VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #9

[bakerlady]

We know anecdotally that she knew McGrady's well as her ski team often went there. So once there she should have felt a feeling of starting to reorient herself (if she had been lost). She knew she was at a safe spot and could have asked the bouncer/doorman for directions. She didn't. I think the police know where she was between the time she left the apartments and when she arrived at McGradys. I think going there was intentional - not a chance happening after lost wandering for an hour. She doesn't act like someone relieved to have found a familiar landmark. IMO she was looking for someone. She looked on the patio then asked the bouncer if she could look inside (but was denied entrance). I also don't see her as stumbling drunk. Some of the McGrady video clips have been edited to make it look like she steps off the curb then back on the curb. That is spliced - she walks off the curb and is off camera for a couple minutes then returns. I am still undecided if her trip down the mall was intentional or if she became disoriented after leaving McGrady's.

I 100% agree. There is no way she was lost. Her own parents even said she was very familiar with the area.

 

[Topcat]

That happened to a guy I used to work with. He was stopped because he looked like a guy wanted for car theft and drug running, and when he produced ID to show he owned the car, they ran him in for identity theft as well. And when he got the car back, they had totally trashed it -- ripped open all the seats, ripped the lining off the door panels, even cut open the spare tire looking for hidden drugs. And there was nothing he could do. Apparently there's no requirement that they return your property in good condition. (Yes, race was a factor...)

there is reasonable expectation one receives their vehicle back in the same condition it was taken away from them if no criminal misdeeds were detected. IOW,he/she could sue.

 

[Cramoisy]

I am pretty sure the sheriff (not Longo) said, in answer to a question, that they have video footage of the two of them together after leaving Tempos (not in the act of leaving Tempos).

The question was 'do you have surveillance video of them leaving the restaurant' and the response was 'we do have them together after they left Tempo restaurant so he's still with her at that time '.

 

[Emaa]

More from Longo on the case:

On Matthew coming into the police station, speaking briefly with a lawyer and leaving without answering questions: "Honestly, it's very bizarre. It's certainly nothing that I've experienced in 33 years in this business."

http://www.today.com/news/missing-u...-actions-very-bizarre-police-chief-2D80165444

Maybe not exactly, but I'm sure in 33 years he's had suspects ask for a lawyer and then refuse to talk and/or leave after. It makes no sense that they'd assist him in getting an attorney if they didn't believe he was there to talk to him.
IMO JLM went into police station and told them he'd speak if he had an attorney. At that point, they can't question him. Then attorney says hell no you're not talking and they leave.

Rather than leading questions like Lauer put forth, I'd like to see a reporter ask "What did JLM say when he walked into the station?"

 

[Jmm124567]

We know anecdotally that she knew McGrady's well as her ski team often went there. So once there she should have felt a feeling of starting to reorient herself (if she had been lost). She knew she was at a safe spot and could have asked the bouncer/doorman for directions. She didn't. I think the police know where she was between the time she left the apartments and when she arrived at McGradys. I think going there was intentional - not a chance happening after lost wandering for an hour. She doesn't act like someone relieved to have found a familiar landmark. IMO she was looking for someone. She looked on the patio then asked the bouncer if she could look inside (but was denied entrance). I also don't see her as stumbling drunk. Some of the McGrady video clips have been edited to make it look like she steps off the curb then back on the curb. That is spliced - she walks off the curb and is off camera for a couple minutes then returns. I am still undecided if her trip down the mall was intentional or if she became disoriented after leaving McGrady's.

I have the exact same view as you

Her behavior does not scream super drunk

She went to McGrady's looking for someone based on her behavior there

I think she was looking for a bar and was meeting 1 or more people

Why do I think a bar?

Because not only her behavior at McGrady's but the fact that she is walking mainly on main roads if she would be looking for a house party she would be on side streets in a residential area.

I think there is a good chance she went to the outdoor mall intentionally looking at the bars down there

I still wonder if maybe she had known JM and maybe that is who she was meeting?

This is the route she may have walked:

 

[MLE]

Really? In 33 years he's never had a POI lawyer up and leave? I find that bizzare from what I'm learning of how things work in the US!

Yeah, I think he's telling another tall tale.

 

[ZsaZsa]

One more time for those who missed it:
These are the arrests/charges for Jesse Leroy Matthew Jr (including all the typos and misspellings of his name) that I found for City of Charlottesville (Circuit & General District Courts) and the same for Albemarle County.
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...sville-13-Sept-2014-7&p=10987592#post10987592
"...in Albemarle he had only 15 traffic offenses but he Charlottesville he had three serious charges. Two were nolle'd and one was appealed and went up to the circuit court.

GC09005874-00 MATTHEW, JESSE LEORY; JR 04/22/2010 01:00 PM ASSAULT: (MISDEMEANOR)
GC09005873-00 MATTHEW, JESSE LEORY; JR. 04/22/2010 01:00 PM ATTEMPT - GRND LARCENY: $200+ NOT PERSON
Both occurred on 6/4/2009 both were nolle'd
Note the dyslexic typo on both those charges but it is him DOB 12/14

and this in 2010 which was appealed up to the circuit court on 4/30/2010
GC10001889-00 MATTHEW, JESSE LEROY; JR 04/22/2010 01:00 PM TRESPASS AFTER FORBIDDEN
he was listed as living in Keswick, VA at time of incident 3/17/2010 (That's St Patty's Day, right?)
at circuit court level:
CaseNumber Defendant Charge Hear Date Status
CR10000129-01 MATTHEW, JESSE LEROY; JR TRESPASS AFTER FORBIDDEN 08/12/2010 Trial - Judge With Witness
The appeal was withdrawn in August 2010 he was found guilty and paid fines and fees.
the rest of the charges in C-ville were 7 traffic offenses
adding these two with the 12/14 DOB and typo of MatthewS
GT04005868-00 MATTHEWS, JESSE LEROY; JR 08/05/2004 12:00 AM FAIL TO OBEY TRAFFIC SIGNAL
GT14000741-00 MATTHEWS, JESSE LEROY; JR 02/06/2014 10:30 AM 39/25 SP"

What does 'Trespass after forbidden' entail? Does that mean someone asked him to leave their house/premises and he refused?

 

[carbuff]

there is reasonable expectation one receives their vehicle back in the same condition it was taken away from them if no criminal misdeeds were detected. IOW,he/she could sue.

Apparently not. The case was thrown out of court.

 

[Jmm124567]

I 100% agree. There is no way she was lost. Her own parents even said she was very familiar with the area.

When did her parents say that?

 

[cady]

I have the exact same view as you

Her behavior does not scream super drunk

She went to McGrady's looking for someone based on her behavior there

I think she was looking for a bar and was meeting 1 or more people

Why do I think a bar?

Because not only her behavior at McGrady's but the fact that she is walking mainly on main roads if she would be looking for a house party she would be on side streets in a residential area.

I think there is a good chance she went to the outdoor mall intentionally looking at the bars down there

I still wonder if maybe she had known JM and maybe that is who she was meeting?

This is the route she may have walked:
View attachment 59621

SHE WAS NOT ADMITTED INTO McGRADY's JMO

 

[jamicat]

Really? In 33 years he's never had a POI lawyer up and leave? I find that bizzare from what I'm learning of how things work in the US!

I don't believe Longo. It happens all of the time. Especially in a a college town. Lawyers nearly always tell clients in these cases not to offer up info unless you have to do so.

I also do not understand why people do not believe Hannah was so thoroughly lost when it has pretty much been shown that where she wanted to be was the opposite direction from where she started her journey. She was very drunk or otherways disorinted from the initial reports. There was a map that was released showing how she turned her self around direction wise. She was truly completely lost and not in good state of mind. A sitting duck for someone to pick her up.

 

[Emaa]

could it mean witness statements (bouncer) and not video? or was it specifically said by LE "video"?

Without watching it for a 3rd time, IIRC it was witnessed.

 

[carbuff]

Do we know for a fact that the white guy who went to police about HG is the one who ducks into the alcove and follows her? Or could he be the larger heavyset guy at the other end of the court, or one of the younger guys in the group?

 

[bakerlady]

This is my post from the last thread. I transcribed a portion of the press conference from yesterday.

These are Chief Longo's exact words. BBM and () by me.

Chief Longo from the press conference.

"And then she finds her way to second street and market right there next to Felini's restaurant....

An eyewitness saw her make that turn, she comes south bound on second street.

We know that because surveillance cameras tell us that, at least two. (the same two we have seen, Sal's and Tuel)

And in one of those images I thought it was a reflection but we look closer and see she is walking with a man.

I believe that man was Jesse Matthew. I really do.

I believe Jesse Matthew and Hannah found themselves at the Tempo Restaurant. I believe that.

Eyewitnesses told us so.

I believe Hannah left Felini's restaurtant with Jesse Matthew. (I think he misspoke and meant Tempo but JMO)

In fact I believe that Jesse Matthew was the last person Hannah was seen with before she vanished off the face of the earth.

"

Still no mention of the video from Tempo which I am still convinced does not exist despite the link Popsicle provided. Maybe I'm just being stubborn tho...

 

[katiewonders]

I'm guessing that the POIs begin answering questions and then they request the lawyer.

Really? In 33 years he's never had a POI lawyer up and leave? I find that bizzare from what I'm learning of how things work in the US!

 

[I Must Break You]

SHE WAS NOT ADMITTED INTO McGRADY's JMO

Yeah we know she wasn't admitted into McGradys but appears she may have tried to be. Also it appears she was looking into the outside patio. That's why I believe she was looking for someone(s) that night and had reason to believe that they may be at McGradys or at Tempos and why she ended up at both locations. I don't think she was lost at all.

 

[wendle83]

Stupid question here. How does one go about getting arrest information on people? Do you have to physically go to the courts? Or, is there an online database to search for such things?

 

[Emaa]

Yeah we know she wasn't admitted into McGradys but appears she may have tried to be. Also it appears she was looking into the outside patio. That's why I believe she was looking for someone(s) that night and had reason to believe that they may be at McGradys or at Tempos and why she ended up at both locations. I don't think she was lost at all.

I do remember Longo saying she was turned away from McGrady's.

 

[cady]

This is my post from the last thread. I transcribed a portion of the press conference from yesterday.

These are Chief Longo's exact words. BBM and () by me.



Still no mention of the video from Tempo which I am still convinced does not exist despite the link Popsicle provided. Maybe I'm just being stubborn tho...

Video would not be IN Tempo, it would be video of the outside of Tempo. JMO

 

[distracted]

Really? In 33 years he's never had a POI lawyer up and leave? I find that bizzare from what I'm learning of how things work in the US!

I think he was saying that in 33 years he had not had a POI walk into the station, ask for a lawyer, speak to the lawyer and then leave. From my experience, that is unusual. And, FWIW, we do not know that he lawyered up. LE has not stated publicly that he has retained a lawyer. He spoke to a lawyer.