I can't tell you what happened but I'm sure that the police are working hard to resolve this case.

 

[absentia]

LE stated at the press conference they have lots of stuff they aren't releasing. They said they were releasing what they could so we could understand why they ended up at the apartment they did (not those exact words). LEA encouraged media to release his name IMO


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

true too. They had enough from removal of the vehicle to get a warrant for the house. so something of hers was in the car. phone? shirt? something very indicative of foul play. but why would it still be there a week later? I keep changing my mind about this.

 

[leilarose68]

I don't know if the description changed in a more recent press conference, but two days ago WG was referred to as a "cooperative witness for now" per LE:

'Person of Interest' Sought in Disappearance of University of Virginia Student Hannah Graham
Sep 18, 2014, 5:30 PM ET
"The man [WG] called into the police tip line hours before the surveillance footage that showed him following Graham was released. He went to the police station at 10:15 p.m. Wednesday night.'Right now we're seeing him as a cooperative witness,' Capt. Gary Pleasants told ABC News referring to the man seen on the video. 'He told police that he was following Ms. Graham as she looked to be somewhat physically distressed and he wanted to make sure she got safely to wherever she was going,' police said in a statement."
http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-university-virginia-student-hannah-graham-man/story?id=25592387

'cooperative witness for now' is not the same as 'right now we're seeing him as a cooperative witness.' the former seems more casual to me.

 

[missgulfsouth]

then you really haven't read about many crimes. many many innocent people get locked up for crimes they didn't do. a lot of these people didn't have lawyers/had really horrible ones.

My education and history speak for themselves, leilarose.

 

[leilarose68]

sigh.
again.
he can help them out with that part of it, right?

oh, i forgot. he is too smart to do that.

what are you even talking about?

 

[popsicle]

He did speak with police the morning of the search, right? Perhaps he did give them his side of the story and we just don't know about it. Maybe?

He spoke with them...he was not interviewed.

 

[DocBrew]

I can't believe that some folks can still reason that this cat is not the perp. That's some cognitive dissonance right there. JMO.

 

[leilarose68]

My education and history speak for themselves, leilarose.

then you should know better. anyone involved in a crime situation should lawyer up.

 

[leilarose68]

I can't believe that some folks can still reason that this cat is not the perp. That's some cognitive dissonance right there. JMO.

when you've looked at lots of cases you realize that things are not always what they seem, and it's a disservice to the case to have tunnel vision.

 

[absentia]

Hmmm...sleep in woods would be out of character, it would seem for a girl in a sparkle short shirt. She was coherent enough to text a friend saying she was lost, she could have easily sent another text saying, come pick me up, I am at the Shell Station on 14th. I think you are correct in the semantic, literal context that there is no evidence that we, the public are aware of. However, LE don't usually waste a bunch of resources on a person they think fell asleep in the woods, or was depressed enought to commit suicide in the woods. I think the interest in the this board pertaining to this girl is perhaps that all of this is OUT OF CHARACTER for her to be missing, even though she was drunk. Compounded by the fact that she was seen talking to a guy who DID NOT come forward even after REPEATED requests by family and LE for anyone who saw her to come forward. Any logical person could summize that foul play is involved here at this point. I am thinking....except for those who stick to an entirely literal interpretation of everything, and in that case, why come to this forum in the first place?? If I thought this thread was about a drunk girl who fell in a river or committed suicide, I wouldn't waste my time here...that would be very non-interesting to me personally.

I think her behavior before she disappeared seems out of character from what I've heard about her character.

 

[Fireweed]

no, it's not evidence of a crime. they don't have all the footage. they don't know that hannah got into the car with this guy. evidence is that which helps to prove something. anything could have happened after they left that bar. all it's evidence of is that they were together at that time.

It would be if it were a separate night from the night she went missing. Circumstantial evidence does not exist in isolation. I keep reading the argument that it is not a crime to have had a drink with HG (well, actually technically it is) or that this guy talking to her is not evidence that he killed her, or that he was just seen with her at 2 am and that is not evidence. Yes, all those things taken in isolation are only evidence of what they are - i.e. a man being seen with a woman. The thing that makes it evidence is that all this happened right before HG went missing. Had it happened three nights earlier, then I would agree it is *advertiser censored* evidence. But JL was ostensibly the last person HG was seen with, and she was drunk and it was 2 am, and after witnesses saw JL's car drive off, HG was never seen again, either in person or on camera.

Yes, those little events - having a drink with her, talking to her - are not evidence that JL did something to HG. What is evidence is that all that happened about 15 minutes before HG was never seen again. That is what makes it evidence, and that is why LE (the professionals here), zeroed in on JL.

 

[leilarose68]

I think her behavior before she disappeared seems out of character from what I've heard about her character.

yep. but you can't rule things out entirely. plenty of people do random things you would never expect.

 

[libby5264]

He spoke with them...he was not interviewed.

This is what I don't get. If you have enough for a warrant, how do you not have enough to bring him in for questioning

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Does poi have a cell phone? Can they ping it for that night? What time did he arrive home do we know? Le is surely working on all that info I'm sure.

What about Hannah's cell phone? Has LE said anything about it?

 

[DocBrew]

when you've looked at lots of cases you realize that things are not always what they seem, and it's a disservice to the case to have tunnel vision.

There's no tunnel vision here. I let the facts lead me. My imagination isn't as vivid, sorry. JMO.

 

[Lava]

when you've looked at lots of cases you realize that things are not always what they seem, and it's a disservice to the case to have tunnel vision.

Seriously. There is no evidence in front of US that says he is without a doubt the perp. He is not even a suspect to us right now. And how many times have we seen LE and the public focus on one person who turns out to be a dead end?