JLM: Morgan Harrington/Fairfax Rape Victim - *Forensic Link* to MH #2

[GhostGhost]

'
Maybe Jesse's just is the personal driver and body transporter for a band of serial killers/rapists.

And he was bringing them in to confess. He was probably going to bring them all back from Mexico to stand trial when he got there.

There's a one hell of a spread between possible and probable. The Probablity is Jesse has lots and lots of Splaining to do.

MOO.


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[jamicat]

Which is why public education needs to change somehow. I'm learning now that we were told he was a local, we were told he would strike again, we were told we'd never suspect he could do anything like this. I didn't learn any of this then.

Folks this time didn't even know they were being asked to search their properties.

We now know (hindsight, I realize) that his friends teased him and he responded unusually to it (and then noticed he was changing his appearance!).... The bouncer didn't "worry" enough to report him to LE but did kick him out of the bar. The freakin' history with the two schools. The dropped assault charges.

Where was the failure? What can we do differently?

Are we really that busy, that wrapped up in ourselves and our own lives, that we don't pay attention? How do we change that? How do they get us to pay attention?

A lot of things were said. The things that now fit are coming to the forefront. That MH's body was found where it was, pointed to someone local. Seriously, who would find the way to that place? Only someone who knew the access points. Had MH been found by some dumpster or just by the side of the road, it could have been a passerby who then dumped the body on his way out of the area, but where MH was found made it pretty clear the perp knew the area pretty danged well. That DNA from the MH case matched that of an earlier rape pointed to a serial rapist/killer.

Perhaps LE did not sound the alarm that Charlottesville was housing a serial killer. Perhaps, if it was really driven home by LE with media to fuel it, which is where we are now, someone might have called in JM as a possibility. But the MO of the Fairfax rape and that of MH are quite different. You wouldn't connect some boor who is always on the make, looking for someone drunk enough to go with him, with someone who jumps random people walking down the street. Whole different scene, IMO. Not saying it couldn't be the same perp...may well be here, and I'm sure it's happened before, but the two cases seem very different to me. Hannah's case is strikingly similar to MH's; extremely intoxicated or other wise incapacitated young women needing rides, and the perp shows up ready to offer said ride, and the girls willingly accept. It took this case to give LE the break needed to find the person who likely killed MH. And it took this case, to bring JM's behavior into a horrifying perspective, that he was not just some harmless buffoon that liked to make a spectacle of himself hitting on women and getting lucky every once in a while when found someone agreeable to his attentions.

 

[joerose]

There is another site that says the dna was found on the tshirt that was found on the bush. I don't think I am allowed to tell what the name of that site is.

 

[joerose]

With all due respect, that link does not support any fact that DNA was found on Morgan's body. No where has LE stated DNA was found on Morgan's body. All that link does is show that according to Morgan's parents DNA was found on her body. As some one else has posted: "Whether they are paraphrasing, using exact words, have assumptions in there themselves is not fully known." While I am not questioning what they have said, they are not LE.

Thank you for reposting this. I remember reading it back then and it definitely changes the theory that the dna was found on the tshirt as some places have been reporting.

 

[Aeronomy]

If the DNA that's connected to the 2005 case were found on Morgan's shirt, then it's likely LE wouldn't just come out and state that information. I think they'd rather have the perp unsure where the DNA was found as it relates to Morgan than to know if it was only found on her shirt. I can certainly see why they wouldn't come out and blatantly say exactly where it was found.

 

[cluciano63]

People who knew JM's MO with women probably thought he likes to be in local places where he was known. May have never occurred to them that he would be out on his own, prowling. If Morgan had been spotted near the mall or in a local bar, they may have made the connection back then.

 

[dotr]

It is not hard to imagine JM's long and plentiful hair, being left behind like a calling card, imo...

 

[Evie Ivy Over]

I can't see how any DNA would have held up at the scene or on MH's body. When you read about collection of samples for forensic DNA testing, it is emphasized that a lot of care is required in order to retain the integrity of the samples. With everything at the scene being exposed to the elements for a good bit of time, what could possibly have been left? Unless whoever took her body to that field went back and left fresh evidence, it seems pretty certain that the DNA is from MH's shirt.

 

[Heroine]

With all due respect, that link does not support any fact that DNA was found on Morgan's body. No where has LE stated DNA was found on Morgan's body. All that link does is show that according to Morgan's parents DNA was found on her body. As some one else has posted: "Whether they are paraphrasing, using exact words, have assumptions in there themselves is not fully known." While I am not questioning what they have said, they are not LE.

While they raise awareness, the Murphys and Harringtons also want answers. DNA found on Morgan's body matched an open sexual assault case in Fairfax County, but the man's identity remains unknown.

http://www.newsplex.com/home/headlines/Families-of-Morgan-Harrington-and-Alexis-Murphy-Join-Forces-to-Save-the-Next-Girl-228257121.html

A man's DNA was found at the crime scene, which matched the DNA found during a rape investigation from 2005.

http://www.turnto10.com/story/26431210/morgan-harrington-murder-case-to-appear-on-unsolved-mysteries

DNA found on Miss Harrington's body - discovered in a field three months after she disappeared while walking to a concert - was also identical to samples taken from a victim of sexual assault in 2005.

http://news.sky.com/story/1344748/hannah-graham-suspect-linked-to-2009-murder

Morgan disappeared in 2009 and her body was found three months later, hidden at a remote farm. DNA evidence of her killer, found on her remains, has since been linked to a 2005 rape case of a Fairfax woman who survived the attack. - See more at: http://www.coloradonewsday.com/news...an-was-found-guilty.html#sthash.l5xs2ecu.dpuf

http://www.coloradonewsday.com/news/regional/78959-hannah-graham-suspect-jesse-matthew-set-to-be-tested-for-possible-dna-link-to-2013-murder-in-which-another-man-was-found-guilty.html

If the forensic evidence that connects the two cases holds true, there is likely another victim linked to the suspect. Virginia State Police investigating Harrington's death in 2009 determined that DNA on her body connected the perpetrator to a 2005 sexual assault of a woman in Fairfax, Va.

https://gma.yahoo.com/suspect-hannah-graham-disappearance-tied-2009-murder-police-171400200--abc-news-topstories.html
Edited to add that we have gone over this topic 1000 times, somehow it always goes back to this. DNA that was on the Tshirt was Morgan's thats how they know it is indeed hers. Also his DNA might be on it as well, but as you see the DNA came from her body. LE is not going to come right out and say these things, Morgan's parents however, have said them many times that I remember, and I don't think that if your child died in such a manner you'd be making assumptions, you would know what happened to your child. You would/could never forget. JMO
BBM

 

[ksj3]

It is not hard to imagine JM's long and plentiful hair, being left behind like a calling card, imo...

Only in 2009 it wasn't that long and plentiful. He had short dreads, per the taxi pic in 2010.

 

[2Hope4]

This is all just so sad. It really is!


As for the DNA, it is just my OPINION that the DNA COULD have come from her panties. I often wonder about Morgan's shirt as well, meaning, could the perp have used her shirt to clean himself afterwards? I'm not expert on DNA. Heck I know what it means, but that's about it. I wonder how long it would last in the bright sun? Would heat or cold affect it? Would the sun's rays break down DNA? I don't know.

I have a good feeling that LE has MUCH more than we could imagine, and they'll connect these dots, and solve this case and others! I have hope that whatever was found at the searches of JLM linking him to Morgan is something like the 'smoking gun'...not saying I think a gun as used, just that the saying 'smoking gun'. Whether it's Morgan's necklace, a lock of her hair, something that in no way could be anyone's but Morgan's! And JLM had no innocent reason to have whatever it is!!!

I don't even know if what I wrote even makes sense!! OFFTOPIC...we're under severe weather warnings...lots of heavy rain, strong winds, flooding, and I think the potential for tornadoes for finally passed, but it's still awful weather.

I

 

[2Hope4]

Only in 2009 it wasn't that long and plentiful. He had short dreads, per the taxi pic in 2010.

True. But if I had the chance, I'd love to pull each of those dreads out by their roots until he started talking and telling the darn truth!! Grrrr!!!!

 

[GhostGhost]

http://www.newsplex.com/home/headlines/Families-of-Morgan-Harrington-and-Alexis-Murphy-Join-Forces-to-Save-the-Next-Girl-228257121.html

http://www.turnto10.com/story/26431210/morgan-harrington-murder-case-to-appear-on-unsolved-mysteries

http://news.sky.com/story/1344748/hannah-graham-suspect-linked-to-2009-murder


http://www.coloradonewsday.com/news/regional/78959-hannah-graham-suspect-jesse-matthew-set-to-be-tested-for-possible-dna-link-to-2013-murder-in-which-another-man-was-found-guilty.html

https://gma.yahoo.com/suspect-hannah-graham-disappearance-tied-2009-murder-police-171400200--abc-news-topstories.html
Edited to add that we have gone over this topic 1000 times, somehow it always goes back to this. DNA that was on the Tshirt was Morgan's thats how they know it is indeed hers. Also his DNA might be on it as well, but as you see the DNA came from her body. LE is not going to come right out and say these things, Morgan's parents however, have said them many times that I remember, and I don't think that if your child died in such a manner you'd be making assumptions, you would know what happened to your child. You would/could never forget. JMO
BBM

I think Jesse must've read this post before fleeing for Mexico.

Forrest Gump doesn't have anything on him and his poppin' up with Rape victims and missing girls.

MOO.

 

[hambirg]

It's a shame that we are still perseverating over this. This is now proof by semantics. I am not going to lob sources back and forth anymore. DNA "on Morgan" does not literally translate to on her remains. It may, but it does not matter.

MH's death is an open, criminal investigation. The investigators cannot reveal where any forensic evidence was obtained, as it would be a fundamental breach to the integrity of the investigation. I will post a supporting statement from Corinne Geller (yet again ), she is the spokesperson for the VSA.


She declines to say exactly when police received the results or even what type of forensic evidence was tested. - DATE April 2010 when released to public that Pantera tshirt found on campus was MH's.

http://www.readthehook.com/67960/pantera-find-shirt-15th-street-was-morgan-harringtons


Further at this time, they were not even finished processing DNA samples from MH's remains.


According to Virginia State Police spokesperson Corinne Geller, the forensic testing on the shirt wasn't complete until the last few weeks–- law enforcement did not know the results in January, when the shirt was first publicly reported, she says–-and police are not releasing any details on the condition of the shirt. Police are still waiting on forensic testing results from Morgan's remains and Anchorage Farm, Geller says, -DATE April 2010

http://www.readthehook.com/67960/pantera-find-shirt-15th-street-was-morgan-harringtons

DNA is not the Holy Grail of any case. It can be weak or strong evidence. DNA at a crime scene or on the deceased does not prove murder. It only shows proximity of two people. Finally, MH could have other DNA on her and it does not come with a date time stamp. So HM could have encountered the perp somewhere else or on another day. It would be great if there were chemical changes that could be traced with it and yield clues.

We won't know unless they charge JM in Morgan's case, so let's just wait and see if LE decides to release further info. Don't mean to be snarky, but seems like it doesn't really matter right now as it's importance is contextual to other evidence gathered and presented at trial.

I can't see how any DNA would have held up at the scene or on MH's body. When you read about collection of samples for forensic DNA testing, it is emphasized that a lot of care is required in order to retain the integrity of the samples. With everything at the scene being exposed to the elements for a good bit of time, what could possibly have been left? Unless whoever took her body to that field went back and left fresh evidence, it seems pretty certain that the DNA is from MH's shirt.

The DNA from Morgan's case was linked to the DNA from the Fairfax case because is was run through CODIS. If the DNA only came from the shirt, it would not even be allowed to be entered into CODIS!

It was found in a bush, on a public street. It could have been touched by any number of people walking by. In order to be entered into CODIS it must be forensic evidence.

Are there additional requirements for forensic (casework) DNA records?
A: Forensic (casework) DNA samples are considered crime scene evidence. To be classified as a forensic unknown record, the DNA sample must be attributed to the putative perpetrator.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/lab/biometric-analysis/codis/codis-and-ndis-fact-sheet

If that DNA came from a shirt that had been on a public street for gawd knows how long, it could not have been entered into the CODIS system. The only DNA on that shirt that has any evidentiary value is Morgan's. Any other DNA found on that shirt could not have been entered into CODIS, it could belong to anyone.

The forensic link may only prove that the perp is or African American descent. Then what? DNA evidence is not by any means a slam dunk.

<modsnip>

Again, the DNA match was made through CODIS. Do you really believe that a partial sample that only showed that the perpetrator was an AA would even remotely qualify for CODIS? If what you suggest even was the case, then why weren't there thousands and thousands of matches? <modsnip>

 

[littlemaybaby]

The forensic link may only prove that the perp is or African American descent. Then what? DNA evidence is not by any means a slam dunk.

We already knew the perp was African American from the description the 2005 victim provided. I *highly* doubt that VSP would notify the Harringtons and the press about a "significant break" in the MH case if it was that they determined the perp was AA. We have known that for several years now (since DNA confirmed a match between the 2005 victim and MH).

I do appreciate the point I think you are trying to make - which is we need to wait and see what this link is before determining that it is going to make the entire case convicting JLM, but I do give LE enough credit to think that they wouldn't have given the Harrington family this new found hope over bringing Morgan's killer to justice without something fairly substantial. I could, of course, be wrong.

 

[wall0214]

There was some doubt that Morgan's parents were at the crime scene at the time that investigators discovered Morgan's remains. They were at the crime scene before the remains were removed from the scene:

"Harrington’s parents, who previously provided investigators with their missing daughter’s dental records and presumably samples for DNA comparison, were enroute to the body recovery site to assist in the identification of the remains."

http://www.livesecure.org/missing-va-tech-student-morgan-harrington-found/

http://www.live5news.com/story/13901965/morgans-parents-to-visit-crime-scene-tuesday
One year ago tomorrow, a farmer discovered Harrington's remains. But Morgan's parents hadn't been to the actual site until today. The moment they waited for brought on tears of heartache.

Gil and Dan Harrington embraced at the site that once held the remains of their 20-year-old daughter, Morgan.

"I wanted to be in this place one time, just one time," said Gil Harrington.

That's a pretty major detail - whether the Harrington's had been to the site previously - I think the Harrington's would have corrected that info. Also, again, it would be very unorthodox for the Harrington's to go to a crime scene to identify remains.

 

[wall0214]

http://www.live5news.com/story/13901965/morgans-parents-to-visit-crime-scene-tuesday
One year ago tomorrow, a farmer discovered Harrington's remains. But Morgan's parents hadn't been to the actual site until today. The moment they waited for brought on tears of heartache.

Gil and Dan Harrington embraced at the site that once held the remains of their 20-year-old daughter, Morgan.

"I wanted to be in this place one time, just one time," said Gil Harrington.

That's a pretty major detail - whether the Harrington's had been to the site previously - I think the Harrington's would have corrected that info. Also, again, it would be very unorthodox for the Harrington's to go to a crime scene to identify remains.

http://www.cavalierdaily.com/article/2011/01/harringtons-visit-anchorage
This Wednesday marked the one-year anniversary of the recovery of Virginia Tech student Morgan Dana Harrington's remains on Anchorage Farm in Albemarle County.

<modsnip>

The Harringtons announced their plans for the walk-through last week in an e-mail.

"In the morning at 9am we will meet at the VSP office in the Fontaine Research Park and follow Morgan's path from University of Virginia's John Paul Jones Arena to Copeley Road Bridge and finally to the field at Anchorage Farm where Morgan was 'disposed' of," Gil wrote. "This will be the first time Dan and I have been allowed on the site, and we are grateful for the opportunity."
<modsnip>

 

[cluciano63]

OT-ish, on a crime show I am watching now, a man was matched by DNA to the murder of a girl, Sofia Silva, and he was in jail on another charge when the Lisk sisters were murdered (both crimes in Spotsllvania, VA.) Due to the crimes being so similar, they re-tested DNA that VA crime lab had matched to Sofia and found it was NOT a match, but that whoever killed Sofia, had killed the Lisk girls. People in crime lab were fired, etc.

Anyway, kind of shocking. The presumed killer of all three girls, Richard Evonitz,shot himself when cornered by police after another girl was raped and escaped.

Anyway, the DNA match (later proven wrong) had not been enough to charge the first guy. LE arrested him for minor charges that would keep him locked up for a year while they tried to build a case. So DNA alone if not usually enough it seems.

 

[Harmony 2]

This thread is long so a new thread was created. Please move on over when you are ready. This thread will close in 10 minutes.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...orensic-Link*-to-MH-3&p=11089445#post11089445

 

[otto]

There is another site that says the dna was found on the tshirt that was found on the bush. I don't think I am allowed to tell what the name of that site is.

Thank you! That is what I was wondering. There are too many people that are claiming, without any link or source, that the 2005 rape is connected with a shirt for it to be one mistaken person. Something else is going on here ... something along the lines of trying to distance Jesse from the criminal offenses, trying to deny that there are any facts in this five year old case.

It doesn't matter how often the facts are posted over the last few weeks, there's always someone else that comes with the same misconception and posts it as though it's a given fact. I'm guessing that, along side the claim that the rape is matched to a shirt, there's little support of the victim's family. From my perspective, it seems that mis-stating the facts is hand in hand with casting doubt on the parents, and suggesting that "we know nothing".

No need to post the link ... no interested in discussions based on wild theory, or pretending we are deaf, dumb, and blind.