Hannah Graham: Remains Identified

[Sachi]

Correct me if I'm wrong on who said this but I think it was Morgan Harrington's mother who rightly (imo) pointed out that sometimes it's not enough for a woman to do things to protect herself, sometimes they need help. For example, a woman can't always find girlfriends to walk her home from the grocery store late at night (or bar or corner store or whatever), nor can she always afford a cab or bus. Women can't control what other people are going to do to them and there's only so much that can be done to protect yourself. Everyone risks their own safety EVERY DAY in a multitude of ways, most are just not unlucky enough to lose their lives. To give an example of this, more people will be killed in cars this year than by serial killers. Should we tell everyone to stop driving? Expecting women to expect to be raped or murdered while simply walking around is not reasonable. Everyone takes chances and some people can't avoid it. Just my opinion.

Well said- so frustrating. I find myself not just incredibly sad but really really pissed off about Hannah , so angry for her suffering and eminent death at the hands of this monster. And, although I understand the above statement , I hate it. I hate that vulnerability that exists for women, for Hannah,for Morgan and all others, I just want a permanent life line. Unrealistic , I know.
I suppose if I was a gazelle that I would instinctively know riding the edge of the herd was a sure way to get picked off but, still at some point, I'm young , fearless / foolish/ sidetracked , inexperienced- you name it and next you know, I'm riding the herd rim. The stumblings of life take us places that can be unfamilar and terrifying where a life line is crucial. Let us be the good, honest and true life lines that help girls get home , to the safety of their life, to friends and family. I want to be a part of a giant network of people who are aware, alert and take action to help get a girls somewhere safe just because it's the right thing to do. Through my fat haze of anger and giant vindictive feelings toward this monster who stole Hannah's life , at the core , my hope is the we "save the next girl" , that good people lean in.

 

[Kale]

I am so glad JM is off the streets now, considering all he is apparently responsible for. Poor Hannah didn't choose to be sacrificed so the monster would be caught, but at least now he's been caught. Imagine what horrible danger C-ville has been in for years with JM walking around! It could have happened again and again and again. Thank you, Hannah!!!

 

[Kale]

Correct me if I'm wrong on who said this but I think it was Morgan Harrington's mother who rightly (imo) pointed out that sometimes it's not enough for a woman to do things to protect herself, sometimes they need help. For example, a woman can't always find girlfriends to walk her home from the grocery store late at night (or bar or corner store or whatever), nor can she always afford a cab or bus. Women can't control what other people are going to do to them and there's only so much that can be done to protect yourself. Everyone risks their own safety EVERY DAY in a multitude of ways, most are just not unlucky enough to lose their lives. To give an example of this, more people will be killed in cars this year than by serial killers. Should we tell everyone to stop driving? Expecting women to expect to be raped or murdered while simply walking around is not reasonable. Everyone takes chances and some people can't avoid it. Just my opinion.

Good point! I try to stress this all the time. Not only can't a woman always have a friend walk them home, or afford a bus or a cab, but terrible things have happened to girls in exactly those situations! Skylar Neese was murdered by her "best friends". Correct me if I'm wrong, but it's starting to sound like Morgan was killed BY a cab driver!! And there have been plenty of horrible incidents on public transportation. There was the famous one in India. I remember one where somebody was beheaded on a Greyhound or something of the like.

Near my town today, there was a school shooting. A girl was killed in the school cafeteria. And when I was a teenager, my mom's very, very, very best friend's husband (a police officer!) turned out to be sexually abusing their nine-year-old daughter and possibly other little girls. You think you know someone. He was a "friend", a person in a position of authority, what if he decided to victimize me? I wouldn't have possibly known to be wary. He helped assemble my bedroom furniture while I sat and watched and no one else was there. What are we truly to do?

Yes, there are things that can be prevented. My number one go-to prevention method is to trust your instincts and run away when you feel uncomfortable. But I've always acknowledged that if someone nearby wants to kill me and is bigger than me, armed, or very very crafty, I'm doomed.

 

[Foxfire]

http://findmorgan.com/category/family-blog/

Gil Harrington’s Thoughts on January 25, 2014

The development of spiritual insight requires a persistent diminishment and distillation of self. In our process of becoming, it is the challenges that most often promote growth. I really want to find a way of reaching the point of stretch and change through joy. Such a better alternative if I could only figure out how.
I realize that the point where you collapse and break is a powerful place where expectations are shattered and discarded and so all things become possible. If you reconfigure your very being and allow transformation to occur. The effort of the struggle “strengthens” us in a way.
Our family’s exceptional challenges require and demand exceptional responses. We soldier on a secure in knowing that we are always given the tools to succeed in every place we find ourselves. The trick is to recognize, accept, and use them.
Spirit becomes most evident when more life can’t be managed. In those sharp times, in that dark place, germinates a fragile surrender; and with acceptance, solace.
241
<sniped - read more>

 

[RSC]

I'm sorry, but I refuse to believe that the answer is that women should have to walk with a buddy to be safe.

We live in a culture where rapists aren't prosecuted nearly enough and misogyny runs deep.

I think the best way to honor Hannah Graham is by mourning for the loss of this teen whose life was brutally taken. And by pursuing justice and taking her murderer off the street forever.

I agree with this! But I also think if prevention of the next girl is to happen, somewhere, not here, discussion should be allowed into how we all, but it seems particularly women can do things that perhaps make them less vulnerable to those who "hunt prey", such as implying the buddy system. Learning from tragedies is at times the best way to honor them.

 

[Celtsleuth]

Well, they have confirmed what we all knew.....very sad at this moment...this and the school shooting in Washington state...I agree with whoever said that sometimes you don't want to even be a part of the human race with all the evil that happens. R.I.P. to Hannah...and prayers for family and friends. JM is screwed now...he deserves to have his life taken away for doing this. I am a proponent of capital punishment and I can't think of a better case for it than this. Prayers for the Harrington family as well...they've had to relive their nightmare all over again. I just hope that she really was so out of it as shown in the last video with JM holding her up that she didn't know what was happening and went quickly...

 

[Kale]

http://findmorgan.com/category/family-blog/

Gil Harrington’s Thoughts on December 17, 2013
ON DECEMBER - 17 - 20134 COMMENTS
The Game Preserve
Morgan why couldn’t you have had another life
Find a lucky guy, be a simple wife
Maybe make a baby or two
That’s what I’d hoped for you
But life is a challenging game
Who knew you’d have to leave the game so early
You had a date with destiny on another field
That was your fate

<sniped - read more>

I wish every person in the world was amazing enough to turn all of their pain into poetry. There might be a lot less Jesse Matthews in the world.

 

[ThinkHard]

I don't think they had any idea who the suspect was because JMs DNA wasn't in any data bank. All they knew is the two cases were linked.

Not until they arrested him for Hannah's case did they have his DNA and I am sure when they entered it in CODIS it came back linking Morgan and the 2005 rape case.

So Hannah's case really helped them solve two other unsolved crimes.

I know they didn't know, know. As they wouldn't have had DNA. But that doesn't mean people hadn't come forward who indicated JLM previously. They certainly wouldn't be announcing him as a person of interest for fear he'd flee. LE often have lists of people who have peaked there curiosity in cases that they do nt release to the public, yet have still come across police radar. All I am suggesting is perhaps for reasons of others coming forward previously JLM had already been on their radar. So when HS Mae was dropped as the one seen with her, it sent up more significant and alarming red flags to LE.

 

[Kale]

Well, they have confirmed what we all knew.....very sad at this moment...this and the school shooting in Washington state...I agree with whoever said that sometimes you don't want to even be a part of the human race with all the evil that happens. R.I.P. to Hannah...and prayers for family and friends. JM is screwed now...he deserves to have his life taken away for doing this. I am a proponent of capital punishment and I can't think of a better case for it than this. Prayers for the Harrington family as well...they've had to relive their nightmare all over again. I just hope that she really was so out of it as shown in the last video with JM holding her up that she didn't know what was happening and went quickly...

It's a rough day. The shooting was in my area. I was so concerned by it that I forgot to check on Hannah, which I've been doing a lot since they found the remains. This may be a bit off-topic, but I just want to say how grateful I am that schools take gun violence so seriously and have developed drills and methods and so forth that can stop these things before they become massive blood baths. The injured students are in critical condition, but there has so far only been one death (other than the shooter) as far as I know... Terrible and inexcusable, but thank goodness more people weren't hurt.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

I know they didn't know, know. As they wouldn't have had DNA. But that doesn't mean people hadn't come forward who indicated JLM previously. They certainly wouldn't be announcing him as a person of interest for fear he'd flee. LE often have lists of people who have peaked there curiosity in cases that they do nt release to the public, yet have still come across police radar. All I am suggesting is perhaps for reasons of others coming forward previously JLM had already been on their radar. So when HS Mae was dropped as the one seen with her, it sent up more significant and alarming red flags to LE.

IIRC, Longo said in one of the earliest pressers, before JLM's name was even released, that this person was "known" to LE.

ETA: Although I'm not sure who HS Mae is. :lol: j/k Darn autocorrect!

I'm sorry, I don't mean to be flippant at such a somber time, but I'm one of those people whose mind just latches on to any comic relief at such a time.

 

[AnnaGrace]

RIP beautiful Hannah, precious girl. I am so sorry for Mr. And Mrs. Graham and Hannah's brother. May they find comfort and strength during this unbearable loss.

 

[Concerned Mama]

Of course no one is to blame but the criminal but it is the nature of human relationship to think in "what if" and "if only" terms and I feel for these kids as they struggle through a very adult exististential process and imagine how things could have been different. With freedom comes responsibility for your choices. Part of college development is learning that you can no longer live as if there is a benign protector always hovering. Please read Camille Paglia's recent piece on time.com. One great outcome of this could be a more complex examination of college behavior--we don't live in a perfect world and can't act as if we do.

I agree with you, and while I have often disagreed with Paglia's opinions, the essay you are talking about should be required reading for many young women, even if just for the sake of considering Paglia's point of view, whether they ultimately agree or disagree.

Of course nobody is to blame except the killer, yet we would be very naive to think the world should operate the way WE want it to, so we should be able to live our lives blissfully without fear. My own daughters are irritated by my advice to be safe, not walking alone at night, not running on deserted trails, not walking around the city or campus oblivious to the world around them with ear buds blasting their private soundtrack. Still, I hope that while they're rolling their eyes at me or letting out an irritated teenage sigh, they'll at least store my advice somewhere in the self preservation depths of their brains.

But having said all of the above, I have to clarify that when I re-watch the security camera footage of Hannah, I see a girl who WAS taking some precautions. When captured across the street from the Shell station, she is running. Why? I'd like to believe it was because she knew she was in a sketchy area where she could be vulnerable, so she was running to reach a more populated area. And that's what just kills me. It's not until she reaches an area with lots of people, an area where she SHOULD be safe, that she falls victim to a predator, a wolf in sheep's (or teddy bear's) clothing. Why didn't somebody step in? So many people. Even a bouncer who had banned the predator from his bar due to the very behavior he was witnessing as he watched Hannah being supported by--practically carried by--this creep?

Hannah may have helped save the next girl from JLM, but the price she and everybody who knew and loved her paid was far too great. If we truly want to help save the next girl, teaching girls to be realists and to be aware of their surroundings may be a step in the right direction, but it's still not enough. To help save the next girl, we need to step up and stop being bystanders, witnessing, but not stepping in to help or question when something doesn't look quite right. If we want to help save the next girl, we should put some of the responsibility for her safety on us.

 

[MJPeony]

I know they didn't know, know. As they wouldn't have had DNA. But that doesn't mean people hadn't come forward who indicated JLM previously. They certainly wouldn't be announcing him as a person of interest for fear he'd flee. LE often have lists of people who have peaked there curiosity in cases that they do nt release to the public, yet have still come across police radar. All I am suggesting is perhaps for reasons of others coming forward previously JLM had already been on their radar. So when HS Mae was dropped as the one seen with her, it sent up more significant and alarming red flags to LE.

BBM- I tend to agree with this. I do think there was some level of JM being on LE's radar. In fact, LE themselves said in one of the first pressers that JM "is known to us" (sorry, don't have that linked right now, but it's in a press conference when they announce he is a POI). Maybe he was known just b/c of traffic infractions, but I'm thinking no. (If that were the case, I'd have been known to LE as well when I was in college b/c I had so many speeding tickets ) I think they had some indication he was involved in something before HG went missing. What exactly, I'm not sure. But something. Drugs, someone had said he looked like Sketch, they knew he was a cab driver the night MH went missing, etc. Don't know. But something. IMO.

 

[ThinkHard]

I'm sorry, but I refuse to believe that the answer is that women should have to walk with a buddy to be safe.

We live in a culture where rapists aren't prosecuted nearly enough and misogyny runs deep.

I think the best way to honor Hannah Graham is by mourning for the loss of this teen whose life was brutally taken. And by pursuing justice and taking her murderer off the street forever.

I know people are particularly defensive on this topic. But suggesting cautions be applied to limiting vulnerability for a young women or anyone is hardly the same thing as accepting the world r the way it is. I would argue till I'm blue in the face that the answer is in the roots. Its in teaching kids empathy and compassion. Its about teaching kids accountability. 100% absolutely!!! But just because in my ideal world we could flip a switch and have all children be given the limits and love they all deserve to take away all the hate, and anger in this world....one must at times be realistic that such predators such rage and impulse does exist, and it is naive to throw complete caution to the wind, simply because its only fair that we should be able too. It is only wise of young women to be aware of circumstances that put them at highest risk for being vulnerable. That to me is a far cry from accepting such evil or victim blaming.

 

[whiskers]

Agree 100% with your feelings of anger. I am so, so angry that this felt entitled to take, use, and dispose of a beautiful human life (LIVES!) like trash. These young women were so much better than him, so much more loved, more accomplished, more engaged and in love with life itself than him - a despicable, disgusting, heinous individual. It makes me so angry that he took their lives away, and took them away from their loving families. So much promise that that sicko took away from all of us.

Exactly. You said it better than me. These lights. These lights and who knows how many other lights he extinguished. I can study their brains as much as I want, but I will never grasp how someone can do this. He is despicable and disgusting.

There is a day of reckoning that needs to happen. May his soul never rest. (I'm not directing this part at your post, I don't want to start a new one.)

I ordered Maryland blue crabs yesterday. Fedex delivered them today. I get to share them with my own sweet Dad tomorrow. This isn't the sort of family gathering Hannah, Morgan, and perhaps many other victims ever get to do with their families. And that's why I'm so angry. How dare a beast think he has that permission. No one has permission or the right to take away a life like this from family and friends.

And yes. So much promise. So much promise.

 

[vthokies19]

Beautiful pic of Hannah from her high school softball

https://twitter.com/wp_softball/status/525780506269741056

 

[Kale]

I agree with you, and while I have often disagreed with Paglia's opinions, the essay you are talking about should be required reading for many young women, even if just for the sake of considering Paglia's point of view, whether they ultimately agree or disagree.

Of course nobody is to blame except the killer, yet we would be very naive to think the world should operate the way WE want it to, so we should be able to live our lives blissfully without fear. My own daughters are irritated by my advice to be safe, not walking alone at night, not running on deserted trails, not walking around the city or campus oblivious to the world around them with ear buds blasting their private soundtrack. Still, I hope that while they're rolling their eyes at me or letting out an irritated teenage sigh, they'll at least store my advice somewhere in the self preservation depths of their brains.

But having said all of the above, I have to clarify that when I re-watch the security camera footage of Hannah, I see a girl who WAS taking some precautions. When captured across the street from the Shell station, she is running. Why? I'd like to believe it was because she knew she was in a sketchy area where she could be vulnerable, so she was running to reach a more populated area. And that's what just kills me. It's not until she reaches an area with lots of people, an area where she SHOULD be safe, that she falls victim to a predator, a wolf in sheep's (or teddy bear's) clothing. Why didn't somebody step in? So many people. Even a bouncer who had banned the predator from his bar due to the very behavior he was witnessing as he watched Hannah being supported by--practically carried by--this creep?

Hannah may have helped save the next girl from JLM, but the price she and everybody who knew and loved her was far too great. If we truly want to help save the next girl, teaching girls to be realists and to be aware of their surroundings may be a step in the right direction, but it's still not enough. To help save the next girl, we need to step up and stop being bystanders, witnessing, but not stepping in to help or question when something doesn't look quite right. If we want to help save the next girl, we should put some of the responsibility for her safety on us.

I have always believed that, while girls are frequently told to not become victims, boys are not all often enough told not to be violent criminals. No one wants to look at their sweet baby boy and even pretend for five seconds that there's a possibility that he'll be the horrible monster that does something like this. It probably doesn't even cross a lot of parents' minds. An eight year old boy is so sweet and innocent. But I think the "Don't hurt people" talk should be as required - and started at as early an age - as the sex talk and the drugs talk.

 

[MJPeony]

I know people are particularly defensive on this topic. But suggesting cautions be applied to limiting vulnerability for a young women or anyone is hardly the same thing as accepting the world r the way it is. I would argue till I'm blue in the face that the answer is in the roots. Its in teaching kids empathy and compassion. Its about teaching kids accountability. 100% absolutely!!! But just because in my ideal world we could flip a switch and have all children be given the limits and love they all deserve to take away all the hate, and anger in this world....one must at times be realistic that such predators such rage and impulse does exist, and it is naive to throw complete caution to the wind, simply because its only fair that we should be able too. It is only wise of young women to be aware of circumstances that put them at highest risk for being vulnerable. That to me is a far cry from accepting such evil or victim blaming.

Well put. IMO it's the same as defensive driving in many ways.

 

[Foxfire]

https://www.facebook.com/coybarefoot?fref=nf
New post by Coy Barefoot 23 minutes ago with pic along Ammonett Branch..

 

[whiskers]

I'm sorry, but I refuse to believe that the answer is that women should have to walk with a buddy to be safe.

We live in a culture where rapists aren't prosecuted nearly enough and misogyny runs deep.

I think the best way to honor Hannah Graham is by mourning for the loss of this teen whose life was brutally taken. And by pursuing justice and taking her murderer off the street forever.

Misogyny does indeed run deep. (Not saying that geared to anyone here. Simply agreeing with your statement.) It also runs deep with many psychopaths. Women shouldn't live in a society where we have to always watch our back. Sadly, at times, it does seem that way.